wedding drama

Claire3

Hi guys,

I'm hoping you can give me advice to get some perspective on what's going on with myself and my fiance. We've been together 6 years. For about the last 4 I've been suffering with endometriosis and have had 4 surgeries to help deal with it, but it seems to be quite aggressive and keeps coming back. We were put under a lot of pressure then to have children in 2010 but we weren't married and I was living away from Ireland studying. As time went on I became more seriously ill, he had planned to move over to be with me and support me but at the last minute backed out because he felt he couldn't leave his family and felt financially insecure. At the time this resulted with us breaking up for a few months and my family and friends wanting nothing to with him for a longer spell.

We managed to get through it and tried to get our relationship back on track. My family inherited some property so a house at home became available. During this time friends started to pair off and get engaged, which I in particular found stressful - it's not that I resented anyone's happiness, I had just hoped that we would have a chance at moving forward with our plans to marry and trying to get pregnant before the whole social scene became super charged with babies.

It came to easter 2013 and we were the last couple un-engaged, I felt that he was never going to propose if I didnt start making moves to come home and I was so exhausted with the stress about fertility and having to cope with being seriously ill on my own I kind of just gave in and put in an application to transfer to a uni at home. - I know some people will say you don't have to be married to get pregnant, it's not what I wanted to do and I think that's the only point I've stuck to for myself out of all this. A month after I put in the application he proposed after 5 years together.
I moved home last summer, started at my new uni and then was forced to take time out as I had to have another operation in January. I'd like to note here that I originally made a conscious decision to move away as I didn't rate the home uni at all and also due to the fact that I endured a period of abuse as a teenager I didn't feel 'home' was a very positive place, the individual who caused this has just been released from prison so being back is very difficult for me particularly at the moment.

To get to the point of why I'm writing this . . . When planning the wedding my fiance insisted it should be at home also and that certain key people (circa 50) be invited. Apparently he has 'every right' to have those key people there and I have 'no right' to complain. I had wanted a small gathering of say max 30 possibly abroad but that was thrown out on the first day of planning and I just had to accept it. My family is essentially my parents and myself, they are inviting a lot of their friends to basically make up numbers on their side so they aren't just an isolated little table in the corner as they were at the engagment party. Their friends are quite well to do, so the wedding for me if it's 80 - 100 people has to be likewise as they want to do well by me. My fiance doesn't understand this at all. Needless to say the bills are mounting up and I'm nervous about it as my mother is expecting a substantial contribution from his family as despite wanting us at home they didn't give us so much as a house warming card when we moved in together. It's also costing us a bomb. I've paid all the deposits so far myself and organised everything on my own (my mum is very ill and my Dad is a carer). In the beginning my fiance was very good looking at stuff and I don't know where I'd be without my Dad's help when I've asked. We ended up having an argument as with four months to go we have no honeymoon booked and a number of other things that I need the groom's input on. I have been asking for his help to sort things out since February and he kept on putting it off.
He knew that my target for sorting out the wedding stuff was the end of May - I have exams in August due to the op in Jan - there's still quite a lot to do and it's affected my ability to get stuck in and study. I only have a limited amount of energy due to my illness and what I do have is eaten up with wedding stuff, I can't even enjoy it anymore and am beginning to resent it - even though getting married was really important to me, the key people I wanted were myself, himself, our parents and maybe a few friends. I really didn't want an extravaganza at the same time as still studying, if I'd known it would be this stressful I would have pushed harder for what I wanted.
This latest episode has occured because I've been treading softly with him for months and finally I've had enough and really needed him to get the finger out and do something to help me plan this affair that is largely for his friends and family. I don't think that's too much to ask? His contribution to the honeymoon was to dictate to me a budget and where he's comfortable going and apparently the rest is up to me to organise again. I basically live in fear of raising any form of conversation where he could perceive criticism in his direction.
The argument transpired along the lines of fighting about the stuff he hasn't done for the wedding that he said he would do, how I'm pissed off being lumbered without assistance considering the size of the event was dictated by his family. This spiralled into arguing about his side being the driving force behind us living here and me telling him how much I hate it and how unhappy I am at having to give up something I really loved doing. He went absolutely mental, his stance is effectively 'how dare I complain when he's a saint and has looked after me when I've been unwell'. I feel like a muzzled dog, I'm not allowed to say anything to him if he doesn't do something he promised to, or be critical of him or 'the family' in anyway or he goes crazy, literally sulking for days at a time, hating me and screaming at me. It's horrible. It isn't the person I fell in love with. I should be able to talk to him if something is making me miserable, because I want to fix it and have some hope that I'm not just marrying into some sort of a hell where my happiness will never matter as much to him as what he or his family wants.

bee06

Are you really sure you actually want to get married or are you doing it because you now feel you have to as all your friends are married?

Life shouldn't be this hard and you shouldn't have to make so many sacrifices without some give on the other side.

Tigger99

He sounds like a deeply unpleasant person with no desire to compromise. Did he want to get back together when he heard about you/your family inheriting a house?

It sounds hugely stressful and is your fiance's personality just going to change after ye get married?

You say that you are sorry that you didn't push harder. You shouldn't have to 'push' Christ ok so he mightnt be into all that wedding entails, but he should want to help you. I found your post confusing but is it that you are feeling pressure from his parents to have big numbers there?

Ok honestly you need to have a conversation with your fiance about whether he wants to get married. I suspect you are afraid to broach this and yes, it's a scary conversation, but do you really want to feel so alone for the rest of your married life, if he's like this already?

