Who'll be this years RWC winners?

Trojan

I think this is slightly more realistic than the IRB rankings, but I'm not sure I'd have us with lower odds than the Saffers (is it just my national pride?).

From WH, 17/9/03.


New Zealand 5/4
England 6/4
Australia 5/1
France 12/1
South Africa 25/1
Ireland 50/1
Argentina 80/1
Wales 150/1
Scotland 150/1
Samoa 300/1
Italy 300/1
Fiji 300/1
Usa 500/1
Tonga 500/1
Japan 500/1
Canada 500/1
Uruguay 1000/1
Romania 1000/1
Namibia 1000/1
Georgia 1000/1


Any thoughts?

Al.

the fnj

France at 12 to 1 is a very good bet, I think England will bottle it, New Zeland don't have the expeirence in their squad, Australia are off form, South Africa have gone to the dogs.

France can beat any team in the world when the want to, if they step up it's there for the taking.

tHE vAGGABOND

kiwi's at a canter ala 1987

DapperGent

Australia. Own back yard and all that.

henbane

Ireland had a half-assed decent shot at it until Geordan Murphy got his leg broke. Now Argentina could fsck us again.

I reckon it's gotta be New Zealand. They is always too good and England won't be able to contain them in a match they are taking seriously. Tour victories mean nothing when it comes to the World Cup.

Hairy Homer

I'm going to have flutters on England, France and South Africa. And I might even stick a few yo yos on Ireland just for the hell of it.

Australia are past it. NZ, obvious favourites but will have a tough quarter final (either England or S Africa) and could slip up. They appear to have left off a real goal kicker too, which could be fatal.

As the great Ray McLaughlin once said, when picking an international rugby side to win a match, the first three players you should choose are your three best goal kickers, and the rest should be those least likely to give away penalties in their own half.


Might also see if I can get odds on either Argentina or Ireland beating Australia by 10 pts or more. I think the Aussies are going to have one really bad crash and burn in this world cup.

Might also see what are the odds on O'Driscoll scoring a hat trick of tries in a match. He's done that before, once or twice.

henbane

Might also see what are the odds on O'Driscoll scoring a hat trick of tries in a match. He's done that before, once or twice.

Be better to have that flutter on Hickie. O'Driscoll is a marked man but he's turning in to an excellent provider (not that he wasn't already).

evilhomer

i'm not so sure australia will crash and burn, they will be playing in front of 60000+ aussie crowds, i hardly think they will roll over and play dead.

New zealand are great but as said before there lack of a consistant goal kicker will hurt them in tighter matches.

as much as i hate to say it England are good enough to go all the way if wilko doesnt get injured!

Ireland have now No cover for the centres and we could be in real trouble if either Maggs or O'Driscoll get injured.
If we get past the quarters we should be happy. Yeah but Georadn Murphy brought something special to the team, cover, speed and creativeness. He will be missed.

So in conclusion

1 England
2 New Zealand
3 Ireland/France (g'wan the ireland)

greg_f

1)New Zealand
2)Austrailia
3)england
4)South Africa
5)France
6)Ireland
7)Argentina
8)Scotland
9)Wales
10)Japan

greg_f

I know the above may seem a bit harsh but lets be a bit realistic, i just hope we can do better than this

Hairy Homer

Originally posted by evilhomer
i'm not so sure australia will crash and burn, they will be playing in front of 60000+ aussie crowds, i hardly think they will roll over and play dead.

History lesson coming up. If this is likely to bore you, skip to the next thread.

I see an uncanny parallel between Wales in the 1970s and Australia today.

Back then Wales were almost unbeatable at home. The only team in the world that won at Cardiff all through the 1970s were the All Blacks, and even then it took a last minute dive out of a line out of which Henry, Van Nistelrooy or even the great Klinnsman would have been proud, to secure the penalty that won the match for new Zealand in 78/79.

Wales just seemed to keep producing great players. When Barry John, arguably the best outhalf ever, retired in 1972, they rustled up Phil Bennet to replace him. When Bennet and Edwards retired in 78 they seemed to have the ideal replacements in Gareth Davies and Terry Holmes. However, history was to prove that Wales' great era was based on the brilliance of some great players: Edwards, John, Bennet, JPR Williams, Gerald Davies and Mervyn Davies.

When the last of those (JPR) retired in 1979 they were living on borrowed time.
In the 1980 season they beat France and Scotland, and could blame their narrow defeat at Twickenham to the eventual Grand Slam winners on the fact that they had been reduced to 14 men by an early sending off in a typically dirty match.

So when they showed up at Lansdowne Road in March that year for the last game of the season, they were in confident party mood. After all, Ireland hadn't beaten them anywhere for 10 years.

They got slaughtered.

The Irish pack, featuring such legends as Fitzgerald, Keane, Slattery, Duggan and O'Driscoll (the other one) ran them ragged. Their supporters, over for a mighty pissup couldn't believe it. They were Wales, for chrissake. They don't lose to Paddies!!!!

Within two years their unbeaten home record in the championship had gone. The year after that, they disrupted an Irish Grand Slam effort by beating us in Cardiff for the last time. Ever. (Go on. Check)

What's all this got to do with Australia? They're in a similar position. A remarkable recent record, culminating in beating the Lions. But their great players have nearly all gone. Eales, Horan, Farr Jones, Kefu, Finnegan, Wilson. They don't have the hard experienced core any more. Most of their mature players, especially in the backs, are Rugby League converts.

They still carry the momentum of World Champions but their core strength has rotted away. I will be having small wagers on Ireland, Argentina and Scotland (whom they're due to meet should they survive the pool stages) beating them by more than 10 points. I reckon one of them will come up trumps.

kmart6

Its true England could win it,but if Wilkinson gets injured in the group stages it could ruin there chances.

