Modren federasion

bizmark

With the feds ever increasing Militry power (building pure warships seems to be a past time for them now) and the crippled state of most alpha quad powers Does anyone see the Feds makeing a play for all out Power ?

As they say you dont build a fleet unless your going to use it

Woden

no no i don't, just not in their nature, they rather sit back and say look rest of the quadrant we could have taken power but we didn't see how great we are join us

bizmark

Dont know about that they really have changed from the Hippy greenpeace loveing tree hugging freaks they where dureing TNG to a far more war like "you touch us we will pound your head into the ground" attiude

Woden

yeah but they are definetly only act in self defense people

User45701

With a fleet that size i think that if there is ever a war the federation wont declare it.
They will end it and they wont go looking for a pease teaty/surrender.

LastIrishMonkey

no way that would be distrubing the peace and the special prime directive.

bizmark

They should go to war with the rommies and conqure them.... Which would = more terrory and a better relatsionship with the klingon empire

Then all that would stand in the way of the fed's are their allies and some minor empires

User45701

Well you know that the klingons and section 31 would both love that. The ferengi alliance might like a chance to expand its ecenomic empire to new terrority aswell.

But you know that the feds would never occupy and entire empire

bizmark

The fed is currently holding the cardie homeworld....And its very unlikely they will return the old cardie colonys .... just the homeworld

The ferengi would be to afaird to try and challenge the federasion and its interest's + the federasion wouldnt allow the ferengi to strength their economy or militry if they went down the empire root

Notting can stand in the way of the fed's

AngelofFire

" Its continuing mission to explore strange new worlds to seek out new life and new civilisations, to boldly go where no one has gone before"

I doubt starfleet would ever abandon that principle. the dominion war was purely self defence. By looking to start more wars the federation would be threading on every principle that the federation was founded upon.

bizmark

The feds need to be more war like every one has taken a pot shot at them Klingons founders Cardies borg .....As the admiral in star trek 9 said "The federasion is old and people are smelling death" then he went on the explane why the fed needs to be more war like (i bleave) + the fed council seemed to agree

And since then we have seen production warship after production warship.....Sovy class prommie class War galaxie upgrades Intrepid class Defiant class Lokia excellsour upgrade Nebula weapions pod ......Etc etc etc

their building to kick some alien ass and you cant blame them

Woden

Originally posted by bizmark
The feds need to be more war like every one has taken a pot shot at them Klingons founders Cardies borg..

and everytime they've won, says it all really, they've fine the way they are and they can uphold there principles, section 31 excluded

bizmark

Ah now lets take a looks at the wars shall we

1. Founders war...Would of lost if it wasnt for the rommies still lost over 40% of their fleet and had Earth bombed
2.Cardies war.....no one knows if they won but seeming they gave away planets it seems they lost or just couldnt be arsed fighting the war any longer
3.Klingon war.....It was short lived but costed the feds a fair few ships
4.Borg.....1 cube = 40 warships

Their not doing that well tbh

User45701

Why didnt the borg send 2 cubes the first time?
Or 2 cubes the 2nd time?

they could even send 5 cubes, its not as if the borg space would be taken over by some loser delta quadrent race if they took a few cubes from borg space and sent them to earth.

Also why havent the borg had a go at the rommys or klingons?

Woden

yet they have survived where other alliances have fallen, disappeared etc.

founders war, well they had to bring the cardassians and breen into alliegance with them in the first place so you can't say anything about feds joining with the romulans.

cardie war, you know well the that federation ships lay the smackdown on the galor class and that the cardassians never where nor ever will be a serious military

klingon war, i doubt the federations heart was every really in the klingon war

1cube = 40 warships, no 1 cube + tactical knowledge of jean luc picard = 40 warships, the borgs slaughter at wolf was put down to the advantage of having picard, i bet they didn't lose as many ships in the fight in first contact.

bizmark

Originally posted by User45701
Why didnt the borg send 2 cubes the first time?
Or 2 cubes the 2nd time?

they could even send 5 cubes, its not as if the borg space would be taken over by some loser delta quadrent race if they took a few cubes from borg space and sent them to earth.

