Celebrating 1916 in 2016

Slideshowbob

So in 7 years we will celebrate 100 years since or nation stood up for itself and those brave men strove for independence

any opinions on how to celebrate it?

passive

We could stage a bloody coup against our oppressive overlords, knowing full well we'd get slaughtered but willingly martyring ourselves. Oh, oh... But to make it even awesomer, to form the majority of our troops we'll rabble-rouse some gullible idealists, mostly working class, who don't know they're heading out to die. Let 'em think we can win! haha... silly peasants. I plan on going down in history!

Slideshowbob

1916 created our nation

It is part of our history

any chance of some intelligent input?

TOMASJ

Slideshowbob wrote: »

So in 7 years we will celebrate 100 years since or nation stood up for itself and those brave men strove for independence

any opinions on how to celebrate it?

finish the job they started and add the occupied six counties, then we really would have something to celebrate.

Grudaire

Slideshowbob wrote: »

So in 7 years we will celebrate 100 years since or nation stood up for itself and those brave men strove for independence

any opinions on how to celebrate it?

As Gaeilge?

Pádraig Anraí Mac Piarais would be proud.

Besides it would get rid of a lot of 'republicans' - ie bags of scum

Nodin

Slideshowbob wrote: »

So in 7 years we will celebrate 100 years since or nation stood up for itself and those brave men strove for independence

any opinions on how to celebrate it?

Big Parades in Dublin, Cork, and the larger towns. Make a decent movie of it maybe.

not yet

Sadly I think most of our people have forgotten what brought this nation into being.....

Whatever the celebrations are they should include family members of each or the men who signed the proclamation.

A big memorial wall with the name of every single man who died (gave their life) on it,placed somewhere prominent...not the fcuking arsEhole of nowhere.

jusk

They should turn Boland's Mill into some sort of museum. It's the biggest waste of space in the city.

Better still, get it back up and running as a biscuit factory.

Morpheus

not yet wrote: »

Sadly I think most of our people have forgotten what brought this nation into being.....

Whatever the celebrations are they should include family members of each or the men who signed the proclamation.

A big memorial wall with the name of every single man who died (gave their life) on it,placed somewhere prominent...not the fcuking arsEhole of nowhere.

How is Arbour Hill the ar$ehole of nowhere?

Theres a massive f*cking wall with the proclamation written on it and the signatories of those brave souls and the godsdamned gravestones in front ot it.

Its at the rear of the National Museum of Ireland, thats what, 5 minutes from the city centre, practically beside Hueston station, theres EVEN a luas stop there!!! And rightly so its quite a peaceful place to spend a few moments contemplating their sacrafices. Ive done 2 guards of honor there at Easter and its a far more moving experience than standing outside the GPO under all the spotlights cameras amid shouts of "Free State B@st@rds!" as we march past.

And keeping with the thread, yes there should be a massive parade in the major cities.

Maybe we could slice the 6 counties away with a massive saw and gently push them off into the atlantic, watching and fondly waving goodbye to all the trouble they caused, as Ulster bobs off into the sunset. Thatd be fun

LordSutch

The really Big Event in 2016 (regarding Irish loss of life) will be the commeration of the battle of the Somme, this is where my thoughts & my emotional allegiance will be that year. Thankfully the South is now grown up enough to accept the massive loss of life that was inflicted upon the Allied & German forces at the Somme in (1916), my emphasis being on the Great loss suffered by Irish men in particular ~ my Grandfather being among them.

Irish casualties in 1916 were truly terrible (death on an industrial scale) the likes of which Ireland had never seen before, and I'm not talking about the 'one hundred' or 'two hundred' Rebels who died in O'Connell St (Dublin) or in other parts of this Country, but the Tens of thousands of Irish men who fell on the Somme that very same year.