Claire3

I do want to get married, I told him I wanted to get married when we first started talking about it in 2010. I really want us to be able to have children of our own and getting married beforehand is important to me. The only reason I have been anxious at all about others weddings is that I know there has already been 'I'll be pregnant before so-and-so' competitive talk amongst some of the newly married ladies which when you're staring down the barrel of impending ivf if you're not pregnant in 4 months is stressful.
I just wanted to marry the man I love and I have been up for it for years.
I wish it felt like he cared about what actually makes me happy. I'm going all out for this wedding to make him happy, I came home. I was the perfect wee wife keeping the house and putting dinner on the table - to be honest that has dropped as I just felt so miserable. It's meant to be the happiest time of my life. . . .

freshpopcorn

I did find your post a bit confusing.
Do ye actually want to get married?
I've heard of lots of brides and they basically had to do most of the planning themselves. They were happy enough doing this.
You shouldn't really be pushed into doing things for your wedding that you don't want to. He also shouldn't be pushed into doing things he doesn't want to. ( I know loads of people who hates weddings abroad).
Can you afford to get married/is there fincial difficulties?
Ye basically need to talk.

LegacyUser

I got married last year and the planning was stressful and even though my husband didnt really help with any of it he didnt complain about what i had organised and got stuck in when his opinions etc was needed. Its the least i would expect especially if him and his family are dictating what type of wedding you are having.

Also a big thing that sticks out when I read your post is that you want to be married to have children. Do you think that you are rushing into this because of it? You have been living away for a while, how long have you actually been living with your fiance now? People change so make sure this is the person you want to spend your life with.

I am in a position where we probably wont have children due to issues with my husbands health even though we would both have liked to have some. But I am glad to have married him to be with him and not for children.

Oryx

I have to be blunt. It sounds like you are building yourself a cage and happily getting into it. How he behaves now is an illustration of what married life will be like. I really think the need to get married means you have blinkers on and are refusing to see you're marrying a caveman.

Claire3

@Tigger99

To be honest I never even considered or looked at the timeline of the inheritance which was during the break up. I don't think he's like that though, I'm - at my parents insistance - having some sort of legal document drawn up prior to marrying anyway to protect me.

The pressure I felt was predominantly from him but also that his family expects a big wedding where they're all there, they are very Irish, though my friends have compared them to the sopranos. . . It's hard as my family really wanted something small but that wasnt taken into account even though they are paying the bulk.

After last night I really don't know if I know him anymore at all. He's so defensive and aggressive, he says he does everything for me, but that doesn't make any sense as we're living a life more akin to his needs than my own. I think he is finding my illness difficult and I think he is unhappy too. We briefly discussed last night ending it if both of us are so unhappy.
If I'm exhausted now, the thought of that shatters me. I don't know how I would begin to unravel it all or how to be without him and essentially it would mean I will probably never have kids. But you're right I am worried that things will only get worse, I can't stay with someone if it isn't right.

Tigger99

Mmmm, are your parents wary of him if they are insisting on this type of document? By the way pre-nuptial agreements aren't legally enforceable in Ireland, so I'd be wary about it from that point of view.

By the way your Mam is ill, your ill, your poor Dad is carer for your Mam and they are paying for most of the wedding with little say? That sounds incredibly one-sided and the last thing ye need is more stress.

I'm glad you and the fiance have discussed whether you have a future, how was the conversation left?

Claire3

@freshpopcorn

I am happy enough, however we were only able to decide to go ahead with the wedding planning following my op, giving 8 months planning time for a big do. When you compile into that that I need time to concentrate to study and that my mother is unable to help at all - that is why I needed the support and wanted to get things sorted earlier. I shouldn't be having to do cake, invitations, rings etc two weeks before I have exams. All along I said I was happy as long as it was sorted by May, even stretching into June wasn't so bad but it's getting ridiculous now.
There aren't any real financial difficulties just awkward as his family are intent on proclaiming they're impoverished even though his sister drives a 30k car and his Dad's mortgage is paid off. . .

@Oryx

I already feel trapped and he really doesn't see that he is behaving like a caveman. Last night I kept asking him to please listen to how I was feeling. He kept over talking me, I asked me to please not shout at me, he didn't stop, screamed at me to get out of his face and stormed upstairs smashing part of the door to the bedroom as he slammed it.
It really wasn't awesome.

Big Bag of Chips

Again, I will ask the question that has been asked a few times... Do you actually want to get married? Or are you just "keeping up with the Joneses?"
You have mentioned quite a bit what all your friends are doing, and the "competition" of who'll be pregnant first... Forgive my language, but, what absolute bullsh*t!
Seriously?

What age are all these people? Getting married and starting families isn't a race, or something you do because of peer pressure. It's something each couple has to individually decide on based on their own lives.

Every single issue you have mentioned in your post is qualified with 'because someone else did...'. Live your life. Chose your own life. Get married if you can afford it. You or your mother should not be expecting a contribution sizeable or otherwise from his family. You are 2 adults getting married. It's up to you to organise a party that you can afford without depending on others to pay it off.

To he honest, the whole thing sounds a mess, and it all sounds rushed and hassled. And it sounds like you are doing all this just so you're not the only ones not married, not pregnant etc.

I think a frank and honest talk is needed between you both. If you can't be open and completely honest with each other, why get married?

Claire3

@Tigger

Yea I know about the pre-nup, I'm not sure how we're going to get around it, currently the property isn't being transferred into my name until it's sorted. My folks weren't keen to begin with and when he backed out of moving over the day before we were due to sign on a flat in 2011 they were furious. It took a lot for them to trust him again.

My folks, now the type of wedding has been decided, are having most of the say in the venue decor etc and helped chose my dress. I think it's more that they would've preferred the bill to be 10k rather than much more as they wanted to save some money aside to help us with medical costs if I can't have chidren naturally.

After I said 'if we're both so unhappy we probably shouldn't be together' there was a long pause then I asked him if that was what he wanted. He said he was dying to marry me. He resents me mentioning anything to do with my old life or uni and went so far as to say I would put it on his gravestone that he let me down. It's really awkward, I don't know what we're going to do. He is livid with me for having a go in the first place.
The night ended with him downstairs and me in the spare room with the door locked.

