British Guantanamo detainee claims torture.

GuanYin

Very strange this, a handwritten letter by a current inmate has been declassified by the US and it alleges torture and murder by US officials.

It seems a strange time to declassify it, given the upcoming election.

Apart from that, if true, its shocking that the US are pretty much as guilty as anyone of what is effectively kidnapping, torture, murder and human rights violations, seeing as noone has been formally charged with anything.

Any thoughts?

link

HelterSkelter

syke wrote:

if true, its shocking that the US are pretty much as guilty as anyone of what is effectively kidnapping, torture, murder and human rights violations,

I'm not shocked at all to be honest.

seamus

HelterSkelter wrote:

I'm not shocked at all to be honest.

I wouldn't be shocked either. Given what happened in Abu Ghraib, allegedly under orders, and considering that Abu Ghraib *should* have been complying with POW human rights mandates, I'm surprised nothing solid has surfaced earlier about torture at Guantanamo.

Hobbes

On the other hand it could be another scam.

Eg.

1. File a shock report that will get everyone up in arms.
2. Have the report debunked by numerous sources.
3. Ridcule the people who released the report.
4. Bury any other reports which would prove correct.

For example Bushes fake documents, which are now blown over but no news stories of the documents that had to be released to APpress recently.

chill

syke wrote:

Apart from that, if true, its shocking that the US are pretty much as guilty as anyone of what is effectively kidnapping, torture, murder and human rights violations, seeing as noone has been formally charged with anything.

Only for the terminally gullible. Every jailbird claims that he is innocent and that he's been abused in prison. It's standard crap for these people.

It's just another scam to crank up the anti american hatred and deflect from the dozens of children murdered by their buddies in Iraq this week in cold blood.

GuanYin

chill wrote:

Only for the terminally gullible. Every jailbird claims that he is innocent and that he's been abused in prison. It's standard crap for these people.

It's just another scam to crank up the anti american hatred and deflect from the dozens of children murdered by their buddies in Iraq this week in cold blood.

Strange, but thats what the english might have said about the irish alleged terrorists wrongly imprisoned during the "troubles".

The fact is, there is no evidence or proof of terrorist connections or wrong doing put forward by any authority regarding these men.

Even if you take them as POW, there is no formal war with the people they are allged connected with.

sovtek

chill wrote:

Only for the terminally gullible. Every jailbird claims that he is innocent and that he's been abused in prison. It's standard crap for these people.

I'm not sure who "these people" are?
I guess the terminally gullible also rely on sources other than the US administration (well even some of them have admitted it...like Mr Rhetorical)....sources which also back up the testimony of individual detainees, like the Red Cross, Human Rights Watch, Amnesty Intl. Nevermind that EVERY detainee that has repatriated hasnt had a court in their country find any reason to hold them.
I take it that you wouldn't be referring to "these people" ie innocent Iraqis/Afghans/Britons/French/Dutch/Canadians...etc etc

Hobbes

chill wrote:

It's just another scam to crank up the anti american hatred and deflect from the dozens of children murdered by their buddies in Iraq this week in cold blood.

If it is to crank up anti-Americanism. Then we have to ask why was it is the US released it?

Also how about the similar reports from people released as innocent? Dismiss that too?

bonkey

chill wrote:

Only for the terminally gullible. Every jailbird claims...

And obviously the terminally gullible will also believe that this inmate is a jailbird, who has been charged, tried, found guilty, and sentenced, rather than someone who is being detained without any of these steps having been taken (with the possible exception of the first).

Clearly anyone being detained is shifty. What were we assured they all were again? "Very Bad Men" or something? Does anyone seriously still believe that???

jc

GuanYin

bonkey wrote:

Clearly anyone being detained is shifty. What were we assured they all were again? "Very Bad Men" or something? Does anyone seriously still believe that???

jc

Of course we do. President Bush said they are and he'd never lie to us, would he?

I think Briney Spears said it best:

by Briney Spears
I think we should just trust our president in every decision that he makes and we should just support that.

[/sarcasm]

OfflerCrocGod

"This culminated, in my opinion, with the deaths of two fellow detainees at the hands of US military personnel, to which I myself was partially witness."

As Sideshow Bob said "Do they give a nobel prize in attempted chemistry?!" You either witness something or you don't. I find it strange that the Americans have released these documents and that there seems to be little furor over it in the press. For what reasons would the US release this document?

It said during welfare visits to the military base, Mr Begg had not alleged systematic abuse there, but had claimed mistreatment at Bagram, which was being investigated by the US.

From the BBC, I suppose he was in Afghanistan as a tourist, you know sightseeing. Maybe they want to as Hobbes said "prove" this is a fake and that way they taint any other claims. For the record I don't think people are in Guantanamo for torture it's just the Americans don't know what to do with the prisoners they capture in their "War On Terror". It's just typical of the Bush administration - Deal With It Another Time®.

sovtek

OfflerCrocGod wrote:

From the BBC, I suppose he was in Afghanistan as a tourist, you know sightseeing.

...because any foreignor found in Afghanistan must be a terrorist...unless they have an American flag on them somewhere.

bonkey

syke wrote:

I think Briney Spears said it best:

Ah, well, that puts it to rest then. If Ms. Spears has said this...who am I to even think otherwise in the face of such....ummm....(someone help me out here)....thingummyness. Yeah. Thingumyness.

God I need more beer.

jc

OfflerCrocGod

sovtek wrote:

...because any foreignor found in Afghanistan must be a terrorist...unless they have an American flag on them somewhere.

Lol ye your right he probably moved from Blighty to Afghanistan in the middle of a war because he was looking for cheap deals on some seaside villas :rolleyes:. Anyway it's obvious the Americans don't have a clue what to do with these guys - they may be released after the 2008 presidential elections once the trained monkey is replaced.

Ping Chow Chi

From the BBC, I suppose he was in Afghanistan as a tourist, you know sightseeing.

Not to nit-pick, but that link you posted claims that he was arrested in Pakistan and was only in Afghanistan because the Americans took him to their base there.