Waterford project team leader tows the Company line

shinzon

Ah well

Twas bound to happen, rang this guy again, was supposed to ring me back gave him a week no callback, just got off the phone to him now

Nah nothing we can do,the DSL guys said not to be wasting your (HIS) time on this.

The line is never going to pass the DSL test ever, so thats it

SCREW EIRCOM AND SCREW BROADBAND

Shin

crawler

Shin come on - chin up - I'm in the same boat.....

The 3.5Ghz stuff may mean there is some hope for us...

shinzon

Went into town not fully expecting this chap to ring back, came back message left with the mother

"Sorry we cant give out the information that (ME) asked for, we cant get involved" thx and goodbye

Flaming typical, all I was asking for was a phone number for the BB team in dublin

Shin

elexes

what would happen if you ordered a second phone line ? i know you shouldnt have to do it but if all else fails ??

shinzon

thats probably going to be my last stab at this id say, what im hoping to do is order the second line and when the engineer comes round ask him to replace the existing cable rather than install a new line as a few people have done in here with some success

shin

Gadgie

Originally posted by elexes
what would happen if you ordered a second phone line ? i know you shouldnt have to do it but if all else fails ??

Knowing eircom, they'd probably just use a pairgain to split the existing line into two...

dahamsta

They can't do that any more Glenn, it's against the rules. Or the law, one or the other. (Is Comreg stuff just boring old rules or can they be defined as law?) Shinzon, the engineer isn't going to do that, in fact if you cancel one line and order another at the same time, they'll just give you the old one back. Order a new line, get it in, /then/ cancel the old one.

adam

shinzon

I didnt think of that, fair enough on monday ill get on the merry go round again and see what happens


Shin

lynchie

I was in the same boat shin, line kept failing. I just ordered a new line asking them to note on the order that the line is for DSL. When the engineer came out he asked me did I want the line for DSL - said yes, so he made sure the line would pass for DSL before leaving. Im stuck paying line rental on a line that I just use for DSL - couldnt even tell you what the telephone number is on this line, but it was better than having dialup

shinzon

who did you ring to order the line specifically for DSL

Shin

Gadgie

Originally posted by dahamsta
They can't do that any more Glenn, it's against the rules. Or the law, one or the other. (Is Comreg stuff just boring old rules or can they be defined as law?)

You mean use pairgains? If so, I had a new line installed on the 18th of August that they pairgained...

dahamsta

I wouldn't swear to it, but I'm pretty sure this came in before August. Muck would know. If it did and the line isn't mission critical, you should complain and make them give you a proper line. No point in making it easy for rulebreakers.

adam

Gadgie

I only found out the other day when I complained that it wasn't passing the DSL test, and I thought that there was noise on the line and wondered if that could be the cause of it (turns out it wasn't noise, it's just a pairgained line sounds different to a proper one). An engineer came out to test it, and I asked if they used a pairgain when installing it and he said yes. I told him that I was interested in getting DSL but the line was failing, and he said that it shouldn't make a difference (he couldn't understand why it wasn't passing).

I'd had a load of hassle getting it installed in the first place (ordered it on July 1st, wasn't installed until August 18th) because apparently there "wasn't any space for it on the pole". The internet always connects at 31.2kbps, so I suspected the line had been split.

I was going to challenge the engineer on the legality of using pairgains, but I don't know the full facts of it so I decided just let it go for the moment. If it turns out it is illegal then I'll hassle eircom about it, but if it's not I won't bother doing anything as I'm not sure if I'll be in this house in 12 months, so I wouldn't be able to get DSL anyway.

bkehoe

Well they do still use pairgains. When a new line is ordered and the area is short of copper they take a look at their pcs for any non-isdn/dsl lines in the area and then pop a pairgain on them. You'd need to speak to the engineer at the exchange to stop them putting on a pairgain if there's any choice - i.e. if there's any free lines.

spongebob

Originally posted by dahamsta
I wouldn't swear to it, but I'm pretty sure this came in before August. Muck would know. If it did and the line isn't mission critical, you should complain and make them give you a proper line. No point in making it easy for rulebreakers.

adam

The rule dates from April 2002, with a revision a year back. The latest version of the Document, the CLFMP as it is known, is stored on the Eircomlab site.

