Irish potato famine - Irish were really this hated??

bo0li5eumx12kp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2zklucyTFU

I learned about this a little in school but, wasn't aware the full extent of the depravity.

The pivotal aspect for me is this videos description of the British leaders contempt for the Irish "personality".

Abbreviated it goes, "this is a punishment of the character of the Irish, one we don't want to interfere with too much".

Helluva statement.

I was raised in Ireland and to be quite frank, I wipe my ass with Irish culture also.

One aspect of it I like is its affinity for the sport of boxing, but this arguably stems from culture manifesting via the IABA, and.... that promoted by the travelling community?
Correct me if I'm wrong.

That being said, I would never wish such a fate on anyone or any culture as heinous as a famine; some leaders at the time were clearly not as cool headed however.


Elitism and financial gain were clearly at play also as, Ireland had plentiful food stocks, but exported everything for profit, ahead of using it to feed their own starving citizens.

El_Duderino 09

Yawn.

Shouldn't you be writing your romantic fiction about 'ploughing strange' and leaving a trail of distraught chicks in your wake?

Your Irish culture baiting is not even as good as the usual stuff.

Feisar

In fairness it was whatever narrative suited the interests of the empire. Right/wrong were fairly malleable. The Irish were hardly the only ones to suffer under this yoke. Zulu’s,Indian’s or whoever needed to be brought to heel were vilified.

The whole no blacks, no dogs, no Irish in the States stems from that and also that we were Catholic.

vicwatson

Read the words “potato famine”

So much wrong with that

Unfollowed

kenmm

yawn - thread on After Hours, everyone claiming its troll. Race to show superiority by posting boring/unfollow/snooze etc.

Unfollow.

Have I won? Did I do boards right?

uck51js9zml2yt

vicwatson wrote: »

Read the words “potato famine”

So much wrong with that

Unfollowed

Yup, should have been called Genocide.

kenmm

kenmm wrote: »

yawn - thread on After Hours, everyone claiming its troll. Race to show superiority by posting boring/unfollow/snooze etc.

Unfollow.

Have I won? Did I do boards right?

Now now don’t be upsetting all the superior beings. Where would we be if they couldn’t show is how much better they are?

The biggest lingering issue with Britain is that they have never faced up to their many many wrongs all over the world. Most other civilised nations have done it whereas they’d do it to us all again if they could because the empire mentality is still being ingrained.

kenmm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

The biggest lingering issue with Britain is that they have never faced up to their many many wrongs all over the world. Most other civilised nations have done it whereas they’d do it to us all again if they could because the empire mentality is still being ingrained.

I'm not sure - that mentality does exist with some, but its a bit too much of a generalisation. For several post war decades, the UK had lots of migrants from former colonies and a lot of it was peaceful(ish..).

Apologies have been issued over the years - but whether of not there was enough of that I dunno. If it wasn't then I don't see that changing any time soon as fascism grows across the western world (and ironically the UKs chance of being a colony far exceeds any chance of them every ruling other nations again!)

EmmetSpiceland

Social reformer Charles Kingsley refereed to the Irish as “White chimpanzees” after visiting Ireland during the famine. Safe to say they didn’t think too much of the sick or dying.

Robert Peel did try to get some, much needed, aid sent over but his pleas fell on deaf ears as the government, at the time, were all about making money and not saving lives.

El_Duderino 09

kenmm wrote: »

yawn - thread on After Hours, everyone claiming its troll. Race to show superiority by posting boring/unfollow/snooze etc.

Unfollow.

Have I won? Did I do boards right?

If you recognised the OP then you’d know it’s not a thread about the famine, it’s about the OP saying some things to wind people up and get attention. Eg. the bit about ‘I wipe my arze with Irish culture’. Seriously, look at some of he other threads they’ve started. There’s no interest in discussion about the famine from the OP.

Feisar

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Now now don’t be upsetting all the superior beings. Where would we be if they couldn’t show is how much better they are?

The biggest lingering issue with Britain is that they have never faced up to their many many wrongs all over the world. Most other civilised nations have done it whereas they’d do it to us all again if they could because the empire mentality is still being ingrained.

Never complain, never explain.

kenmm

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

If you recognised the OP then you’d know it’s not a thread about the famine, it’s about the OP saying some things to wind people up and get attention

That is your assumption, correct. But even if true - who cares?

Lots of threads get clogged up with this sorta sh!te. If you think they are trolling, report it - let the mods mod.

And yes - I am aware I am being a little hypocritical with this post!

---

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Eg. the bit about ‘I wipe my arze with Irish culture’. Seriously, look at some of he other threads they’ve started. There’s no interest in discussion about the famine from the OP.

And regarding that part - just because you disagree with their assertion that Irish culture sucks that makes it a troll?
I agree - lots of Irish culture stinks. Greedy, often clique, quite gossipy, lots on keeping up with the Joneses (Gotta get on the ladder ya know!) and a lot of general Ignorance to world views.

