[BOOK CLUB] - Catch 22 *spoilers herewithin*

RE*AC*TOR

Welcome to the Second Book Club Discussion Thread


- This Thread is for the discussion of the book Catch 22 by Joseph Heller.

- Irrelevant posts will be deleted.

- It is assumed that everyone reading this thread has read Catch 22, therefore spoiler tags are not necessary.

- If the discussion includes references to other works, try not to spoil - as others may not have read it.

- Try to use quotes to illustrate your points if applicable.

- Keep the discussion about the book (ie don't make it personal).

- Discussion will begin on September 1st. All are free to participate.


- Most shops should have it, if not try http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0099477319/pd_ka_1/202-7159596-2765429




RE*AC*TOR


PS lolth - I used your intro from the last book club as template for above

LoLth

Book Club #2 thread is now open for business

John

I have to say I really enjoyed this book, I thought it was hilarious for the most part and bleak for a small chunk (especially towards the end). It reminded me of the M*A*S*H movie an awful lot, the dark humour and the dialogue were similar. I'm guessing M*A*S*H was written after Catch-22 although I can't remember when the original book of M*A*S*H was published.

RE*AC*TOR

M*A*S*H was written in 1968 - by Richard Hooker. Catch22 - 1951. It's a prevailing kind of humour associated with times of war. Its very interesting to trace the 9 Catch 22s in the book. The first being in chapter 4 where Colonel Korn has a rule allowing only those who never ask questions to ask questions.

Dont be at yourself

I really enjoyed the book, myself. I felt that it took a while to get going - there are just so many characters, and references to little incidents that don't happen until hundreds of pages later - but once you get into it it's very hard to put down. Very humorous too, but it often makes you feel guilty for laughing.

My favourite scene of the book is the briefing where Yossarian starts moaning in response to the nurse, with the whole room eventually erupting into moans and giggles. I've read plenty of funny books, but it took me a good 10 minutes to read those few pages I was laughing so much. Am I alone in that?

What were the 9 Catch-22s? Off the top of my head, I can think of the afformentioned question-asking one, the one where only crazy people can be grounded (and asking to be grounded is a sign of sanity), Major Major only allowing people in to see him when he wasn't there and Or telling Yossarian why the whore was hitting him over the head only when he had the apples in his cheeks.

John

I can't think of any more Catch-22's than those listed. I've never read a book that I wanted to start reading again immediately after I've finished.

Favourite character: Orr and his perfect logic (only telling Yossarian about the girl with show if he let him put the crab apples in his cheeks).

bandraoi

I read this book for about three months while studying fo my Leaving Cert. It's the only book I've ever memorised entire passages from just for their sheer perfection. To this day it is by far and above my favourite book.

I loved Milo Minderbinder.

RE*AC*TOR

Ok So the 2nd one is the insane men asking to be grounded are actually sane - that's chapter 5. The third one is in chapter 6 Army regulation Catch-22 says you've always got to do what your commanding officer tells you to do, even if it goes against army regulation. In chapter 9, regarding Mudd's belongings being moved from Yossarian's tent - only Yosarrian had a right to remove them, except Major Major deemes Yossarian to have no right - thus no one could remove them.
{phew too much writing - back later}

John

Hmmm, I don't think this is really a good book for discussion considering we all seem to have the same opinions on it.

RE*AC*TOR

All that's required is a couple of interesting points of discussion to stimulate this in the proper direction.
Ok, so I said there were 9 so-called catches. I outlined the first 4 above.
The next 5 are in chapters 10, 11, 12, 16 and 39. Anyone wanna have a stab at them?

RE*AC*TOR

hmmm, tumbleweed time.....
anyway chapter 10 :- Seargeant Towser may admit men to see Major Major - but only when he's out.

I'm guessing this thread is dead. Oh well, sin é.

gogo

After all my posts in the suggestions thread I am sorry to admit that I didn't get a chance to read the book, I started a new job and i haven't even read the paper since. altho i started catch 22, unless I could comment on the first two chapters I'd be at a loss here.
Sorry reactor, I hopefully will get a chance to read it yet. It started off brillantly if thats any good to any one.

gogo

RE*AC*TOR

don't worry about it, these things are hard to organise anyway, people lose interest, have other things to do etc.

DapperGent

Nearly finished it, busy month. Haven't read this thread. Will comment when I'm finally done.

I'm enjoying it hugely and would have been finished ages ago but for huge busyness.

OfflerCrocGod

The book is brilliant.....it makes it kinda hard to have a discussion about it doesn't it?...let's b1tch about J. Heller for writing a flawless masterpiece

impr0v

Heh, just finished it in time to discover that this is no longer a sticky, my attention span is shot to pieces lately.

Again, I can't do much other than echo the fact that it was an enjoyable and very funny book. It did certainly get darker towards the end and Heller seemed to be in a rush to kill off a number of characters in quite a short period of time.

I guess Yossarian getting to go home (via Sweden) should have been a satisfactory end to the book, but I was left feeling that it was all tied up rather hurriedly, and that Nately's whore's ultimately unexplained murderous intentions towards Yossarian were used as a sort of deus ex machina to hustle the book towards that hurried conclusion. For me those murderous intentions were the one part of the book that grated, and didn't really tie into the whole, despite them being no more surreal than any other goings-on. She considered Yossarian a bad influence, as all women did, and he was the one to tell her of Nately's death, but that still doesn't explain to me why murdering Yossarian suddenly became such an important thing to her. Perhaps she also blamed him for getting her and the others thrown out of the apartment when the military police sacked the place?

Overall though, it's very hard to direct any real criticism at the book, and it's not hard to see why it has done so well. I was surprised at how well the book has dated, in terms of language, which surely is testament to how far advanced it was at the time. Also, it's worth stated what a marvellous job the author did on maintaining the sense of frantic urgency throughout the book. At no time does one get the sense that the book took the eight or so years it took to write, it seems to have been blurted out in a series of big blasts, like Kerouac banging away on a typewriter for 15 hours hyped on benzedrine.

theCzar

I wish i'd found this thread earlier, so sorry if i'm digging up dead threads...

I've read Catch 22 several times, it's the only book i've read that periodicly caused me to put it down, stare into space as laughter and revulsion fought a pitched battle in my brain.

case in point: "M&M enterprises", primarly when he negotiates a contract to do a bombing, and at the same time hires himself out to the Germans to shoot down the bombers, but it's ok, "because everyone has a share" and the command accept that. Looking at todays business dealings (Haliburton anybody), it's not that far fetched!

Heller's greatest triumph was conveying the maddening helplessness of Yossarian, unable to escape (by legititmate means) what seemed like certain death. I found myself really hating orr for blocking yossarians escape, his jovial nature in the face of death was so infuriating.

I haven't read it in a year or so, so apologies for inaccuracies, i was a vague as i dared