Accident with tractor

Our man in Havana

Hi folks

I had a bit of misfourtune on Friday morning involving a tractor.
What happened is as follows, I was driving along at about 40-45 ona road which I have driven loads of times. Came up to a bend and proceeded around it. Then suddenly a tractor was parked across the whole width of the road. I tried to stop but no joy as I hit the front of the tractor, either that or impail myself on its rear spikes.

Anyway. Car wrote off, chaisis bent. No damage to tractor. Cops came and were very unhelpful. Refused to do anything about the tractor driver unless they charge me with careless driving. Was cautioned at scence. Everything cleaned up and car taken to scrapyard.

The whole thing stinks. I wasnt speeding and they condone the behaviour of the tractor driver ie parking a tractor crossways as to obstruct the whole road.

I am annoyed. Any advice would be appreciated.

Time Man

You are supposed to be travelling at such a speed that you can stop in time. Can you get the dudes insurance details and then just make a claim?

Sleipnir

Was the tractor insured to be on a public road?
afaik, farmers sometimes insure them to operate only on their own property, i.e not on public roads in which case he would have been there illegally.

but I'm a little vague about that so you might want to double-check it.

seamus

What was the response of the tractor driver?

I assume the Gardai took his name and insurance details. If it was a country road, the trouble is that the local cops will always fall on the side of the local farmers.

Put in a claim against his insurance company. Claim that he was parked dangerously (5 penalty points). Careless driving is a serious offence. If the Gardai were serious about using that against you, they would have charged you on the spot.

From the way you've said it, it stinks completely, but I could be picking it up wrong. As Sleipnir says, farmers don't need to insure their vehicles for use on private property. Check his insurance to see if it's valid.

jongore

Your screwed, even if make a claim if the cops took his side any claim against his insurance would be thrown out.

BTW most tractors will be insured, it costs bugger all and farmers can get a blanket insurance for farm, car and tractors etc.

Our man in Havana

The farmer had a valid insurance on his window. The cops read a caution to both of us. Him for dangerous parking and me for careless driving.

Dunno what to read into it.

I am worried if I report the accident it would immediately hike my insurance. I dont intend claiming against my policy.

Fudger

jasus thats a bitch. Sorry for your troubles.

first thing i would do is get the tractors reg number and check out its insurance policy and tax situation. He might not have either (as most bloody tractors) and therefore shouldn't be on a public road. Also find out what the hell he was doing? what was he doing in the middle of the road? If he was doing work for the council or something like that he should have had roadworks or work in progress clearly marked at least 200 metres form where he was operating. Also the appropiate permission. Also check out what he/she is licenced to drive. Could be a simple case of he doesn't have a tractor allowance on his licence. Wouldn't be the first case i have heard off. The avenues are pretty open i.e. you could go for road worthyness etc..... the tractor drivers driving history......etc etc etc

it depends how ruthless your willing to be and making sure you have a good solicitor familiar with this kinda stuff...........its a very common occurance.

i wouldn't worry about the gardai getting on your balls. If there is a valid reason against the tractor driver a judge will go with the law and not some toothless overpaid security guard..... i mean the gardai !

seamus

How can they say, "OK, you're both wrong, now f*ck off before we charge you?". Clearly the whole point of a dangerous parking charge is because of the serious risk it poses to other traffic, as this did.

Time Man

Originally posted by Bond-007
I am worried if I report the accident it would immediately hike my insurance. I dont intend claiming against my policy.

It won't hike your insurance, I had an accident with a scumbag refugee last year, his fault but I still reported it to my insurance as he was driving without insurance. They told me it wouldn't affect my insurance at all and it hasn't

seamus

Originally posted by Bond-007
I am worried if I report the accident it would immediately hike my insurance. I dont intend claiming against my policy.

You're obliged to report all accidents to your insurer, whether you're claiming from them or not. If they eventually hike your insurance because of it, you can land them in serious ****. Just tell them that the accident occured, and neither party is taking it any further, to the best of your knowledge. You'll fill out an accident report form, and a few days later, a rep will ring you to discuss it, particularly if he believes you should pursue it.