Tigger99

I'd be worried that he got so angry that a door got smashed. Is that why you locked the spare room? Clare3 there are so so many red flags in your posts. This is not a healthy relationship.

Tigger99

Why does he resent u mentioning uni or your 'old life' do u mean life before him?

Claire3

@ Big bag of chips

We have wanted to get married for the last 4 years, I love him I want to be with him and have a family with him.

I completely agree with the competition between friends being bull, my point was when we are trying to get pregnant having to undergo endless invasive tests etc it would have been nicer to not be surrounded by people in our social group being complete idiots about settling down. Which is why I had hoped we'd get married and start trying before the idiocy began if that makes sense? They are all in their late 20s/early 30s.

With regards to the wedding I and my family wanted something small. The bigger 'party' was dictated by the number in his family hence my folks and I think it is fair for them to contribute.

You are spot on with the rushed and hassled part. I've had two surgeries in the last year, we were told after the last one that further surgery could cause more damage. The next surgery I will be having is a hysterectomy. The rush is not either of our choices.

Claire3

@ Tigger

Sorry I should have made that clear, I really miss my original uni and where I lived before, I really loved my degree and I felt positive about my future career etc. The feeling isn't that positive at home. He hates me saying anything about it as obviously my saying I'm not happy right here isn't what he wants to hear. He feels I blame him for my coming home, which I don't really, it's his family I'm more irritated with for having such a hold over him but then maybe thats just passing the buck.

bee06

Claire, there is no doubt that wedding planning is stressful with the money side and the fact that everyone seems to have an opinion on how it should be done. But all of that should be offset by the fact that you as a couple are a team dealing with it. This isn't the case for you and if you can't rely on him for the wedding planning how can you rely on him when things get really serious. Wedding planning is going to seem like a dream compared to the stress of IVF if you have to go down that road and if/when you have a baby are you going to be able to rely on him to help or are you going to have to deal with it all yourself too?

Stavro Mueller

I can't help but think that you're viewing this through the prism of "Oh sh!t, time is running out". I'm also very concerned about two paragraphs you typed here. If you were my sister and I knew her fiance was behaving like this towards her, I'd be going frantic with worry. Has he always had this unpleasant streak in him?

He went absolutely mental, his stance is effectively 'how dare I complain when he's a saint and has looked after me when I've been unwell'. I feel like a muzzled dog, I'm not allowed to say anything to him if he doesn't do something he promised to, or be critical of him or 'the family' in anyway or he goes crazy, literally sulking for days at a time, hating me and screaming at me. It's horrible. It isn't the person I fell in love with. I should be able to talk to him if something is making me miserable, because I want to fix it and have some hope that I'm not just marrying into some sort of a hell where my happiness will never matter as much to him as what he or his family wants

and

I already feel trapped and he really doesn't see that he is behaving like a caveman. Last night I kept asking him to please listen to how I was feeling. He kept over talking me, I asked me to please not shout at me, he didn't stop, screamed at me to get out of his face and stormed upstairs smashing part of the door to the bedroom as he slammed it.
It really wasn't awesome.

LegacyUser

Going to be very blunt here.

Claire your husband to be is a dog, he's not going to magically change after the wedding, he will only get worse. Now if you're dead set on marrying him to keep up with your friends then off you go, but the signs are there that it's certain your future with him will be misery, but the price you're willing to pay for the sake of appearances is your own business.

If you knowingly bring a child into this relationship and the toxic environment you've described however (no matter how desperate you are to have one) well I'm sorry but you are absolutely failing that child as a mother.

strobe

Do you really want to get married to this man specifically, and for him to be the father of your children, because of who he is? Because you love him to bits, think he would be an amazing husband and father? Or is he just who's there and you're worried you won't find someone else in time if it's not him? It really really sounds like the latter... which isn't fair to him or you, and I can only see a very unhappy ending down that road...

meeeeh

So neither of you saved a cent for the wedding despite living in a gifted house. He wants the whole clan there despite not doing anything or paying for anything. And you want his parents to pay because his sister has a 30k car and they have no mortgage. Well neither do you.

I think your fiance is being a total jerk but neither of you is acting like an adult. Which set of parents is supposed to mind the kids when you have them?

Claire3

@ meeeh

I have saved for the last 4 years and as I said I have paid all of the deposits so far despite being a student! My parents helped us out with the house as we are being forced to have a family about 5 years ahead of our schedule, we have put a lot into it ourselves as it was a wreck when we got it and they will be getting back the value of what it was prior to renovation once its sold.
His whole clan is demanding to be there and my parents aren't prepared to give them a free ride which is fair. Most of my savings and whatever my fiance saves from working 70 hour wks will be going in as well.

By the way as I've explained my mother is ill and my father is a carer. His mother is dead and his father is 70 so we'll be looking after our children ourselves and not fobbing them off on anyone should we be blessed to have them.

Claire3

@ Everyone else

I have loved this man more than I have ever loved anyone and I wanted to spend the rest of my life with him but the fact that he can't seem to understand why I'm unhappy and doesn't want to discuss doing anything about it without going off on some rant that I'm the worst in the world. Especially with the way he was last night. It has given me doubts which is why I'm on here and I don't know what to do about it. At the moment I don't want to be near him and then I've people phoning me about the hen party and I'm getting on as if everything is normal?!?

Starokan

Based on your op my immediate reaction is wtf are these people getting married for. You are back living somewhere you do not want to be, he wont help organise the wedding, he wont talk to you about key issues and gets pretty aggressive when you try to, are you both just caught up in the whole thing and getting married for the sake of it or do you actually love each other ?

