I passed my driving test (almost!)

Urban Weigl

Did my driving test in Castlebar, and almost passed it. I would not be making this post if I was not convinced that the tester was out to fail me. I don't really mind a lot, because I do not need to use the car for the next year, but it still pisses me off that they would do that. Details below. I have highlighted all the areas where the tester ticked the Grade 2 box (no other boxes or other grades were ticked).

2. POSITION
On bends: I have no trouble with bends, and it is a mystery why this was checked.

3. OBSERVATION
Moving off: I followed the correct procedures at all times. If anything, I overdid it, to make sure the tester was able to see.

Overtaking: I safely overtook a school bus that parked in front of me, on a wide road with white striped lines, with excellent visibility. That is the only reason I can think of.

4. REACT TO HAZARDS
Reaction: I did not miss any hazards, and reacted quickly and appropriately. I even specifically looked in the direction of hazards in addition to my reaction, to make sure the tester was able to see that I was aware of them.

7. SIGNALS
Turning Left: I did not do this hand signal 100% correctly; I did it with my left hand instead of my right, but otherwise the signal was correct and (more importantly) correctly visible from the outside.

12. VEHICLE CONTROLS
Handbrake: I started up a hill with the help of the hand-break, which went smoothly (it literally could not have gone better). I released the handbreak correctly, and did not roll backwards, nor did the car jump or try to accelerate against the handbreak, or anything else for that matter. He could not have given me a point here unless you are not permitted to use the handbreak to assist moving up a slope (if that's not allowed, that is news to me).
Steering: When asked, the tester was not able to give a satisfactory answer to this question. At no point did I make any steering "mistakes".

13. SPEED
Traffic conditions: I always took extreme care to watch out for traffic conditions, slowing down whenever I was unsure where someone else might make an unexpected turn, etc (for example going into roundabouts, junctions, and so on).

17. TURNABOUT
Competently: I was able to complete this within 3 points, even though this is no longer required! Perhaps I was supposed to get it done in just 2?
Observation: I took extreme care here, and made it very obvious that I was looking in all directions, and aware of all other road users and rules.

While everyone has a different driving style, and it is inevitable that the tester would give everybody some points somewhere, there is no reasonable way he could have given me 9 or more, unless:
1. He was not aware of the rules of the road (scary), or;
2. He was out to fail me*

Again, the only mistake that I did make was that when making the left hand signal (from inside the car to a pointsman), I used my left arm instead of my right, though my hand was correctly visible from the outside.

*I can think of a few reasons. For instance, the Castlebar test centre was in a bit of a fight with the government recently. I look quite young (I am 21). The tester had a bad day and it was raining. The tester wants to ensure that waiting times remain ~1 year in length. Who knows, just too many possibilities.

Saruman

i notice a LOT of used extreme care and maybe overdid it.. you know the tester probably saw you as not being confident and in my oppinion someone who is not confident on the road is an accident waiting to happen.. then again my dad says they all have an understanding that they fail so many people to keep the Q high as 1:they have a job and 2: they get overtime dealing with the Q's

I passed first time myself.. was this your first? Few people pass first time anyway.

Rabies

If your a young male driver then there is higher chance of failure. Next them show some leg, might work

woosaysdan

as saruman said though been over cautious can be a bad thing!!! shows that you have no confidence at all or that your very nervous!!! some of the stuff you were marked on was bad form alright but unfortunately thats the way things go!!! unlucky man!

Sleepy

Don't worry about it. A test that involves painting by numbers can't qualify you as a painter. A test that involves driving by numbers, while it may qualify you as a driver, doesn't make you a good one.

Think about it, not even insurance companies accept the fact that you've passed the driving test makes you a competent driver, why should you worry about the results of it? You'll get it next time around, don't worry about it.

Urban Weigl

I don't mind not passing as I do not plan to drive outside of Ireland for at least a year, and in fact will not be driving much at all in the next year anyway.

The thing that makes me pissed off is that this guy is on my payroll, as I pay taxes. With testers like this, it is no wonder we have so many accidents. I demand a tax refund!

As far as being overcautious, you'd think he'd have checked off some boxes under section '11. Progress' if he thought that. I scanned in and uploaded my test below:
http://www.avara.net/drivingtest.jpg

The Muppet

Hard Luck but don't worry about It..Next time don't let the examiner see you are nervous . On your turnaround did you look back over your right shoulder before starting the manouver? Your were unlucky but just failed . These are minor faults and Four less and you would have passed.


Did you do any Pre test?

Better luck next time .

Giblet

It was probably the excessive drinking you did while driving.

seamus

Time to play Devil's advocate here. As a matter of curiosity, how long have you been driving? Do you do much driving?