Also why havent the borg had a go at the rommys or klingons?

Fans bleave its because the Borg are trying to "fatten up" the fed for take over.....They have to make new tech to destroy borg ships....The borg come along destroy a few fed ships take the technology all is well

The fed isnt a threat to the borg (other than painway and the borg destroyer) so why take over ?.

And they did attack the rommies klingons and co....I remember seven (or someone) haveing a flash back and some klingon ships where being destroyed by the borg

Woden

Originally posted by User45701


Also why havent the borg had a go at the rommys or klingons?

thats coz they recognise the federation as the major strength in the alpha quadrant i think so they went after them, also they where introduced to the federation first via Q and stuff, they may have had a small pop at the romulans, those boarder attacks along the neutral zone that the feds blamed on the romulans where borg iirc, not sure if the borg did the same on the romulan side of the boarder.

bizmark

Originally posted by Dataisgod
yet they have survived where other alliances have fallen, disappeared etc.

founders war, well they had to bring the cardassians and breen into alliegance with them in the first place so you can't say anything about feds joining with the romulans.

cardie war, you know well the that federation ships lay the smackdown on the galor class and that the cardassians never where nor ever will be a serious military

klingon war, i doubt the federations heart was every really in the klingon war

1cube = 40 warships, no 1 cube + tactical knowledge of jean luc picard = 40 warships, the borgs slaughter at wolf was put down to the advantage of having picard, i bet they didn't lose as many ships in the fight in first contact.

The galor is a match to most fed ships up to the Ambasadore/Nebula class (thats what it was designed for fighting the galor) Galaxies beat the **** out of them in 1 shot though

The founders would of won if it wasnt for the wormhole aliens thats the only reasion they needed the breen......The cardies where just a handy beach head

As for the klingon war their heart wasnt in it ?.....ah come on

and they lost a fuge load of ships dureing the first contact fight in the small bit you see they lost like 10 ships.....And remeber it was a 3 hour (or is it 3 day) running battle with just one cube

Woden

and what about the breen, the breen where needed no matter what you say bout the cardassians also the self replicating mines where in front of the wormhole they had to be removed which was done by cardassian iirc they where also needed

the klingon war, i reckon the feds didn't really want to go war with them, not with people that they had been allies with for so long, and it is established that in an individual empire vs empire fight that the fed would kick the ass of any other alpha quadrant empire no contest, thats how its been able to stand for so long against all the other expansionist empires and you know it,

so you didn't see the feds making a play for all out power anymore then i do

and there is no way they lost as many ships against that cube and in that film they actually destroyed the cube didn't just put them to sleep which shows the difference between the original battle and that one

bizmark

and what about the breen, the breen where needed no matter what you say bout the cardassians also the self replicating mines where in front of the wormhole they had to be removed which was done by cardassian iirc they where also needed

The Breen would not have been needed if the Founders could of brough their fleet though the wormhole.....Breen ships are crap once the energy draining weapion was useless

As for the Self repliateing mines.....The founders should of just went through them so what if they lost a few dozen ships they have plenty of them and soliders

the klingon war, i reckon the feds didn't really want to go war with them, not with people that they had been allies with for so long,

not wanting to take on your enemy for any reasion is dangours

and it is established that in an individual empire vs empire fight that the fed would kick the ass of any other alpha quadrant empire no contest,

Ya they would win ......Thats why i think they should destroy the rommies now before they rebuild with scimitars Valdours and upgraded warbirds

so you didn't see the feds making a play for all out power anymore then i do

The federasion is a empire ....All empires expand or die either peacefuly or by war if the fed cant expand by peace it will have to by war and theirs many easy targets around right now

and there is no way they lost as many ships against that cube and in that film they actually destroyed the cube didn't just put them to sleep which shows the difference between the original battle and that one

They won because Picard knew a weakness in the borg ship ......Theirfore your "the 38 ships where destroyed because of picard" comes back to bite you in the arse

User45701

wow So much to say i love these in depth star trek conversations.

