How durable are CD-R's

ZENER

A rather worrying report from a Dutch computer mag about the claimed lifespan of CD-R media.

Doesn't go into specific manufacturers but seems to point a finger at cheap 100 for a tenner discs. Interesting read !!

ZENER

EDIT// DOH !!!!

Sorry !

leeroybrown

Link?

I've always tried to avoid using low quality media for anything I intend keeping myself. I generally only buy good branded Discs (generally Ritek). I've built up a lot of CD's (soon to become DVD's) and I have to say that the quality media almost always stands the test of time.

I've seen low quality discs (I'm not even talking 100 for 10 bad here) bleached to an unrecognisable colour and rendered useless by sunlight in a very short time. Not my discs luckily and they were left in a spindle in direct sunlight. In general anything including the worst discs available will write sucessfully in any burner. It's the ease with which they scratch and especially the deterioriation of the dye over time that is the problem.

po0k

or when their brittle polymer snaps in your slot-loading 16x DVD drive and takes out the lens armature.....

tman

/me shakes fist at Mr. Data cdr's

verbatim datalife plus are the only blank cdr's that i allow into my drive these days.
judging by peoples reccomedations, ritek will be all i'll use once i get a dvdr drive.
its worth paying that little extra for peace of mind

ZENER

The news article says the tried many different brands of media !

How long do you expect your data to last? Makers claim anything up to 100 years, that test says more like 2 or 3 years !

ZENER

aaf

Originally posted by tman
/me shakes fist at Mr. Data cdr's

verbatim datalife plus are the only blank cdr's that i allow into my drive these days.
judging by peoples reccomedations, ritek will be all i'll use once i get a dvdr drive.
its worth paying that little extra for peace of mind

From what I've been reading, you're probably better off getting Verbatim DVD's aswell. Good, reliable brand.

Captain Trips

Yeah cheap CDs don't last, some stuff I've burned back in 96 or so at 2x era (maybe even 1x, christ that was a while ago) doesn't work for me, when CDRs were expensive and I was poor. I usually reburn data every 2 years now, nothing really important, but mostly my documents and stuff.

I think it's data that is largely affected, as old audio CDrs on the same media is still good (at least to my ear, there are undoubedtly lots of inaudible errors). No idea about DVDs but given that the data is in much smaller spaces (physically), data loss is probably more likely on poor quality discs; we'll see in 2 or 3 years I suppose as DVDRs are at the dirt cheap stage (almost).

Caliden

Go PC-Line 50 cds for a tenner!!

only use em to put crap onto basically or for giving to relations/friends etc

blobert

I think generally the less you pay the crapper the quality, though this is not always the case. Good old Mr. Data makes some pretty good disks (if you get the Audio ones) that still work after several years.

I did make the mistake of buying 100 unbranded cds for super cheap that hardly work at all. You can't burn music tracks on to them at more than about 2x speed without getting all kinds of crazy remixes of your songs that you didn't want!

Then again I bought a whole bunch of expensive Memorex ones that were useless too. Best to find somthing that your happy with and stick with them.

Captain Trips

Originally posted by blobert
I think generally the less you pay the crapper the quality, though this is not always the case. Good old Mr. Data makes some pretty good disks (if you get the Audio ones) that still work after several years.

Yeah I second that; I have had no probs with Mr. Data (and even with the idiot in Peats saying that "those are for data only, they won't burn audio" because that even makes sense (not kidding, he told me that).

HP 80mins ones work well for me as well, but TDK 80 mins won't play in my car. Both of these I regard as "premium" brands.

byte

I have for a long time, used Verbatim DataLifePlus (SuperAZO) discs and have never had any problems with them.

Currently using Maxell discs, though it'll be a while before I see how the last longterm.

hostyle

Originally posted by Caliden
Go PC-Line 50 cds for a tenner!!

only use em to put crap onto basically or for giving to relations/friends etc

I've been using them for over two years with only one batch of failures, and it was a bit obvious they were bad ones. When I opened the pack, I got a shower of little silver snowflakes.

I even have 5 year old crap quality (ie. deep blue dye) CDs that still work perfectly. If you don't look after your CDs they will fail pretty quickly. Keep them away from sunlight, heat, moisture and dust. Don't store them on the spindles you bought them on. Don't use jewel cases (or at least not ones that are likely to crack, shatter when you open them, or that have problems releasing the CD). I use those big 120 and 240 CD holder bags.