The Eircomlab site purports to be the home of the Eircoms very own R&D department. You may note that the 'R&D dept' is housed in a single small office in central Dublin. His job is to publish terminal specs and line specs.

The CLFMP is Here , it is where the no pairgain on a new line rule came about.

If Eircom cannot supply a new line in your area without resorting to pairgain then they should either.

1, Supply you wirelessly using the 3.5Ghz frequency. This service is 384k only and available in about 20% of the country. You also get your voice over this service and pay normal line rental and can cancel the copper.

OR

2, Give you your money back in full because you told them the new line was for DSL AND they cannot supply 3.5Ghz wireless alternative in your area.

If the new line works then cancel the old one as Adam said.

M

Floater

Originally posted by lynchie
I was in the same boat shin, line kept failing. I just ordered a new line asking them to note on the order that the line is for DSL. When the engineer came out he asked me did I want the line for DSL - said yes, so he made sure the line would pass for DSL before leaving. Im stuck paying line rental on a line that I just use for DSL - couldnt even tell you what the telephone number is on this line, but it was better than having dialup

Why not get them to transfer / port your old number to the DSL line so you won't be involved in a change of number if you decide to dump the second line?

Floater

tomk

Originally posted by dahamsta
Order a new line, get it in, /then/ cancel the old one.

When a new line is ordered for a premises that already has a line, do they not just connect up the unused pair in the existing cable? I got a separate ISDN line a few years ago, and that's what they did - no new cable involved.

So in your case, shin, isn't the unused pair likely to be in the same condition as your existing line?

This is not based on anything other than my experience - it may be different in your case.

lynchie

Originally posted by Floater
Why not get them to transfer / port your old number to the DSL line so you won't be involved in a change of number if you decide to dump the second line?

Floater

I thought about that before but even If I wanted to do that, It would be some job trying to explain that to a biddy on the other end of the phone!

Originally posted by tomk
So in your case, shin, isn't the unused pair likely to be in the same condition as your existing line?

This is not based on anything other than my experience - it may be different in your case.

In my case, he hooked up the other unused pair. The quality of the unused pair was far superior than the existing line. The unused line may be better or worse but you wont know till its hooked up. If it doesnt work, then just cancel the line straight away. May cost you installation but its worth it if you really want DSL.

Failing that Shin, hire a JCB, accidently rip up your line, and get them to put in a new one

elexes

so how did it turn out ?

shinzon

After reading all about this hooking up of the unused pair im a bit reticent about going ahead with ordering the new line, these cables were laid when the estate was built 40 years ago, so methinks the unused pair would be of the same if not worse quality then the existing line

i just dunno what to do

Shin

Calibos

Kinda scuppers my plan as well, this unused pair lark. Look at my line at the end of my drive. An Eircom winback rep said they wouldn't fix it as long as my phone worked. He recommended a new line for €130 but theres not much point if its just the unused pair of the same line.

BigEejit

Originally posted by Calibos
Kinda scuppers my plan as well, this unused pair lark. Look at my line at the end of my drive. An Eircom winback rep said they wouldn't fix it as long as my phone worked. He recommended a new line for €130 but theres not much point if its just the unused pair of the same line.

IIIIITS PICKAXE TIME FOLKS !!!
In fairness, that line is a disgrace .... an accident waiting to happen

Urban Weigl

Where are you based?

shinzon

That is a disgrace, have you sent these piccies to comreg or even eiircom, they cant leave the line like that

Shin

Calibos

Bray. I recently checked the online checker again after not bothering for ages. When I noticed no requirement for account number anymore I put all the neighbours in. Off those I could remember 5 out of 5 on the other side of the road passed. That ruled out distance from the exchange and line quality between my estate and the exchange. Course they are on another Eircom junction box/manhole on the other side of the road. Then I put in both my neighbours on either side who I would imagine are on the same box as me (ie the one pictured at the bottom of my drive.) They both passed. So that leaves the line between the box and my house (and we can actually visually see what state that is in!) and/or my internal wiring and equipment (ISDN, FAX & a DECT).

