STRIKE!!!!!!!!

pat kenny

Yes you heard me right I said STRIKE,yes its what you have been dreaming of since you started school
14th-full strike
16th,22nd,23rd,28th,29th,30th-work to rule and withdrawl of supervision ( school management recomends I dont come into school)
YIPPIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Im gonna buy myself a kite and fly it at 3am.

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Mills

Yeah I'm getting the same days off hopefully both sides get dug in and it goes on for a few months

Hecate

bah, secondary school pe0ns

we still have to go to college

Hobbes

I wonder if we will see any students sue the teachers union for upsetting thier chances to get into collage due to lost work?

or I wonder what the chances are any student will actually do any school related work on the strike day?

Paladin

Actually if it goes on Ill be kinda pis$ed.
Those arses have a short working day, and a short working year. There isnt any physical toil, only "stress" which is avoided by most teachers by not giving a fcuk.
I dont think they deserve anything outside the already agreed pay schemes.
Not only this, but they insist on damaging the future chances of the people whose future taxes will be paying them.

Basically, they can get bent as far as Im conerned. The government shouldnt give in. The teachers will end up missing out on so much pay that they will have change their tune. There is no way they should get this absolutely ridiculous 30% pay increase they want.

In all fairness. The cheek.


[This message has been edited by Paladin (edited 12-11-2000).]

Stephen

Indeed... I am in sixth year... Not that i think this will affect my studies much (since I don't do as much as I should anyway) but it will be a handy excuse

Canaboid

Originally posted by Hobbes:
I wonder if we will see any students sue the teachers union for upsetting thier chances to get into collage due to lost work?

No.
As I keep telling ya Hobbes, this is not America.

Bard

Originally posted by Hecate:
bah, secondary school pe0ns

we still have to go to college

Bah... students

Bard

Originally posted by Paladin:
Actually if it goes on Ill be kinda pis$ed.
Those arses have a short working day, and a short working year. There isnt any physical toil, only "stress" which is avoided by most teachers by not giving a fcuk.
I dont think they deserve anything outside the already agreed pay schemes.
Not only this, but they insist on damaging the future chances of the people whose future taxes will be paying them.
<<< SNIP!!! >>>
[This message has been edited by Paladin (edited 12-11-2000).]

Teachers are possibly the most under-rated and badly paid yet vitally important workers in Ireland today. Most of them would have to be working for about 15-16 years to get paid what I'm being paid now, and me only being a few years in the industry.

YES they deserve a pay rise. Do you have any inkling of how bad the pay and the annual raise system for teachers is in Ireland? "Appalling" is too weak a word for it.

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LegacyUser

where is all my wonderfull teachers I wanna go to school.Will some one be my teacher please!!!!!!!!!!

kayos

Bard your right in the respect that Teachers are very valuable to the country and yes I agree they deserive a pay rise. But the way I look at it their not that badly paid I know one teacher on 27K which I would not complain about when you only work from Sep to June and have about 2 months off between that as well. So for him that would be a 8K pay rise. Most teachers do grinds which will cost you I'm guessing here about 15-20 an hour. If the only way to get them back to work was to agree with the 30% increase I would give it to them on one catch it is goign to be assested on your students proformance because I can remember back in my school days we had a few teachers who would give you every help you needed just to see you do well and then we had teachers came in told us to do an exercise and fcuk off for the rest of the class. So the better you teach the better you get paid its simple like in most jobs the better you work the more you get paid.

just my 2pence worth

kayos

LoLth

There was a skit on this on RTE the other night, actually quite funny. It was an interview with one of the teachers...

anyway,
30% ?? No way! That's waaaay too much.

I personally, would give a lower pay rise (but I would give one), I would spread their taxation through the entire year (and the pay packet) - which would stop the loads of teachers who sign on during the summer even though they are working at something else (usually grinds or summer projects).