Assuming you do and that you were venting a bit when posting I would say you have serious issues to work on before you get married and have a child together. First would be communication , if he continues to refuse to discuss the wedding and / or other serious issues then I would advise you to walk away as you cannot have a relationship without communication. Second would be compromise , all relationships are built on compromise, you compromised a lot by moving back, he seems unwilling to do this in any way (although I will say he is as entitled to invite x,y,z to the wedding as you are) , the problem is there seems to be no joint decision , he effectively states his point and does not budge until you give in, that's not going to get any easier in the future.

I would advise you to think seriously about the marriage and perhaps to sit with your fiance and ask him to do the same, this should be one of the happiest times of your life and it clearly is not as it stands. Its not insurmountable if you both love each other but there is a lot of things to be ironed out before you stand in front of an altar

Big Bag of Chips

You do realise his sister will have a car loan for her car. She won't have walked in and paid cash. What has what his sister owns got to do with paying for your wedding anyway? When we got married my mam & dad paid the hotel, because they wanted to and we were VERY grateful. I had saved for 2 years with the intention of paying for it myself/ourselves. I never "budgeted" for others to pay for my wedding. So my parents gave us about €5000. His mam and dad gave us €100 in a card.

Your wedding is a joint affair. At this stage of your relationship your finances should be joint as well. So you saying you paid all the deposits is a bit strange? Where's all his money? Why didn't you tell him what needed to be paid for and get him to pay out some of the expenses?

Trust me... Life is difficult. Me & my husband are best friends. We can talk (fight!) through anything. When times get tough.. and I promise you, times will get very tough.. at least we know we have each other's support. We might argue or disagree about something, but we respect each other and we know at the end of the day or relationship is solid.

Is yours?

rainbowtrout

Claire, your posts read like a car crash waiting to happen. To be honest I'd be wondering why you are really getting married?

Claire3 wrote: »

Hi guys,

As time went on I became more seriously ill, he had planned to move over to be with me and support me but at the last minute backed out because he felt he couldn't leave his family and felt financially insecure.

We managed to get through it and tried to get our relationship back on track. My family inherited some property so a house at home became available. During this time friends started to pair off and get engaged, which I in particular found stressful - it's not that I resented anyone's happiness, I had just hoped that we would have a chance at moving forward with our plans to marry and trying to get pregnant before the whole social scene became super charged with babies.

Why couldn't he leave his family to support you?


The whole marriage and babies thing seems to be a competition in your head. Medical problems aside, you wanted to do the marriage and babies thing before your friends??? That's not a good enough reason to get married. Ever.

Claire3 wrote: »

Hi guys,



It came to easter 2013 and we were the last couple un-engaged, I felt that he was never going to propose if I didnt start making moves to come home and I was so exhausted with the stress about fertility and having to cope with being seriously ill on my own I kind of just gave in and put in an application to transfer to a uni at home. - I know some people will say you don't have to be married to get pregnant, it's not what I wanted to do and I think that's the only point I've stuck to for myself out of all this. A month after I put in the application he proposed after 5 years together.

So what if you were the last couple un-engaged? It's not a race or competition. I'm wondering if being married and having the ring on your finger and being able to call yourself Mrs. X. is a little more important to you that the relationship and what marriage entails.

You felt that he was never going to propose, in one of your other posts below you said that you both wanted to get married for years, yet it sounds like here that it might have mainly coming from you.

Claire3 wrote: »

To get to the point of why I'm writing this . . . When planning the wedding my fiance insisted it should be at home also and that certain key people (circa 50) be invited. Apparently he has 'every right' to have those key people there and I have 'no right' to complain. I had wanted a small gathering of say max 30 possibly abroad but that was thrown out on the first day of planning and I just had to accept it. My family is essentially my parents and myself, they are inviting a lot of their friends to basically make up numbers on their side so they aren't just an isolated little table in the corner as they were at the engagment party. Their friends are quite well to do, so the wedding for me if it's 80 - 100 people has to be likewise as they want to do well by me. My fiance doesn't understand this at all. Needless to say the bills are mounting up and I'm nervous about it as my mother is expecting a substantial contribution from his family as despite wanting us at home they didn't give us so much as a house warming card when we moved in together. It's also costing us a bomb. I've paid all the deposits so far myself and organised everything on my own (my mum is very ill and my Dad is a carer). In the beginning my fiance was very good looking at stuff and I don't know where I'd be without my Dad's help when I've asked. We ended up having an argument as with four months to go we have no honeymoon booked and a number of other things that I need the groom's input on. I have been asking for his help to sort things out since February and he kept on putting it off.

First thing, marriage is about compromise. You should not be told that you have no right to complain. A compromise should have been reached together. Read the stuff that is highlighted. There is a lot of crowd pleasing and keeping up with the Jones going on. So what if your parents friends are well to do, it doesn't mean the wedding has to have loads of money (that you can't afford) thrown at it to impress them.

Claire3 wrote: »

This latest episode has occured because I've been treading softly with him for months and finally I've had enough and really needed him to get the finger out and do something to help me plan this affair that is largely for his friends and family. I don't think that's too much to ask? His contribution to the honeymoon was to dictate to me a budget and where he's comfortable going and apparently the rest is up to me to organise again. I basically live in fear of raising any form of conversation where he could perceive criticism in his direction.
The argument transpired along the lines of fighting about the stuff he hasn't done for the wedding that he said he would do, how I'm pissed off being lumbered without assistance considering the size of the event was dictated by his family. This spiralled into arguing about his side being the driving force behind us living here and me telling him how much I hate it and how unhappy I am at having to give up something I really loved doing. He went absolutely mental, his stance is effectively 'how dare I complain when he's a saint and has looked after me when I've been unwell'. I feel like a muzzled dog, I'm not allowed to say anything to him if he doesn't do something he promised to, or be critical of him or 'the family' in anyway or he goes crazy, literally sulking for days at a time, hating me and screaming at me. It's horrible. It isn't the person I fell in love with. I should be able to talk to him if something is making me miserable, because I want to fix it and have some hope that I'm not just marrying into some sort of a hell where my happiness will never matter as much to him as what he or his family wants.

