interesting John Kerry documentary

hitachi_man

for those of us following the US presidential race, i discovered a perplexing video about kerry. i posted about it here. what do you think?

alleepally

Just had a look at it earlier on and it's not so much perplexing as not a surprise, considering who the makers of the documentary are, and who pays for the site the video is on, namely:

"Paid for by the Republican National Committee and
Bush-Cheney '04, Inc."

What happens in the US is not just of concern to the people of the US. Personally, I pray that Bush will not be re-elected and I know that many billions around the world would join me in that prayer. Pity we all can't vote in November as 'concerned citizens of planet Earth'.

Nick_oliveri

alleepally wrote:

What happens in the US is not just of concern to the people of the US. Personally, I pray that Bush will not be re-elected and I know that many billions around the world would join me in that prayer. Pity we all can't vote in November as 'concerned citizens of planet Earth'.

Ne'er a truer word could be said. Well done

OY

I have posted my thoughts on this site before but i will repeat them here.

I am well aware of who made this and of how biased it is naturally going to be. But it is the reasons hinted at in this video that make me think Kerry is just jumping on a band wagon and is not a good cantidate for president.

This is my first time seeing this movie but i have been thinking for some time now that he seems confused and flustered on his issues.

His sudden anti-war stance is just a springbaord to the white house.

bobbyjoe

Watched to doc.
Not surprising really also considering who made it.
The clips jump around from 2003 to 1998 one toward the end. Jumping scenes around and taking comments out of context that reminds me of a criticism made against someone else.

Its funny that the Republicans are using the fact that he believed the intelligence given to him by Bush against him. I'd expect bush to have a lot more info than a senator.
He consistently said that he wanted more diplomacy, and to give the inspections more time and that they should disrupt Saddam's regime.
He voted to give Bush authority to fight if Hussein didn't comply with inspectors

Their also attacking him on his career in the Senate even though Bush dosen't have one!! He went from Gov of Texas to the Whitehouse.

This flip-flop term comes from Fox. They spent loads of time talking about the ballons and how the directer swore while on tv (which he didn't know was being broadcast and also so fing what!!!) in depth analysis there.

Kerry isn't an ideal candidate but even Krusty the clown would be better than the chimp man.

OY

Kerry isn't an ideal candidate but even Krusty the clown would be better than the chimp man.

Pity we all can't vote in November as 'concerned citizens of planet Earth'.

I agree with the second quote but ask you bobbyjoe if you are sure that Kerry will be any better than Bush. He would have done nothing different in these past few years and the situation today would be the exact same in my opinion.

So if your beef is with Bush then fine, let us oust him but i am not happy that his replacement is not 'the ideal candidate'.

In 4 years time will we be wanting Kerry ousted???

bobbyjoe

He would have done nothing different in these past few years and the situation today would be the exact same in my opinion.

Doubt it.
Most people would have realised that they had little or no evidence of a threat from Saddam and let the inspectors do their job, maybe built up a some foreign support.
Kerry having been to war woul be a lot slower to put people in harms way than Bush who has no compulsion about it. He hasen't even attended a funeral, a large percentage of those out there are national guard or reservists (ie cheaper) despite ducking out of it when he had the chance.

Check out this one.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article6423.htm

In 4 years time will we be wanting Kerry ousted???

Maybe but if Bush gets a second term he can do what he likes, watch out Iran, but hey if your rich great tax cuts for you.

OY

Most people would have realised that they had little or no evidence of a threat from Saddam

Sure...he is a nice guy! I am not saying for a minute that i am happy with the war in Iraq. But i am also not willing to say that to leave him be would have been a good move either.

let the inspectors do their job, maybe built up a some foreign support.

The inspectors have been in the country since 1991 and despite clear violations (thinking of those long range rockets Saddam was producing, you know the ones he spent the last 10 yers saying he had none of) they did nothing.
If by foreign support you mean the UN then account for the divisions that lie within the UN. Jacquass Chirac et al are no better than Bush and have their own interests in mind!

