Tribes: Vengeance

Dustaz

Sierra and Irrational held a press conference the other day in LA to show off how tribes3 was getting along. It looks pretty sweet and seems to have a realistic release date (q4 2004).

After the abortion of tribes2 i wont be getting my hopes up, but the fact that they hired KineticPoet to do the multiplayer aspec t of the game does give me cause for optimism (the guy was a legendary capper and went a long way to perfecting the art of skiing)



http://www.worthplaying.com/article.php?sid=15802

http://pc.ign.com/articles/488/488081p1.html


The gist of both these articles is that there will be concessions to the newer players approaching the tribes franchise - Smaller maps, more controllable jetpacs, that sort of thing.



Tribalwar also have some video footage of the event

Tazzle

I'd love a game of tribes right about now..

Rev Hellfire

Was/is there ever a uptodate linux version of the tribes1 server ?

Dustaz

Dont think so rev.

BadCRC (he of All Your Base fame) had a linux server, but i think development kinda ground to a halt.

tHE vAGGABOND

"the fact that they hired KineticPoet to do the multiplayer aspec t of the game does give me cause for optimism"

I would be more happy if it had the great network code of tribes 1 written by someone who can write great network code and fun, balanced maps by a team of people who can make great maps and not some great player.

Its like Quake 3 being designed to keep the likes of thresh happy, and therefore making no one in the world happy

Also someone actually fixing bugs pre-release would be great. Tribes 2 spent a fortune on an external beta test 6 months pre-release and shipped with that many bugs the automatic installer had to be patched day one, let alone the rest of the game

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Dustaz
Sierra and Irrational held a press conference the other day in LA to show off how tribes3 was getting along. It looks pretty sweet and seems to have a realistic release date (q4 2004).

After the abortion of tribes2 i wont be getting my hopes up, but the fact that they hired KineticPoet to do the multiplayer aspec t of the game does give me cause for optimism (the guy was a legendary capper and went a long way to perfecting the art of skiing)

Skiing!!? That bastard is the one responsible for single handily ruining the game then. It started out with armored hulks slugging it out combined with fast movers using the chaos to brave the onslaught of fire and snatch the flag and then degenerated into everyone picking the tiny female model and skiing forward and back from the flags. No one really even bother shooting at each other, it was all just about the fastest skier. :mad: The lack of decent area of effect weapons meant it was incredbily difficult and tedious to catch good skiers.

For anyone who didnt play Tribes and\or werent subjected to skiing, imagine every player in BF1942 in planes flying back and forth in a CTF game.


Matt

Dustaz

Originally posted by tHE vAGGABOND

I would be more happy if it had the great network code of tribes 1 written by someone who can write great network code and fun, balanced maps by a team of people who can make great maps and not some great player.

KP isnt writing the network code, thats being done by IG. Hes in charge of developing the multiplayer formats. Hes already designed two highly popular mods for tribes2 and one for tribes 1.

Its like Quake 3 being designed to keep the likes of thresh happy, and therefore making no one in the world happy

Tribes 2 was a dumbed down version of Tribes 1 to address the idiots like Matt Simis. It sucked. Noone liked it even when the bugs were fixed. The 'classic' mod that changed the physics to become more like t1 is now twice as popular as t2 base. They have learned that lesson well.

Also someone actually fixing bugs pre-release would be great. Tribes 2 spent a fortune on an external beta test 6 months pre-release and shipped with that many bugs the automatic installer had to be patched day one, let alone the rest of the game

The problem with the T2 beta was twofold. 1. It was a closed beta, with only 1000 testers at its height. 2. The producer ignored all bug reports and the game was released with 90% of the reported bugs still extant.

T:V will have an open beta (a la q3test) before launch to address this exact problem.

Dustaz

Originally posted by Matt Simis
Skiing!!? That bastard is the one responsible for single handily ruining the game then. It started out with armored hulks slugging it out combined with fast movers using the chaos to brave the onslaught of fire and snatch the flag and then degenerated into everyone picking the tiny female model and skiing forward and back from the flags. No one really even bother shooting at each other, it was all just about the fastest skier. :mad: The lack of decent area of effect weapons meant it was incredbily difficult and tedious to catch good skiers.

Ah the oldest whine in the tribes universe. The "i cant ski, i cant stop skiiers" whine.