This post is not meant to 'knock' the memory of the Rebels, (if thats what most people want to commerate then so be it) I am just pointing out where the massive loss of Irish life happened in 1916 ..............

mountainyman

Camelot wrote: »

The really Big Event in 1916 (regarding Irish loss of life) will be the commeration of the battle of the Somme, this is where my thoughts & my emotional allegiance will be that year. Thankfully the South is now grown up enough to accept the massive loss of life that was inflicted upon the Allied & German forces at the Somme in (1916), my emphasis being on the Great loss suffered by Irish men in particular ~ my Grandfather being among them.

Irish casualties in 1916 were truly terrible (death on an industrial scale) the likes of which Ireland had never seen before, and I'm not talking about the 'one hundred' or 'two hundred' Rebels who died in O'Connell St (Dublin) or in other parts of this Country, but the Tens of thousands of Irish men who fell on the Somme that very same year.

This post is not meant to 'knock' the memory of the Rebels, (if thats what most people want to commerate then so be it) I am just pointing out where the massive loss of Irish life happened in 1916 ..............

The men who fought in Dublin in 1916 fought for Ireland. The men who fought on the Somme fought for the British Empire. That they died like cattle in the service of evil may bring a tear to the eye but their deaths were meaningless.

LordSutch

How sad.

partyguinness

Camelot wrote: »

The really Big Event in 1916 (regarding Irish loss of life) will be the commeration of the battle of the Somme, this is where my thoughts & my emotional allegiance will be that year. Thankfully the South is now grown up enough to accept the massive loss of life that was inflicted upon the Allied & German forces at the Somme in (1916), my emphasis being on the Great loss suffered by Irish men in particular ~ my Grandfather being among them.

Irish casualties in 1916 were truly terrible (death on an industrial scale) the likes of which Ireland had never seen before, and I'm not talking about the 'one hundred' or 'two hundred' Rebels who died in O'Connell St (Dublin) or in other parts of this Country, but the Tens of thousands of Irish men who fell on the Somme that very same year.

This post is not meant to 'knock' the memory of the Rebels, (if thats what most people want to commerate then so be it) I am just pointing out where the massive loss of Irish life happened in 1916 ..............

Fair enough but why that post here? This thread is about the 1916 Rising.

That is a whole different topic.

El Stuntman

by 2016 the country will be run by the IMF and the ECB so I don't see any point in planning 'independence' celebrations

mountainyman

Camelot wrote: »

How sad.

Yes it is very sad that so many young Irish men died like cows in a slaughterhouse in the service of an evil and genocidal empire. The role this country played in the British Empire is a national shame that we need to confront, make a mea culpa and move on from.

The fact that the Irish were the only effective troops on the first day of the battle just makes it sadder.

LordSutch

partyguinness wrote: »

Fair enough but why that post here? This thread is about the 1916 Rising.

That is a whole different topic.

OK, I shall butt-out of this topic ..................

partyguinness

Camelot wrote: »

OK, I shall butt-out of this topic ..................

Entirely up to you.

This thread is about the 1916 Rising.

If you wish to debate the Irish soldiers in the Somme then by all means start up a new thread. Otherwise this thread will degenerate into a "British Empire" bashing exercise.

It wasn't me!

How to celebrate?

Personally, I don't go for showy parades and television spectacles. Frankly, I think the rebels of 1916 were misguided and irresponsible and paved the way for a lot of unneccessary violence and suffering, and didn't achieve anything that wouldn't have been achieved peacefully.

That said however, I like bravery and appreciate it from all quarters, so I'll raise a quiet glass to a series of courageous men. Regardless of their politics, those who died in idealism have respect for that alone. So I'll be raising my glass to those who died in Dublin and in the Somme and everywhere else.

K4t

It wasn't me! wrote: »

How to celebrate?

Personally, I don't go for showy parades and television spectacles. Frankly, I think the rebels of 1916 were misguided and irresponsible and paved the way for a lot of unneccessary violence and suffering, and didn't achieve anything that wouldn't have been achieved peacefully.
.

I disagree, Redmond never got anywhere. It was the 1916 rebels who set off the physical force nationalism and without the War of Independence (Collins), we would never be a Republic today. However, I think Brugha and De Valera were misguided in rejecting the Treaty.