Again, look at the highlighted bits. If one of your friends described their partner in these terms to you, what would you say to them? You shouldn't live in fear of your partner screaming at you or giving you the silent treatment. You describe yourself as a muzzled dog, which suggests that with your partner that things must go his way, in his words 'you don't have a right to complain'. That's not an equal, loving relationship.

Claire3 wrote: »

I do want to get married, I told him I wanted to get married when we first started talking about it in 2010. I really want us to be able to have children of our own and getting married beforehand is important to me. The only reason I have been anxious at all about others weddings is that I know there has already been 'I'll be pregnant before so-and-so' competitive talk amongst some of the newly married ladies which when you're staring down the barrel of impending ivf if you're not pregnant in 4 months is stressful.
I just wanted to marry the man I love and I have been up for it for years.
I wish it felt like he cared about what actually makes me happy. I'm going all out for this wedding to make him happy, I came home. I was the perfect wee wife keeping the house and putting dinner on the table - to be honest that has dropped as I just felt so miserable. It's meant to be the happiest time of my life. . . .

You need to forget about your friends and who is pregnant and who is not. They have every right to have children and their decisions should have no impact on yours. Sure, it might be difficult to watch them with their children if you have difficulty conceiving down the road, but it's not a good enough reason to rush into marriage.

That other line about being the perfect wee wife... do you feel that because you are acting out this role of being what you perceive to be the perfect wife, that then he should want to get married and everything will fall into place? I don't think it's enough, and I wonder again are you playing a role to please people, in this case your fiance instead of just getting on with your life? There are two of you in the relationship and 'keeping house and putting a dinner on the table' is something both of you should be doing. Playing the role of the traditional housewife is perhaps not the best road to take with someone who tells you you have no right to complain. If anything it could make you subservient to him.

Claire3 wrote: »

@Tigger99




After last night I really don't know if I know him anymore at all. He's so defensive and aggressive, he says he does everything for me, but that doesn't make any sense as we're living a life more akin to his needs than my own. I think he is finding my illness difficult and I think he is unhappy too. We briefly discussed last night ending it if both of us are so unhappy.
If I'm exhausted now, the thought of that shatters me. I don't know how I would begin to unravel it all or how to be without him and essentially it would mean I will probably never have kids. But you're right I am worried that things will only get worse, I can't stay with someone if it isn't right.

You need to separate out the relationship with your fiance and having kids. You need to figure out if marrying him is the right thing to do before you consider having kids with him. Do you want to be stuck in a marriage with someone you are afraid to criticize, who is aggressive, sulks when he doesn't get his own way, says you can't complain?

Claire3 wrote: »

@freshpopcorn


There aren't any real financial difficulties just awkward as his family are intent on proclaiming they're impoverished even though his sister drives a 30k car and his Dad's mortgage is paid off. . .

@Oryx

I already feel trapped and he really doesn't see that he is behaving like a caveman. Last night I kept asking him to please listen to how I was feeling. He kept over talking me, I asked me to please not shout at me, he didn't stop, screamed at me to get out of his face and stormed upstairs smashing part of the door to the bedroom as he slammed it.
It really wasn't awesome.

On the wedding thing, you aren't entitled to have your wedding paid for by someone else. If you can't afford what you want then you have to cut back.

More worrying though again is the way your fiance treats you, as described above.

Claire3 wrote: »

@Tigger

Yea I know about the pre-nup, I'm not sure how we're going to get around it, currently the property isn't being transferred into my name until it's sorted. My folks weren't keen to begin with and when he backed out of moving over the day before we were due to sign on a flat in 2011 they were furious. It took a lot for them to trust him again.

My folks, now the type of wedding has been decided, are having most of the say in the venue decor etc and helped chose my dress. I think it's more that they would've preferred the bill to be 10k rather than much more as they wanted to save some money aside to help us with medical costs if I can't have chidren naturally.

After I said 'if we're both so unhappy we probably shouldn't be together' there was a long pause then I asked him if that was what he wanted. He said he was dying to marry me. He resents me mentioning anything to do with my old life or uni and went so far as to say I would put it on his gravestone that he let me down. It's really awkward, I don't know what we're going to do. He is livid with me for having a go in the first place.
The night ended with him downstairs and me in the spare room with the door locked.

All of the words you use to describe your fiance's interactions with you are negative. That should be of concern to you. You had a life abroad at uni. He should not begrudge you this. You should be able to talk about it, it was an important (and happy) part of your life.

Claire3 wrote: »

We have wanted to get married for the last 4 years, I love him I want to be with him and have a family with him.

I completely agree with the competition between friends being bull, my point was when we are trying to get pregnant having to undergo endless invasive tests etc it would have been nicer to not be surrounded by people in our social group being complete idiots about settling down. Which is why I had hoped we'd get married and start trying before the idiocy began if that makes sense? They are all in their late 20s/early 30s.

With regards to the wedding I and my family wanted something small. The bigger 'party' was dictated by the number in his family hence my folks and I think it is fair for them to contribute.

Your friends are not being idiots, they are doing what a lot of people in their 20s/30s do: settling down. They just got there before you, which is what I feel is the root of the problem.

From your earlier post it sounded like your fiance dictated the number invited not his family, either way, it should be a decision between the two of you who to invite and how to pay for it.

Claire3 wrote: »

@ Tigger

Sorry I should have made that clear, I really miss my original uni and where I lived before, I really loved my degree and I felt positive about my future career etc. The feeling isn't that positive at home. He hates me saying anything about it as obviously my saying I'm not happy right here isn't what he wants to hear. He feels I blame him for my coming home, which I don't really, it's his family I'm more irritated with for having such a hold over him but then maybe thats just passing the buck.

