nForce2

The_B_Man

im building a pc and i mite be gettin a motherboard with the nforce 2 chipset. i was also gonna get Geforce 4 MX 440-8x AGP - E53.66 from komplett.ie but i only read in a review that the nforce 2 comes with onboard geforce 4 mx440. is this true? or are they a filtered down version of the Geforce 4 MX 440-8x AGP? any one have any info about this? im interested coz it could save me €50 straight away. my pc is as follows:

From www.komplett.ie : All prices include VAT

Updated:
Case: Chenbro Gaming Box Black/Orange 350w PSU - E80.01
Processor: AMD Athlon XP2600+ 1.917 GHz - E100.19
MotherBoard: Abit NF7 V2.0 - E83.49
Graphics: Abit Siluro Geforce FX 5200DT 128MB - E70.18
Ram: Corsair Value S. PC3200 DDR-DIMM 512MB - E81.07
Fan: CooloerMasterJet7+ Cooler = E41.55

Total : E456.49

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or

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Upgrade Kit AMD XP2800+ 2.083 Ghz Barton, Asus A7N8X Deluxe, PC3200 DDR 512MB, Fan
E325.43

Case: Chenbro Gaming Box Black/Orange 350w PSU - E80.01
Graphics: Abit Siluro Geforce FX 5200DT 128MB - E70.18

Total: E475.62

Stephen

With regards to nforce 2 motherboards with onboard geforce4 mx chipsets:
Some motherboards will come like that, others have no onboard graphics. My Abit NF7-S for instance, has no onboad graphics. Check the specs of whichever motherboards you're interested in.

Dempsey

Abit NF7 V2.0 and the Asus A7N8X-E Deluxe

No mention of onboard graphics on either. The Asus isnt bad or anything but Id recommend the Abit NF7 v2.0 myself.

That ram is for 400MHz FSB (yer CPU is 333MHz), are you overclocking? It will work fine but it will be slightly "underclocked" to match the bus of the CPU chosen.

Id also look for a better graphics card if possible it may be 8x but still isnt that good, might be worth it to stretch for 9600Pro, you might be better off in the long run

The_B_Man

i looked into it more! the only board with onboard graphics is the A7N8X-VM!

crap, i knew i'd miss something! that ram is over the top then? its for home so theres not gonna be any ocing!

as regards graphics, i might spend €70 on the geforce fx 5200. it should be enough for me little sister chattin on MSN Messenger to her mates and the odd game of quake or watchin DVD/DivX movies.

why do u recommend the abit nf7?
so ur sayin i need pc2700 ram?

the abit has no firewire. u know them firewire pci cards? i take it u dont need the firewire connectors on ur mobo for them ie theyre totally self contained? (unlike the firewire backplates u get that connect to the pins on ur mobo)

Dempsey

PC2700 would save you a few quid alright (not an awful amount). PC3200 would work the finest in there too.

If thats all that the machine will be really doing then a MX440 would be fine.

I recommend one because i hear good thing about them, more so than the Asus board so...

I have a Abit board(IC7-G) and its excellent, not one problem with it, id expect the same from the NF7 v2. If i went athlon at the time, that would have been the board i would have bought.

Firewire is supported but I dont see a connector for the firewire. The ones your on about will connect to the board and stick out a PCI hole(not occupy the slot). is it essential?

The_B_Man

m lookin at a few sites now. is the Abit NF7 V2.0 the same as the Abit NF7-S V2.0? coz if it is then it DOES have firewire! firewire isnt essential but i'd rather have coz i can see me da buyin a DV camera in the next few months. the only reason i was lookin at the asus a7n8x-e deluxe was coz i didnt think the abit nf7 had firewire and also coz it has gigabit lan, the abit only has 10/100. i think ill just go for the abit nf7 v2. im usin some of me old stuff like keyboard, mouse, 15 inch monitor, speakers 60gb 7200rpm seagate HD. i think ill stick to the pc3200 ram. i think ill also throw on a DVD writer like this one on komplett . it only duz dvd+rw though. do u think the cooler is too much? the "lite" version is cheaper @ ~€25.