But shure the craic is mighty so its not all bad!

Tired Gardener

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

The biggest lingering issue with Britain is that they have never faced up to their many many wrongs all over the world.

Where would they start? Given the length and breadth of British history, which atrocity would be first on that road to redemption?

Aboriginal Tasmanians?
Great Famine of 1876–1878?
Boer concentration camps?
Amritsar massacre?
Partitioning of India?
Mau Mau Uprising?

These are just some of the events the British are guilty of, each nation/race of people who have suffered at the hands of the British have a legitimate grievance. Who's takes precedence in getting an appology/acknowledgement? How would this be done, by extent, by brutality, by length, by more recent?

There is a lot of blood on the hands of the British, a lot which the British governments try to down play. A good percentage of the British population are kept ignorant to their true history... which is all the more damaging for a multitude of reasons.

Your Face

The OPs real daddy is an Irishman.

El_Duderino 09

kenmm wrote: »

That is your assumption, correct. But even if true - who cares?

Lots of threads get clogged up with this sorta sh!te. If you think they are trolling, report it - let the mods mod.

And yes - I am aware I am being a little hypocritical with this post!

---

And regarding that part - just because you disagree with their assertion that Irish culture sucks that makes it a troll?
I agree - lots of Irish culture stinks. Greedy, often clique, quite gossipy, lots on keeping up with the Joneses (Gotta get on the ladder ya know!) and a lot of general Ignorance to world views.

But shure the craic is mighty so its not all bad!

You realise this is exactly what the OP wanted? And now they got it.

Tired Gardener

Tired Gardener wrote: »

Where would they start? Given the length and breadth of British history, which atrocity would be first on that road to redemption?

Aboriginal Tasmanians?
Great Famine of 1876–1878?
Boer concentration camps?
Amritsar massacre?
Partitioning of India?
Mau Mau Uprising?

These are just some of the events the British are guilty of, each nation/race of people who have suffered at the hands of the British have a legitimate grievance. Who's takes precedence in getting an appology/acknowledgement? How would this be done, by extent, by brutality, by length, by more recent?

There is a lot of blood on the hands of the British, a lot which the British governments try to down play. A good percentage of the British population are kept ignorant to their true history... which is all the more damaging for a multitude of reasons.

In their minds all they ever did was educate savages across the globe.

daheff

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

The biggest lingering issue with Britain is that they have never faced up to their many many wrongs all over the world. Most other civilised nations have done it whereas they’d do it to us all again if they could because the empire mentality is still being ingrained.

And threatened to do so during the Brexit negotiations!!!

Tired Gardener

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

In their minds all they ever did was educate savages across the globe.

Not in all their minds. I am English, and I try to educate myself on what the history is. The older generations, do have the mindset you speak of, but my generation and the younger generation are a bit more knowledgeable... or at least try to be.

Fr_Dougal

Paulina Fat Manganese wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2zklucyTFU

I learned about this a little in school but, wasn't aware the full extent of the depravity.

The pivotal aspect for me is this videos description of the British leaders contempt for the Irish "personality".

Abbreviated it goes, "this is a punishment of the character of the Irish, one we don't want to interfere with too much".

Helluva statement.

I was raised in Ireland and to be quite frank, I wipe my ass with Irish culture also.

One aspect of it I like is its affinity for the sport of boxing, but this arguably stems from culture manifesting via the IABA, and.... that promoted by the travelling community?
Correct me if I'm wrong.

That being said, I would never wish such a fate on anyone or any culture as heinous as a famine; some leaders at the time were clearly not as cool headed however.


Elitism and financial gain were clearly at play also as, Ireland had plentiful food stocks, but exported everything for profit, ahead of using it to feed their own starving citizens.

Very strange.

In a previous post you wrote:

Hi - I am student from England.
I am moving to Sligo shortly and believe that a lot of accommodation frees up at the end of May when the students leave.

I am not looking for an apartment in a student village or anything

daheff

daheff wrote: »

And threatened to do so during the Brexit negotiations!!!

Indeed yes, Ms Patel. She always comes across as one of the most purely evil people in existence.

DrumSteve

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Indeed yes, Ms Patel. She always comes across as one of the most purely evil people in existence.

Still would though.

DrumSteve

DrumSteve wrote: »

Still would though.

Nah, such a vile personality would curdle milk.

DrumSteve

Deleted User wrote: »

Nah, such a vile personality would curdle milk.

and....?

jimgoose

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Indeed yes, Ms Patel. She always comes across as one of the most purely evil people in existence.

Ah Priti, my little onion bhaji. She just needs a bit of Irish in her. :cool::cool::D

Oh and OP, top o' de mornin' ta yerroner Sorr.

