Why should the state give so much to the disabled ?

yellum

(devils advocate)

Why should the state give so much and go out of their way so much for diabled people ?

The state does spend an awful lot on disabled people and it never seems to recoup its money back. Our taxes /might/ be lower if the state stopped pampering some people. So why should so much effort be spent on disabled people ?

Falkorre

hmmmmmmmmm.........
Zipping my lips to see how this pans out for the moment.

yellum, got any stats to backup and compare for that statement?

As this has the potential to go seriously flamey (an not in a good way) i say be carefull! Lets actually discuss this and not just scream at each other k?

B

Victor

I'm not sure if it does give **so much**.

While there is a constitutional guarantee to free primary education, that has long been ignored by government.

Government has been immensely reluctant to improve on Accessibility / Mobility measures - why are we still constructing buildings with steps at the front, when we could construct a cheaper building without steps? I suspect this is largely on architctural snobbery grounds - being "above" the public as you look out ftom your office. Likewise the government handed out free travel passes to people in wheelchairs, when those people couldn't use busses because they were inaccessible.

The government engages in many measures to regulate society. Providing monetary and medical benefits and some social services to those with a disabilty (and the ill, elderly and children) is in line with this.

Where the government has drammaticly failed is in not empowering people to help themselves.

Suzybie

Yellum,

sigh...zipping lips here too thinking its a Glenn Hoddle moment....

Making my weary way to bed to plan another day of being a burden on the state and its tax payers...


suzy

Guy:Incognito

They would be better off introduceing a scheme to cut off lazty wasters dole. You should only be entitled to 6 months dole at a time (up to a maximum over a lifetime) as it is my firm belief that with the exception of certain people , ie disabled and/or unable to work, theres no one who is incapable of getting a job. There are jobs available for anyone who wants one but too many people are gettiing an easy ride.

People on the dole should be handed a card with a name and address of a job where they will be starting asap (maybe a weeks leway) when they go to sign-on and if they decide not to turn up or they get fired for being a lazy bastard or not going in, they should lose entitlement to the dole for about 5 years.
That would free up a lot of spare cash

Victor

Originally posted by Stekelly
People on the dole should be handed a card with a name and address of a job where they will be starting asap (maybe a weeks leway) when they go to sign-on and if they decide not to turn up or they get fired for being a lazy bastard or not going in, they should lose entitlement to the dole for about 5 years.
That would free up a lot of spare cash

Yep, I agree, all those [strike]strip clubs [/strike] gentlemen's clubs and [strike]brothels[/strike] escort services are crying out for workers. :P

Señor Juárez

hear about all those millions being spent to upgrade to special wheelchair accessible buses? it costs a helluvalot to give a bus the ability to crouch, and it uses a helluvalot of space for that wheelchair place.

not to say it isnt a good idea.....but i get the bus twice a day, usually more at weekends, and i have never, ever, not even once seen a disabled person taking advantage of these facilities.

It also doesnt help that less than 1 in 4 buses has this facility. imagine waiting at a bus stop where a bus comes every 20 or 30 mins. then imagine having to ignore the first 3 or 4 buses that came.

Victor

The space is regularly used by parents with prams, elderly people and so on. It also provides standing room when not in use.

Typically routes are converted to a single bus type, not a mixed fleet, so people know reasonably well which routes will have an accessible bus. While this creates certainty, it mean it will take longer for accessible services to reach everyone who needs it.

The crouching feature on buses is becoming less important as bus stops are being rebuilt with higher kerbs.

Señor Juárez

aint people supposed to NOT have prams out on buses? they tend to fly around at corners and such, and that cant be good for little jimmy.

i regularly get the 16 bus, about 1 in 4 or 5 is a crouchy new one.

speaking of which...what are they doing with all the old buses??

Victor

Originally posted by marclar
aint people supposed to NOT have prams out on buses? they tend to fly around at corners and such, and that cant be good for little jimmy.

The newer buses are designed to carry one wheelchair or one pram, but only if it is placed rear facing and the brakes applied. Older bus models should have the pram stowed and the child seated.

Originally posted by marclar
speaking of which...what are they doing with all the old buses??

The new buses are being bought at a slightly higher rate than old buses are retired. Given than a bus can be on the road for 6-18 hours a day, they wear out quicker than cars

Moonbeam

Why should the state give so much and go out of their way so much for disabled people ?

Wouldn't it be be nice if they did?

Everyone should have the chance to be able to carry out their day to day lives with out too much hassle(within reason I know) from things that others take for granted,
They shouldn't necessarily go out of their way so much but just take it into account when new buildings and public transport is being designed and developed, and when employment laws are implemented,

I remember going to England a few years ago with my friends as a pa,and the ease of getting around there was unbelievable compared to here,The transport,the restaurants even the night clubs were alot more accessible.

Tyrrial

personaly i think that DCU alocates way to much money for people with Dyselxia. free laptops, free printing, healthy grants available. i mean come on! will a new laptop really help people to read better? i think not. and before anyone gives out about be being jelouse or something, i AM dyslexic and i AM in DCU.... any thoughts?

Amz

I've noticed over the years going through the various levels of education that people with dyslexia do get an awful lot of allowances. Surely though if they're available to you, you should avail of them? Obviously people believe they're needed?

Although I cannot comment having never experienced the situation myself. I didn't realise ye got free printing! I don't! and I need it coz I've to print slides out one per page and it's ****ing expensive!!

Victor

Lots of colleges have laptop programmes, not just for those with dyslexia.