Col_Loki

This abit board (version of the NF7) has on board graphics and should do exactly what you want.... Komplett - Abit Nf7-M . I have the Abit NF7-S myslef, the main difference is it supposrt SATA hard drives, it has FireWire and slightly better built in sound. Abit are fantastic , ive had Asus and Msi and id never go away from abit.....

Pc3200 ram is about the same price give or take a euro as far as i remember. Ive recently recomended Pc3200 oem memory from komplett (twinmos) and both sticks were duds, such a pain and no one needs the hassle of RMA (komplett are very slow with them these days)... try www.pc-memory-upgrade.co.uk for ram, might be a little dearer but there based in kildare, its free delivery and there customer service is very good!! (Corsair Value isint bad ram btw, just dont go for oem) .

The fan you are thinking of is a little bit crazy, if your ok to spend that much why not get one that will work silently and be adjustable if you want to overclock.... this one is rated very highly Zalman CNPS 7000a ALCU .

As reguards the DVD+R burner , i think its a good choice. I have one myself and im very happy with it. Great price for such a good drive!!

Giblet

Yep, I have the Abit NF7-M, and it has an inbuilt GF4mx440.

The S is more featured in other ways, but has no IGP.

And yes the RAM will work at 400mhz and the CPU at 333mhz and it won't be slowed down.

Dempsey

The NF7-M suits you better, i didnt see that when i was looking around last night( tiredness:D ). Its exactly what you want except no firewire. 100Mb LAN is fine, wont be disappointed or anything.

For memory, www.shop4memory.com (same company as www.pc-memory-upgrade.co.uk), I havent bought ram anywhere else, their selection leaves komplett and others in the shade, and free delivery.

BadCharlie

Have this board "NF7-S V2.0" its great. Have my chip clocked from 2500barton to a 3200+ with stock cooling and pc2100ram. So as u can guess ill say go abit all the way!!

The_B_Man

theres a difference between the nf7 v2.0 and the nfy-s v2.0. apparently the "-s" is for SATA and it also has "dolby 5.1" as opposed to "5.1". see for urself: Abit NF7 V2.0 and Abit NF7-S V2.0 . i suppose i can get the nf7-m with the IGP and just buy a firewire card if i need it! they're only bout €30 in Compustore. which ill save anyway on not buyin the separate graphics card. actually, is there any problems caused or decreases in performance from havin the IGP mx440 over a separate mx440 in the AGP slot? i think i read somehwere there was. i think it was something to do with the dual channel memory competing with the graphics in 128-bit mode or something along them lines (possibly the problem with nf7 v1.0 or even the a7n8x range). ill have 2 start keepin the reviews i read.


just noticed, the nf7-m with IGP has a fsb of 333mhz. the others have 400mhz. is that only a problem for me when i wanna upgrade in a few years as the only 400mhz amd cpu is the top line 3000+ and above cpus and the one im buyin is 2600 or 2800 with 333mhz fsb??

OfflerCrocGod

Originally posted by Giblet
And yes the RAM will work at 400mhz and the CPU at 333mhz and it won't be slowed down.

And how does the RAM achive that?.

Woden

tbh when you upgrade in a few years you won't be going from a 333mhz bus to a 400mhz bus, you'll be getting a mucher bigger upgrade to 64-bit processors etc. so i don't think there is a problem there. the later abit nf boards support 400mhz they are the nforce 2 ultra boards, i suppose its up to you to decided whether you will need 400mhz in the near future.

also the lite version of the coolermaster cooler you mentioned will be more then fine to cool what you are getting so i won't get the more expensive version. a lot of people recommend the lite version over the more expensive version anyway.

Col_Loki

And how does the RAM achive that?.

