Complete and utter guitar idiot needs help.

DeVore

Hi,

I know very little about guitars. I have vaguely strummed my ex-flatmates guitar and thats about it.

I have a couple of questions for you guys about buying and learning the guitar.

1. I'm planning on buying something cheap and nasty until I decide that I am really going to commit to this. My objective is to be able to play songs like Christy Moores stuff dumbed down (if you get me).
I'm looking at buying a new guitar for about 100 notes or a second hand one.... anything I should know before buying??

2. I'm going to make a concerted effort to learn guitar. I've tried before and failed because I didnt really commit to it. That and it hurts like a fnckin' bitch!
Anyone got any advice for a complete n00b. I dont want to be a rock star I just want to be able to strum songs to sing along to at a party sort-of-thing.

DeV.

bombidol

Epiphone make decent little accoustic guitars. To be honest anything you buy for 100 or so notes is going to sound the same as any other brand. check for things like rust on strings and cracks in the body. make sure the machine heads are tight (the tuning things) Emm..thats all for now

ferdi

an acoustic for 100 clams, check the buy and sell. there'll usually be something half ok in there. or go to a shop, either way bring someone along who knows their stuff so u dont get ripped off. maybe stretch the budget a bit, get the next model up - get a better instrument and it'll hold its resale value better.

ferdi

for the sore fingers get cotton ball, drench it in white spirit and work it into ur finger tips - it'll dry em out a bit and they'll hurt less.

stick with it man, being able to play an instrument at any level is great.

DeVore

Thats another thing.
I'm notoriously hard on myself and easily demotivated if I'm not like a super fast learner... but I've been told not to expect too much too fast.

What can I realistically expect from the next 3-6 months if I practise like 3-4 times a week for 20-30 mins a go?

How fast should I pick this up?

DeV.

frea

A good Irish site with some easy chords:


Helped me a lot.

http://www.iol.ie/~murphypj

frea

And...


http://www.tabcrawler.com

bovril

I bought a beginners guitar while back but I changed the strings on it. I bought the lightest ones I could get and the ones I got had polyweb coating. They did hurt my fingers a little bit but I imagine it would have been worse with heavier strings. You can then change the strings to heavier ones as you get better. Ask in any of the music shops and they'll sort you out if you go down this route....

frea

I would recommend getting an electronic tuner until you can tune by ear. An out of tune guitar will drive you mad. Also get lessons if you can afford them. They are usually not expensive.

DeVore

yeah I was thinking of spending another 100 on guitar lessons to kick start the initiative. Any recommendations?

DeV.

superconor

i couldnt help you about the guitar lessons, as im from the north, but if you use nylon strings im sure they would make it easier to learn on, as they wont cut into your fingers so much.

As for cheap guitars, rust on the strings can be easily repaired by getting new ones, but it may be an indication to the condition of the rest of the guitar i.e - if they neglect the most basic - strings, what would they do to the rest of it?

Ancient1

If you're willing to spend a bit more than a 100 (you should, tbh), check out that guitar shop on Capel Street. There's even an entry-level Martin for around 300 E's.
Even if you're a beginner you should be spared the torment of playing the cheapest piece of sh1t you can find - it's kinda demotivating. Get yourself a nice one for 300 or so, and you wont give up as easily.

Regarding practice, 20-30 mins wont do the job initially. You cant afford to do that in the beginning. Believe me, the first stage is the hardest - persevere with an hour a day and you'll be on your own in a few months time.

mirv

The Yamaha F-310 sells in McCulla Piggot's for €150. Hunt around and you might get lower, you could try to haggle it down a bit too. It's meant to be a good, yet cheap acoustic. Ask for them to set it up with 'low action' so it's easier on your newbie fingers.

Cheez

I recommend you try and learn some easily chorded(having only 3 to 5 chords the whole song)type songs by ear. Its good to be able to pick out chords yourself and learning what key a song is in and stuff like that. Your fingers get used to it just make sure you change strings regularly. Learn songs you like! not some song just cuz its easy&keep challenging yourself but most of all to get into the rythm and chillax. Soon you'l be dying to get home to release some pent up emotion through strummin the sh1te out of your guitar!

fitz

I'd always recommend learning on a Spanish guitar.
Nylon strings are easy on your fingertips, easy to strum without a plec (which no beginner should use initially), and the wide neck stretches your fingers, improving reach.

feylya

Originally posted by fitz
I'd always recommend learning on a Spanish guitar.
Nylon strings are easy on your fingertips, easy to strum without a plec (which no beginner should use initially), and the wide neck stretches your fingers, improving reach.

Personally, I'd recommend the exact opposite. Spanish necks are massive, which will make beginning harder. It's far easier to play a G on an ordinary acoustic than on a Spanish. As for the steel strings, Dev is after a Christy sound (I believe). It's incredibly disheartening (is that a word) to play the right chords but still not sounding right.

My advice - grab someone (even from Boards) for a day, drag them into a guitar shop and ask their advice on certain guitars.

Ancient1

I dont think the width of the neck would matter that much to a beginner - as long as it's set up properly!
If, as a beginner, you get used to playing a wide (ie classical guitar) neck, it'll be somewhat easier adjusting to slimmer necks, although the other way around doesnt make much difference either - i learned how to play on both necks and never had trouble provided the set-up was smooth..

fitz

I absolutely hate when people recommend the easiest way to learn guitar.

Just cause it's easier, doesn't mean it's better.

If you start on a fat neck with nylon strings, your finger strength, chord form, chord changes, strum technique, will all be better in the long run.