It was Collins' 'Step by Step' theory that made Ireland a Republic.

How to celebrate: Knock down that f**king spire and erect a statue of Padraig Pearse reading the proclomation and an Irish flag.

José Alaninho

K4t wrote: »

Knock down that f**king spire and erect a statue of Padraig Pearse reading the proclomation and an Irish flag.

+10

Thomas_S_Hunterson

A jolly big piss-up is in order IMO.

José Alaninho

I my personal opinion, if a United Ireland has not been achieved by 2016 then we should not celebrate it at all. Anything other than the Republic they envisioned (politically, socially and economically) is merely lip-service to the sacrifices of the men and women of 1916.

View Profile

They should re-enact the scenes outside the GPO using actors in costume complete with pyrotechnic explosions and gunfire.

That would be cool!:D

K4t

José Alaninho wrote: »

I my personal opinion, if a United Ireland has not been achieved by 2016 then we should not celebrate it at all. Anything other than the Republic they envisioned (politically, socially and economically) is merely lip-service to the sacrifices of the men and women of 1916.

A United Ireland was/is never going to happen. Simple as that. However, it was the bravery of the 1916 rebels that got us where we are today. They started it off. Home Rule was getting us nowhere and they decided to take action. They're courage and bravery led to the Treaty and the Republic we have today. They did achieve something. But nobody could have achieved a United Ireland.

murphaph

K4t wrote: »

How to celebrate: Knock down that f**king spire and erect a statue of Padraig Pearse reading the proclomation and an Irish flag.

Of all the rebels, Pearse was the biggest knob.

At least the others weren't totaly intent on martyrdom. Pearse was no better than an islamist terrorist.

If (and I believe it will happen) there are to be celebrations I'd prefer if they were commemorations for all those that died, particularly the inncocent Dubliners caught up in the whole thing, but including the rebels and army/policemen who died during the fighting.

It would be entirely appropriate to commemorate the Somme at the same time given the similar profiles of those men who persished. A very sad year all round was 1916.

Yes we got our republic and look how well we run it

It wasn't me!

K4t wrote: »

I disagree, Redmond never got anywhere. It was the 1916 rebels who set off the physical force nationalism and without the War of Independence (Collins), we would never be a Republic today. However, I think Brugha and De Valera were misguided in rejecting the Treaty.

It was Collins' 'Step by Step' theory that made Ireland a Republic.

How to celebrate: Knock down that f**king spire and erect a statue of Padraig Pearse reading the proclomation and an Irish flag.

I strongly disagree. The Home Rule Act was already on the statute books and was to be enforced at the close of the war in Europe. Physical force nationalism was not necessary. The war of independence was equally unnecessary as without the ramifications of the violence of 1916, a peaceful path would have been pursued in the aftermath of the war. As regards not being a republic now? Firstly, escalating violence prompted the Government of Ireland Act 1920 which caused the partition of the north, meaning when the negotiations took place in London, it was absolutely out of the question that the north would be conceded, because it would not be legally possible without the acquiescence of their parliament at Stormont; therefore the war of independence, leading from the rising in 1916, is responsible for partition as we know it now. Then of course, the British empire crumbled in the aftermath of the two wars. There was never any question that it could remain as it was financially destitute and morale was low, an easy time for countries to leave the empire with the minimum of fuss. Had a peaceful political path been followed at this point, it would have been economically a good time to propose a secession from the empire and would have been far more acceptable to the British administration than at any other stage, and we could have easily avoided the problem of partition as without an arms race and escalation of forces, hostilities wouldn't have mounted to such an extent as they did. So, if you ask me, it would have been far more expedient to pursue a course of peaceful political action, which would have avoided partition and led to probably a unified free state in the twenties and a completely separate republic in much the same timeframe as the the southern parts of the island declared a republic. Violence, in this case, was only a hindrance to the aims of those who practised it.

roadwars

1916 should not be celebrated as it was an act of terrorism. At the time the majority of Dubliners would have agreed with this, don’t forget only years before they were waving the union jack during the visit of the king, and the mocked the prisoners as they were paraded down the street.
All that you will be celebrating is that the British army over reacted by shooting the rebels.
Save the celebrations for a more worth while event.