I don't get anything about his family having a hold over him through all of your posts. What I'm getting is that your fiance is aggressive towards you and you have a lot of your life decisions dictated by other people, and other decisions are being made based on competition with friends.

Step back and look at what made you happy, and ask yourself is your current situation making you happy.

LegacyUser

I am in a similar situation regarding children.

You need to ask yourself, if you are unable to ever have children, will you be happy to have given up your other life to move back home to live with this man forever. And even if you do have children, eventually they would move out and have lives of their own. I have two aunts and uncles in their 60's who have divorced in the last few years after their grown up children moved out claiming they were only staying together for the children.

As some one else mention stress about a wedding is nothing compared to going through IVF.

Claire3

Starokan wrote: »

he effectively states his point and does not budge until you give in

This is precisely the issue i'm having with him, he is very stubborn and obstinate when it comes to what he wants. He has always had a temper but that had mellowed massively in the last 4 years. Last night was a flashback to someone I really don't want to know, it isn't him. Sometimes when it comes to big decisions I've just felt worn down over time and I definately just gave up on my old Uni as I couldn't take the long distance and our relationship stagnating anymore.

dellas1979

Claire-I remember you posted a thread on this before (over a year ago at this stage).
And you said all the things you said before, exactly the same things, except now, you are getting married in a few months.

I dont really see what changed, in you or him, from what you describe, except you got your wish of a ring on your finger.

When you get married, you'll probably have the same gripes about him. Except then you'll be legally tied to him.

Where is this going for you?

I know you are looking for advice, but I just dont know what anyone can say or do for you. We cant change him. You cant change him. He is not going to all of a sudden change with a ring on his finger.

Your next wish is a child. Youll still have the same gripe with him then too.

rainbowtrout

Claire, you've just posted on another thread in this forum what appears to be to be the most honest appraisal of your current situation. You said that you are resentful of basically having to give up uni to come home and that he expects you to be a dutiful woman.

The latter comment is of more concern based on the way you've described him treating you.

meeeeh

Claire3 wrote: »

@ meeeh

I have saved for the last 4 years and as said I have paid all of the deposits so far despite being a student! My parents helped us out with the house as we are being forced to have a family about 5 years ahead of our schedule, we have put a lot into it ourselves as it was a wreck when we got it and they will be getting back the value of what it was prior to renovation once its sold.
His whole clan is demanding to be there and my parents aren't prepared to give them a free ride which is fair. Most of my savings and whatever my fiance saves from working 70 hour wks will be going in as well.

By the way as I've explained my mother is ill and my father is a carer. His mother is dead and his father is 70 so we'll be looking after our children ourselves and not fobbing them off on anyone should we be blessed to have them.

It is your wedding and you should put your foot down regarding the guest numbers but while his parents are being a bit vulgar there is no obligation on them to pay for the wedding. It is not them getting married.

But you and your partner seem to be under horrendous pressure. I live with someone who works that kind of hours per week and I have to keep on top of everything outside work. I even organise his trips to the doctor. There is a reason why we have 40h working week and if you work 70 there is usually someone else making sacrifices. So I am not surprised all the organising is up to you.

Claire3

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

You do realise his sister will have a car loan for her car. She won't have walked in and paid cash. . . Where's all his money? Why didn't you tell him what needed to be paid for and get him to pay out some of the expenses?. . . our relationship is solid.
Is yours?

The difference between your wedding and mine is that you had more than double the time to plan due to no medical pressure and probably weren't in and out of hospital like a yoyo so didn't have your ability to earn screwed over. We would have loved to have things a bit more organised and not need so much help to make it happen. My point with his family is that they aren't impoverished and it is unfair to expect myself and my family to pick up the tab for 30 of them when we wanted a wedding of 10 - 30 people in total. Does that make sense? Believe me I am really grateful for anything anyone is doing for us.
He apparently earns 25k a year, pays half bills and money going into the house is half what he would spend on rent so I have begun to wonder if he has some sort of drug or gambling habit as I have no idea where on earth all his money goes! The argument last night was to do with the organisation of the wedding and that I have paid out everything, done everything etc and I was arguing to try and get his help. He thinks that I am just taking everything out on him because I'm under pressure and can't seem to grasp that part of the reason I am under pressure is because of him. The reason I'm on here is I'm questioning the solidity of our relationship due to the way he behaved towards me.

our relationship is solid.

Is yours?[/QUOTE]

strandroad

This is car crash in slow motion... You really should not be getting married now, if ever. He is treating you horrendously, why would you marry someone who is behaving like this - screaming, ignoring you, showing no respect, support or understanding? He might not be the man you loved anymore, does he even love you at all? It's not how a loving fiance behaves!

rainbowtrout

Claire3 wrote: »

The difference between your wedding and mine is that you had more than double the time to plan due to no medical pressure and probably weren't in and out of hospital like a yoyo so didn't have your ability to earn screwed over. We would have loved to have things a bit more organised and not need so much help to make it happen. My point with his family is that they aren't impoverished and it is unfair to expect myself and my family to pick up the tab for 30 of them when we wanted a wedding of 10 - 30 people in total. Does that make sense? Believe me I am really grateful for anything anyone is doing for us.
He apparently earns 25k a year, pays half bills and money going into the house is half what he would spend on rent so I have begun to wonder if he has some sort of drug or gambling habit as I have no idea where on earth all his money goes! The argument last night was to do with the organisation of the wedding and that I have paid out everything, done everything etc and I was arguing to try and get his help. He thinks that I am just taking everything out on him because I'm under pressure and can't seem to grasp that part of the reason I am under pressure is because of him. The reason I'm on here is I'm questioning the solidity of our relationship due to the way he behaved towards me.