While I do think that sometimes a person can be failed unfairly, the vast vast majority of people were failed fairly, and their ego is hurt too much to admit it, or the fact that they don't know what they did wrong is why they failed!

Urban Weigl wrote:

2. POSITION
On bends: I have no trouble with bends, and it is a mystery why this was checked.

Did you allow yourself to swing in or out? While in reality it can sometimes make sense to change road position before a bend to improve visibility, for the purposes of the test you stay in the same place - driver in the middle of the road (i.e. car just left of centre) for normally wide roads, or slightly more left than right for narrow roads.

3. OBSERVATION
Moving off: I followed the correct procedures at all times. If anything, I overdid it, to make sure the tester was able to see.

Overtaking: I safely overtook a school bus that parked in front of me, on a wide road with white striped lines, with excellent visibility. That is the only reason I can think of.

99.999% of the time, when someone is marked down for observation on the overtake or moving off, you have neglected to do the system.
For overtaking - Rear view mirror, (indicate), right-hand mirror, (alternate between RH mirror, RV mirror and looking forward until your way forward is clear), left-hand mirror, right-hand mirror, look over your shoulder, go. Between each looking behind, you include a glance forward around the vehicle you're overtaking to make sure nothing has crept up in those few seconds, and in case any hazards (pedestrians, junctions) present themselves.
For moving off - Rear view mirror, (indicate), right-hand mirror, (pause until you have a clear go), look over your shoulder, go.
If you miss any of this, the looking over the shoulder one is what most people forget, then you're likely to be marked down. It's not simple.

4. REACT TO HAZARDS
Reaction: I did not miss any hazards, and reacted quickly and appropriately. I even specifically looked in the direction of hazards in addition to my reaction, to make sure the tester was able to see that I was aware of them.

Are you sure? If you didn't see a hazard that the tester did, then he'll mark you down. If you didn't see something then of course you'll say you saw everything (Just presenting an alternative viewpoint).

7. SIGNALS
Turning Left: I did not do this hand signal 100% correctly; I did it with my left hand instead of my right, but otherwise the signal was correct and (more importantly) correctly visible from the outside.

Indicating using your left hand inside the vehicle is not visible. The point of using your right arm to indicate left is so that all traffic can see your limb sticking out of the window - i.e. traffic in front, behind, from the right, from 45 degrees. The signal was wrong, there's no point in trying to sugar-coat it.

12. VEHICLE CONTROLS
Handbrake: I started up a hill with the help of the hand-break, which went smoothly (it literally could not have gone better). I released the handbreak correctly, and did not roll backwards, nor did the car jump or try to accelerate against the handbreak, or anything else for that matter. He could not have given me a point here unless you are not permitted to use the handbreak to assist moving up a slope (if that's not allowed, that is news to me).

I don't understand what you're saying here, by "assist moving up a slope". The handbrake should only be used when the vehicle is at a complete stop. So you drive up the hill, slow down, stop. Shift into first gear, pull the handbrake, put the vehicle into neutral, release the foot brake (gently). Then put it back into first gear, begin "accelerating" until you feel the bite (the rear of the car drops slightly), then release the handbrake swiftly and smoothly and accelerate away smoothly.
Is this what you did?

Steering: When asked, the tester was not able to give a satisfactory answer to this question. At no point did I make any steering "mistakes".

What anwer did he give you?

13. SPEED
Traffic conditions: I always took extreme care to watch out for traffic conditions, slowing down whenever I was unsure where someone else might make an unexpected turn, etc (for example going into roundabouts, junctions, and so on)

As others say, you may have appeared underconfident. while it's generally agreed that overconfidence will fail you in a second, overcautiousness will make you appear inexperienced and underconfident. Even if you're unsure about what someone will do, pretend you do know by keeping your distance, and dealing with it smoothly when they do make their manouver.

17. TURNABOUT
Competently: I was able to complete this within 3 points, even though this is no longer required! Perhaps I was supposed to get it done in just 2?
Observation: I took extreme care here, and made it very obvious that I was looking in all directions, and aware of all other road users and rules.

Perhaps a matter of incorrect use of the handbrake? There's no requirment to get it in any amount of goes, but the more points in the turn, the more times you have to do anything correctly. God, my 3-pointers a bit rusty (bikes don't have to do them see ), but iirc;
Pull up to where he asks. Put into first. Pull handbrake. Put into neutral. Release foot brake. Begin procedure for moving out, but add in a lot of extra looking around for other traffic which may come upon you (Tallaght's great for this, very wide open). When you're ready to go, release the handbrake and make your first turn. Stop gently. Pull the handbrake. Put in to neutral. Release the foot brake. Put into reverse. Your indicator may have turned off, but it's not necessary for the moving backwards part of this. (Remember to keep looking all around you, **** the mirrors). Same for reverse, then stop. Handbrake. Neutral. Release foot. Look around. Indicate. 1st Gear. Go when ready. Etc.

