Processor Life + Overclocking

BoB_BoT

Hey all, have one or two questions reguarding overclocking, when overclocking a processor does it reduce it's life by much? If so roughly how much does anyone know?

I have a Barton 2500xp @ 333mhz fsb, I also have 1gig of pc2700 ram 333mhz. Could I overclock by much without having to pay out for new ram that's 400mhz?

I'm sure this question has being asked before so thanks for any help,
Rob

*edit* buggery should have put this in the tech forum, soz Mods, must remember to read forum rules first . */edit*

unkel

Originally posted by BoB_BoT
I have a Barton 2500xp @ 333mhz fsb, I also have 1gig of pc2700 ram 333mhz. Could I overclock by much without having to pay out for new ram that's 400mhz?

How much you can overclock the ram depends very much on what ram it is (make, model). You will probably need to increase the vcore. Some ram is still guaranteed if you increase it to 3.0V. You could also set the FSB / ram divider in the bios to 5:4 or 3:2

You would have been better off buying PC3200 or PC3500 ram though

unkel

Originally posted by BoB_BoT
when overclocking a processor does it reduce it's life by much? If so roughly how much does anyone know?

Yes cpu life is reduced. By how much is very hard to say, depends mainly on what temperatures the cpu is after the overclock. The reduction in life is hardly relevant though. A cpu under normal operating conditions would last at least 10 years, so who cares if that is reduced to 4 years. The cpu will be well obsolete at that stage and virtually worthless

economic life << technical life

quarryman

so is it just temperatures that affect the lifespan so? meaning that if you make sure to keep them low when overclocking it should still be running in 5-6 years or more?

OT: i ran prime 95 all day yesterday (about 10 hours) and there was no errors. the max temp was 51c.

P4 2.6 @ 3.01 (13x231) 15%

OCZ 3200 @ 2800 (180MHz) underclocked to get 5:4 ratio

can i consider this stable? i ran the blend test (ram and cpu)

netman

I've been overclocking my processors since the Pentium (P1) and never had problems with them. Not a single one has failed in all those years.

Generally, when overclocking you're looking at getting better cooling for the processor. My overclocked temperatures are lower than a generic default setup. If anything, you could argue that the processor life should be longer because it's running under less-stressful conditions. (temperature-wise at least)

Can't say what the processor life is, I never had one for more than a year. After two years it's so obsolete that it's worthless and you can usually pick something much much better for a few euro.

Unless you're building a server I would highly recommend overclocking, it's very rare in this world that you get something for nothing

unkel

Originally posted by netman
Can't say what the processor life is, I never had one for more than a year. After two years it's so obsolete that it's worthless and you can usually pick something much much better for a few euro.

My point exactly

Originally posted by netman
it's very rare in this world that you get something for nothing

Do you consider tweaking and fiddling with the settings of the bios for hours and hours nothing? And what about all the sweat and the angst the thing is gonna be fried

Originally posted by quarryman
OT: i ran prime 95 all day yesterday (about 10 hours) and there was no errors. the max temp was 51c.

P4 2.6 @ 3.01 (13x231) 15%

OCZ 3200 @ 2800 (180MHz) underclocked to get 5:4 ratio

can i consider this stable? i ran the blend test (ram and cpu)

prime95 for 10 hours is stable in most people's books

What cooling do you use? At your current overclock you could probably run 1:1 by upping the DDR voltage. Check your ram though, my OCZ is still guaranteed at 3.0V but you won't need that much probably

RicardoSmith

I've never had an overclocked one fail either.

unkel

Same here and I've overclocked pretty much all my cpu's in the last 6 years

(even some of my work pc's - don't tell anyone)

quarryman

Originally posted by unkel

prime95 for 10 hours is stable in most people's books

What cooling do you use? At your current overclock you could probably run 1:1 by upping the DDR voltage. Check your ram though, my OCZ is still guaranteed at 3.0V but you won't need that much probably

I'm using a Shuttle. This is a pic of the ICE cooler inside:



So I could leave the ratio at 1:1 and up the FSB and the RAM voltage. When i started out i upped the FSB without changing the ratio and it didn't get very far at all. i think it was 210 or something. I'm pretty sure this was caused by the RAM since when I underclocked it and then raised the FSB it went pretty smooth up to about 235MHz FSB. I don't know too much about changing voltages but i'd say the Shuttle Bios should allow me to do it (i'll check tonight).

This is the RAM i'm using in my setup if it helps any.

unkel

Originally posted by quarryman
This is the RAM i'm using in my setup if it helps any.