Bobblehats

Deleted User wrote: »

Nah, such a vile personality would curdle milk.

A pretty petal she is not

Our greatest curse is being part of the British isles in the eyes of all the immigrance! For whom with such a decorated history it is open season

DrumSteve

DrumSteve wrote: »

and....?

She's priti vacant.

Marcos

You just have to look at Edmund Spenser and his time in Munster to see where the likes of Trevelyan's thinking comes from. In his "A View On The State Of Ireland" Spenser lays out his plans for the total conquest of Ireland. He was granted lands in Munster in 1580 by Baron Grey De Wilton. Lord secretary of Ireland who was attempting plantations in Munster as a means of extending the crowns influence outside the Pale. He used a scorched earth policy that killed 30,000 and led to a mass displacement of Gaelic Irish from plantation areas to towns in search of food.

It was on this campaign that Spenser based his harrowing eyewitness description of the effects of starvation on the Irish in the View.

Out of everye corner of the woode and glenns they came creepinge forth upon theire handes, for theire legges could not beare them; they looked Anatomies [of] death, they spake like ghostes, crying out of theire graves; they did eate of the carrions, happye wheare they could find them, yea, and one another soone after, in soe much as the verye carcasses they spared not to scrape out of theire graves; and if they found a plott of water-cresses or shamrockes, theyr they flocked as to a feast for the time, yett not able long to contynewe therewithall; that in a shorte space there were none almost left, and a most populous and plentyfull countrye suddenly lefte voyde of man or beast: yett sure in all that warr, there perished not manye by the sworde, but all by the extreamytie of famyne which they themselves hadd wrought.[15]

The final five words in this passage suggest that, for Spenser and the English intelligentsia, enforced starvation in Ireland was not seen as morally repugnant. It was something that the Irish naturally brought upon themselves because of their irredeemable barbarism.

This echoes Trevelyan's views that the famine was the fault of the Irish.

Not surprisingly Spenser thought that all Gaelic Irish culture and language should be eradicated. Here are his views on the Irish language, and the Normans who adopted it.

I suppose that the chief cause of bringing in the Irish language amongst them was specially their fostering and marrying with the Irish…. For, first, the child that sucketh the milk of the nurse must of necessity learn his first speech of her…though he afterwards be taught English, yet the smack of the first will always abide with him; and not only of the speech, but also of the manners and conditions… they moreover draw into themselves together with their suck even the nature and disposition of their nurses. For the mind followeth much the temperature of the body, and also the words are the image of the mind… so that, the speech being Irish, the heart must needs be Irish, for out of the abundance of the heart the tongue speaketh.

He cites this as a reason the Normans became more Irish than the Irish themselves, and the Irish language and culture had to be eradicated and replaced with English language and culture instead. In order to achieve this, he advocated the use of famine as a military tactic.

"Great force must be the instrument but famine must be the means, for till Ireland be famished it cannot be subdued. . . There can be no conformity of government where is no conformity of religion. . . There can be no sound agreement between two equal contraries viz: the English and Irish".

Church on Tuesday

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yawn.

Shouldn't you be writing your romantic fiction about 'ploughing strange' and leaving a trail of distraught chicks in your wake?

Your Irish culture baiting is not even as good as the usual stuff.

I prefer his earlier stuff too.

bo0li5eumx12kp

Marcos wrote: »

You just have to look at Edmund Spenser and his time in Munster to see where the likes of Trevelyan's thinking comes from. In his "A View On The State Of Ireland" Spenser lays out his plans for the total conquest of Ireland. He was granted lands in Munster in 1580 by Baron Grey De Wilton. Lord secretary of Ireland who was attempting plantations in Munster as a means of extending the crowns influence outside the Pale. He used a scorched earth policy that killed 30,000 and led to a mass displacement of Gaelic Irish from plantation areas to towns in search of food.



This echoes Trevelyan's views that the famine was the fault of the Irish.

Not surprisingly Spenser thought that all Gaelic Irish culture and language should be eradicated. Here are his views on the Irish language, and the Normans who adopted it.



He cites this as a reason the Normans became more Irish than the Irish themselves, and the Irish language and culture had to be eradicated and replaced with English language and culture instead. In order to achieve this, he advocated the use of famine as a military tactic.

Excellent post.
You're of the opinion this is the genuine root cause of the Irish famine?
I suppose, they didn't obstruct the progression of the famine as they so easily could have.
But is this attributable to wealthy/greedy/immoral Irish landowners and elitists also?


Following the impetus - thoughts, emotions, actions - behavior, personality, culture.

It's just one mentality versus another in its most fundamentally conceptualized form.


That c**t Thatcher was right, poverty is a mentality - but so is elitism.

Capt'n Midnight

Look up the old Punch cartoons to see the caricatures

branie2

"No Irish need apply" springs to mind