I don't see why you're so worried about a hike though? Surely the cost of replacing your car will be more than any insurance hike?
I'd say, make a claim against his insurance company, but be prepared for a counter-claim. Discuss it with solicitors/your insurance co., and if everyone is telling you that you won't win, broker a 50-50 deal with the farmer.

BUMP!

Don't report it to your insurance. If they find out well great for them. Simply put - do you TRUST your insurance co? (I DONT!! )

Talk to a solicitor and be HONEST re the details and he will be able to either sue the farmer or his ins co for the damages. Make sure the solicitor knows all the facts however - if you get this wrong you are leaving yourself open for serious trouble...

Our man in Havana

The car was only worth about €700. Its more the inconience that it has caused. The policy is due for renewal anyway and I am worried that they would refuse cover on any new car.

ahearn

you seem to have forgotten one little fact, and long may it live with you plus €700 is not much to pay to get you to think about your driving skills.

.....yeah what did you hit? a 'tractor'...your just damn lucky you didnt hit a couple of kids out cycling or crossing the road at that point or any other pedestrians, then you wouldn't be on here whining about what to do....

you were doing 40-45 around an obviously blind bend where you had no idea what was around the corner 'case in point' you couldn't stop in time when you saw the tractor...well the tractor didn't move, you got a 'bent' chassis???

it's pretty clear to me and i'ld imagine in the gardai's minds, you were careless 'mildly' wreckless 'in my view' driving with total disregard to where you were, what type of road you were on, what was ahead of you around a completely 'blind' corner, and what else may have been on the road at the same time as you.

people like you cause the death of many children on our roads....if you are gonna get yourself another car, I'ld suggest you sit back and think about what just happened and what might've been.

kindoff a different story if you were sitting in the joy now with 10yrs for death caused by wreckless driving?

Our man in Havana

I would like to thank everyone for their views and advice. I have been advised to make offical complaints to the Gardai about their conduct and as such I would like to leave it at that.

ahearn

My whole point is that YOU are supposed to be driving in such a manner as to be able to STOP when you happen upon an obsticle in front of you.

You've obviously not read my post as I mentioned nothing about the tractor being parked illegally, I'm simply trying to point out to you that YOU hit the tractor, the tractor did not hit you, and wrote off your car.....would you have been able to stop if it was a pedestrian crossing the road?

Simple really, it could've been a pedestrian, it could've been a broken down car/bus, it could've been a tree over the road, you were driving wrecklessly and without due regard, if you can't admit that then god help us all.

seamus

Originally posted by ahearn
My whole point is that YOU are supposed to be driving in such a manner as to be able to STOP when you happen upon an obsticle in front of you.

You've obviously not read my post as I mentioned nothing about the tractor being parked illegally, I'm simply trying to point out to you that YOU hit the tractor, the tractor did not hit you, and wrote off your car.....would you have been able to stop if it was a pedestrian crossing the road?

Simple really, it could've been a pedestrian, it could've been a broken down car/bus, it could've been a tree over the road, you were driving wrecklessly and without due regard, if you can't admit that then god help us all.

If a tractor is taking up the entire width of the road, then it's not possible to avoid one. Most of the time when you come upon a vehicle on a blind corner, you don't have time to stop, but you do have space to slow down and avoid them.
You don't know the nature of the crash, no-one here does except Bond. Every road user has a duty to prevent accidents. If you break down on a blind corner, or are carrying out work, you have a responsibility to either warn oncoming traffic, or alert the Gardai, so they can do it. If you're crossing the road, you do it somewhere where you're visible. The rules of the road may be black and white, but their application isn't. It could be argued that in order to drive safely and avoid all accidents, you don't drive at all, and your very being on the road in the first place caused the accident.

If he had ran over some pedestrians who didn't have the good sense to cross at a better place, they would certainly share the blame, IMO.

mike65

ahearn, pipe down.

Bond 007 I feel for you, and for the rest of you

BUY A FECKING CAMERA!

Nothing like a few pix to show a solicitor or insurancve company if you report it.

Mike.

rander00

Hes obviously in the wrong. Driving on a road he "knew", and still crashed????