You dont have to have the RAM insync with the FSB , you can run it by "SPD" and it will run at its designed speed and timings.
Also the PC3200 ram will run at Pc2700 with no problems at all, so if you have the choice always go for Pc3200 (unless its a good bit more expensive).

The Xp3200+ is the end of the Socket A CPU's , there are only currently 2 AMD chips that are socket A and use 400mhz FSB (xp3200+ and Xp3000+ - also in 333mhz FSB version). AFAIK the NF7-M is 400mhz FSB compliant but im not 100% (ignore komplett) .

The_B_Man

The Xp3200+ is the end of the Socket A CPU's

thats not very encouraging!! then is there any point in me gettin a crappy 32-bit pc now? or will i still get a few years out of it?

Woden

yeah you might as well go ahead with it, it will last as long as you want it if you only wanna play dvd's quake and use msn, its still a good idea to upgrade to a 32-bit system now you'll get a good while out of it.

also with an amd system its a good idea to run the memory in synch with the fsb of the processor it gives better performance i think

The_B_Man

so faster, more expensive 400mhz RAM will be slower than RAM that has a top speed of 333mhz because the CPU is 333mhz? or do u mean get the faster stuff and "underclock" it in the BIOS or sumtin? i thought that was automatic?

Woden

if you buy a 333mhz cpu and 400mhz ram the ram will probably be underclocked automatically by the bios, the 400mhz ram will perform the same as if you purchased 333mhz ram provided all the timings are the same.

in my machine for example i have a 333mhz processor and 433mhz ram, the processor is overclocked to 400mhz so my ram is still underclocked. however i have some breathing room if i want to overclock somemore as i wouldn't have to overclock the ram.

OfflerCrocGod

Originally posted by COL_LOKI
You dont have to have the RAM insync with the FSB , you can run it by "SPD" and it will run at its designed speed and timings.

How?, the FSB runs at 333Mhz the RAM at 400MHz where does the extra 67Mhz of information enter the FSB of the CPU?, if the FSB goes at 333Mhz that WILL BE the max speed of the RAM(unless you oc). The RAM can't transfer faster then the CPU can handle - cause that causes bad things to happen!;).

Dempsey

Originally posted by OfflerCrocGod
How?, the FSB runs at 333Mhz the RAM at 400MHz where does the extra 67Mhz of information enter the FSB of the CPU?, if the FSB goes at 333Mhz that WILL BE the max speed of the RAM(unless you oc). The RAM can't transfer faster then the CPU can handle - cause that causes bad things to happen!;).

If ya have PC3200 Ram running on a 333Mhz bus the ram will automatically be set by the bios to run at PC2700. Underclocking the ram effectively to keep it in sync with the fsb

Woden

i thought you could run the ram at 400mhz though if you wanted too even if the processor was running at 333mhz. i thought however that best performance in an amd platform is obtained by running the ram and cpu in synch,

i don't think this is true though of an intel platform?

Col_Loki

There is an option in the BIOS to run your FSB:RAM at 5:6 which would mean your RAM running at 400mhz (supposidly) and your FSB at 333mhz.

Although utterly pointless it is an option in the Abit NF7 BIOS. There is obviously 0% performance gain from doing this.

Am not sure why i brought this up prob to show it would work either way..... oh yea and the fact that it was nearly 2 in the morning .

Kazu

why build

http://www.compgeeks.com/products.asp?cat=SYS

The_B_Man

does un/buffered or non/parity make any difference? any1 able to even explain wat they are? i think theres a registered one aswell but i dont know wat it is!

OfflerCrocGod

Cause COL_LOKI you made it sound as if you could have your cake and eat it too; which is patently false the CPU FSB Rules Then All!!!!:D.

Dempsey

Originally posted by The_B_Man
does un/buffered or non/parity make any difference? any1 able to even explain wat they are? i think theres a registered one aswell but i dont know wat it is!

Get non-ECC. That type is generally used in server machines. Ill give ya a link or something about it later.