Eh, do you have a laptop? You really need to run "Speeling and Grammer". At least on a computer, one can check your spelling (even if doing so is difficult) - it tells you its not right - whereas one is left oblivious with handwritten notes and projects.

Amz

I received a second hand laptop from DCU, it was referred to as "The Beast" when I got it...

Now normally when something is referred to as "the beast" it causes you to become a little excited, in this instance however I was left with a piece of crap laptop that runs Windows 95/98 can't remember coz I don't use it... It is as slow as bedamned has none of the software I'd need installed on it! So I now have "the beast" stored in my bedroom in it's case probably never to see the light of day unless my mam needs it to type something out. I can't realistically be lugging it around with me as I commute each day and I've no locker!

Lafortezza

One thing I thought was a bit weird was that during college there was a couple of people who suffered from "exam anxiety". This meant that they freaked out with worry when put in an exam situation, whether they couldn't handle the time pressure, or looking around and seeing a hall full of people busily scribbling away or whatever. Now we all get nervous/terrified in exams but these people seemed to get huge allowances for their problem.

They'd get a seperate room and examiner and were pretty much allowed as much time as they needed to get through the questions required. Now thats all well and good but after thinking about it, if this person didn't feel the anxiety once they were put in the special room without the stress of the big exam hall, then they were no longer as stressed and could perform as well as the majority. Except they could take up to four and a half hours for a three hour paper. Obviously the one or two I knew always seemed to do very well in exams.

Soz for teh slightly off-topic it just seemed a bit unfair to me.

sunbeam

Yeah, they used to let students suffering from exam anxiety sit their papers in 'sick bay' in my college as well. As far as I know they didn't get any extra time though.

Tyrrial

Originally posted by Amz
I've noticed over the years going through the various levels of education that people with dyslexia do get an awful lot of allowances. Surely though if they're available to you, you should avail of them? Obviously people believe they're needed?

Although I cannot comment having never experienced the situation myself. I didn't realise ye got free printing! I don't! and I need it coz I've to print slides out one per page and it's fucking expensive!!

just go and ask the disability service if they'll credit your libaray account. they did it for a friend of mine.

Amz

Probably will, the printing is costing me a bomb, I've spent over twenty quid on one subjects printing already this semester and we're only back two weeks!

Tyrrial

let me know how you get on.

i've just discovered that as a computer application (CA) student i have 2 printing accounts. one in the library and one on the CA building. but the disability service can only credit the libarary one.. so they said that they will give checks monthly to be put into my pub... ummm i mean CA building account.... interesting... eh

Amz

Ooooh... wil go tomorrow and have a natter... Tuesday is my business doing day
Monday is my what did I do at the weekend day...

Proud Mary 1980

Okay I haven't read previous posts on this topic as I'd get so mad. Oh btw this is my first post. The state doesn't give enough at all, I am a 23 year old woman with a disability. I have had to fight for everything I have and I'm still fighting.

Demonique

Well, why should they pay so much to lazy ****ers who are able to work but can't be bothered

Why should they pay so much to teen girls who are too stupid to keep their legs shut or open them because they know they could get a council house?

Hagar

yellum wrote:

(devils advocate)

Why should the state give so much and go out of their way so much for diabled people ?

The state does spend an awful lot on disabled people and it never seems to recoup its money back. Our taxes /might/ be lower if the state stopped pampering some people. So why should so much effort be spent on disabled people ?

You're making a common mistake, the State is the people of Ireland, not some abstract public body, it's us, the people ourselves, collectively.

The reason the disabled get so much money and effort spent on them? Simple, they need it. They are our children, our brothers and sisters, our fathers and mothers, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc. They have not been treated well in the past, things are getting better I think but I'm fairly sure that there is much more to be done.

As for recouping the money, well I'm glad I'm not in your family.

Amz

Unfortunately though Hagar they don't get that much money and effort spent on them at all.

The number of people with disabilities in employment in this country is very, very low. There are so many barriers to education and employment that many people with disabilities have no alternative but to claim disability benefits etc.

Things are changing in some regards, but this country is still very backward in the way it treats those with a disability compared to other countires.

luckat

OP, define your terms, please. What gifts by the state are you talking about exactly?

Blowfish

luckat wrote:

OP, define your terms, please. What gifts by the state are you talking about exactly?

Considering the thread was started 3 years ago and the OP has since been banned, it might be a bit difficult for them to answer

Blue Velvet

i just bought a mobility scooter and it goes really really fast, it was good at first but then the guards started hasstleing me for using it in the cycle lane!!!! unbelievable i can move just as fast as a bike, and if i go on the pavement i might hit someone

KilbarrackBlows

yellum wrote:

(devils advocate)

Why should the state give so much and go out of their way so much for diabled people ?

The state does spend an awful lot on disabled people and it never seems to recoup its money back. Our taxes /might/ be lower if the state stopped pampering some people. So why should so much effort be spent on disabled people ?

ough this post just pissed me off so much i hope you ****ing disabled and see how much it is you get "^£$%^ thick. :mad:

ah wtf just noticed it was bumped its aincent *calms down*

Victor

Blue Velvet wrote:

i just bought a mobility scooter and it goes really really fast, it was good at first but then the guards started hasstleing me for using it in the cycle lane!!!! unbelievable i can move just as fast as a bike, and if i go on the pavement i might hit someone

Tell them mechanically propelled wheelchairs (if that is what you have) are exempt.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/si/0182.html

Does it have lights and reflectors?