Originally posted by bizmark

And they did attack the rommies klingons and co....I remember seven (or someone) haveing a flash back and some klingon ships where being destroyed by the borg

Yes i remember when there was a flash back of the borg fighting the klingons bizmark - thanx for reminding me.

I have always wonderd did the borg have a HUGE go at the rommys remember the romulans terminated all contact and when they retured the romulan commander said "Matters more urgant caused our withdrawl but make no mistake we are back" (or something like that)
Ive always wonderd if mabe the borg just had a big go at them and it took a while to build back up there fleet.

Originally posted by bizmark
The Breen would not have been needed if the Founders could of brough their fleet though the wormhole.....Breen ships are crap once the energy draining weapion was useless

- Oh comeon the breen ships are good.
They are VERY manoverable - the defiant couldnt match one of there ships in the final battle
There disrupters are powerfull aswell

Originally posted by bizmark

Ya they would win ......Thats why i think they should destroy the rommies now before they rebuild with scimitars Valdours and upgraded warbirds

The Valdours arnt that good. But ye one would assume that there are still blueprints for the semitars cloak - That will be a massive threat.

-

The cardassian obsidian order is the main thing they have going. Its true the galors arnt good. If a galaxy can do that do the galor id love to see a sovy fight a galor

Id say after the death of the borg queen the loss of a transwarp hub and the destruction of the uni complex the borg will stay away from the feds until they can adapt. Or elce the federation will be precived as a threat and they will send 20 cubes.

I wonder what interesting and new klingon ship is on the drawing boards.
A sovy would beat a negvar correct?

Woden

Originally posted by User45701

A sovy would beat a negvar correct?

now that is an interesting question an answer to which i don't have, i'd say it would be an interesting fight though.

with regards to the valdour, they can't be that bad, these are new romulan ships they must have some advancements over the warbirds, unless they are shit easy to make so that a few of them can count for a warbird

bizmark

Ok.....

Ive always wonderd if mabe the borg just had a big go at them and it took a while to build back up there fleet

Unlikely seeming the rommy commander though it was the federasion who destroy the out post's........and i think by "more ugent" they ment rebuilding their fleet which was frankly laughable compeared to starfleet in Tos building 1 km long ship's takes time

They are VERY manoverable - the defiant couldnt match one of there ships in the final battle

I could jump into a torpedo boat and be more manoverable than a 40,000 ton battleship doesnt mean im better 2 q torp's destroys breen ships 7 or more of their torp's are needed to destroy the definat with out sheilds or power.....I think i know whos better in a one v one fight

The Valdours arnt that good. But ye one would assume that there are still blueprints for the semitars cloak - That will be a massive threat.

Ah their not build as replacements for the warbird i think thats very unfair to judge them against the best federasion ship and some huge ****ing mobile weapions platform.....They should be judged against the likes of the nebby i say that's where their aimed

The cardassian obsidian order is the main thing they have going.

They where destroyed

I wonder what interesting and new klingon ship is on the drawing boards.

More scaled up birds of prey

A sovy would beat a negvar correct

Ya negvars are designed to take on static defence targates (base's and the likes) with its 2 HUGE disrupters .....Mind you it does have a fudge load of smaller vorcha level disrupters........But its very slow so i think the sovy would kick its arse in

User45701

But was the obsidian order actually destroyed?
Yes it was but will it return?

We can only hope although i think the feds would hjave something to say about it.

So what we want to see is a Nev`ver vs Sovy if its the ENT E ill put my money on the sovy if its just some other sovy ill put 5 euro on the neg`var

Slutmonkey57b

I think the borg are waiting for the humans to develop technology that will clean up all the hideous spelling mistakes in this thread.