FTA69

Morphéus wrote: »

Maybe we could slice the 6 counties away with a massive saw and gently push them off into the atlantic, watching and fondly waving goodbye to all the trouble they caused, as Ulster bobs off into the sunset. Thatd be fun

This coming from the man who says he does guards of honour over the remains of those who fought and died for a 32 County Republic. Disgraceful.

pablomakaveli

roadwars wrote: »

1916 should not be celebrated as it was an act of terrorism. At the time the majority of Dubliners would have agreed with this, don’t forget only years before they were waving the union jack during the visit of the king, and the mocked the prisoners as they were paraded down the street.
All that you will be celebrating is that the British army over reacted by shooting the rebels.
Save the celebrations for a more worth while event.

Thats complete crap tbh. The rising is important because it was when the republic was proclaimed. It was a direct confrontation with the british forces and not delibratly attacking random civilians which is more in line with a terrorist act. Some of the countries future leaders participated (ie de Valera, Collins etc) people who might have never risen to prominence otherwise. And it led to many people in Ireland becoming firm supporters of an Irish republic.

Home rule may have happened, it may not. If it had we would have been still subservient to the british rather than a free nation of equal footing.

It wasn't me!

FTA69 wrote: »

This coming from the man who says he does guards of honour over the remains of those who fought and died for a 32 County Republic. Disgraceful.

The army is apolitical.

TOMASJ

roadwars wrote: »

1916 should not be celebrated as it was an act of terrorism. At the time the majority of Dubliners would have agreed with this, don’t forget only years before they were waving the union jack during the visit of the king, and the mocked the prisoners as they were paraded down the street.
All that you will be celebrating is that the British army over reacted by shooting the rebels.
Save the celebrations for a more worth while event.

Agree with a lot of this (the Jackeen waving their butchers aprons for brit royalty and spitting on those heroes) and how the 1916 fighters were classed as terriosts by the same type of client that would have called those who carried on the fight the PIRA terrorists,

Save the celebrations for a more worth while event

As I said on post 4,the job they started is only half done, we should celebrate when it is finished.

It wasn't me!

TOMASJ wrote: »

the 1916 fighters were classed as terriosts by the same type of client that would have called those who carried on the fight the PIRA terrorists,

As I said on post 4,the job they started is only half done, we should celebrate when it is finished.

Eh, the PIRA were terrorists in the most absolute sense, and to say anything else is to lie, blatantly. It's not a matter of opinion, they were terrorists.

José Alaninho

One man's terrorist = another man's freedom fighter. All a matter of perspective and opinion. In your opinion the PIRA were terrorists. In my opinion they were a guerrilla army defending the nationalist people of the 6 counties from Loyalist / State violence who sought to end the injustice of the failed Northern statelet by reunifying the country. Were their methods at times questionable, at times condemnable? Yes. Were they justified in using armed force against the foreign army present on their soil? Also yes. The PIRA are not the issue here however; we are discussing 1916 I believe.

It wasn't me!

José Alaninho wrote: »

One man's terrorist = another man's freedom fighter. All a matter of perspective and opinion. In your opinion the PIRA were terrorists. In my opinion they were a guerrilla army defending the nationalist people of the 6 counties from Loyalist / State violence who sought to end the injustice of the failed Northern statelet by reunifying the country. Were their methods at times questionable, at times condemnable? Yes. Were they justified in using armed force against the foreign army present on their soil? Also yes.

Their tactics make them terrorists. Nobody can legitimately deny that the PIRA were a terrorist force, bu virtue of the methods they employed.

José Alaninho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Their tactics make them terrorists. Nobody can legitimately deny that the PIRA were a terrorist force, bu virtue of the methods they employed.