Again, the only mistake that I did make was that when making the left hand signal (from inside the car to a pointsman), I used my left arm instead of my right, though my hand was correctly visible from the outside.

Again, the only mistake you made as far as you were aware. Perhaps that's the reason you've failed.

I'm not trying to be horrible here or make you feel worse. I'm a driving test failure veteran at this point (although I've only failed twice, on different vehicles, long waiting lists mean I've had a *lot* of time to think about it ). Maybe you did fail because the tester had it in for you. Maybe he didn't, maybe you actually failed. Either way, assume that you failed because you weren't up to the task, and work on improving your driving and passing the next time. There's no opportunity in it to improve your skills and your character if you don't accept responsibility (even if it's not your fault).

Urban Weigl

seamus wrote:

Time to play Devil's advocate here. As a matter of curiosity, how long have you been driving? Do you do much driving?

I have been driving for 5 years, driving quite a bit during that time. Recently, I had visitors over for a few weeks, and was driving several hours every day on average during that time.

While I do think that sometimes a person can be failed unfairly, the vast vast majority of people were failed fairly, and their ego is hurt too much to admit it, or the fact that they don't know what they did wrong is why they failed!

I can apprecaite that, but this was not the case here. I do not mind failing the test -- first of all, it means almost no saving in insurance for me, and secondly I will not be doing much driving during the next year (certainly none outside of Ireland). What DOES piss me off however is that as a business owner and a tax payer, this guy is on my payroll, and not doing his job.

Did you allow yourself to swing in or out? While in reality it can sometimes make sense to change road position before a bend to improve visibility, for the purposes of the test you stay in the same place - driver in the middle of the road (i.e. car just left of centre) for normally wide roads, or slightly more left than right for narrow roads.

No. I was aware that I should not do this during the test especially, and in addition the speed limit was 30mph.

99.999% of the time, when someone is marked down for observation on the overtake or moving off, you have neglected to do the system.
For overtaking - Rear view mirror, (indicate), right-hand mirror, (alternate between RH mirror, RV mirror and looking forward until your way forward is clear), left-hand mirror, right-hand mirror, look over your shoulder, go. Between each looking behind, you include a glance forward around the vehicle you're overtaking to make sure nothing has crept up in those few seconds, and in case any hazards (pedestrians, junctions) present themselves.
For moving off - Rear view mirror, (indicate), right-hand mirror, (pause until you have a clear go), look over your shoulder, go.
If you miss any of this, the looking over the shoulder one is what most people forget, then you're likely to be marked down. It's not simple.
Are you sure? If you didn't see a hazard that the tester did, then he'll mark you down. If you didn't see something then of course you'll say you saw everything (Just presenting an alternative viewpoint).

While I did not notice that I did, and while I was aware at all times not to miss these procedures (they are reflex anyway at this stage), it is something that I could have done at least once, though I don't believe I did. However, even assuming I did, this would have left me far from failing the test, as you will see by looking at the marks.

Indicating using your left hand inside the vehicle is not visible. The point of using your right arm to indicate left is so that all traffic can see your limb sticking out of the window - i.e. traffic in front, behind, from the right, from 45 degrees. The signal was wrong, there's no point in trying to sugar-coat it.

I don't have a problem with getting a point for that, though I think that neither is visible (I was supposed to indicate to the pointsman with my right hand also inside the vehicle).

I don't understand what you're saying here, by "assist moving up a slope". The handbrake should only be used when the vehicle is at a complete stop. So you drive up the hill, slow down, stop. Shift into first gear, pull the handbrake, put the vehicle into neutral, release the foot brake (gently). Then put it back into first gear, begin "accelerating" until you feel the bite (the rear of the car drops slightly), then release the handbrake swiftly and smoothly and accelerate away smoothly.
Is this what you did?
What anwer did he give you?

That is what I did. I never had the handbreak on while moving or attempting to move. Sorry for not explaining it more clearly; I haven't tried to move the car with handbreaks on in years.

As far as what answer he gave, he said I should read the back of the results, which will tell me why. Well, it doesn't (obviously).

As others say, you may have appeared underconfident. while it's generally agreed that overconfidence will fail you in a second, overcautiousness will make you appear inexperienced and underconfident. Even if you're unsure about what someone will do, pretend you do know by keeping your distance, and dealing with it smoothly when they do make their manouver.

I was a bit nervous, but no more than average. I wouldn't say that I was being underconfident, though it's hard to be a judge.

Again, the only mistake you made as far as you were aware. Perhaps that's the reason you've failed.