Skiing and its effects are responsible for turning a clever enjoyable multiplayer game into an online legacy. Skiing is what prolonged Tribes shelf life to over 5 years. Skiing is what ensured there would be a tribes2 and tribes 3.

Skiing is what made the game FUN for a lot of people. It made the game the fastest online game ever made. If BF1942 and its pensioner speed is what appeals to you, then fine but dont say it ruined tribes just because you werent good enough to handle its implications.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Dustaz
Ah the oldest whine in the tribes universe. The "i cant ski, i cant stop skiiers" whine.

Skiing and its effects are responsible for turning a clever enjoyable multiplayer game into an online legacy. Skiing is what prolonged Tribes shelf life to over 5 years. Skiing is what ensured there would be a tribes2 and tribes 3.

Skiing is what made the game FUN for a lot of people. It made the game the fastest online game ever made. If BF1942 and its pensioner speed is what appeals to you, then fine but dont say it ruined tribes just because you werent good enough to handle its implications.

LOL
Well back in the day I had a pokey old modem, aiming at some twat zipping around dressed as a girl playing from his UK cable modem wasnt fun.. I cant see how it would be for anyone in a similar situation. I was there when Tribes started. Skiiing wasnt.

Skiiing isnt hard either, I dunno why you would suggest it is? I simply preferred the more balanced game that existed before.. you know, when plans and strategies existed. If it wasnt so "popular" then this exploit would have been removed, much like the floating\hopping was from CS. I guess now-a-days people dont equate exploits\speed with good gameplay. I play DC for 1942 mainly, its considerably faster than vanilla 1942.


Matt

Dustaz

Originally posted by Matt Simis
LOL
Well back in the day I had a pokey old modem, aiming at some twat zipping around dressed as a girl playing from his UK cable modem wasnt fun.. I cant see how it would be for anyone in a similar situation.

By "similar situation" do you mean a refusal to adapt? Dont know about you, but i only ever played tribes with a modem. mine/disk stopped the heavy skiers. grenades and discs stopped the light skiers. Its not really that hard. Well, it might be if your idea of fun is bf1942.

I was there when Tribes started. Skiiing wasnt.

Yes it was. It was there from the beginning, people just didnt know about it. Its still there, people still play it. You dont.

Skiiing isnt hard either, I dunno why you would suggest it is? I simply preferred the more balanced game that existed before.. you know, when plans and strategies existed.

What, like "LOLZ EVERYONE INTO TEH PLANE!!"? Strats became more complex after skiing became popular not less. Maybe if you played with a tribe, you would know that.

If it wasnt so "popular" then this exploit would have been removed, much like the floating\hopping was from CS.

Funny how its still in after all these years.

TheSonOfBattles

MEEEEEEOOOOWWWWW!!!!

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Dustaz
By "similar situation" do you mean a refusal to adapt? Dont know about you, but i only ever played tribes with a modem. mine/disk stopped the heavy skiers. grenades and discs stopped the light skiers. Its not really that hard. Well, it might be if your idea of fun is bf1942.

Yes it was. It was there from the beginning, people just didnt know about it. Its still there, people still play it. You dont.

What, like "LOLZ EVERYONE INTO TEH PLANE!!"? Strats became more complex after skiing became popular not less. Maybe if you played with a tribe, you would know that.

Funny how its still in after all these years.

I get the feeling you dont like 1942...
Skiing was in Tribes from the start and people didnt know about it in the same way many bugs are in many games when released. It doesnt mean exploiting them is a "good thing". I just didnt think the armor, heavy weapons and floating down hills like fairys gelled together to make a good game atmosphere. A similar exploit existed in CS (which was worse than skiing, virtually everyone in CS *had* to BH). Bunny hopping was removed, because it was an exploit and detracted from the game and forced everyone to play a certain way that wasnt originally envisoned when planning class\weapon\game balances. Much like skiing did to Tribes.

You may not agree with me and seem to take harsh words against skiing very personally, but now at least you know that some people that were huge fans of Tribes (and I am\was) will not appreciate the fact your messiah of skiing has a heavy hand in the game design.

However, I could put on my optimist hat and conclude that if Mr Ski is in the development process then skiing could be made an integral part of the game (and not a cheesy exploit) and the end result is a game that can remain balanced and feature skiing.



