[Article in SR] ComReg clarifies net facts in connection clash

damien

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?uid=test&sid=iDE8dK8L&storyid=single3911

ComReg clarifies net facts in connection clash


08.10.2004 - A dispute has broken out between the communications lobby group IrelandOffline and the Commission for Communications Regulation over the issue of functional internet access (FIA), an obligation on telecoms suppliers to ensure a minimum internet speed on all phone lines.
IrelandOffline had claimed that the regulator had removed a minimum level of quality on FIA last year and alleged that telecoms providers were no longer obliged to guarantee to consumers that phone lines were capable of carrying internet traffic. "When FIA was removed from the universal service obligation (USO) it was a massive step backwards," IrelandOffline chairman Damien Mulley said.

However ComReg said that FIA had not been withdrawn and that the 2003 regulations contained a USO around providing internet access. Quoting from the document, ComReg replied: "Any connection (to the public telephone network) provided by a designated undertaking shall be capable of allowing end users to make and receive (c) data communications at data rates that are sufficient to permit functional internet access taking into account prevailing technologies used by the majority of subscribers and technological feasibility."

The regulator acknowledged that the USO decision last year did not define a particular data rate to represent FIA but nonetheless it required Eircom to engage with ComReg and develop a plan for addressing network performance issues that could affect the line speeds experienced by internet users.

According to ComReg, the EU directive that broadly defines the scope of USO - and on which the national regulations are based - did not, unlike the previous 1997 directive, define the data rate. This had been set at 2.4Kbps - but it was referred to at that time under the broad heading of "data communications".

IrelandOffline had claimed to have heard "widespread" complaints from Irish internet users that their connections were too slow to be workable or unable to carry an internet signal at all. ComReg said that it had received 50 complaints to its own office in relation to FIA.

ComReg confirmed to siliconrepublic.com that it has been in discussion with Eircom on this issue and other areas concerning the details of the USO requirement. The regulator said it expects the process to conclude shortly and added that it would be emphasising that increasing broadband availability would be the main priority in these discussions.

By Gordon Smith

spongebob

damien.m wrote:

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?uid=test&sid=iDE8dK8L&storyid=single3911The regulator said it expects the process to conclude shortly

They said the same thing to anybody who contacted them in November/December 2003 . I did not belive them then and I do not belive them now.

M

spongebob

damien.m wrote:

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?uid=test&sid=iDE8dK8L&storyid=single3911The regulator said it expects the process to conclude shortly

They said the same thing to anybody who contacted them in November/December 2003 . I did not believe them then and I do not believe them now.

M

damien

From that famus USO, On page 6

On the matter of functional internet access, the USP shall
(g) on or before 24th October 2003, develop a statement which sets out the range of factors which can affect its network performance (and are within its control) and therefore the speeds enjoyed by internet users.
(h) on or before 24th October 2003, inform ComReg of the number and location of connections to the public telephone network that employ carrier systems/pairgain devices.

So, they were meant to know this almost 12 months ago.

Only 50 complaints. Would have thought there would have been more.

eircomtribunal

damien.m wrote:

Only 50 complaints.

We have to ask Comreg about the trigger levels of their "consumer complaint trigger programme" they seem to operate!

Comreg try to fob us off with bluff, while they go to bed with lying McRedmond and do him all the favours he's asking for.

P.

C Fodder

If there are more than 50 people in IrelandOffline who have complaints (only 50 !) lets get each individual to make a written complaint to comreg and ask them next week are they sure that only 50 compaints about USO internet were received.
I personally can't validly complain on this one.

jwt

However ComReg said that FIA had not been withdrawn

The regulator acknowledged that the USO decision last year did not define a particular data rate to represent FIA

A Jesuit priest would be proud of that.

Imagine if electricity supply voltage or mains gas pressure or mains water pressure was treated this way.

"Oh yes, we have stated that it must be of a certain standard"
"What is the standard?"
"Em...well ....we haven't actually defined one yet. But they MUST meet it!"


Terry Pratchett eat your heart out.

Which reminds me.....

"It is said that whosoever the gods wish to destroy, they first make mad. In fact, whosoever the gods wish to destroy, they first hand the equivalent of a stick with a fizzing fuse and Acme Dynamite Company written on the side. It's more interesting, and doesn't take so long."
(Terry Pratchett, Soul Music)


I think we just lit the fuse
John

spongebob

eircomtribunal wrote:

Comreg try to fob us off with bluff, while they go to bed with lying McRedmond and do him all the favours he's asking for.

Has anyone asked Comreg about the "Missing" USO Directive transposed in this country in April 1999. Thats 5 and a Half Years Ago ." Its STATUTORY INSTRUMENT. S.I. No. 71 of 1999 . The Directive is Here .

Section Four

Whereas a fundamental requirement of universal service is to provide users on request with a connection to the fixed public telephone network at a fixed location, at an affordable price

€24 a month, yeah

whereas there should be no constraints on the technical means by which the connection is provided, allowing for wire or wireless technologies; whereas fixed public telephone network infrastructure newly installed after 1 January 1998 should be of a quality which supports, in addition to speech, data communications at rates suitable for access to online information services;

Comreg cannot pretend they did not know that this was the law since April 1999 and neither can Eircom .

