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Weird Mulitfunction Fax problem: Help!

Zascar

I just bought a Dell A960 Multifunction - it will print/scan/copy perfectly but I am having weird problems when trying to fax.

I have 2 phone lines - the main primary line & the fax line) If I hook it up to the main line it works perfeectly, sending and recieving.

However, when I connect it to the fax line, and I try to call the number, it gives me an engeged tone. If I plug the phone line out it will ring as normal, but when I plug it in, it goes dead. It can't be the printer as it works fine on the other line.

On one attempt, I was trying to send a fax, it seemed to be doing nothing, so I unplugged the phone line, put it back in, and it then sent the fax. However every time I have tried since it is still engaged.

I called €ircon and they tested the line and say it is fine. This makes absolutely no sense to me...

Help!

Anyone any ideas?

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spongebob

Originally posted by Zascar
I have 2 phone lines - the main primary line & the fax line) If I hook it up to the main line it works perfeectly, sending and recieving.

Not ISDN are they?

when I connect it to the fax line, and I try to call the number, it gives me an engeged tone. If I plug the phone line out it will ring as normal, but when I plug it in, it goes dead.

Do you have just the Dell A960 plugged in or is there another phone plugges in also?

Does the lead for the Dell A960 have a standard Eircom plug on the end or does it have a BT adapter on it?

What was plugged into the Faxline before you got the A960? What type of plug has it got?

It sounds like a wiring/plug/socket problem.

If you plug a standard phone into the fax line does it work ok? Also does the same phone work OK in the main socket?

Have a look at the pins in the socket to make sure that none are touching.

Could you swop the A960 phone lead and try it with a different one and see if that helps?

atheist

Get a spare phone cord. Look through the clear plastic ends. If there are 4 wires, snip outer pair (one on left, one on right).

tribble

Zascar

Thanks for the replies guys, answers here:

>Not ISDN are they?
No, I was on ISDN but then got it disconnected. I have eircom broadband now. I ahev the filters onthe line but it makes no difference of theya re on or off.

>Do you have just the Dell A960 plugged in or is there another phone plugges in also?
The room has the 2 phone lines in 1 corner. Just one thing connected at a time.

>Does the lead for the Dell A960 have a standard Eircom plug on the end or does it have a BT adapter on it?
Standard eircom plug.

>What was plugged into the Faxline before you got the A960? What type of plug has it got?
A fax machine. Normal plugs all around.

>It sounds like a wiring/plug/socket problem. If you plug a standard phone into the fax line does it work ok?
Yes, eircom did tests and said there is nothing wrong.

>Also does the same phone work OK in the main socket?
I didn't try but I assume so, I'll check again...

>Could you swop the A960 phone lead and try it with a different one and see if that helps?
Yes tried that but makes no difference...

>Your socket is wired incorrectly.
>Probably using the old 3 wire system.
>Modern telecom equipment is internally decoupled.
>Some equipment is not affected by the 3 wire system, but some is.
>Open the socket and disconnect all wires but those going to the centre pins.
>Snipping the outside wires (on the fax cable)will achieve the same effect. But your better off doing the modifications to the socket.

Wow ok, Erm, sound tricky but I'll give it a go... Any websites that give me a walk though perhaps?

Thanks for all the help Guys!

Your socket is wired incorrectly.
Probably using the old 3 wire system.
Modern telecom equipment is internally decoupled.
Some equipment is not affected by the 3 wire system, but some is.
Open the socket and disconnect all wires but those going to the centre pins.

Snipping the outside wires (on the fax cable)will achieve the same effect. But your better off doing the modifications to the socket.

This may not work. If the socket in question is a "Master Socket" the decoupling capacitor is built into the socket. The incoming line is on two wires only and there is no easy way of removing the decoupling capacitor.

If the cable has 4 wires in it cuttimg the outer two as the atheist said would be your best bet. If you don't want to go snipping wires, I have a two wire cable here I will post to you, if you PM your address to me.

What does the phone socket look like? Is it white or a cream colour? Is it a genuine Eircom socket??

Which line is the DSL on? Is it on the Fax line? If so were you connected to the Internet while you were trying to use the A960?

If you open the socket and swap the two wires over - reversing the line polarity it might solve the problem.

Zascar

Originally posted by ST
>>This may not work. If the socket in question is a "Master Socket" the decoupling capacitor is built into the socket. The incoming line is on two wires only and there is no easy way of removing the decoupling capacitor. If the cable has 4 wires in it cutting the outer two as the atheist said would be your best bet. If you don't want to go snipping wires, I have a two wire cable here I will post to you, if you PM your address to me.
Thanks, Really sound of you, will do. However I need a long cable - 25ft, if yours is not that big can I buy one easily?

>>What does the phone socket look like? Is it white or a cream colour? Is it a genuine Eircom socket??
Not Sure,I'll check next time I'm in the house.

>>Which line is the DSL on? Is it on the Fax line? If so were you connected to the Internet while you were trying to use the A960?
Good point, I'll check. Yes, The pc was on the intenet at the time. If that is the problem, then will I not be able to use a fax on that line at all

If the Fax line is also the line with DSL on it, make sure that you have the A960 plugged into one of the filters or into the half of the computer splitter/filter which is for the phones.

Then try sending a fax with the computer online, and then with it offline.
Also try this with the old fax machine.

This will indicate if the DSL is causing the interference, and if there is a problem whether it affects only the A960, or both the A960 and the Fax machine.

Unfortunately the lead I have is only 6 foot. I will have a look to see if I have a longer one.

atheist

Both AC and DC current are used on phone lines. Master sockets, phones and other telephone devices usually have a capacitor which prevents DC current (till you lift the receiver and sound gets modulated). However AC passes through the capacitor making the phone ring.

The black telephone cable from the exchange uses two wires. Extensions use four wires. The master socket dose the splitting. Retailers are not supposed to sell these sockets - only extension sockets, which is why it is not unusual to see a BT master socket connected to correct an Irish socket.

If you look at a phone socket there's potentially six wires. The two rarely wired up were used to carry a clock tick used for billing and metering. If we number these 1 2 3 4 5 6, and we know that telephone devices can work on two wires, the Irish standard is to use wires 2 and 5. The US standard (which most RJ11 devices use) is 3 & 4 and the BT standard is 1 & 6.

If you hold both ends of a phone cable together, looking through the RJ11's clear plastic you will find 6 wire, 4 wire and 2 wire cables. Sometimes the colours are in sequence and sometimes the opposite, a mirror cable, which is used to correct polarity.

In telephone history the wires were labelled tip, hook and ring. However tip has nothing to do with tapping the cradle receiver like phreaking the old A/B telephones, hook has nothing to do with hanging up, and ring, you've guessed it has nothing to do with making the phone ring. It dates back before RJ11, with all those black & white pictures of respectable ladies working on manual switchboards, with their patch leads. The plugs looked like large versions of what we have on headphones. The ring was the middle hoop, the tip the pointy end, and the hook was the collar used to aid inserting and removing the patch lead from the board.

Unfortunately I have found little or no consistency in the way things get wired in this country. It is one of those things we don't understand like air conditioning. I post this not in answer to your question but as an explanation why no one could point you to a simple website walkthrough.

Zascar

Thanks guys. I friend gave me a cable that is 2 wire. It is only 4 feet long or so, however, if put the 2 wire cable directly into the socket, and then join it to a normal cable with an adaptor, I think it should work fine. If the signal from the socket is only carrying the 2, then after that it will be no different even if it joins to a 4 wire cable... - Am I right?

atheist

Yes. Let us know how the test goes.