Comreg to Let ESB Invent Postcoding Sceme For Ireland

spongebob

The ESB will do it anyway while Comreg haven't an original or useful thought betwen them.

The system is to track MPRN 's as the ESB calls them. A "Meter Point Reference Number". This will tag a geographic reference to the location of the Meter .

A Description of the ESB 'Postcoding' system is Here , once the ESB have done it Comreg will simply go along with it as they appear to have no ideas themselves.

The Car Reg scheme , as a basis for postcoding, is inadequate since the Language Bill. All the county codes are in English. You would now have to have an English and an Irish derivative of every placename which is not the best idea if you want Uniqueness. Numbers are uncontentious, not to mention constitutional and therefore numbers it will be.

The system can handle 10,000,000 unique geographic reference points. There are 1.4 Million households in Ireland and maybe 300,000 other structures including semi -derelicts. The ESB system can log 143 items per KM 2 whether they be house, shop , lamp or whatever. In addition, the ESB are going ahead with this plan anyway in preparation for deregulation of the market.

I heard the system may be

0 expansion reserve
1 Dublin Northside
2 Dublin Southside
3 Munster
4 Leinster
5 Connaught/Ulster.
6 expansion reserve
7 8 9 poles, signs and uninhabitable structures.

The ESB will probably then stick RF tags in everywhere , EG Turn right at 89235675 would be the pole at the bottom of my road .

Comregs function will be to reserve RF tag ID numerric space and frequency for the ESB in one of the ISM bands.

M

Borzoi

How come it needs an 11-digit number, ffs:rolleyes:

spongebob

The postcode component will only have 4-5 numbers, the first 2 are discarded and the next 4-5 will be used. That narrows a premises down to a cluster of 100 max.

UK postcodes are c.50 max once the letters at the end are factored in eg. NE1 2AA (2AA is a cluster of about 50 addresses or maybe a big company on its own). The UK scheme was invented in the day of the postman on his bicycle so 100 would do if you had a van, weight wise.

M

dahamsta

Isn't the electricity market, strictly speaking, already deregulated Muck? I thought that happened a few years ago; that the lack of competition was just down to the greedmeisters wanting jam on their duopoly.

adam

spongebob

Originally posted by dahamsta
Isn't the electricity market, strictly speaking, already deregulated Muck?
adam

Strictly speaking no. The new numbering system allows any carrier to put their own metres on the network, hence digits one and two in the code.

I think they call this "Local Loop Unbundling Adam"

m

dahamsta

Never heard of it.

I was thinking more along the lines of independent generating stations.

adam

Specky

There's a lot of infrastructural technology needs to be deployed in order to make the complete deregulation of electricity supply practical.

It's not like a phone call really. You need to be able to control and meter the system at a local level "above" the consumer and the technology isn't in place and working yet. In the power industry it's being called "distribution automation" or DA for short.

Couple of Irish companies working on the equipment. The ESB have bought and deployed some but not enough for it to be really deregulated.

In my opinion I don't much care who works out the post code system as long as someone does. I live in a rural area where there are at least 50 houses all with exactly the same address (and they aren't even all on the same road) and am sick and tired of having parcels undelivered because couriers can't find us (or should I say couriers can't be bothered to ring up or ask in the post office which they have to pass to get to us anyway). Or having post go missing for weeks on end because the sender doesn't fill out the full mailing address (on line forms are great the way they want things like "town" and "city" then miss out the street name when they produce the mailing address label...).

Anyone who's tried dealing the larger courier companies abroad will know that their systems simply don't work if you can't give them a post code!! Luckily somebody in UPS must have done something to the system here to make UPS Ireland's booking system work.

Gripe gripe, moan groan,

Victor

Originally posted by dahamsta
Isn't the electricity market, strictly speaking, already deregulated Muck? I thought that happened a few years ago; that the lack of competition was just down to the greedmeisters wanting jam on their duopoly.

The top end of the market is deregulated, each year and extra bracket of user is added. All of hte green energy market is deregulated.

ro_G

was that from ESBI or ESB Muck?

ro_G

they are setting themselves up for some good LBS (location based services), which makes me think its ESBI

ro_G

http://www.esbic.ie/geobusiness/geobusiness.htm

sceptre

Originally posted by Borzoi
How come it needs an 11-digit number, ffs:rolleyes:

A checksum digit in there somewhere might be nice.