If you cannot afford to have all those people are at the wedding and his family do not want to pay for having extended family there which they are not really obliged to do, then you cut them from the guest list. It's your wedding, time to start taking charge.

Again, there are more warning signs there that need to be discussed if you don't know what he is earning or where it is going. He's entitled to have some money to spend on himself, but I'd be concerned if I was in your position.

Big Bag of Chips

If you can't discuss something as simple as a wedding with him, and trust me compared to what can happen you in life deciding on how many people you should have at a wedding, and how much you can afford to spend is very simple, then continuing with the wedding is the biggest mistake you will make.

You want to be married before you have kids. What if you never have kids? I think you see children as the solution. And when you have kids they will be the distraction you both need to make everything else perfect. But children are not guaranteed... So, what about if you get married and it ends up being just the 2 of you. For the next 50-60 years it is just you and him. His personality is his own. That's not going to change. He's managed to suppress it for the last 4 years, but now with a bit of pressure in your lives it is resurfacing. Lots of people get married thinking things will somehow change. Nothing changes. The person your fiancé is the day before he gets married will be the exact same person he is the day after he gets married.

I feel genuinely worried for you, Claire. I think you will go ahead with this wedding because you've invested too much time, effort and money to back out. But I think you will spend many nights crying in the spare room as you realise how much you have sacrificed, and how little he compromises.

I'm out now, because I don't know what you want to hear from people. And I think regardless of what you hear it won't make a difference anyway. Your problem is with your bf and how he treats you and how unreasonable he becomes. No amount of advice here can make any difference to that.

Good luck to you.

I wish you well, and I sincerely hope things work out the way you would like them to.

bee06

Claire3 wrote: »

He apparently earns 25k a year, pays half bills and money going into the house is half what he would spend on rent so I have begun to wonder if he has some sort of drug or gambling habit as I have no idea where on earth all his money goes!

I'm actually speechless at this! You don't know what he earns or what he is doing with his money to the point you think he could be gambling or on drugs! What the F!!

ElleEm

Claire, you really seem deluded to what is going on here.

How can you talk about your relationship being solid when your boyfriend has so much control over you? He is telling you how many people to invite to your wedding, with no discussion. He will not help or support you when planning your wedding. He is "livid" when you bring up issues with him. He is aggressive and physically destructive to your home. You have no idea how much he earns or what he spends his money on.

Why do you want this man to be your husband? Do you really think he will make a good father, if this is how he treats you, an adult? What happens if you cannot have children? Think about how this will make you feel, forever it just being you two. Will this be enough for you?

It sounds like your partnership here is with your parents. It certainly is not with this man. What positives does he contribute to your life? It seems like you can't even like him right now. I very much doubt that this will change after the wedding, when the pressure of procreating is on.

Your posts read like you are ticking boxes of house, marriage, kids. It seems like these THINGS are more important than your own happiness. Please take time to read through the posts here again, particularly Big Bag of Chips' last post.

Merkin

I think you both would be absolutely mad to even think about getting married to one another.

You're racing at high speed blindly against the clock, he seems to be putting every possible obstacle in the way without actually breaking up with you, both of you sound seething with resentment for a plethora of reasons, you seem to be fixated on real or imagined peer pressure, he seems in no way interested in either the wedding or the relationship......need I go on?

WHY would you get married? Seriously, this is doomed to failure.

And incidentally, seeing as communication between you is so poor, does he know you are expecting to get pregnant the moment you walk up the aisle?

dellas1979

In the fear of not having children, youve now pigeon holed yourself. Instead of accepting and being at peace with yourself, and whats happened, and dealing with things, the whole race is now running out of steam. Its all becoming like a steam roller.

I too wish you well, and bow out, but do hope, some how, that it works out for you.

LegacyUser

Claire3 wrote: »

I completely agree with the competition between friends being bull, my point was when we are trying to get pregnant having to undergo endless invasive tests etc it would have been nicer to not be surrounded by people in our social group being complete idiots about settling down. Which is why I had hoped we'd get married and start trying before the idiocy began if that makes sense? They are all in their late 20s/early 30s.

No that doesn't make sense. Are you saying you wanted to be married with kids first as your friends would/have become obsessed and therefore idiots about getting married and having kids? Seriously who cares. you sound obsessed with getting married and having kids and are I'm sorry to be blunt being an idiot about the whole thing. Your seem to be totally focused on having kids now because your medical condition could cause infertility issues but also can't stand the thought of trying for kids before marriage so have moved from somewhere where you admit to being happy to somewhere your not, admit to moving from a good Uni you were doing well at to one that in your own words don't rate. Your having a larger wedding then you wanted and one you can't afford and marrying someone who you admit has yelled at you, broke a door in a temper tantrum and refuses to speak to you like an adult about some basics things. Honestly it sounds like the only reason he proposed was because of you making such a massive effort of moving back home and he didn't really have a choice. Sounds like his refusal to move away to be with you was a giant red flag but you opted to ignore it because, and this is my reading of things OP, you want to get married and have kids, your illness has put a shorter biological clock countdown on the issue so you are pushing ahead with this guy cus you've invested so much of your time and money and altered your whole life to suit him and your afraid of walking away, starting over and risking never having kids.

Might be worth speaking to someone independent from the whole mess - either via your GP or your college and get your head on straight before you move forward with this wedding.

ABajaninCork

OP - I read through this thread. I also read through your other thread. And I can't believe that an (apparently) intelligent, educated woman is putting herself through this. What for? Rarely, have I seen a thread where everyone is in complete agreement - THIS WEDDING SHOULD NOT GO AHEAD!!

From what I read, your fiance is less than supportive. Everything has to be done his way or NO way. You feel you cannot express an opinion as he gets nasty and tries to bully you. Are you really that desperate for a wedding that you feel you need to put up with this?

