Gothic 2 - I am hopelessly addicted

Mad Mike

Has anyone else out there played this awesomely beautiful game?

It has provoked mixed feelings among reviewers. Many criticise its non-intuitive interface and the general difficulty level. Others give it top marks. In general serious RPGers seem to rate it higher than casual gamers. RPGdot awarded it game of the year last year.

The interface is certainly non-intuitive - there isn't even a mouse cursor. The combat interface in particular takes some getting used to. It takes a little investment of time to get used to this game but once you have made the effort it really does pay off.

Much of this diffculty is actually deliberate. In fact some options like quick save and instant potion drinking which are disabled by default can actually be enabled in an ini file. This ini file is a real gem because it is filled with notes from the developers explaining why they chose each option (eg "we have disabled instant potion drinking by default because we think it ruins the game"). Many professional reviewers of the game clearly never found out about this ini file - because their reviews are full of complaint about the lack of instant potions.

I have to admit I play with quick save enabled but i have left instant potion drinking off and I agree with the developers - it is a better game for that.

Gothic 2 is a beautifully constructed immersive world with a strong storyline and challenging quests. If you tweak up the graphics and sound settings the outdoor scenes in particular (with the possible exception of dodgy water effects) are superb.

So if you are lookng for a superb, beautiful, challenging role playing experience and if you are prepared to invest a little time and effort to get it - you have to try this game.

AL][EN

/me skuttles off to find a copy of gothic 2

as soon as i find it i'll let you know. i havent actually herd of the game but im intrigued........

Mad Mike

Originally posted by AL][EN
/me skuttles off to find a copy of gothic 2

as soon as i find it i'll let you know. i havent actually herd of the game but im intrigued........

You won't regret it. Be prepared to struggle for a little bit at the beginning and not just because of the non-intuitive interface. Wandering off into the woods is a recipe for sudden death until you have levelled up a bit. That said thre is much satisfaction to be gained when you finally become strong enough to kill a tough monster.

Sand

Yeah, its very good. I played it through and completed it as a mercenary and Ive got to say its one of my favourite games - the same crowd are also responsible for Arx Fatalis which is even more atmospheric imo.

The combat is tricky to get used to - One on one your best strategy is to stand your ground and be patient, blocking attacks until you get your chance to hit back. Against multiple opponents its best not to fight against multiple opponents.... either try and draw them off one by one - very hard some times, or invest in a bow and get good at taking down foes with it at range.

I think its a good deal more beutiful than Morrowind - the island on which its set is more believable and less patchwork. The game itself is linear enough. Try to do everything and kill everything you possibly can in chapter one - youll need the xp.

Karl Hungus

Absolutely fantastic game, and one that actually improves on the original!

quozl

yeah it's brilliant. Worth getting the 1st one cheap on re-release and playing it first. It's also excellant.

Karl Hungus

Originally posted by quozl
yeah it's brilliant. Worth getting the 1st one cheap on re-release and playing it first. It's also excellant.

There's a lot of flaws with the original that might put people off... That absolutely infuriating barter system for one!

It's certainly a great game once you get past all that, but overall Gothic 2 is much better, and even for first-time players I'd reconmend 2 over the original. Other than giving a bit of back-story, it's not really nessicary to have played it at all, as there's not really that much plot that you can't pick up on in the first five minutes of playing Gothic 2.

zekiel

You will find copies of this game for 14.99 in PC World at the moment, I saw it in Liffey Valley store anyway.:D

Mad Mike

After 3 weeks of total immersion in the beautiful world of Gothic 2 I took a break to zap some bug eyed monsters in the PC version of HALO. Returning to Gothic's clunky combat interface after the fluid controls of the FPS was painful. However having worked through that particular pain barrier I am as immersed as ever.

Melee Combat advice to anyone taking up Gothic 2:

1) Be sure to select the "old Gothic 1" combat interface - The supposedly simplifed new interface makes you move you fingers off the movement keys to fight.

2) The default Gothic interface doesn't allow instant drinking of health potions during combat so be sure and heal yourself to full strength between fights. Of course if you are a big girl's blouse you can always turn on instant potion drinking in the gothic.ini file.

3) First rule of fighting - When in doubt run like hell. Particularly at the start of the game when you are very weak. Most monsters will not chase you very far and often you will only be chased by one monster from a group allowing you to tackle the baddies one at a time.
NB only run back along paths you already know to be clear of enemies. No point running away from a group of Goblins straight into the jaws of a shadowbeast.