Matt

Dustaz

Originally posted by Matt Simis


However, I could put on my optimist hat and conclude that if Mr Ski is in the development process then skiing could be made an integral part of the game (and not a cheesy exploit) and the end result is a game that can remain balanced and feature skiing.

We need to get one thing straight.

Skiing is not a bug. It is not an exploit.

Ski'ing was a feature of the physics that was discovered in pre-release testing of tribes 1. The dev team left it in for release because they thought it was cool. After about 8 patches, Ski'ing was not patched out while other real bugs were left in. Skiing IS what the developers intended.

You might as well be saying that Headshots are a bug in counterstrike. Skiing just takes a little more practise than headshooting (and incidentally, a lot LESS practise than bunnyhopping - how hard can hitting your space key be)

Anyway, Skiing was not patched out for Tribes2 either and was made 'an integral part of the game' i.e. it featured in the manual and the tutorial. However, the problem was that owing to people like yourself, the dev team put a cap on the speed that can be accrued by a person not in a vehicle. As a result, this meant that the game was so slow as to be unplayable. Public server play was awful as a result of having to rely on random muppets to transport other random muppets around (your own bf suffers from this too). Clanned play made a little more sense, but there was still the feel of S L O W about it.


FYI, it wasnt KineticPoet who 'discovered' skiing. He was just one of the best tribes 1 cappers and came up with some really inventive Skiroutes on the map.

Tell me how exactly skiing ruined balance in tribes 1? Correct me if im wrong, but i get the impression that you played a few pub games here and there and then moved onto the next game when you didnt like the turn tribes took.

tHE vAGGABOND

ok, ok - lets hope this game is good, few things..

The producer ignored all bug reports and the game was released

As someone in the games industry, the producer should have zero to do with bug reporting. The producer of a title like tribes two is mainly to sit between the developers and the business people. To make sure the coders are ahppy and doing their job, and then on the other side that the marketing and sales people at the publishers are doing their job. While he would liaze with the test team, no producer of a game I have worked on has had anything but once every so often meetings with me. If the develoeprs did not fix the bugs, or could not fix the bugs thats different. Maybe the system for people reporting bugs was bad, all I remember was that I saw someone at a lan with the first beta, and to be nice, it was utterly ****ed! But what idiot said the T2 was fit to release, after the bad feedback that must have come back from the closed beta should have been (and prolly was when dynamix was shot down!) fired!

Two things I would be worried about would be that sierra have hardly been setting the world on fire with their wide array of titles, they make released a lot of crap games. Second the fact they are using a mish mash of technology increases the chances of their being bugs left right and centre in the game. I think builing upon the T2 codebase with havok's stuff and whatever else could have been a better option. An open beta is great, but its no use getting 10,000 dodgy bug reports from an open beta, on top of say are several thousand bugs from internal testing all together in their bugs database >> they simply wont have time to fix them..

But as a ex tribes player I hope Im wrong

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Dustaz

You might as well be saying that Headshots are a bug in counterstrike. Skiing just takes a little more practise than headshooting (and incidentally, a lot LESS practise than bunnyhopping - how hard can hitting your space key be)

Anyway, Skiing was not patched out for Tribes2 either and was made 'an integral part of the game' i.e. it featured in the manual and the tutorial. However, the problem was that owing to people like yourself, the dev team put a cap on the speed that can be accrued by a person not in a vehicle. As a result, this meant that the game was so slow as to be unplayable. Public server play was awful as a result of having to rely on random muppets to transport other random muppets around (your own bf suffers from this too). Clanned play made a little more sense, but there was still the feel of S L O W about it.
.

Skiing does not take more skill than headshots or bunny hopping. Most players used scripts that allowed little more than one hand on spacebar to ski.

[I dont claim "ownership" over BF nor do I advocate it as the model for all things right and wrong in multiplay fps btw.]

Why must someone that takes the time to transport their allies around be a "muppet"? DesertCombat features user flyable aircraft, people enjoy learning to fly them and working as a team to get the chopper in enemy bases. This never really "took off" (pardon the pun) in Tribes as each individual was so fast it negated the need to actually use vehicles. The individual was even harder to take down than a craft and could reach stupidly fast speeds, heavy armor overtaking scout craft... why bother with craft at all!?

