[Article] Another low-tunnel story!

mike65

Fer Petes Sake!

this from unison.ie

A MOTORWAY tunnel under the River Shannon that was given the green light yesterday won't be high enough to accommodate supertrucks.

The National Roads Authority (NRA) was given the go-ahead by An Bord Pleanala to build the sophisticated dual carriageway under the Shannon Estuary as part of a €320m bypass of the city.

However, the tunnel's height has been set at 4.65m for trucks, just 3cm too low for the so-called supertrucks that have controversially come onto Irish roads carrying huge loads.

Transport Minister Seamus Brennan is due to make a final decision on the height of the Dublin Port Tunnel next month, but he is expected to confirm that it will remain the same, similar to the Jack Lynch tunnel under the River Lee in Cork.

Mr Brennan has strongly indicated he will not change the truck height, also 4.65m, and signalled the Government may instead set a maximum height for trucks on Irish roads, effectively banning supertrucks for safety reasons.

The NRA and Dublin's tunnel builders have warned the minister that increasing the height of the Dublin Port Tunnel will lead to serious safety concerns and must not be attempted at any cost. The minister has been told it would cost €70m to raise the tunnel but this would delay it by seven months.

The Limerick tunnel, approved by Bord Pleanala yesterday, will carry more than 220,000 - many of them heavy goods trucks.

Bord Pleanala also approved the Nenagh to Limerick road, due to be completed in 2010.

Treacy Hogan

Mike.

John R

I am just waiting for the truck lobby to accuse Brennan of bias because he is short himself.

mackerski

mike65 wrote:

A MOTORWAY tunnel under the River Shannon that was given the green light yesterday won't be high enough to accommodate supertrucks.

If this is the Limerick bypass we're talking about, then I'm pretty sure they must be abusing the term "Motorway".

Dermot

Flukey

I saw that too, and it is ridiculous. That should not be allowed to happen and the Dublin port tunnel should be adjusted to take all the trucks.

maxheadroom

Flukey wrote:

I saw that too, and it is ridiculous. That should not be allowed to happen and the Dublin port tunnel should be adjusted to take all the trucks.

Or we could follow the rest of Europe and ban these trucks outright, instead of following an Anglo-American transport model. For once.

Hecate

Raising the height of the port tunnel at this stage is the dumbest idea in the history of the universe. I can't believe they're still knocking it about in the media as if not having the tallest tunnel in europe is some sort of disaster. Its really amazing the spin they put on these things on the radio and in the papers - oh yeah, I forgot its the silly season.

Supercubes constitute a tiny, tiny amount of the overall lorry traffic.

GerardKeating

Flukey wrote:

I saw that too, and it is ridiculous. That should not be allowed to happen and the Dublin port tunnel should be adjusted to take all the trucks.

WHY ???

Almost every other country in Europe has banned these SuperCube trucks.

Every country 'cept the UK.

Why don't we just ban them as well....

thejollyrodger

motorway where is that down in Limerick???

here, just ban these supercubes on our roads and save us all some time energy and Money!!

sceptre

mackerski wrote:

If this is the Limerick bypass we're talking about, then I'm pretty sure they must be abusing the term "Motorway".

Dermot

Heh. The new roads appear to be built to motorway specs.


Except for the roundabouts:)

If they're going to keep the tunnels too short for these trucks they need to ban the trucks. It's simple logic. Make the tunnels high enough or ban the things.

GerardKeating

Flukey wrote:

I saw that too, and it is ridiculous. That should not be allowed to happen and the Dublin port tunnel should be adjusted to take all the trucks.

WHY

Most every other country in Europe has banned these SuperCube trucks. Every one 'cept the UK.

There is a major cost to allow these trucks on our roads. In addition to works on the tunnells, the heavier weight to these trucks will also wreak the roads faster then the current juggernaughts,


gerard

Seth Brundle

mackerski wrote:

If this is the Limerick bypass we're talking about, then I'm pretty sure they must be abusing the term "Motorway".

Dermot

...given that Ireland doesn't have any proper motorways but fancy dual carriageways!