If you want to play semantics than yes, they were 'terrorists' in that they sought to end British rule by 'terrorising' the British government into leaving. My point was more about their justification doing so.

But, again, in discussing the Provos we're way off topic here.

ejmaztec

It would be better to just visit the cemetery and listen to them all turning in their graves.

CCCP^

It will be interesting to see the contrast, though it won't be apparent and definetly won't be commented on by the media, of the differences between the ideals of the young Republic against the reality of modern post-celtic tiger Ireland. Biiiiiig difference boys and girls.

FTA69

The army is apolitical.

What's that got to do with anything? He's the one calling for "massive parades" in the city to commemorate people whose ideals he is completely misrepresenting by calling for a fifth of the national territory to be "cut off with a saw". It's just a plainly thick position to be honest.

Their tactics make them terrorists. Nobody can legitimately deny that the PIRA were a terrorist force, bu virtue of the methods they employed.

Sure a terrorist defined by the dictionary is someone who uses violence to achieve a political aim, which would therefore mean everyone who ever picked up a gun is a terrorist. It's a perjorative and loaded term which can be twisted any way.

TOMASJ

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Eh, the PIRA were terrorists in the most absolute sense, and to say anything else is to lie, blatantly. It's not a matter of opinion, they were terrorists.

A question for, It wasn't me!
do you think the IRA men who fought against the british in 1916 were terriosts,
would you refer to the british Army's Parachute regiment and the SAS and their surrogates in the various loyalist groups as terrorist,
as the methods they employed were not dissimilar to what the IRA used,

A lot of people would call the Israel Army and the US Army not to mention there political masters terrorists,

others like yourself think otherwise

hideous ape

murphaph wrote: »

Yes we got our republic and look how well we run it

I'd rather live in a backward, piss-poor, badly run, corrupt third world but free nation than live in a rich enslaved nation to the British Empire. Better to die on my field than on a field I'm renting from some foreign government. People who go on about the EU been no different...well the difference is we can leave the EU if the people ever want to. To get out of the British Empire required 1916!

Most people supported the British because that was the order of society at the time. Just as the Scottish and Welsh had also accepted their lot. The ordinary person on the street could not comprehend that "we" the "simple paddies", could actually run our own country. The people had to be lead...hence 1916!

I for one celebrate Easter 1916 every year and to me 2016 should be a huge celebration. It's embarassing that we don't even have a National Day of Independence...most other countries do. The French celebrate Bastille Day, an event that led to the murder of an estimated 18,000 people or more. Our independence was not achieved at Easter 1916, it took centuries before 1916 and is still been achieved to this day. It is however a date to hold up in recognition of everything that led to us been a *partly* free nation.

I'm glad that none of us today have to make the same decisions as the men and woman of 1916. So the greatest celebration we can do for them is to finish what they started by unifying this country but using peaceful, democratic means. The gun has finally been taken out of Irish politics, it's time the British made some long term decisions about the Six counties.

It wasn't me!

TOMASJ wrote: »

A question for, It wasn't me!
do you think the IRA men who fought against the british in 1916 were terriosts,
would you refer to the british Army's Parachute regiment and the SAS and their surrogates in the various loyalist groups as terrorist,
as the methods they employed were not dissimilar to what the IRA used,

A lot of people would call the Israel Army and the US Army not to mention there political masters terrorists,

others like yourself think otherwise

Rebels in 1916: Not terrorists. Militarily useless insurgents who ended up costing several hundred civilians their lives, but not deliberately. Wrong, not terrorists in any real sense.

Paras: Again, not really. One tragic incident, about which the truth still hasn't entirely come out, and may never do, in which civilians were shot, but without further clarification on what happened and why, it would be unfair to call them terrorists. (Much more fair to question why the British installed the Paras, a hardened combat unit, in such a situation, and their motives.)

SAS: No, surgical strikes on the IRA are absolutely fair game. Probably the best move in British dealings in Northern Ireland was to deploy their special forces. If the IRA wanted to claim it was a legitimate war, they had to accept that they then became legitimate tactical targets, and couldn't revert to civilians when confronted by armed men.