4) Second rule of fighting - pick off groups one at a time. Try to catch the attention of the nearest monster and then back off. If you are lucky only one of them will chase you and you can take it on on its own (see above). If you are unlucky and a group follows you keep running till you shake them. There is a key ("R" I think) which allows you to look over your shoulder while running. It is a pain to use but it can be a lifesaver.

5) Equip your chosen weapon (press "1" or "2") in plenty of time, if possible even before the monster sees you. It takes ages to draw a sword in this game and it is almost impossible to do so under pressure.

6) Basic combat interface: Stand still, point at the monster, press and hold down the right mouse button. Once you hold down the right mouse button you are in combat mode and can no longer move. The W,A,S and D keys now control your weapon. "W" is a forward strike and "S" is a block. "A" and "D" are side swipes. I think that the right control key will also activate combat mode but since your hand is on the mouse anyway the right mouse button makes more senes to me.

7) Tip: Use side swipes at first - These are easy to chain and do just as much damage as a forward strike. Even at the later stages of the game sideswipes are generally better against dumb animals. Since you cannot move while in combat mode there is a subtle matter of timing - time your swipes to hit the monster as it comes towards you but before it actually hits. Done correctly the monster will recoil from your strike and you will take no damage.
EDIT: Also you don't have to alternate left and right swipes. Often is is easier and more effective just to keep whacking on one side.

8) Against human opponents block("S") / hit ("W"), block / hit is actually a better combination than sideswipes but this takes more skill. With proper timing you get a free hit after every successful block. Unfortunately you cannot just hold "S" and keep your guard up. You must time the block to coincide with your opponents strike.

9) Congratulate yourself after a successful kill - don't forget to put away your weapon before going to pick up any loot and don't forget to heal youself before tackling another foe.

Kiith

how can there be no mouse support. what the hell were the developers thinking. saying this, i think i'll still try the game.

Mad Mike

Originally posted by Kiith
how can there be no mouse support. what the hell were the developers thinking. saying this, i think i'll still try the game.

No No No - There is mouse support - in fact the mouse is used for looking around just like an fps.

But there is no mouse cursor in the middle of the screen. It is a bit off putting at first but you soon get used to it. When you focus on an item or an enemy it highlights the selected object so you know what you are looking at.

This was a concious decision by the developers to incresae the immersion factor. It actually works pretty well "in game" and I can't complain about it. What I do complain is the fact than having abandoned the mouse cursor "in game" they have also abandoned it in the inventory interface and the options interface. This forces you to use the keyboard to scroll through menus. How this inhances the immersion factor is beyond me.

Kiith

whats the story like. is it anything like morrowind? cause that was one of the best games ever.

Mad Mike

I would have to say that Morrowind beats Gothic 2 in terms of storyline. The main plot of Gothic2 can seem a bit silly at times. Morrowind also has a much bigger gameworld and much richer character development.

Where Gothic 2 really scores is in creating a living breathing gameworld. The NPCs of Gothic are full of life. They chat away to each other. They go about their various businesses during the day. They go to the pub in the evening and go home to bed at night. This is in stark contrast to the lifeless npcs in Morrowind. Remember the 50th time a cardboard cutout imperial guard asked you to "Moooove Along"? Also every single conversation in Gothic2 is spoken (subtitles are optional). This is much more immersive than the text based dialog that drove Morrowind. The entire gameworld is continuous and you don't get the annoying loading pauses that were a real nuiscane every hundred yards or so in Morrowind. There is an enormous amount of detail in the world of Gothic2 - walk along any path and you will find little touches that reveal the care the developers put into building the gameworld.

I think if you enjoyed Morrowind you will almost certainly enjoy Gothic2. Both games are clearly labours of love on the part of their creators. in my opinion Morrowind is the more ambitious game but sometimes failed in that ambition (the stupid economy situation for example). Gothic 2 on the other hand probably comes closer to achieving everything that the developers wanted it to be.

Karl Hungus

Morrowind would definetly beat Gothic 2 in terms of size, but it's more a case of quantity vs. quality.