And always, always, always check the integrity of the CD immediately after you burn it. Nero CD-Speed Tools ScanDisc (under Extras menu) and / or WinDiff.

PS. I only have a really old 8x LG burner and get very few problems with the CDs it produces. But I have noticed that a lot of people with these new fangled high speed burners with countless media failure problems.

Caliden

yah still a few left out of my 2nd load and, had a few failed burns due to broken cd-writer so cant blame cd's. keep em in 120 cd holder bag with plastic sleeves, does the job

Stephen

I've been using a bunch of imation 40x CD-R's for over a year now without problems. previously had problems with those sh1tty "vivastar" yokes.

LegacyUser

Vivastar 100 for a tenner - one in ten work if im lucky. you think im playing? Stall over and have a look...i tried buring some mp3's onto a cd for a mate and the cd's were utter crap and locking in my drive.

Im buying verbatim right now judging from this thread.

ZENER

Sorry for cutting in guys but the article was about the lifespan proclaimed by manufacturers of blank media.

We have all been duped into believing that we can still have our precious data/music/photos in pristine condition in 100 years time. It seems now this was an "untruth" or distortion of the facts.

Ok I accept that some brands work better than others but I think that's partially down to compatibility between media and burner and is a different issue.

I'm a firm believer in the phrase - you get what you pay for - but in this case do you really ? If you pay top notch say 1 or 2 euro for a blank CD will it last the claimed 100 years - judging by the article - it doesn't look like it. So could we accuse the makers of false advertising ? Can we blame them for loss of precious data ?

Irrespective of brand/price do you think any media can last the claimed 100 years ? The makers claim to have ways of simulating the aging process of goods like CD-R media, this is how they are able to make the claims they do, should they review these methods? Or should we as users pay more attention to the small print on the box ?


ZENER

LegacyUser

Originally posted by ZENER
Sorry for cutting in guys but the article was about the lifespan proclaimed by manufacturers of blank media.

We have all been duped into believing that we can still have our precious data/music/photos in pristine condition in 100 years time. It seems now this was an "untruth" or distortion of the facts.

Ok I accept that some brands work better than others but I think that's partially down to compatibility between media and burner and is a different issue.

I'm a firm believer in the phrase - you get what you pay for - but in this case do you really ? If you pay top notch say 1 or 2 euro for a blank CD will it last the claimed 100 years - judging by the article - it doesn't look like it. So could we accuse the makers of false advertising ? Can we blame them for loss of precious data ?

Irrespective of brand/price do you think any media can last the claimed 100 years ? The makers claim to have ways of simulating the aging process of goods like CD-R media, this is how they are able to make the claims they do, should they review these methods? Or should we as users pay more attention to the small print on the box ?


ZENER

No.

Just buy verbatim. they do the job.

hostyle

Originally posted by ZENER
So could we accuse the makers of false advertising ? Can we blame them for loss of precious data ?

No and no. Maybe they do have a 100 year life span - in a clean room. Or under some other special conditions. People always buy into this "will last a lifetime" crap and never question the small print.

I'm not trying to defend the manufacturers of crappy CD-Rs BTW.

As for loss of your precious data, I presume you have multiple backups in multiple locations? And when one backup fails / is lost you create a new one from a remaining good backup? If not its no ones fault but your own.

leeroybrown

At the end of the day, CDR's aren't a permenant archival format. I can remember reading an article somewhere 7 or 8 years ago describing archival on CD's (I think they were refering to profesionally pressed media too) as having a limited shelf life and nothing has changed since. I have a lot of stuff stored on CD only, but nothing I wouldn't be able to replace.

Specific audio CD-Rs were created by manufacturers in the hope that they could impose some regulation on the market. All the original Audio CD copiers would only work with the specific Audio CD's and for a long time manufacturers avoided the data CD-R compatability that we take for granted now.

Originally posted by SyxPak
or when their brittle polymer snaps in your slot-loading 16x DVD drive and takes out the lens armature.....

I remember that. When that CD sheared in half the fragments absolutely mashed the drive internals.

Some tests were conducted a year or so ago to see what speeds were needed to generate sufficient centripetal force to tear a CD apart (I'm sure you remember it SyxPak ). The speeds required aren't that far from today's CD drives:

http://www.paintbug.com/cdexplode/

I find that the greatest cause of failure of my CDR's are scratches from dropping them and manhandling they take while being moved. My DVD-R / DVD+R collection will be treated much more gently.