Such a plonker,, if you were driving properly, you would have been able to stop. Your supposed to be expecting tractors on country roads, and if it was "Blocking the whole road", (would have to be sideways parked nearly), you would have been heading for tractors side and not the "rear spikes". What if it was the farmers jeep? Thats what has insurance so expensive,,, muffty`s in there little hyped up E700 bangers crashing into good drivers with E30,000 jeeps and stuff.

So learn how to drive and stop whinging bout your E700 piece of ****. I bet the farmer would bust his hole laughing at you if you told him you were taking it further. You take a blind bend on a country road at 30 or else expect the worst.

Cucullan

Ahern what are you on about, whats the point in saying he could have hit this or that HE DIDN'T, he hit a tractor that a farmer was ignorant enough to park on a bad bend. Your either one of two things 1) Some city slicker who never drove on a country road (country road been where thick farmers drive along taking up the whole road with their machinery and everyone is supposed to get out of their way)
OR 2) A Farmer

seamus

Originally posted by rander00
Hes obviously in the wrong. Driving on a road he "knew", and still crashed????

Such a plonker,, if you were driving properly, you would have been able to stop. Your supposed to be expecting tractors on country roads, and if it was "Blocking the whole road", (would have to be sideways parked nearly), you would have been heading for tractors side and not the "rear spikes". What if it was the farmers jeep? Thats what has insurance so expensive,,, muffty`s in there little hyped up E700 bangers crashing into good drivers with E30,000 jeeps and stuff.

So learn how to drive and stop whinging bout your E700 piece of ****. I bet the farmer would bust his hole laughing at you if you told him you were taking it further. You take a blind bend on a country road at 30 or else expect the worst.

Nice troll. Almost got by me

DMC

Originally posted by mike65
Bond 007 I feel for you, and for the rest of you

BUY A FECKING CAMERA!

Nothing like a few pix to show a solicitor or insurancve company if you report it.

Yep, I always carry a camera in the car too. A cheap disposable could be worth €€€€ to you in the long run. I'd say if you whipped out a camera in front of the guard and the farmer, the guard may have acted differently.

Bond, I hope you get that Astra I suggested

JohnBoy

Ahern what are you on about, whats the point in saying he could have hit this or that HE DIDN'T, he hit a tractor that a farmer was ignorahe nt enough to park on a bad bend.

His point is when you're in control of a motor car you're only supposed to be going so fast as to allow you to stop within your field of vision.

If you drive round a corner and plough into anything that was hidden around the blind bend you are automatically in the wrong.

you came round the corner too fast.

they call em blind bends for a reason. if you cant see what's in front then slow down.

whether the farmer was in some way to blame or not is entirely immaterial. you came round the corner too fast to be able to stop when an obstruction presented itself.

and the point about what if it was a kid the far side of the bend is perfectly valid.

just like if a driver runs into the back of another car they are entirely at fault.

it's up to you to protect yourself against things like this.

John

woody

The Law is an ass but John is right although the Farmer was a total tool.

Happened to me in Carlow Came round a bend and car had stopped for a feckin fox, was at 30 mph in a 60 zone.

Slam, the mup in the crappy micra worth about 2k punt at the time sent me an invoice for nearly 5 k... I said F*ck him and went to court worked in my favour but was rare.


Simple as this in an area ie. brow of a hill, bend, low vis. Slow down to a snails pace why as it will be for a short period and you can then react quicker a lot of us have learned the hard way.

As for the Camera, 100% I have two in the booth just in case.

Time Man

Where do you keep the booth?

Originally posted by woody
The Law is an ass but John is right although the Farmer was a total tool.

Happened to me in Carlow Came round a bend and car had stopped for a feckin fox, was at 30 mph in a 60 zone.

Slam, the mup in the crappy micra worth about 2k punt at the time sent me an invoice for nearly 5 k... I said F*ck him and went to court worked in my favour but was rare.


Simple as this in an area ie. brow of a hill, bend, low vis. Slow down to a snails pace why as it will be for a short period and you can then react quicker a lot of us have learned the hard way.

