Home Recording Equipment

Paladin

Ive got a zoom PS-02 myself (€140 2nd hand from US) and I personally think its absolutely awesome, although rather limited (punch-in is not very clever in it being the main complaint) but thats expected from something the size of a cigarette box. Excellent recording quality though.

I was just wondering what other people use or recommend? I will in future upgrade to something larger partially because I want to do drum recording in the future.

Doctor J

Drum recording means, realisitcally, 8 analogue (mic) inputs. This rules out practically all of the all-in-one multitrack units (Boss BR1180 etc).

Although it's not what you'd like to hear, the best solution for this is a PC/Mac based setup. A quality sound card and quality multi-track software. Pricey yes, but if you want real drums it's the only sensible solution.

Zoton

I just plug my guitar directly into the sound card, its a soundblaster live platinum, but the quality isn't very good so i wouldn't recommend it very highly. The sound gets a bit muddied, but putting it through and fx pedal helps.

Anyone know good drum tracks software available? (preferably freeware if possible)

blobert

I'd have to agree. PC home recording is definately the best way to go. It's not all that expensive these days a decent soundcard won't cost you that much either...

Doctor J

Originally posted by Zoton
Anyone know good drum tracks software available? (preferably freeware if possible)

Have a look for Hammerhead Rhythm Station. I use it for making demos of new tunes before they get rolled out to the band. It's not the be all and end all but it gets the job done. There are also different sound modules for it, search for acoustic3.hub, has a decent bass drum and snare sound.

Stream it to disk, then use cool edit or some wave editor to structure the patterns...

John

Can you load your own drum samples into that Hammerhead Rhythm Station or do you have to use sounds created for it?

Doctor J

I'd imagine you can load anything into it, I've never had the need.

blobert

Here's a great forum for you to find out about all things computer music related:

http://forum.midiaddict.com/

fitz

If you just looking to demo stuff, a soundblaster audigy (or equivalent) will do the job. You'll need dynamic mic, something that doesn't require phantom power.
If you get a condensor mic, you'll need a mixer in between it and the soundcard to provide the phantom power.

Then download Cubase or a similar DAW for recording/arranging, Soundforge for noise reducing and other processing, Fruity Loops or Reason for drum loops, and you're laughin.

Use the dynamic mic (an SM58 from Shure will give you great value) to record acoustic and electric guitar as well as vocals. Plug the bass straight into the soundcard.

Getting a good drum sound will need something a lot more involved, but if this is for demos, you're as well with the loops.
Or you could mic the kit with the SM58 in a central overhead position, but it won't sound as nice as clever loops done in Reason.

Also, if you're an experienced Linux user, you should check out www.agnula.org

Jammer

I have a Creative Soundblaster Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Pro...has all 1/4" jack plugs/midi/digital this and that. It came bundled with Cubase SX2...supports the ASIO 2 spec too. I bought it for recording, but havnt done much. It has all the games stuff like 7.1 sound, EAX etc etc. Its still the top of the range card AFAIK. Would recommend it to anyone.

Paladin

I was actually going to upgrade to something like this ZOOM MRS 802 . I didnt want the hassle of a PC, as my PC wont be able to stay with the recorder cause ill need it for college (and would have to buy a new one cause its too old to run any process intensive software - 333MHz).

Doctor J

I have a Boss BR1180 and a feature it shares with the Zoom is that you only have two inputs, which means you can't record drums (well). You can try but it'll suck and you'll have wasted your time and whatever drummer is sitting around scratchin his/her ass while you try to position two mics that just aren't up to the job to get some definition on the bass drum and kill the crippling high end from the cymbals. It's just not worth the heartache man. You'll need reaaly high quality mics to mic a drum kit like that and it'll still suck. Those types of recorders are fine for doing demos at home but you'll need to invest in a drum machine of sufficient quality that you don't want to smash it into millions of itty bitty pieces. If you want real drums, a PC is the only way to go. If not, the Zoom will do everything you need.

rob1891

I'm looking at 8 track 24bit 48khz firewire recorders on ebay, an out of date MOTU 828 goes for about 350 euro. Only difference between it and the newer model is the controls are better (the hardware underneath I am told is the same).

That's hardly a lot to spend, you'd probably get a brand new 4 track tape in rip off ireland for not much less and you can chain two of them together for 16 tracks if you need to at some point in the future.

At the moment we have cubase & a usb audiophile, which is a just 2 tracks of 24bit/48khz. 2 small mixers to fit about 6 mics for drums onto those two tracks. Lots of messing around to try and get everyone to play in time!!

Jammer

Need a fairly decent PC to keep up...latency can cripple a "live" band recording!

Eoin Madsen

Latency is only a problem if you're monitoring through the card. Monitor the input rather than the recording output and there'll be no problems.

WetDaddy

Or you could mic the kit with the SM58 in a central overhead position

Fitz, what do you think recording drums with a stereo Sony mic would sound like? That's what I'm planning to do over the next week or so.

I've tried in the past to mic up drums as much as possible using crappy Sennheisers and the like, but there's really very little benefit because you're left with no control.

Anyone know the best place to buy SM58's? Or anywhere that does them second hand?

fitz

Tbh, without properly micing the kit, your not gonna have much control, but if it's a nice room, you'll get a kinda lo-fi sound. Just don't expect to be able to do much with it. At least it'll be stereo.

Eoin is really the person to ask about recording stuff...he has vast knowledge of these things...

Zoton

Can cubase be used to make up drum tracks or is it just for editing them?

Eoin Madsen

I imagine you'll have better luck with the stereo sony mic than an SM58. As an overhead the 58 is a poor choice - it's a dynamic mic, and is thus less sensitive, and suffers from greater proximity effect and off-axis colouration. Basically, it records things right in front of it. A condensor (even a poor quality one like a Sony stereo one) will serve better as an overhead mic. Put it between 1.5 and 2 metres above the kick, and it should capture the whole kit. For basic micing with some control, you really just need an overhead (preferably two, or a stereo mic like you have), a mic for the kick and a mic for the snare. I'd recommend an AKG D112 for the Kick, and an SM57 for the snare. If you look in the resources thread stickied at the top of this forum, I think there's a link to a guy that does second hand gear in Ireland. An SM57 should be easy to come by. It's also good for recording guitar amps. Failing second hand, best place at the moment is http://www.thomann.de.

Cubase is a sequencer. It can't edit anything, really. It's primary function is for mixing and arranging wav files, segments of wav files, and MIDI sequences. You can program MIDI drums with it - like a drum machine - is that what you mean? With plugins like Halion or Gigasampler you can also program drum sequences in the same way but using your own samples.

WetDaddy

Thanks for the advice Eoin!

I think what I'll try is using the condenser for the overhead like you say, and cheapy sennheisers (due to funds) for the kick and snare, see how that sounds.

The question about the SM-58 was more aimed at recording vocals.

Hey, Fitz was right: You -DO- know your stuff!

("Off-axis colouration"... I must remember that one)


-S

Eoin Madsen

Well, you'd be better off recording vocals with a large diaphram condensor if you can get your hands on one. Look at the thomann.de t.bone range, they do a couple of decent ones for under 200 euros. The SM58 would do the job for demoing, but it's really just a live mic. What kind of Sennheissers do you have anyway?

WetDaddy

They're really cheap Sennheisers: I've got 2 e815s's.

It's only a really rough demo I'm recording at home, for the most part to just get arrangements down.

http://www.beemusic.com have used SM-58's for €65!

Just hope they're still open; the page kind of hints at them closing down or something.