Im not the only one who didnt like skiing, so please stop pretending those that dont share your view are fringe lunatics:

http://www.tribalwar.com/soap/index.php?articleid=22 (talks about the complaints when skiing had to be toned down as it was ruining the game)

http://www.firingsquad.com/games/tribes2/
(talks about how skiing removed the teamplay and how skiing was not part of the game originally- it was "found out")

http://actionvault.ign.com/features/interviews/tribesvengintpt1.shtml
(Devs discussing how skiing was *not* integral to Tribes1 but will be in Vengence)

http://www.the-junkyard.net/tribes2.php
(Tribes2: quote "A bug that was left in, in Tribes, commonly called Skiing (utilizing this bug, heavy armored troops could cover ground faster than an Air scout), has been greatly curbed so as to balance the game.")

http://www.planettribes.com/lorne/mods/purity.shtml
(A mod made to reduce the predetermined "ski route" gameplay and 5 min games that excessive skiing caused in vanilla Tribes)


Wow, look, it seems quite alot of people, from mod makers to devs to press to fans are not "good enough to handle its implications" just like me!

Ill leave you and this topic with a quote from a tribes mod (re: skiing) that attempts to tackle your ilks rabid, fanboy devotion: "This has become almost a religious issue, but for no reason. The whole point of Tribes, IMO, is to have fun, whether that fun be in the form of a challenge or because of the creative freedom the game allows in the way of tactics."

To be honest, I really dont care about this as much as you do, I guess it has to do with me being an "idiot"... Im sure your crusade has recruited some new players into the friendly Tribes universe tho... :rolleyes:



Matt

Praetorian

It looks good. I'm looking forward to kicking your collective a$$3$ ww)

Dustaz

Originally posted by Matt Simis
Skiing does not take more skill than headshots or bunny hopping. Most players used scripts that allowed little more than one hand on spacebar to ski.

I never said it did. Skiing is easy, skiing well isnt.

Why must someone that takes the time to transport their allies around be a "muppet"? DesertCombat features user flyable aircraft, people enjoy learning to fly them and working as a team to get the chopper in enemy bases. This never really "took off" (pardon the pun) in Tribes as each individual was so fast it negated the need to actually use vehicles. The individual was even harder to take down than a craft and could reach stupidly fast speeds, heavy armor overtaking scout craft... why bother with craft at all!?

I was referring to public servers where players didnt really know what they were doing and (certainly in tribes2) the amount of time wasted in waiting to get a skilled pilot with 4 heavies to actually go to a base without crashing was laborious. vanilla bf suffers from this same problem. For the most part, people are stupid.


Now, onto your Press clippings extravaganza!

Im not the only one who didnt like skiing, so please stop pretending those that dont share your view are fringe lunatics:

Certainly not, there are plenty of lunatics who didnt like skiing. Most of them thought tribes 2 was 'kewl' and are now playing games like bf, but not tribes 2. Noone really plays it. Its boring. There was a team called 5150, who were a pretty impressive tribes1 team. They played in the premier ladder for tribes competition for Tribes2 and dominated it. They didnt lose a SINGLE match. They didnt lose a SINGLE map. They dropped from the competition out of boredom.

http://www.tribalwar.com/soap/index.php?articleid=22 (talks about the complaints when skiing had to be toned down as it was ruining the game)

http://www.tribalwar.com/soap/index.php?articleid=15

http://www.tribalwar.com/soap/index.php?articleid=6

"No strategy can "ruin the game". They simply introduce new aspects to a diverse game that was made to have strategies. What's the solution? You have two. Either become a cluster team yourselves and beat them at their own game (something some teams either will not nor can not do), or come up with new strategies to counter"

http://www.tribalwar.com/soap/index.php?articleid=18

"Their answer to reduced skiing: more vehicles. Oh joy. Sure vehicles might be cool to run around in, I know occasionally I hope in a scout and fly around maps just because it's fun. But does anyone else remember back when Tribes came out, before skiing got big, what using vehicles was like? Well let me remind you who don't. Walk up to a vehicle pad and try to purchase a scout. Only you couldn't because they were all sitting on top of the enemy's base on Scarabrae with no one in them. Or you'd buy them and some jerk would hop into them before you. "


And a thousand other threads on tribalwar. Its funny how you managed to find the minority in there.

http://www.firingsquad.com/games/tribes2/
(talks about how skiing removed the teamplay and how skiing was not part of the game originally- it was "found out")

http://actionvault.ign.com/features/interviews/tribesvengintpt1.shtml
(Devs discussing how skiing was *not* integral to Tribes1 but will be in Vengence)

Both of these are pre-release blurb for a game that failed miserably.

http://www.planettribes.com/lorne/mods/purity.shtml
(A mod made to reduce the predetermined "ski route" gameplay and 5 min games that excessive skiing caused in vanilla Tribes)

Great, who plays this? noone.