BrianD

the heavier weight to these trucks will also wreak the roads faster then the current juggernaughts,

While I'm in favour of banning supercubes and not raising tunnel heights, I must correct you on a technicality. The GVW of a supercube can not exceed that of any other trailer unit. AFAIK the maz legal weight is 38tonnes. Supercubes can carry more volume but not more weight.

Victor

kbannon wrote:

...given that Ireland doesn't have any proper motorways but fancy dual carriageways!

Erm

Seth Brundle

Victor wrote:

Erm

I think you know what I meant!

Andrew Duffy

So what's a "proper motorway" then? The slight majority of the UK's motorways are dual two-lane, unlit, grade seperated roads like ours. And the majority of interchanges in the UK are roundabouts. Does the UK not have proper motorways?
If it's motorway-motorway interchanges, at the moment only two exist in this country - the M7-M9, which is a freeflowing fork, and the M50-M1, where the M50 teminates on a roundabout. This is being upgraded to a freeflowing three-level interchange called a directional-T as part of the M50 upgrade. The interchange between the M11 and the misnamed M50 south-eastern motorway (it is obviously a continuation of the M11) will also be a freeflowing fork, as will the M7-M8 and M4-M6. There are also several rather old-fashioned freeflowing trumpet interchanges on dual carriageways around the country.

BrianD

Will the free flowing forks be bi-directional? Exit 9 on the M7 (for the M9) only allows southbound traffic leave for the M9. If you are travelling north on the M7 you have to go to Exit 8 and backtrack to Exit 9 to get on the M9. Anyone lost yet?

BTW where the hell are the Exit numbers on the M1? I have also heard that the M1 extension from Dundalk to Newry is being project managed by the DOE in Northern Ireland.

Now we are completely off topic! BTW how high is the Jack Lynch tunnel in Cork.

Andrew Duffy

BrianD wrote:

Will the free flowing forks be bi-directional?

No. If they were, they'd be Directional-Ts.

BrianD wrote:

BTW where the hell are the Exit numbers on the M1?

I have been meaning to ask the NRA this for a while. I suspect they're leaving numbering until the network is more complete. Since it opened, I've taken two trips north on the M1 to bypass the N2, and I still haven't taken the correct exit for the new Ardee link road. I presume it's actually the third exit marked Ardee.

BrianD wrote:

I have also heard that the M1 extension from Dundalk to Newry is being project managed by the DOE in Northern Ireland.

An extra 11km of motorway is being added to the north of the M1 as the Dundalk Western Bypass, but to continue to Belfast you'll have to go around a roundabout and onto a dual-carriageway. This is because the authorities in the North (or popssibly Westminister) have no intention of building a motorway their side, so the road has to link up with the crappy A1 dual carriageway, full of right turns and the lovely section where one carriageway is straight and the other is the original road full of hairpins - fun to drive on but horribly dangerous.

BrianD wrote:

BTW how high is the Jack Lynch tunnel in Cork.

Same as the Dublin Port Tunnel and the proposed Shannon Tunnel in Limerick - 4.65m. Open to correction, of course.

BrianD

There is a major upgrade underway on the A1. It would be ironic to have the M1 from Belfast going south-west to Enniskillen and the M1 from Dublin going north to Belfast. Only in Ireland ...

Victor

BrianD wrote:

There is a major upgrade underway on the A1. It would be ironic to have the M1 from Belfast going south-west to Enniskillen and the M1 from Dublin going north to Belfast. Only in Ireland ...

In the original NI scheme (from very old history book) the M11 was Belfast-Newry and the M12 was Craigavon-Markethill (or thereabouts).

Victor

My, what a stupid piece. What started as concerns over narrowing the carriageway of the Port Tunnel (a consequence of raising the height in the circular tunnel) has now become "disaster".

http://home.eircom.net/content/unison/national/3782878?view=Eircomnet

Road disaster fear prompts minister's ban on supertrucks
From:The Irish Independent
Wednesday, 11th August, 2004

THE Government is to ban very tall trucks from roads to avoid a traffic disaster.