A winback Rep called when I was at work. The mother told him we would only consider coming back if we were sorted for broadband. She told him we always failed. He said, "thats strange cause anyone in your estate who ordered broadband was able to get it....except you and the guy across the road who also has ISDN". The mother says, "So its because we have ISDN that we are failing??" NO he says!!:rolleyes: He then asked could he use our phone to call an enginneer installing broadband atm in Bray (Which I now know thanks to caller ID and will hopefully use myself in the future! ). Totally anti competive unfair winback special treatment etc etc but I wasn't going to turn down the chance of a live test and I wasn't there anyway, it was my BB brainwashed mum dealing with him Mum disconnected the Fax but left the ISDN box plugged in and forgot about the DECT.

Anyway, they ran the test about 5 minutes later and the engineer got back on to say we still failed. Mum then pointed out the exposed damaged cable outside and asked was that the problem and what could be done about it. The winback guy reckoned it could be the problem but that Eircom would not replace the line unless the phone actually stopped working. He recommended a new line for €130 which leads us back to the point about them using the unused pair!! and I ran the idea about sabotaging the line to get a replacement passed the oul dear and thats a no go as she reckons we could be without a line for God knows how long till they send someone out to repair/replace it.

So I reckon what I will do know is:

Ring the engineer and get a retest with ISDN plugged out, FAX and DECT disconnected.

If it still fails............

Try and get the line repaired and then retested

If it still fails or they wont fix it...........

Order a new line and try and persuade the enginneer to run a new cable

And if it still fails.........

Give Up!

De Rebel

Report an intermittent fault on the line. It stops working for periods of time on an irregular basis. At other times it works fine. Please could they come and repair it.

Calibos

De Rebel,

My memory is a bit fuzzy, remind me what my problem is again. ie Should I be hearing a dial tone when the line is dead, should I hear static etc etc. I'm sure the biddy will want a specific description of my 'intermittant fault' :D

Cheers M8

spongebob

Originally posted by Calibos
I'm sure the biddy will want a specific description of my 'intermittant fault' :D

Cheers M8

Static and or Crackling and or Echos , sometimes together in no particular order , not always when it rains but whenever there is a POND around that wire of yours it is REALLY bad.

M

De Rebel

You could even camp it up a bit for good effect. You though you had it cracked, this intermittant problem. You were matching the arrival and disappearance of the problem with the weather and it looked like it coincided with wet days, until last Xday (fill in the blank yourself) when it was raining but the problem didn't occur, disproving your theory and mistifying you even further. SO now you are in dire straights altogether and you have nowhere else to turn. It can only be a problem wilt the line.

You get the idea. There is nothing like the mysterious intermittant problem to enable logging a call without having to guarantee evidence. Amazing the way it disappears just as the repair man arrives, but ah shure as your here anyway.........

And if they give you any of that, "Well we can't find the problem so therefore there isn't a problem" BS, ask them to put on the record in their call logging system the fact that an elderly relative who needs constant medical attention comes to stay on a regular basis and you are fearful of the consequences if the intermittant problem recurs during one of here her visits and you are unable to summon urgently needed medical assistance when she is having one of her turns...... That always puts the wind up them!!

Best of luck.

Calibos

Funny you should say that De Rebel. My elderly recently widowed grandfather has had one of those emergency phones fitted where he can press a button and a number of phone numbers including ours is dialled. I'm not sure if Eircom supply the phone but they certainly had engineers out sorting out his phone lines a fortnight or so ago, which they will have a record of. Its funny but in his 100+ year old victorian home with house alarms, phone alarms etc connected to his phonelines.....he passes the prequal test!!!

Gadgie

Originally posted by Muck
The CLFMP is Here , it is where the no pairgain on a new line rule came about.

Muck, would you be able to tell me which part of the CLFMP refers to the no pairgain rule? I must have read that thing about ten times but I can't made head nor tail of it - it's all double dutch!

I e-mailed the eircom customer care department about removing my pairgain and I got the following reply:

Hello Glen (sic),

I am sorry, if your line does not past the test, adsl is not available on your line. If you are on a pairgain, this is the only way we can give you service at the moment, and this cannot be removed.

Regrds,

Veronica

I've noticed there have been a lot of posts recently from people wanting pairgains removed so your help in this matter is greatly appreciated.

Perhaps there should be a FAQ on this?