desiel Vs petrol

yossarin

lo all,

my GF is about to get a car from work.
she's been offered a petrol or desiel model of the yaris she wants.

I was just wondering - I know that desiel is less enviromentally friendly and cheaper , but does anyone have any recommendations as to which would be a better choice ?

btw, the car is a long term rental, so its condition in 10 years is less of a factor for us.

an_taoiseach

"I know that desiel is less enviromentally friendly"

Huh ?

Diesel motors produce less CO2 per kW ( or per horse power if you prefer ) than petrol motors. Also Diesel engines use less fuel for a given power output then petrol motors

Modern small diesels are very clean.

Most European countries promote Biodiesel consumption ( Ireland is one of the few that does not :mad: - dont blame me thats down to Charles Mc - if we could make fuel out of horse sh!t you can bet your life he would have a tax break for it ). Growing your own motor fuel must be a neat trick if you are into enviromental matters.

Is your idea of "enviromentally friendly" a gas guzzler ?

With regard to the choice :

What is the expect mileage per year ?

Do you know if the insurance is the same ?


An T

Q3000

Sorry to burst you bubble taoiseach but diesel is worse than petrol because it creates more PM10’s than petrol have a read of the article below and see if you still diesel is an environmentally friendly fuel.
http://www.abc.net.au/health/regions/features/diesel/default.htm

JohnBoy

The thing is that in europe we have some of the cleanest diesel in the world, and also the cleanest diesel engines are sold here.

The yaris AFAIK already meets the Euro4 proposals which have been brought forward to 2005, and is not far off the Euro5 emissions standards.

Also that article focuses on the diesel smoke put out by HGVs not by 1.5 yaris'

I personally feel that diesel is a more ecologically viable fuel than petrol.

Unfortunately in ireland diesel cars tend to cost quite a bit more than petrol ones, but if she's getting it as a company car I'd reccomend the diesel.

If you're paying for it yourself you do need to be doing quite a reasonable mileage before the greater costs start to be covered by the fuel cost savings.

John

yossarin

> What is the expect mileage per year ?
About 15 K per year (at least)

>Do you know if the insurance is the same ?
about the same - its a company car so she, in her own elegant turn of phrase, "doesn't give a rats ass"

"enviromentally friendly" - you know, hippy things: less bad pollutents emitted per mile travelled I suppose. I know both petrol and diesel are carcinogens anyway, but diesel seems to be worse.
thanks for the link Q3000 anyway. depressing reading !

We're in england at the moment - is Biodiesel an option here ? I am stfw'ing but would also appreciate some experienced comment.

Imposter

What size is the engine (both the petrol and the diesel)?

How much of the fuel costs will she/ye have to pay?
If this cost is negligable i'd go for the most powerful car.

Also with a petrol/diesel comparison of the same size engine the petrol is nippier.

Gmodified

Toyota 1.0 16v VVTi 4/998 14.1s 50.4 MPG
Toyota 1.4 D-4D 4/1364 12.9s 67.3 MPG
Toyota 1.5 VVTi T Sport 4/1497 9.0s 40.9 MPG
Toyota Verso 1.4 D-4D 4/1364 13.9s 56.5 MPG
Toyota Yaris 1.3 4/1299 12.1s 47.1 MPG
Toyota Yaris Verso 1.3 VVTi 4/1299 12.5 s 44.1 MPG

an_taoiseach

As JohnBoy says the small diesel engines that you find in cars these days are very clean

It is the HGVs that are bad on the pollution front. There is a lot of work going on to sort this out by both the manufacturers and by companies that think they have an angle on it ( such as Clean Diesel )

In the UK Biodiesel is available and also diesel produced from used cooking oil ( which is otherwise a pollutant ). Gordy allowed some reduced tax level on UK biodiesel which makes it about the same price as ordinary diesel.

Why does the EPA here drag out the issuing of a permit for this process ?

BTW "I am stfw'ing" is new to me:o - what does it mean ? give me a clue

As regards choice sounds like its down to personal preference. She should have a go in both. Diesel cars have a lot of low rev torque which means that they dont need high Revs. Driving technique is different - some like them & some dont.

Bubble Burst


An T

Redshift

Diesels are great in stop start traffic dont even need to touch the acellerator lift off the clutch and away she goes even up hill like aslip road, great torque almost impossible to stall accidently.

Q3000

Yossaian this may seem strange after my diesel rant but you probably would be better off with the diesel as company cars in the UK are taxed on a combination of car price and CO2 emissions and as an_taoiseach said diesels have lower CO2 emissions. Have a look at the tax calculator http://www.honda.co.uk/companycar/tax.html see how much the difference is.

yossarin

stfw - search the f*king web
used in a situation where a poster is too lazy to look themselves
a bit like RTFM (read the f*cking manual)

I've been assured by a diesel car owner that the tax here is higher on diesel cars.


to summarise so far:

diesel in small cars is about the same enviromentally.
diesel cars run with less juice
diesel fuel is cheaper

i think we'll be suckin diesel then

an_taoiseach

"stfw"

An T

red_ice

Right, well, i drive a 2ltr deseil Peugeot partener and ive driven many a petrol car.

The difference in both engones being

less responce that petrol (unless its turbo), deseil taking more revs to get anywhere, which means burning more fuel

The deseil engine is also alot louder than petrol. Deseil works on the principal of compression to make ignition. Where as a car uses a spark plug to creat the flame.

Now, who ever told you its less economy friendly is telling a lil fib. Its 5x more friendly than petrol and can be almost 15x when you use cooking oil as fuel (yes thats right, throw in the run of the mill cooking oil.) which is totally illigal.. for the simple fact that they cant slap much tax on oil. bastids!

red_ice

ohh yea, another point which i forgot is that when a desiel engine runs out of gas, you have to get it specially started, where as with petrol you can just put fuel into it and turn the keys.

Hope thats some help

yossarin

pros and cons.

thanks red_ice

like the cooking oil thing though

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by red_ice
[B...]less responce that petrol (unless its turbo), deseil taking more revs to get anywhere, which means burning more fuel
...! [/B]

Actually a Diesel requires less revs not more to get the same performance than a petrol car. But it gains revs slower. More revs does not equal more speed or more acceleration. it just equals more power.

However planing the foot in either petrol or diesel and the economy suffers badly. To get the best economy you drive smoothly and use lower revs. Theres a certain power band where the car/engine is most efficent and you have to stay within that to maximise economy. Theres another power band that maximise performance but its normally much higher in the rev range. Generally its the least fuel efficent.

In a small car that was going to do a lot of mileage I get the diesel. You'll need to fill it up less, so less stops at the petrol stations and you will have greater range, maybe 400-500 out of tank of diesel compared to 300-350 out of a tank of petrol. Depending on the size of the tank of course.

You used to have to get diesels serviced a lot more than petrol cars. Dunno if this is still true of newer diesels though.

Big al

cant speak for the yaris but the laguna diesel is serviced every 18k miles

yossarin

cheers all,

we're going with the diesel. weekend trips ahoy !

RicardoSmith

Originally posted by yossarin
cheers all,

we're going with the diesel. weekend trips ahoy !

Its meant to be a nice little motor. While I like performance cars and have had a few in the past I still really like diesels. I like the way they drive, low rpm, lots of torque.

C@non

I have a Golf mk4 TDI the motor last twice or even more than a petrole car, the engine parts are much more expensive than a petrol, but if i had to pick between a GTI and a TDI golf.. good burn the GTI, the torque that a diesel has specially when u get it chipped is much better than a petrol car.