A maximum height for trucks will be introduced and it will be lower than that of some of the fleet already operating on our roads.

There is currently no height restriction for trucks and the radical measure is being taken in response to safety and environmental concerns.

The announcement will be made within the next few weeks, to coincide with official confirmation that the height of the Dublin Port Tunnel will not be increased to accommodate the supertrucks, also known as supercubes.

Minister of State Dr Jim McDaid, who is responsible for the haulage sector, told the Irish Independent yesterday that the new limit would not be any higher than 4.65m, the maximum clearance height of the tunnel.

Mr McDaid said "a catastrophe" on Irish roads was inevitable unless supertrucks - which rise to 4.8m and higher - were banned.

"They have have gone higher and higher and are carrying light loads. You can see them swaying in the wind. It is inevitable that there is going to be a catastrophe on our roads. It is only a matter of time," warned Dr McDaid.

Transport Minister Seamus Brennan will announce next month that the height of the Dublin Port Tunnel will not be increased because of major safety fears.

Mr Brennan has been officially told in writing by the National Roads Authority, Dublin City Council and other agencies that to increase the tunnel height would lead to serious accidents.

Mr Brennan is also to announce details of the maximum height limit for trucks coming into the state.

There will be a full period of consultation with the haulage industry before the height restriction is introduced.

But the move to restrict the truck height on Irish roads to 4.65m or less will lead to "war", according to haulage sources as some trucking firms have already invested in supercubes of 4.8m in height. Those are operating between Ireland and the UK.

Some 13 out of 15 EU countries will have lower height restrictions for trucks, some as low as 4.2m.

Studies have shown that fewer than 1pc of trucks will not be able to enter the Port Tunnel.

Mr Brennan has asked Dublin City Council to prepare a traffic management plan for the city when the Port Tunnel opens next year.

All trucks will be banned from Dublin City centre when the Port Tunnel opens, apart from those making deliveries.

Jimmy Quin, spokesman for the Irish Road Haulage Association (IRHA), said it would be "asinine" to have a 4.65m truck height limit when roads and bridge infrastructure with a 5m clearance was being put in place.

Mr Quin said the ultra high trucks, whose numbers are still small, used main roads operating between Britain and Ireland and could be catered for on the ferries.

Treacy Hogan Environment Correspondent

Irish-trucker

if you got it , a truck brought it .


so stop your moanin :cool:

sceptre

Irish-trucker wrote:

if you got it , a truck brought it .


so stop your moanin :cool:

You dragged up a four month old thread to make a contribution that wouldn't convince a three year old child with brain damage?

Well done.

Kaner

The solution to the tunnel height and 'supertruck' problem is to use trailers with lower decks and smaller tyres on triple axles. This will allow the use of two decks, except near the trailer hitch. You can buy a lot of trailers for the cost of raising the tunnel height.

BrianD

Am I imagining things or are their postings from at least three different threads here???

dmeehan

ask all those people who were stuck in a 14 mile tailback at rathcoole overbridge wether they think supercubes shuold be banned or not

sliabh

dmeehan wrote:

ask all those people who were stuck in a 14 mile tailback at rathcoole overbridge wether they think supercubes shuold be banned or not

I think the view is that the damage was caused by a crane. A supecube would usually be carrying light cargo (flowers was suggested by someone). They are all fairly light frame construction anyway, so the trailer would be shredded and the bridge should suffer only minor damage.

Victor

http://www.nra.ie/News/NewsAnnouncements/d1572.HTML.html

Limerick Southern Ring Road Phase II - Notification of Oral Hearing

DRAFT TOLL SCHEME FOR THE PROPOSED LIMERICK SOUTHERN RING ROAD PHASE II

An Oral Hearing will be held to inquire into matters raised in objections to the Draft Toll Scheme for the proposed Limerick Southern Ring Road Phase II. Mr. Maurice O’Connell has been appointed to hold this Oral Hearing which will commence on Tuesday 1st February, 2005 at 10.00am in the Kilmurry Lodge Hotel, Dublin Road, Castletroy, Limerick.