He's not just a good kicker but also a good alround player who is'nt afraid to get stuck in which has caused injuries in the past.

Although i really think New Zealand will walk away winners as they are on form.

They have a good pack ands there backs are dangerous when they get the ball.

When they get to the 1/4 finals its either S.Africa who they will beat easily and this was proven in they try nations.Against france it shouldnt be much of a problem.

Anyway my verdict is a New Zealand win

The Brigadier

Got to favour an England win....

For the first time ever I feel confidant that we can actually win something....

On paper the best side in the World Cup, and England have just carried on improving. They could also put out a 2nd XV and beat most sides in the WC.

bucks73

I think it will come down to either NZ or England and I fancy England just to shade it as they are more experienced and battle hardened.

Dont fancy Oz to win it even though they are at home and SA have looked very poor. Even Wales would give them a game. France are too inconsistent but will do well.

colster

I think England maybe favourites but there are some factors that can count against them.
Injury to Wilkinson and the age of some of their forwards. Will Dellaglio, Back, Johnson etc be able to cope with on the fast hard tracks down there.
Remember they toured in the winter time down there.
I think the All Blacks who have a handy group will win. I have France as my outside bet.
I think England and Australia have to play 1-2 really tough games in the group England v South Africa and Australia against Ireland and Argentina.


I think

suppafly

i reckon The ALL blacks will do it. g'wan the kiwi's!

daveirl

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DEG viper

As long as England dont win it I will be happy. im tippin Ireland to get to the semi finals though.

The Brigadier

Why don't you want England to win???

I'll be cheering Ireland on unless they are playing England....

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Spud

G'WAN the Nambia .Na ill go for Australia with England 2nd

The Brigadier

Originally posted by daveirl
Cos they're arrogant and irritating and their media is so annoying and something about 800 years of occupation.

And all Irish people are fighting drunks?

Come on guys get over it....

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Stormfox1020

I think new zealand will win, i would like to see England win, because they have never been this good before and most of their players will be gone by time the next world cup comes around, they will have lost Back, Delagio, Thompson and many others due to age, so if they dont win it now itll be awhile before they do. As for the odds in winning i think its absurd putting Wales and scotland before teams like samoa, cuz to be honest both wales and Scotland are ****e (this comming from a welsh man aswell). and argentina should be up in the ranks to, with their ever so close game with ireland on saturday.

beardedchicken

Originally posted by James Melody
Why don't you want England to win???

well, without getting into the historical biases and hackneyed stereotypes (like someone else did..ahem) , i personally would love to see this particular england rugby team getting pounded into the aussie dust, for one because they are an arrogant side which believes the publicity of its own invincibility (dallaglio and wilkinson i'm looking in your direction) and secondly because there are a number of just plain sneaky and dirty players on that team that the irb should have done something about long ago (johnson)

that and the fact that they're england! (heh!)

DEG viper

well, without getting into the historical biases and hackneyed stereotypes (like someone else did..ahem) , i personally would love to see this particular england rugby team getting pounded into the aussie dust, for one because they are an arrogant side which believes the publicity of its own invincibility (dallaglio and wilkinson i'm looking in your direction) and secondly because there are a number of just plain sneaky and dirty players on that team that the irb should have done something about long ago (johnson)

U have hit the nail dead on there. Not to forget that neil back robbed Munster in the heinekin cup final.

Hopefully that will be hammered by the aussies or all blacks, but would nt be brilliant if we knocked them out ourselves with the o driscall gettin a hat trick of ties and hays splittin wilkinson in 2. That is what dreams are made of

The Brigadier

Well when we win the World Cup I shall be very vocal in here....

If we don't I will disappear for a while...:D

Stormfox1020

Wuts so bad about Johnson and wilkinson? they are just rugby players trying to earn a living. But i agree with you about neil back hes a arrogant **** head (not that id say it to his face), and after what he did to munster he shud be banned . He is a brilliant player tho. But for ireland winning the world cup, Fat chance after the performance against Argentina, they have no chance agaisnt the aussies, England or New zealand (if you have doubts about england beating Ireland Look at last years six nations Final)

vorbis

well I don't want England to win either but I think we should stop with the arrogance line. Our commentators and journalists believed we could easily win the world cup after beating Australia at home last year. I find we get a lot more arrogant after good results than the english.

DEG viper

I would nt b so sure bout ireland when it gets to the quater final stage any team apart from wales or scotland could win their match.
Johnson i notin but a thug
while wilkenson is notin just a cocky bastard.
and there is every chance that ireland will be australia

eirebhoy

Originally posted by James Melody
Why don't you want England to win???

I'll be cheering Ireland on unless they are playing England....

Originally posted by daveirl
Cos they're arrogant and irritating and their media is so annoying and something about 800 years of occupation.

Originally posted by beardedchicken
well, without getting into the historical biases and hackneyed stereotypes (like someone else did..ahem) , i personally would love to see this particular england rugby team getting pounded into the aussie dust, for one because they are an arrogant side which believes the publicity of its own invincibility (dallaglio and wilkinson i'm looking in your direction) and secondly because there are a number of just plain sneaky and dirty players on that team that the irb should have done something about long ago (johnson)

that and the fact that they're england! (heh!)

How could you all forget the last time Ireland played England and the English took the wrong position on the greeting line and they refused to move to their correct position forcing Mary McAleese to walk on the grass. Can you imagine if we did that to the queen? We would never hear the end of it. Until every one of the current English players retire I won't forgive them for that.

Also, James Melody, you know yourself what the English would think of us if we ever did something like that to the queen.