As for the Camera, 100% I have two in the booth just in case.

ahearn

Ahern what are you on about, whats the point in saying he could have hit this or that HE DIDN'T, he hit a tractor that a farmer was ignorant enough to park on a bad bend. Your either one of two things 1) Some city slicker who never drove on a country road (country road been where thick farmers drive along taking up the whole road with their machinery and everyone is supposed to get out of their way)

very astute observation Cucullan your addition to the thread is astounding and worthy of a set of oversized flanges for your 4ltr 85 imported micra.
Do you know what a farmer is? and do you yourself know how to drive on a country road besides what you probably try and imitate in your turbo-charged micra after watching some rally driving programme for tuned-up glorified washing machines.
I won't even attempt to answer your 'thick' farmer comment since that belongs on a diff. thread, one i'm sure your quite boistreous on.

when you come upon a veichle on a blind corner you should be able to stop, if not your a careless driver. when you do 40-45mph around a blind corner your a suicidal driver and don't belong on any road.

from reading replies I'ld say about 3 ppl actually know how to drive, the rest just start-car, accelerate and turn off until it's time to get out of car.

enjoy it because the next corner might not have a tractor across the road, but a member of your own family and deny it all you want by fronting yourself on the board with a 'don't give a ****' attitude.

..it's your life, go kill who you want with it, once it's not me or mine.

tara.

Discovering

What happened to you was pretty unfortunate.

Technically and to the letter of the law you were (partly) at fault.

I also think the farmer was equally at fault and that is probably why the gardas warned both of you.

However this post raises an interesting issue.

If everyone drove on country roads where they could react to all possible causes of crashes we would never get anywhere.

What we got to do is get everyone to drive with safety in mind!

I am sure the driver of the tractor knows the road well and the average speed of cars on that road and that the way he parked would make it very difficult for a car to get stopped.

Therefore if he put a little consideration to safety he would realise the danger.

But he knew that if someone hit him that he would probably not get in trouble regardless of the circumstances.

Finally I could not agree more with mike65 about the camera. Less than 10 quid and can really prove what actually happened. Cheapest Insurance in Ireland!!!

My girlfriend was in an accident on a narrow country road.

The pictures of the camera proved she was on her side of the road and took evasive manoeuvres and the other car was in the middle of the road.

Otherwise it would be her word against the other driver.

byte

Yeah, I always carry a camera in the car. And I agree with Discovering's previous post.

Cucullan

It must be brilliant been perfect Ahern, never made a mistake in your life no!
As it happens I drive an 01 Skoda Octavia and I do drive very carefully as I usually have my 2 year old son with me strapped safely in his child seat. I drive on country roads the whole time as thats where I've lived most of my life. Fair enough you do meet them d****s in their heaps of s**t but I'm not one. The point I was making was there is no point in saying he might have hit this or he might have hit that, if we were to give our whole lives worrying what "might" happen we might as well all stay at home. Of course people should drive at speeds suited to what road their driving on that goes without saying but maybe 45 mph was an accepable speed for the bend he took. Like I said I drive on country roads the whole time and I've seen alot of farmers doing alot of stupid things and not just on blind bends and sometimes no matter how careful you drive sometimes accidents can't be avoided.
Of course Ahern you don't have to take anybody's advice because your soooo perfect.

FAYESY

I'd like to raise a point or 2 - I am not flaming! I have read this post which my husband started.

1) Yes Bond was driving a tad too fast - so yes it is partly his fault.

2) The farmer had pulled out of a field & was accross "side ways" with the SPIKES on Bonds side of the road - he applied the breaks but could not stop in time, so he swerved into the front of the tractor. I feel if he had hit the spikes I would be a window right now, all because the farmer wanted to close the gate of the field he had just driven out of.

3) The gards were unhelpful, they even offered to take Bond home but said if he left the car there they would prosecute! How was that helpful? Bond was on the phone to me & was in a state of shock, as they offered no constructive help at all.

4) The road Bond was on was a de-restricted road i.e 60mph limit. Bond was travelling at approx 40mph on a road he knows very well. I know my hubby IF he could have STOPPED he WOULD have.

I hope you will take a concerned wifes opinions into consideration, before this argument gets out of hand. We have spoken with a lawyer, in there considered opinion the conduct of the Gardi was nothing short of disgraceful, and we have been advised to report the matter to the superintendant, and feel it would be wrong to make any further comment.

Stephen

Ahearn, won't somebody PLEASE think of the CHILDREN!!$!£$!


/me pukes