To be honest, I really dont care about this as much as you do,

No, you dont. If you did youd still be playing tribes2 with its lack of skiing and vehicle driven combat.


Look, i know some people dont like ski'ing and how it affected the game, but these people must accept that it is the majority of tribes players that prefer it that way. These were the people that evolved tribes far past its potential. It is for this reasons that there WAS a tribes2 or will be a tribes3.

The magic of the evolution of tribes is what kept people playing for 5 years, they STILL play it today. The same cannot be said for the compromise tribes2.

Dustaz

Originally posted by tHE vAGGABOND
As someone in the games industry, the producer should have zero to do with bug reporting.

I have no idea how it worked, but all i know is that judging from people who were on the beta, a lot of the blame was laid at dave georgesons feet. Both for the bugs and the early release.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Dustaz

No, you dont. If you did youd still be playing tribes2 with its lack of skiing and vehicle driven combat.


The magic of the evolution of tribes is what kept people playing for 5 years, they STILL play it today. The same cannot be said for the compromise tribes2.

Eh.. I said I *don't* care about this as much as you do (re: skiing).

Other than that, all Ill say is that I never played more than the demo of Tribes2, I was a big vanilla Tribes 1 fan. Tribes2 sucked for many reasons, most of them technical. I dont know why you assumed I played Tribes2. Afaik, the amount of people that did is relatively miniscule, certainly compared to 1942 and Tribes1.

On a slightly different topic: Perhaps vehicles are worth another shot these days? I find most people have enough smarts these days in 1942,DC to command and fly vehicles and work as a team. Getting a bunch of people to ride and command a vehicle to complete an objective is the ultimate example of teamwork. Id hate to see Tribes3 try to resurrect the "glory days" of Tribes much like Tribes2 did and fail equally miserably.



Matt

Dustaz

Originally posted by Matt Simis
Getting a bunch of people to ride and command a vehicle to complete an objective is the ultimate example of teamwork.

I guess this is where we differ on the entire issue. I dont find that the ultimate example of teamwork. 3 people get into the same vehicle and help each other out to attack a position from that vehicle. I see that as working together, and thats fine. Lots of people like it, great but im not mad about it.

In tribes 1, the team work was different (and imo, greater). Your much maligned mach 1 capper is useless in the face of a good base defense. So he needs 3 heavies to go in before him to clear the way for him. The base def WILL deal with them quite quickly and ready the defense quicker than you may think. The window of oppurtunity that the capper has is very small so this needs to be co-ordinated very well. People need to start their runs so that they finish 30 seconds later (even a minute later) at pretty much exactly the same time. Its not a case of looking at the guy beside you in the helicopter, its a case of practising timing, and learning how to adjust things on the fly to compensate for something that happened 10 secs ago 500 meters away.

This type of teamwork allows for both co-operation and the 'cowboy' element - the feeling that one player CAN make a difference. I dont get that feeling from 1942 or tribes2 as im just another faceless drone in a massive team. In tribes 1 (and CS also has this in spades), i feel that although on my own, im not useful, as part of a team i can stand out and make the difference.

Basically, thats what annoys me about people saying "theres no teamwork in tribes1"

Id hate to see Tribes3 try to resurrect the "glory days" of Tribes much like Tribes2 did and fail equally miserably.