I'm sorry to say this, but I'm getting the distinct impression that you want the wedding more than your fiance does. Did you have to give him a 'nudge' to propose? And why the high speed dash headlong to the altar? You're studying and his job doesn't pay much. How on earth were you managing to save? How will the finances be handled after?

OK - you'd like children. And because of your medical condition, you feel time is running out. Having kids isn't the be all and end all. Many relationships break down because of the strain children can place on it. Neither do you have to be married to have children. Why are you so desperate to have children with this man? What makes you think things will improve when (if) they come along?

I'd also be interested to know how the pre-marriage course went (if you did one) between you? Was communication discussed?? How about finances? Did you discuss that in any detail at all? What about the fact you may be infertile? And the not insignificant fact you do not want to live here??

I think you need to think very long and hard about this. You've been given a glimpse of what life will be like for you. A wedding is for one day. You'll be married and miserable for a VERY long time. Divorce is not easy to come by in Ireland. It's not like the UK where you can divorce after a year. And you've been gifted property which your fiance will be entitled to a share of if you marry him. It'll be an expensive and VERY messy mistake! Just for the sake of keeping up with the Joneses.

Is it all worth it?

Oryx

Having read your further replies, just simply, don't get married. You are doing it for the wrong reasons to a man you have a very uneven relationship with. I can't say it any simpler. Don't do it. Or you will look back with such regret when you are trapped in a much tougher situation legally, financially and emotionally.

Sound Bite

There are several warning signs here which should be enough to call of this wedding but I it appears that your need to get married & start trying for a baby as soon as possible is clouding your judgement.

Endometriosis & its effects is a major issue & also affects your thought process given you know that your are fighting many more obstacles than a person without fertility issues to conceive.

I have it too & have changed my mind in the idea of babies several times & may do again but I do understand the temptation to stay in a bad relationship because of the belief that by the time you find another man & establish that relationship it may be too late to have children.

Do not let your desire to have children allow you enter into this sham of a marriage.

Maybe I'm wrong but to me it seems like this may be the case

Merkin

Genuine and practical suggestion. Why don't you cancel the wedding and use your savings to have your eggs frozen?

ABajaninCork

Merkin wrote: »

Genuine and practical suggestion. Why don't you cancel the wedding and use your savings to have your eggs frozen?

That is SUCH a good idea! OP - I'd be giving very serious thought to that. I wish I had...

FactCheck

Because frozen eggs will be useless to her when she has her hysterectomy in a couple of years.

I think everybody is being a bit disingenuous with the whole "WHY are you doing this??!!" schtick. Folks, she's basically said over and over again why she's doing it.

This is her only chance to have biological children. She cannot bank on a medical miracle. She is seriously ill and this is it for her. So she either walks away from this, and hopes she meets someone who will want to adopt with her, and can afford to adopt, and they can negotiate the ethical minefield of international adoption, and adoption is still even legal (countries close themselves to adoption all the time). Or she just goes with what she has.

Claire like everyone else I would not take this gamble. I think he's going to be a lazy, impatient father. I think your marriage will never survive the infant/toddler years. You will be alone and he will probably be a rubbish weekend dad too. And you'll have to watch your kid suffer the results of that and that will feel SO much worse than the worst he makes you feel now.

So I, like everyone else, would say walk, and take your chances.

But I have never had to walk away from my only chance to have biological children and possibly children full stop. I'm not going to be glib about how that should be easy. A big part of me entirely understands why you would say "**** it, so what if we get divorced. I'll never regret the kid." And you know what? You probably won't. Being a single parent doesn't result in mass shaming any more. It's not ideal for the kid but sure almost half of children grow up with separated parents and they survive.

So make your deal with the devil if you want (I don't mean your fiance is the Devil, I mean it in a figurative sense). Just do it with your eyes open and don't expect anyone to sugarcoat it for you and say it's a great plan. It's an incredibly crappy plan. But you're in an incredibly crappy situation and it's one that I suspect almost nobody here can relate to. I certainly can't and I'm very glad I've never had to.

Best of luck - above all, with your health.

Stavro Mueller

Maybe she could freeze the eggs and go down the surrogacy route? Excuse my ignorance here - I can't say I know much about it. And if people say it's expensive, surely it can't be worse than the inevitable divorce that is going to come from this story.

Merkin

Haven't you heard of surrogacy?

ABajaninCork

cymbaline wrote: »

Maybe she could freeze the eggs and go down the surrogacy route? Excuse my ignorance here - I can't say I know much about it. And if people say it's expensive since, surely it can't be worse than the inevitable divorce that is going to come from this story.

Just what I was literally typing! I can relate to her situation as it's happened to me. Sadly, I can't have children now.

But FactCheck's right - The OP's health, physical as well as mental is paramount. I still wouldn't undertake this wedding. It'll cost plenty. And not just money.

FactCheck

She will not be the legal mother of any children born through surrogacy. She will have to find a partner who will want to go through that. Her children will live in legal limbo for years (the Irish Times ran a series about this recently). She will have to negotiate the ethical minefield of paying an impoverished Indian woman to carry her child. And it may not even succeed.

Sure, it's possible. It's also possible they will invent a cure for endometriosis next year. Or a synthetic womb.

But she has to deal with actual likely practical scenarios, and this guy is here right now and offering a baby the ordinary, straightforward way in just a few months' time.

I don't think it's a good idea. I just understand why she's so tempted and I think people are being incredibly glib about her options. This isn't a brainstorming exercise.

FactCheck

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Just what I was literally typing! I can relate to her situation as it's happened to me. Sadly, I can't have children now.

I'm so sorry

ABajaninCork wrote: »

It'll cost plenty. And not just money.

Just financially, it will probably cost her a big chunk of the house they're living in.