Probably the best ram in the world and still guaranteed at 3.0V :cool:

Originally posted by quarryman
When i started out i upped the FSB without changing the ratio and it didn't get very far at all. i think it was 210 or something. I'm pretty sure this was caused by the RAM since when I underclocked it and then raised the FSB it went pretty smooth up to about 235MHz

Makes perfect sense. Your ram is rated for FSB 200. It is excellent ram for overclocking but will need higher voltage. CPU also needs higher voltage. Happy overclocking, but keep an eye on the temperatures though. Things can get hot in a Shuttle

Start with 1:1 and 210 with an increase of 0.025 V on the CPU and you might as well start with 2.9V to the ram (lifetime warrantee and all). Check if stable, if so go up in steps of 5 or 10. If unstable up the voltage to your cpu. You can go to 1.75 no bother and according to a lot of people even higher. With a bit of luck you might get to 230, 235 with 3V to the ram. If that ain't enough for you, then go 5:4 and start all over again

unkel

Oops your memory is only guaranteed to 2.8V - beware, going over this will invalidate your warrantee :eek:

Maybe 5:4 is better in this case

quarryman

what is the advantage in keeping a 1:1 ratio anyway? is it just to get the most out of the ram?

Woden

i think so, i'm going to bandy about a term i don't really understand but if you have a 1:1 ratio i think you have more memory bandwidth, also amd systems run better if you have a 1:1 ratio and generally i think it is good to have a 1:1 ratio so the ram runs at as high a frequency as possible.

thats why we see manufacters realising ram running at frequencies of 275mhz as people can do some cool things when overclocking p4's and they want to run them 1:1

secret_squirrel

If you have a 1:1 ratio the FSB (communication link between CPU and memory) runs in sync, meaning that data travels between them most efficiently. If you run out of sync say 5:4 or 3:2 then there is more chance that one part will have to wait for the other. Since the memory will only cycle 4 times when the fsb has cycled 5 times.

In practise it makes a few % difference to performance - if that. Its very dependent on other factors like the nature of the processing, and wait times for other components.

Thats the simple explanation afaik. Once it gets into CAS latencies and 8-3-3 setttings Im pretty much lost

[edit] btw how come my ICE isnt gold? [/edit]

nadir

I have a crappy cooler, just the one that came in the box, its a p4 2.4 ghz and I was running it at 2.7 Ghz. But then one day i was like playing a movie, and a game of quake and compiling whatever at the same time, and it started going real slow, and I got loads of errormessages in the console, saying ACPI, Therrmal Zone critical 67 C .etc so I had to shut down. Im not overclocking at all now, Ill wait till i get a proper cooler and all. I wonder though if you actually start having probs like that, would that affect the lifespan on not ?

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by nadir
I have a crappy cooler, just the one that came in the box, its a p4 2.4 ghz and I was running it at 2.7 Ghz. But then one day i was like playing a movie, and a game of quake and compiling whatever at the same time, and it started going real slow, and I got loads of errormessages in the console, saying ACPI, Therrmal Zone critical 67 C .etc so I had to shut down. Im not overclocking at all now, Ill wait till i get a proper cooler and all. I wonder though if you actually start having probs like that, would that affect the lifespan on not ?

No the P4 has thermal protection built in. If it gets too hot it slows it self down so its not damaged. Very smart.

STaN

Originally posted by unkel
You would have been better off buying PC3200 or PC3500 ram though

I've 4 x 256Mb (1Gb) OCZ PC3500 CL2 DDR RAM Dual Channel Optimised for sale if any are interested - €200 for them

They give you an extra 34Mhz over PC3200 ram (434Mhz) and have allot more tollerance if you are going to overclock allowing you to have a 1:1 FSB ratio at higher FSB speeds or even greater operability at 5:4 with a higher clocked FSB.

Sir Random

Your ram is rated for 2,3,2,5 which suggest CH5.
Not bad, but nowhere near the best ram in the world (BH5). You might be able to take it higher at 1:1 by relaxing the timings to 2,3,3,6 or even 2.5,3,3,7.
Have you set the timings manually to 2,3,2,5 in the BIOS? Lots of mobos have probs with ram SPD and can really slacken the timings giving lower performance. My P4C800 was running my Mushkin at 2.5,4,4,7 :eek: at stock fsb!

You'll need to check the bandwith with Sandra to compare medium fsb +1:1 loose against higher fsb + 5:4 tight, but if you can get a decent fsb at 1:1 2,3,3,6 then I'd stick with that.

The main threat to cpu lifetime is raised vcore. Higher fsb's make no real difference other than the higher running temps. If the temps are kept down with stock vcore then it should last almost as long as at stock speeds. I had a P100 at 120 for almost 5 years 24/7. The heatsink even fell off at some stage and it kept going. I still have it too

unkel

Originally posted by STaN
€200 for them

That's a bargain, STaN

Why don't you readvertise on the for sale forum. I'm sure someone will snap them up