The characters of Gothic are more, well... In depth.
And signing up with one of the 3 main factions of the game will be interesting, as it's not like in Morrowind at all, where you can sign on with every single guild and organization willy-nilly (Apart form the 3 great houses, that is), and the different characters treat you accordingly. Draw your weapon in the city as a mercenry, and the Militia will put a few dents in your skull accordingly... and so on.

Gothic is just a very tight game world, where most of the characters will have something to do with subplots, and such. Another great thing is, you can't simply train your character up to god-like standards as you could in morrowind... You have to work to level up. In that respect it's just a perfectly balanced game, considering you can level up pretty regularly, whereas in some RPGs it takes hours of hacking through endless hordes of monsters to get your character up a level.

One thing I noticed was

in Gothic 2, the theives guild took some finding! Not like in, well, any other RPG where you can just stroll into a guild and sign up as a criminal character.

quozl

Originally posted by Karl Hungus
it's not really nessicary to have played it at all, as there's not really that much plot that you can't pick up on in the first five minutes of playing Gothic 2.

Aye, that wasn't why I suggested playing gothic I first. It's because you get told the entire story of the first one at the start of playing the second. I think the first one's a great game and worth playing as well, so that's why i suggest doing them in order.

The first games also a fair bit shorter.

Greg

Naar

Gothic 2 is as addictive as crack. I picked it up recently and I'm about half-way through the game as a Fire Magician.

However,

1) Be sure to select the "old Gothic 1" combat interface - The supposedly simplifed new interface makes you move you fingers off the movement keys to fight.

is not correct. In fact, the Gothic 1 interface involves holding down an action key and then using the movement keys to do various slashes, whereas the Gothic 2 interface has different buttons for the different slashes and the parry. At no time do you have to take your fingers off the movement keys.

I might as well add some tips while I'm here. Two-handed weapons seem like a poor choice at first, because they're so slow compared to one-handed weapons. Once you hit Master, though, they're almost as fast, plus you do more damage and have a longer reach (important, since you want to keep most wild animals as for from you as possible.)

Fighting tips for things I found tricky at first:

Field Raiders: They charge straight at you, so when they get close, jump back. They'll miss with their mandibles and get a bit confused, so smack them with a combo. Repeat as necessary.

Skeletons: These things are fast. It may be better to use a one-handed weapon if you're not a two-handed master. They do one of two things: a slash, or a slash then a second quick slash. The key is to block their attacks and counterattack, but if they do a single slash, you're not sure if they're going to follow it up. I usually keep blocking until they do a double attack, then attack once I know I'm going to hit.

Snappers & Lizards: Both of these attack with powerful charges. You have to time your initial attack perfectly so that it hits them, disrupting their charge. Then you can attack again or jump back, as appropriate.

Orcs Warriors/Elites & Lizardmen: These hit hard, but they're really stupid. They charge right at you and raise up their weapon for an overhead swing. This is your cue to hit them with a two-hit combo. Then back off/block any followup attacks and repeat. If you keep backing off, none of their attacks should hit. The same applies if there's more than one, but usually you'll have to block immediately after the two-hit combo to stop the second orc's charge.

Golems: These are murderously strong and if they knock you off your feet, you're in trouble. Use a blunt weapon and press the attack constantly to keep them from attacking.

Mad Mike

However,
is not correct. In fact, the Gothic 1 interface involves holding down an action key and then using the movement keys to do various slashes, whereas the Gothic 2 interface has different buttons for the different slashes and the parry. At no time do you have to take your fingers off the movement keys.

[/B]

But since the combat keys are different to the movement keys (in Gothic2 mode) surely one hand has to move - either the left or right hand.

The beauty of the gothic 1 interface is that you can hold down the right mouse button to enter combat mode. So your left hand stays on movement (WASD) and you right hand stays on the mouse all the time.


For some reason the manual says you need to press CTRL to enter combat mode but why anyone would do that when your hand is already on the mouse beats me. If you are using Gothic2 mode - I suggest you try Gothic1 controls again - it really is more fluid to be able to go from movement to combat all with the same buttons.

Great to see another recruit by the way.

Naar

A little creative control reconfiguring and you don't need to move your hand anywhere. With your left hand on WASD, it's easy to hit 1/2 to pull out your melee/ranged weapon. If you map side swings to Q and E, you can also do those without any problems. Combined with the mouse for your primary attack and block, you have everything you need without having to hold down a button all the time.