BuffyBot

The last digit in the ESB code is a checksum digit

davros

According to the ESB guy at ComReg's symposium on postal codes this week, the ESB support the introduction of a postal code since MPRNs don't tell them how to find a particular meter. They still have a big problem with our non-unique, non-standard addresses.

rcunning03

are postal codes going to be introduced, or is it wishful thinking on the esb's part, i read an article that said an post would goto court if postcodes were introduced

spongebob

Gont forget that any postcode system in Ireland has to be numeric . If it is language or mnemonic based it would have to be in Irish.

It would then make sense to have a regionally significant digit at the beginning as in Germany. 8nnnnn in Germany is a Bavarian Postcode etc. Regional significance alone would make the courier companies vurry vurry hoppy.

M

davros

Originally posted by Muck
Gont forget that any postcode system in Ireland has to be numeric . If it is language or mnemonic based it would have to be in Irish.

Why is that? Car licence plate numbers have codes based on English.

davros

Originally posted by rcunning03
are postal codes going to be introduced, or is it wishful thinking on the esb's part, i read an article that said an post would goto court if postcodes were introduced

As I mentioned on the other thread, An Post have no objection to a postal code as long as they don't have to pay for implementing it.

Victor

Originally posted by davros
Why is that? Car licence plate numbers have codes based on English.

However, registration plate give priority to Irish.

Only saw this now.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2091-904879,00.html

Think tank calls for Irish postcodes
Jane Suiter

THE Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI) is to back the introduction of postcodes in Ireland at a symposium tomorrow. The influential think tank joins the Electricity Supply Board, the emergency services and banks in calling for the system, which is being opposed by An Post.
Ireland is one of only two countries in the European Union without proper postcodes, although many addresses are easily confused. There is a Blackrock in Co Louth, Co Dublin and Co Cork, for example. An Post argues that postcodes are unnecessary because the Irish population is so small and scattered.

ComReg, the communications regulator, has organised a postcodes symposium in Dublin tomorrow. Afterwards the regulator will publish an information note outlining everyone’s policy position and is likely to make a recommendation to government next year.

Brendan Whelan, director of ESRI, will tell tomorrow’s meeting that the institute is in favour of postcodes, particularly because of their value in researching everything from cancer to market trends. Almost 40% of addresses in Ireland are not unique, and postcodes would help with credit scoring and health risk analysis by health boards, according to Whelan.

At present the smallest defined spatial unit is a district electoral division of about 1,000 people. British postcodes can describe an area as small as four homes.

The symposium will analyse different forms of postcodes. The regulator is keen to keep historical place names intact, while Whelan believes that numbers should be easily remembered.

Many believe a system similar to Britain’s, using a combination of letters and numbers, works best. This would allow those with existing postcodes to retain them. For example, Government Buildings, Merrion Street, Dublin 2 could simply change the last line of its address to Dublin 2 0XX.

An Post insists that it can deliver letters as efficiently with the current system. But it is still well below the target of 94% of letters getting next-day delivery, achieving only 76% at the last count.

Etain Doyle, chairwoman of ComReg, told An Post that it is vital that it improves its performance during the busy pre-Christmas period. She has also asked An Post to revise its code of practice for reimbursing customers for loss or delay.

Victor

Originally posted by Muck
A Description of the ESB 'Postcoding' system is Here , once the ESB have done it Comreg will simply go along with it as they appear to have no ideas themselves.

Multiple systems make baby Jebus cry!

Originally posted by Muck
The ESB system can log 143 items per KM 2 whether they be house, shop , lamp or whatever. In addition, the ESB are going ahead with this plan anyway in preparation for deregulation of the market.

Oddly, what would one do in a typicaly suburban area with 2,500 homes/km2? That would have 2,500+ meters (when you add in shops, the odd flat, garage, granny flat etc?). Or the 5,000-10,000 in an urban area?

spongebob

Originally posted by Victor
Multiple systems make baby Jebus cry! Oddly, what would one do in a typicaly suburban area with 2,500 homes/km2? That would have 2,500+ meters (when you add in shops, the odd flat, garage, granny flat etc?). Or the 5,000-10,000 in an urban area?

We in the wesht can trade you some featureless bog and uninhabited islands if you need the address space

M