I think you have the wrong end of the stick. Tribes 2 aimed to be the game that Tribes 1 was 'intended' to be. Forced vehicular combat and no mach 1 skiing. Thats why it sucked

Pugsley

Skiiing isnt hard either, I dunno why you would suggest it is? I simply preferred the more balanced game that existed before.. you know, when plans and strategies existed. If it wasnt so "popular" then this exploit would have been removed, much like the floating\hopping was from CS

Uhhh, removal of bunny hopping removed, pretty much, ALL of the fun of TFC, once BH was removed tactics could be seriously dumbed down because you no longer have mach3 medics, while I played little of Tribes2 and none of Tribes1, from this rant I see its pretty much the same rant. Some people want no BHing and a more 'slow paced team work game', dusty however seems to want to faster paced game of blitzing. In TFC with BHing in the team work was huge, defending mach3 medics took some seriously well skilled defence soldiers, and VERY quick communications. Offence required serious timing, you only had a small time gap before the defence were ready between each attack. Once BH was removed great soldiers were no longer as neccesary, yes they helped, but they werent NEEDED anymore, therefore the game got dumbed down. Medics no longer needed to navigate 1 meter wide rooms at speed of 30mph while having rockets fired at them from all angles, further dumbing down, you no longer NEEDED amasing medics. The serious dumbing down of both player skill and team work by just removing bunny hopping....... So Im with dusty on this one, keep the speed gaming, skiing is a good thing by the sounds of it.

Matt Simis

Originally posted by Pugsley
Uhhh, removal of bunny hopping removed, pretty much, ALL of the fun of TFC,

No one mentioned TFC. But you are right, you most likely would like skiing too.



Matt

SantaHoe

Originally posted by Matt Simis
No one mentioned TFC.

Well Counter-Strike was mentioned, and since they're mods on the same engine - there was just as much controversy in the TFC community about bunnyhopping, and similar tactical implications.
But that's going off the point.

Although Skiiing sounds like fun, if it renders vehicles useless then surely what's the point of having vehicles?
IMO they should have some ski's as a part of your chosen inventory, meaning you can't carry something else, and have those skiing polls if you want to go uphill... and a little bobbly hat

Honestly though, when I played T2, I was one of those "EVERYONE IN TEH PLANE!!!" muppets... used to love taking a transport of people and doing loop-the-loops, oh such fun!
Taking a bomber out on your own, and jumping from the pilot seat, to the bombadier's seat while still in mid-air.
Doing the happy-yeeehaaa-dance while firing my blaster, only to accidentaly TK someone looked hillarious.
I don't think I've laughed has hard playing any online game as I have with T2
Must install the oul' girl again one of these days... anyone still playing it online?

Hal1

Originally posted by SantaHoe

Honestly though, when I played T2, I was one of those "EVERYONE IN TEH PLANE!!!" muppets... used to love taking a transport of people and doing loop-the-loops, oh such fun!

Yea that rocks!

Taking a bomber out on your own, and jumping from the pilot seat, to the bombadier's seat while still in mid-air.

Can be a difficult move

Doing the happy-yeeehaaa-dance while firing my blaster, only to accidentaly TK someone looked hillarious.
I don't think I've laughed has hard playing any online game as I have with T2
Must install the oul' girl again one of these days... anyone still playing it online?

Yep, and have being playing it for the last 3 years. I still believe it is a great game and one I'll always go back to, im a bit of a die-hard when it comes to T2 and I cant wait for teh Vengence

Hal1

p.s.
what was/is your alias in Tribes2, mines !Madden! see the Tribes2 addicts here http://t2stats.thepact.net/

Dustaz

is that the same EM from Tribes 1 days?

zAbbo

You guys might be interested in http://hosted.tribalwar.com/legends/

Which is Tribes-like and free multiplayer

tHE vAGGABOND

Dustaz - no its not

Most of the old tribes 1 EM ppl joined UK clan EED. Tribes 2 was ****, so we never really played it. We are currently found playing Desert Combat on our server AhM. (due to members age, jobs, marraige, babies etc we drink more than we play these days!)

An ex-EM member revived the clan name and actually made them good again, but it was never quite the same

Dustaz

Originally posted by bazH
You guys might be interested in http://hosted.tribalwar.com/legends/

Which is Tribes-like and free multiplayer

Yeh, they used the GarageGames Torque engine to try to rewrite Tribes1 since sierra wont fix the existing issues with it. I thought it was still in beta tho?

edit: yeh, still in beta.

Hal1

EM = Electric Mayhem , a ladder tribe Im currently with atm and they are still active playing Tribes2. Not sure if they are the same guys that played Tribes1 Dustaz, I wasn't playing Tribes back then.

Dr_Teeth

hehe yeah that's Sud's re-launched EM. Man they still play T2? dearie me.

Teeth.