So what is the current definition of "Suitable For Access" Buttsy ? Yiz shower have had over 5 Years to implement that one. The Directive is 6 and a half years old now.

M

jwt

fixed public telephone network infrastructure newly installed after 1 January 1998 should be of a quality which supports, in addition to speech, data communications at rates suitable for access to online information services;

It is suitable Muck, it is, honest.

It exceeds the defined particular data rate to represent FIA. Maybe it’s below the defined particular data rate to represent FIA. Who the hell knows?

ComReg certainly don’t


John

De Rebel

damien.m wrote:

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?uid=test&sid=iDE8dK8L&storyid=single3911

The regulator acknowledged that the USO decision last year did not define a particular data rate to represent FIA but nonetheless it required Eircom to engage with ComReg and develop a plan for addressing network performance issues that could affect the line speeds experienced by internet users.

Have to say that this kind of rubbish makes my blood boil. As a tax payer I am paying for ComReg to waste their time on these ridiculous engagements. As an eircom customer (however reluctant) I am paying line rental for teams of their people to waste time on ridiculous engagements. So I have the pleasure of paying BOTH sides to waste their time on these engagements.

This needs ………….

1. ComReg to define functional internet access – JUST DO IT – 32K. Easy as that. No rocket science. No navel gazing. No researching from first principles. And no bloody “engagements”
2. Eircom to either (a) Accept the definition and implement it or (b) Go to Court/Appeals Panel/EU and dispute it.

Thats it. End of story. Nothing else required.


As a taxpayer and a forced customer of eircom I bitterly resent the pair of them wasting my money on “engagements”.

Eircom are legally charged with a responsibility to their shareholders. They have NO responsibility to their customers other than the responsibilities imposed by ComReg. I fully understand eircom’s reluctance to accept or agree a minimum standard. I have no such understanding of ComReg’s position. They are charged with regulating the market. They are charged with assisting competition. They are charged with defending the consumer. They are certainly not charged with engagements for engagements sake.

Clearly, if a year of engagement has yielded nothing, then this is beyond ComReg to resolve. Clearly it falls to others to act in their stead. So what it needs is:

• FOI ComReg – everything to do with their engamenents with eircom
• Summarise the problem in plain English for those who will need to do ComReg’s job for them (DCMNR, Media, etc)
• Sumarise the futility of Comreg’s actions.
• Summarise the simple steps that need to be taken
• Get the Minister to issue a directive to ComReg requiring “publication of a clear, unambiguous, universal and measurable definition of FIA within 30 days”

We should also consider a brief report to the Comptroller and Auditor General. He is charged with ensuring that public funds are not wasted and more and more it looks as though that is exactly what is happening in ComReg. If it is the case that these engagements have a substantial cost associated with them, then there may be a case to answer. As things now stand ComReg is part of the Problem, not part of the Solution. Its sad to say it, but in cases like this we would be better off without them.

dahamsta

damien.m wrote:

Only 50 complaints. Would have thought there would have been more.

I wonder if they logged the one they themselves referred to us Damien, simply because there was bugger all they could do to help the user...

DonegalMan

De Rebel wrote:

We should also consider a brief report to the Comptroller and Auditor General.

Is there a mechanism for doing this?

eircomtribunal

De Rebel wrote:

Have to say that this kind of rubbish makes my blood boil... As things now stand ComReg is part of the Problem, not part of the Solution. Its sad to say it, but in cases like this we would be better off without them.

Will have to resend them my New Years card.
P.

lucernarian

Has Noel Dempsey done anything at all since he entered the Department? I haven't heard any speeches from him since his initial speech when he was appointed. Perhaps his first action could be to issue a directive to Comreg to actually set a proper speed for FIA.

damien

dahamsta wrote:

I wonder if they logged the one they themselves referred to us Damien, simply because there was bugger all they could do to help the user...

Adam, go on, tell everyone the story. It's very entertaining. Any further news from that person btw ?

dahamsta

Sure I'll let the person tell it themselves. I've removed identifying information, but obviously if Comreg would like to get in touch with IrelandOffline about this particular case, I'm sure you'd be only too willing to discuss it with them?

I am writing this for my father [...] . He [...] has a major problem with his internet connection, so much so that he can't actually send emails. ComReg suggested that he contact you as a last resort. This is what he says:

"My computer is currently connecting at 14.4kbs and it goes down as low as 12.8 at times. UTV told me it's my the problem is my line, as did Dell Tech Support. Eircom tell me they will only guarantee voice. I think myself it's because I changed to UTV as the service provider, but I have no proof of that. Can you help, help, help!!!"

This brings up a number of questions:

1. Did Comreg in fact refer this person and/or other people to IrelandOffline to resolve this issue?
2. If this is the case, considering that this person obviously feels that their connection isn't "sufficient", why didn't Comreg itself try to resolve the issue?
3. If this isn't the case, is Comreg calling this person a liar?
4. If Comreg's assertions to SiliconRepublic are in fact correct, why did they not address Eircom's assertion that they will only guarantee voice?

I haven't heard anything back from them Damien, but as you know I explained to them that there was very little we could do with individual issues in this particular area beyond lobbying, because we believe that the FIA USO is effectively toothless. As you have explained to SiliconRepublic, and Comreg now refute.

adam