If you're gonna take up guitar, why would you wanna rush into being able to play stuff, and be so hampered by bad habits that you find it very hard, if not impossible to break free of them and improve.

And don't learn songs.
Start of with all the basic chords.
Practice strumming single chords, starting with downstrums only, then add in chord changes while trying to keep the strumming consistent.

Once you've grasped that and are able to change from any chord you know to any other one without interrupting your strum, try it with upstrums on the offbeats :

4 downstrums = / / / /
+ = upstrum -> / / / /+

Keep practicing and learn how to strum properly.
Once you can do any strum pattern, and can change from chord to chord without interrupting it...get the chords to songs...
You'll find you can play them with little effort.

This may take a little longer to learn, but you'll be a much better guitarist than if you take the "quick and easy path."

The lazy mans way out is why there are so many **** guitarists around who can't play in time.

It's one thing being able to play.
It's entirely another being any good.
Which do you want?

Personally, I can't understand learning something half-assed, it seems like a waste of time to me...

My 2c.

feylya

Originally posted by fitz
I absolutely hate when people recommend the easiest way to learn guitar.

Just cause it's easier, doesn't mean it's better.

If you start on a fat neck with nylon strings, your finger strength, chord form, chord changes, strum technique, will all be better in the long run.

If you're gonna take up guitar, why would you wanna rush into being able to play stuff, and be so hampered by bad habits that you find it very hard, if not impossible to break free of them and improve.

And don't learn songs.
Start of with all the basic chords.
Practice strumming single chords, starting with downstrums only, then add in chord changes while trying to keep the strumming consistent.

Once you've grasped that and are able to change from any chord you know to any other one without interrupting your strum, try it with upstrums on the offbeats :

4 downstrums = / / / /
+ = upstrum -> / / / /+

Keep practicing and learn how to strum properly.
Once you can do any strum pattern, and can change from chord to chord without interrupting it...get the chords to songs...
You'll find you can play them with little effort.

This may take a little longer to learn, but you'll be a much better guitarist than if you take the "quick and easy path."

The lazy mans way out is why there are so many **** guitarists around who can't play in time.

It's one thing being able to play.
It's entirely another being any good.
Which do you want?

Personally, I can't understand learning something half-assed, it seems like a waste of time to me...

My 2c.

And you think you know how I play because of one post? Interesting.

But, again, I'd have to disagree with the "don't learn songs". Thats probably the easiest way to loose interest.

fitz

Where did I infer that I know how you play?
I don't know how you learned, so I can't make assumptions on how you play...

If you're interested in something, again, why would you want to rush?

Surely real interest will spawn patience, as you'll wanna get it right.

If you couldn't be arsed, well, you weren't really that interested in the first place...

feylya

The lazy mans way out is why there are so many **** guitarists around who can't play in time.

That line got to me.

Never been fustrated by something that isn't working out? Sitting there going A, D, B, Dsus4 is all great and grand if you want to know a lot of guitar theory to become really good, but if you just want to play a few songs at a party, then they're feck all help.

fitz

Why should that line get to you, it wasn't directed at you, like I said I don't know your playing.

It is however, a relevant point.

And I did, unless I've forgotten how to read, say that once you're able to strum properly and change chords, you'll find playing songs easy enough.

Surely you're not saying that people should "play a few songs at a party" if they can't change chords or strum?

You're damn straight I've been frustrated, I can't get my head around sheet music. In one ear, out the other. I've been pissed off cause I wasn't able to seperate my kick drum foot from my hihat hand for a long time. Practice, practice, practice...now I can do it.

But I didn't learn how to do things right by diving straight into songs.

Learn the basics, apply the knowledge.
It doesn't work the other way around...

feylya

All I'm saying is that it's far more interesting to a beginner to learn a song so they can go "Hey, that cool, I can play a song" before they get bogged down with all the guitar theory.

fitz

No offence, but strumming and chord changes are hardly guitar theory are they?
It's not like I'm talking about chromatic scales or anything.
And do you know why?
Cause I don't know a chromatic scale.
I can play them, but I don't know that's the name for what I'm playing.
You're cramming this "music theory" crap down the wrong throat, I play completely by ear...

Yes songs are more interesting.
But a song played really badly isn't...

feylya

Chord Theory/construction - Not the easiest thing in the world but helps when playing by ear.

Either way, peace brother. We'll just agree to disagree.

fitz

Jesus, will you get off the theory horse!
I never mentioned chord theory.
I'm not saying learn what root notes compose what chords.
I said learn chords.
Just the shapes, how to form them.

I'm gonna drop this now, and agree to disagree, this is like banging my head off a wall...

Ancient1

So, DeVore....at this stage you must have concluded that it's best to just pick up the guitar and start playing.

You wont get anywhere listening to us:D

feylya

Originally posted by Ancient1
So, DeVore....at this stage you must have concluded that it's best to just pick up the guitar and start playing.

You wont get anywhere listening to us:D

Bravo...

DeVore

Yeah I was beginning to come to that conclusion.

Kharn is a good mate and he's up tonight (and he's so sickeningly talented I want to chop his hands off and use them for ashtrays) so I'll ask him what he thinks too.

Seriously, though thanks to everyone for various ideas and provided I go ahead with this project I hope to be playing some simple Christy Moore stuff within 6 months.

Lets see how I do.

DeV.

pyure

i might be a lil late jumping on the wagon here, but for my 2 cents go here - www.guitarnoise.com

lots of lessons and cool simple songs to play, probally the best online reference for anything to do with learning/playing guitar.

as for playing simple christy moore in 6 months, shouldnt be a problem
good luck and stick with it