But seriously my issues though are not with Bush. Do you not think that the same 'intelligence' and the same agendas would have been there for Kerry as for Bush? After all it was Clinton, a democrat, who began bombing Baghdad in 98.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

bobbyjoe

Do you not think that the same 'intelligence' and the same agendas would have been there for Kerry as for Bush?

What intelligence? Powells presentation to the UN was a joke. The buildings shown had been inspected and found clear several times. He had graphic representations of moblie chemical units instead of photo's. Why? cos they didn't even know if they existed. No wonder the UN didn't back them. The 45 minute claim (I know it was British but still wasn't disputed).

The Republicans already had an agenda its called the new American Century, Rumsfeld and Cheney were after Iraq all along just looking for an excuse.

Giving Bush the benefit of the doubt and that he really believed all this shouldn't he resign after starting a war for nothing (he ousted Saddam and no I'm not a Saddam lover but that wasn't the original intention). If he was so worried about Saddam why did daddy sell him the chemicals in the first place? Why not isolate him and inspect the place to bits. Maybe because they knew they wouldn't find wmd's.

How come no one has resigned, Rumsfeld should be gone definitly but no he lets them go on and on. Tenent resigned (jumped before he was pushed imo) probably out of disgust at being on charge for the biggest f up ever.

Sand

What happens in the US is not just of concern to the people of the US. Personally, I pray that Bush will not be re-elected and I know that many billions around the world would join me in that prayer. Pity we all can't vote in November as 'concerned citizens of planet Earth'.

Im sure something could be worked out if you started paying taxes.

Kerry isn't an ideal candidate but even Krusty the clown would be better than the chimp man.

Kerry is just the same as Bush. Absolute same. Hell do everything as Bush would do it. Theres not a shred of difference between them on issues that matter to us - i.e. foreign policy.

Most people would have realised that they had little or no evidence of a threat from Saddam and let the inspectors do their job, maybe built up a some foreign support.

Kerry didnt. He was in fact urging armed action against Saddam for years.

If he was so worried about Saddam why did daddy sell him the chemicals in the first place? Why not isolate him and inspect the place to bits. Maybe because they knew they wouldn't find wmd's.

The answer to that is linked. Youre not isolating Saddam, youre isolating Iraq and your putting in place sanctions to stop any possible materials for a weapons programme or military buildup getting into the country. The problem is there are a lot of dual use items, that could be used for totally innocent purposes, or could be diverted to the military or a research programme. Because of shortages caused by those sanctions 4500 kids were dying each and every month.

Relax the sanctions with Saddam still in place and youre taking a large gamble that Saddam will have changed his ways and wont immediately try to develop WMD to re-assert his authority. Keep the sanctions in place indefinitly until Saddam dies or the regime falls and youre killing millions of innocents.

Back to the dual use items - US agencies provided biological cultures to the Iraqis - not for a weapons programme but as part of the Iraqis efforts to research and combat disease in Iraq. Were they stupid to believe that cover story? Yeah probably. Did figures in the administration know or at least suspect the truth? Almost definitly. Chemical weapons are even easier to make than biological ones, a competent chemist can churn out nerve agent like tabun, sarin or soman with ingredients that are all legally available. Relax the sanctions with Saddam in charge and the exact same thing happens again.

Kerry knew this back when he was arguing that ground troops were needed to remove the threat of Saddam once and for all. Bush knew it too. Spot the difference?

bus77

Sand wrote:

Kerry is just the same as Bush. Absolute same. Hell do everything as Bush would do it. Theres not a shred of difference between them on issues that matter to us - i.e. foreign policy.

That's true. But while I can picture Kerry nodding his head when others speak in his ear like Bush I can at least picture him raising his hand every once in awhile to ask a question. Thats the most important thing at this point.(Due to lack of choice )

OY

Kerry is just the same as Bush. Absolute same. Hell do everything as Bush would do it. Theres not a shred of difference between them on issues that matter to us - i.e. foreign policy.

Hurray! I agree Sand. Good man.

alleepally

Sand wrote:

Im sure something could be worked out if you started paying taxes.

Ah yes, the dollar is king of course.