As for assessing them on Student performance, that has a danger. I had a math teacher who got absolutely excellent results in Leaving Cert. Math, Chemistry and Applied Math. How? Simple, he booted anyone who didn't meet his standards out. ******* tried to kick me out of honours maths (I got a B2 in the end by the way) and managed to bar me from sitting in his applied math class. The only reason he couldn't get me out of Maths was because he admitted , in front of the whole class that he "didn't like me" - that made me sooo sad - and the principal decided that it wouldn't look good if I was kicked out after that. However, a lot of students better than me were kicked out for failing two of the weekly exams... never mind that maybe differentiation is not your strong suit which would imply that you'll also suck at integration.

You assess teachers pay on the performance of their students and there'll be a lot more barred from taking subjects that they'll probably excel in given the opportunity.

I reckon an annual exam for them is in order , to keep them up to speed with course developements. Also, stricter inspections and a complaint system that goes higher than the principal of the school -as most students wouldn't dare complain about a teacher for fear of the misery he'll suffer , and not just imposed by the one he complained against, as a result.

Yeah, it's a tough job, but it's **** easy to get into compared to most other professions where you have the same responsibility. How many teachers do you know that have studied child psychology? And yet they are in charge of children and are in a position to cause nearly ass much damage to a child as the parents.

A bit more pay (not 30% though) and more requirements. None of this "money for nothing" that they are talking about.

oh, and as a comparison, I was fialing honours German but my teacher gave me extra work ,concentrated on the bits I was ok at - written, reading and listening - so that they could carry me thorugh the exam, and did her best to get my spoken german up to an acceptable level. I got a B2 in that as well (my highest in an honours exam before that had been 50% unless it was reading/listening only).

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[This message has been edited by LoLth (edited 13-11-2000).]

Hobbes

I would just like to point out that not all teachers are full time teachers and there is a whole world of difference between part time and full time teachers.

Also teachers don't get paid for that holiday. Least the ones I know don't, they normally have to get a second job.

Greenbean

Have to?

No-one expects them to get 30%, thats the usual bartering deal - start off high then work down to 10%, 15% or something.

As for assessing teachers on their students.. I wouldn't recommend that on a "country-wide" scale; there are areas that are traditionally "dum" or more un-academic than others and to blame it on the poor teacher because Johnny wants to go off and become a knacker or run the family farm is unrealistic. Maybe on an appropriate scale in comparison to tradational expectations you could rate the teachers.

I remember this d4 twat on rte suggesting all schools should go private, thus making all the local schools compete and improve themselves. Of course he didn't think beyond his fcking door step outside the pale, where on average you only have one option - not like Blackrock where theres two or three secondary schools in walking distance (loads in driving/bus distance). Fortunately his fellow politician ripped him apart for suggesting this and put him in his place.

Back home in the father country (Donegal), my secondary school had 1,700 pupils and was the only one for a 15 - 20 mile radius. We had to walk in barefeet, across a desert made of broken glass (basalt mountains). Some rode on goats' backs - but those were the rich gits.

kayos

LoLth I know what you mean about Teachers tring to get you out of their class it happend to me in Maths as well He never said he didn't like me but just kept on saying that I was going to fail bla bla bla and to go down to pass. Same thing we had weekly tests and this was how he was guessing that I would fail. I had loadsa fights with him over this in the end I won out since I was appling to Brunel in London and had the place depended on Maths and physics and some other subject but I had to take Honours in these subjects. So it was a case yof you kick me out and you lost me a college place. In the end I ended up witha B2 when he heard that on the day of the leaving Cert results his comment was Will if he got that the rest of the class must have got A1's when in fact have the class graded below me.

But I do think that teachers pay should be assested on their preformance in some way. Cause be honest lads some Teachers just dont give a t0ss. How exactly this is done I dont mind but it should be done.

Kayos

Mills

I think they deserve a pay rise, but 30% isn't a realistic figure. Teachers do get payed for those 2/3 months during the summer over here, and also for all the other days that schools are off throughout the year. plus if the teacher's good and cares about their students they'll spend an average of 2-3 hours each night marking work and preparing for the next day's classes. My mother's a teacher so that's where I'm getting the above, may or may not be true in all cases. Part time teachers are a lot worse off though, only paid for the classes they have each week, so I'd expect they do need second jobs during the longer holidays.

pat kenny

Hey this is the after hours board its no place for inteligent discussion I only started this topic for fun,you'v hijacked my fun topic you utter ba$tards.
Take it to the humanities board now that you'v sucked the fun out of it.