I never said I did not make any other mistakes at all. As I said, everyone is bound to get a few points, but there is no way I could have gotten 12 if the tester was not trying to fail me (most of them I can discount easily).

I'm not trying to be horrible here or make you feel worse. I'm a driving test failure veteran at this point (although I've only failed twice, on different vehicles, long waiting lists mean I've had a *lot* of time to think about it ). Maybe you did fail because the tester had it in for you. Maybe he didn't, maybe you actually failed. Either way, assume that you failed because you weren't up to the task, and work on improving your driving and passing the next time. There's no opportunity in it to improve your skills and your character if you don't accept responsibility (even if it's not your fault).

I did a pre-test a few years ago, when I was not nearly as good as I am now, and passed that with flying colours. I'm not saying I am a perfect driver though: nobody is, even if they think they are. What I am saying is that I well exceeded what is required for the test. And you can always learn and improve.

Edit: Perhaps it is time to bring in the army to assist with driving tests, and get those waiting lists down as well! Waiting 12 months to get a test date is just not on.

ionapaul

I did the driving test twice, both times in 1999. I am still puzzled by why I failed the first time. I can remember making a mistake the second time all right, but not the first time when I was failed! I didn't need or take lessons in between the two attempts.
I am quite sure that it was down to the test being administered by two different people, the second one perhaps a little more sympathetic than the first.

edit* Both times I applied for the test I wrote a letter to accompany the application form, explaining that I was planning to emigrate to the States (one of the times that was true) and needed a license ASAP. On both occasions I got an appointment within weeks - the waiting lists were impressive back then too. Even if you don't make up an excuse, just write a letter mentioning that you will accept any cancelled appointment and can attend upon short notice - you will get seen a lot sooner.

Urban Weigl

ionapaul, when you did your test the second time, did you also tell the driving tester that you really needed the license as you were heading to the states?

robbie1876

As others have said, it's a confidence thing. I confidently drove through a red light on my test and still passed. Once you show that you have a good level of overall confidence and ability in your driving, I'm convinced that the indvidual points don't matter that much.

Hobbes

If they get paid by the test then I'd say most people would fail their first test.

ionapaul

No, I never mentioned anything to the driving instructor about needing my license, only mentioned it (both times) on the letter accompanying the application form - I very much doubt the instructors get to see this! To the instructors I was just other young applicant...

Sleepy

robbie1876 wrote:

As others have said, it's a confidence thing. I confidently drove through a red light on my test and still passed. Once you show that you have a good level of overall confidence and ability in your driving, I'm convinced that the indvidual points don't matter that much.

Driving through a red light is one of the few things that is supposed to be an automatic fail. Your tester musn't have been the brightest.

steveland?

When ya get into the car give the instructor a sip of the whiskey you keep under the seat. Might relax him/her

RossFixxxed

I had no reason why I failed the first time I did the test. Did another driving lesson and he got everything that was down on the sheet after 10 mins in the car with me. Got it the second time, didn't think my driving was as good.

I put a shirt and tie on, clipped my work ID on, shaved and made sure I looked very smart the second time, even acting a little 'nervous' when I went out, being too cocky when you're young is a NO-NO. Seemed to make a big difference...

Edit: you can instantly fail on any of the categories. That's what a class C mark is on the test sheet. You can fail totally and outright on courtesy, on indicators, on turning left hand corners...

Also any 'stories' about the driving test you hear. You can this, but you musn't this are bull****. Go get a professional lesson and pre-test from a good school of motoring and it should go grand! Good luck!

R

robbie1876

Sleepy wrote:

Driving through a red light is one of the few things that is supposed to be an automatic fail. Your tester musn't have been the brightest.

Yeah, it happened early in the test, I presumed I had failed so just relaxed and enjoyed the rest of the drive without a worry. I guess he didn't see the red light, must have been looking at his notes or something.

The Muppet

robbie1876 wrote:

Yeah, it happened early in the test, I presumed I had failed so just relaxed and enjoyed the rest of the drive without a worry. I guess he didn't see the red light, must have been looking at his notes or something.

You could have failed him on Observation.

Lucky Escape for you.

blondie83

When I was working in the motor tax/driving liscence department one summer I heeard quite a few stories about the driving test place. You should never book your test for a Friday, cos they're only allowed pass a certain number of people per week, and chances are they'll have given most of them out by then.

There was a case where this woman went in on a Friday - she got asked some questions on rules of the road and got them right. When her tester guy went to the toilet she had a look at his sheet to see what she would be asked next, and discovered that he had her already down as failed, even though she hadn't even gone out in the car with him. She took the department to court and got her driving licence in the end. The guys excuse had been that they had reached their limit for passes that week, and so he had to pre fail the woman!

richy1

can i ask how much are the practise driving tests and how many did you have

Micky Dolenz

Try here.