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Lenny

my school ain't go'n on strike

:Oj:

deRanged

hmmm.
> Those arses have a short working day, and > a short working year. There isnt any
> physical toil, only "stress" which is
> avoided by most teachers by not giving a
> fcuk.
have to take exception to this.
no stress?
did you read the other thread titled
"the numerous ways we torture our teachers"
sounds like all the teachers mentioned there have a great time. divil a bit of stress and loads of support from their pupils.
loads of teachers choose to give up their time and run sports/clubs in schools. they run adult ed. classes for nothing.
if you have an issue with the percentage they are looking for fair enough. but try to keep it real.
yeah - some teachers are useless and don't care. lots of them do.
(guess what my parents do )

Greenbean

Won't somebody please think about the children!!

richindub2

Wooooooooo....Green mentioned Blackrock and i live there

Cake Fiend

Originally posted by OJ:
my school ain't go'n on strike

It's a secondary teacher strike, montessouris are still running

Paladin

From the several schools that I would know a decent bit about, I would say less then half the teachers are of a standard that they would deserve the pay rise.

The huge (and quite appaling) number of teachers that either are too lazy to teach, too apathetic (there is a difference) or quite simply too useless an educator to teach has demonstrated to me that they do not deserve a 30% pay rise.
They will be getting a 5% rise regardless of how this tunrs out with their current deal. Why did they agree to that if they are gonna complain now? Everyone else is getting more?

I remember a teacher saying "the people we educated are now earning much more than us".

What about college professors? They gonna go on strike next? " Oh the ppl we educate are earning even more on average than the ppl the teachers educated"

In all fairness that ******.

Yes I saw that thread "the ways we torture our teachers".

Personally, I rekon teachers should have the power to expel anyone who consistantly proves they arent interested in an education - without the normal red tape.

As for a difficult job? Its only difficult for a minority in my school anyway. You lot can tell me about ure schools, but in mine I would say about 30-40% have it tough in the sense they are either decent hard-working good teachers, or are the teachers who cant control a class and get 'tortured'. The rest of the teachers are lazy useless ignorant twats (surprisingly *gasp* the majority of whom are over 40 and are the higher earners amongst the teachers which really sucks)

If they are gonna give the teachers a pay rise, then a rise in standards should be enforced too. Unfortunately this has its drawbacks too, since the education system cant get enuff teachers as it is. Mind u, the computers companies cant get enuff programmers, electronics companies cant get enuff engineers etc.

Bleh. Im tired now. off to bed </rant>

Hannah

let me get this straight teachers entering the profession enter into a job in the public sector that they are pretty much guaranteed for life. people entering the private sector, enter a profession where perhaps the future is not so secure. In a boom economy the private sector experience a pay rise, the public sector may experience a smaller one, however in a depression the private sector's job security is lower => security is inversely proportional to pay increases. The teachers seem to be comparing themselves to the private sector and expect to be paid salaries that match those of their private sector contempories? yeah?

Hobbes

let me get this straight teachers entering the profession enter into a job in the public sector that they are pretty much guaranteed for life.

Sorry that isn't always the case. If anything a part time teacher has to be one of the worst jobs because your not guaranteed work and you do not get paid for school summer holidays.

C B

I gotta agree with Lolth on the issue of evaluating performance.

When I did the Leaving I was **** at languages but I had a great teacher who relly put her heart into it and gave extra classes after school and at weeekends for free and I ended up getting a C1.

I was excellent at Business Subjects and I had a **** Biz Org. teacher who was fu(k all help and I got an A1 in that subject.

So which teacher deserves higher pay.

Even if you had a huge database of results and factored in a number of variables such as previous performance and performance in other subjects my German teacher would get badly paid cause it was my worst result. Now thats hardly fair.

Hannah

actually i don't care who gives in, government or teachers, i am just really sick of being used by the teachers to prove a point, which is exactly what the work to rule is. I mean i don't pay taxes, i don't vote and i really don't give a damn so why am i being dragged into this?

Illkillya

striiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike

amp

One of the things you hear a lot is:
IT professionals get way more than teachers.

WTF?? Well I'm an IT (un)professional and I'm not getting paid as much as formula one drivers!!!

STRIKE!!!

Oh wait the IT profession isn't really unionised. And we generally work much, much longer hours FOR THE WHOLE FUPPING YEAR!!!

Bloody teachers, bloody railway workers...

But I'm not totally evil, nurses should be paid loads more. I mean, having to give a 70 year old a sponge bath is worth a 30% raise. And they wear those lovely uniforms with the hats and the........NO CARRIER

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Lunacy Abounds! Play GLminesweeper!

Paladin

Ye, my dads a lecturer, so in a sense what the teachers get will influence his future pay.
His opinion is basically exactly what amp says.
He used to work in industry. He worked his ass off, loadsa hours etc.
Now that he is lecturing, he has a 4 day week! (swapping classes to manage that one).
He has long holidays, he is under much less pressure than in industry.
Basically he is still counting his lucky stars, and is laugh at the fact that teachers are complaining? As far ah he is concerned, he (and the teachers) have the easy life. The only difference between him and teachers, is he needs a much higher qualification, and his field (electronics) is advancing very fast, so he has a lot more work to do to keep up, and of course his students are more mature.
Bleh.

PS - dont anyone mention that I told you his opinions on this, cause he has teacher friends :P

WhiteWashMan

i think that most of the issues comes from the fact that teaching is not in the same league as other social servies payments.
the gardi get way more and do less from what i can see. i dont see why they shouldnt be paid more. it would seem that striking is becoming very popular at the moment but sometimes thats the way it goes.
however, id say the teachers dont really want to go on strike. how many of you have actually been in the centre of strike action? a couple of years a go i was a shop steward for SIPTU in an electronics manufacturing plant. we nearly went on strike. its very bloody scary.
so if the teachers feel the have to go out on strike, i reckon the really feel the deserve a pay rise. 30% is a bit much thou

pat kenny

Originally posted by Illkillya:
striiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike

You said it baby!!!!!!!!!!!
3day week

If they really want this strike over hire this guy.



LALALALAALALALALALALAAL
We aint gonna have no inteligent discussion here.

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tHE vAGGABOND

Imagine still being in school....

Hate tha'

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

gandalf

Hmmm following this one with interest.

Its been quite a few years since I was in school but I reckon my experiences there will still hold good for today.

I went to a fee paying secondary school so the standard of teachers was suppost to be higher. Around 40% of the teachers I had were useless. They did the bare minimum and in some cases even less than that. We had a Irish teacher who would stare out the classroom window and get us to read from our textbook without giving a damn about what we were saying. Balancing against that there were some excellent teachers. One man in particular I remember. He was my German teacher. Saying that I didn't have a aptitude for languages is a understatement. I didn't like this teacher and he didn't like me but he made the effort and I ended up against the odds getting a honour in the leaving. This man missed 1 day sick in the 5 years I went to this school, apparently it was his only sick day in 9 years. People like him should get whatever they are asking for. The wasters and hangers on who are just going thru the motions should be subject to some sort of quality control before they get anything.

I work in IT Sales. If I don't do my job properly, make sales targets forcasts etc. eventually I will get axed. I know for a fact that teachers who are not making an effort to do their job will not. My mother worked as a teachers assistant a few years ago in a primary school and she was shocked to see what these teachers have gotten way with.


Gandalf.

BTW I love them saying that this Celtic Tiger crap is all occuring because of them. I think it would be more apt to say that this is occuring in spite of them

sixpack's little hat

But most importantly of all,did you get your kite? and fly it at 3am?

NakedBibleReadingMan

my school was one of 3 secondary schools open in dublin apparently

Lenny

ahh my school was open aswell today.. but I told my parents my school was on strike
hehe
how bold

:Oj:

Monty - the one and only

this thread is moving away from the boundries of a normal topic and into spam...any more and I'll take out the key.

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"Respect my Authoratai"

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