Loyalist paramilitaries in the north? Absolutely terrorists, every bit as bad as the IRA. Collusion (which definitely occurred, but on nothing like the scale some people seem to think) was despicable. Ultimately, when there's no means to an end but violence, I'll support that violence. If there's an alternative, and people just want to jump to violence, then I've no time for them and utterly condemn that violence and those people.

And for the record, a lot of people would be absolutely wrong about the Israeli and US Armies.

norrie_1001

I think 1916 should not be celebrated.

What we should be celebrating is the 6th of December 1922, the day this country became officially independent.

That date has never been celebrated and in 2022, the country will be independent for 100 years, surely this has to be noted.

Grudaire

norrie_1001 wrote: »

What we should be celebrating is the 6th of December 1922, the day this country became officially independent.

The obvious answer is what about the North, but i think a better question is 'what about the ports?' they stayed far from independent right up to just before the Second World War...

sceptre

Cliste wrote: »

The obvious answer is what about the North, but i think a better question is 'what about the ports?' they stayed far from independent right up to just before the Second World War...

I'm sure we could have a special mass on the edges of Cobh, Lough Swilly and Castletownbere on 19 May 2038.

Other countries don't tend to regard the continued presence of a military base held by their former masters as a sovereign exception on their territory as a reason to defer their independence day celebrations.

gurramok

It wasn't me! wrote: »

I strongly disagree. The Home Rule Act was already on the statute books and was to be enforced at the close of the war in Europe. Physical force nationalism was not necessary. The war of independence was equally unnecessary as without the ramifications of the violence of 1916, a peaceful path would have been pursued in the aftermath of the war. As regards not being a republic now? Firstly, escalating violence prompted the Government of Ireland Act 1920 which caused the partition of the north, meaning when the negotiations took place in London, it was absolutely out of the question that the north would be conceded, because it would not be legally possible without the acquiescence of their parliament at Stormont; therefore the war of independence, leading from the rising in 1916, is responsible for partition as we know it now. Then of course, the British empire crumbled in the aftermath of the two wars. There was never any question that it could remain as it was financially destitute and morale was low, an easy time for countries to leave the empire with the minimum of fuss. Had a peaceful political path been followed at this point, it would have been economically a good time to propose a secession from the empire and would have been far more acceptable to the British administration than at any other stage, and we could have easily avoided the problem of partition as without an arms race and escalation of forces, hostilities wouldn't have mounted to such an extent as they did. So, if you ask me, it would have been far more expedient to pursue a course of peaceful political action, which would have avoided partition and led to probably a unified free state in the twenties and a completely separate republic in much the same timeframe as the the southern parts of the island declared a republic. Violence, in this case, was only a hindrance to the aims of those who practised it.

I strongly disagree with you

Home rule was on the cards if i remember correctly from history for 44 years before 1916 occurred. It was promised by successful British govts through generations.
At each election, the nationalists won and had a mandate for home rule but this was ignored.
What it boiled down to was the trust of the British govt was lost through their own fault. Patience ran out for the nationalists and they saw an opportunity.
There was no guarantee that Home Rule be implemented after WW1 as the Unionists vehemently opposed it as well as the trust issue. So there would of been a civil war anyway with the Unionists if it went through.

roadwars wrote:

1916 should not be celebrated as it was an act of terrorism. At the time the majority of Dubliners would have agreed with this, don’t forget only years before they were waving the union jack during the visit of the king, and the mocked the prisoners as they were paraded down the street.
All that you will be celebrating is that the British army over reacted by shooting the rebels.
Save the celebrations for a more worth while event.

You are twisting history with that post. It was not terrorism.

Successive Dublin elections before 1916 showed a vast majority of Dubliners supported Nationalism a breakaway state in whatever form.
Those Dubliners waving Union flags were the minority of English stock that once lived mostly in southern suburbs like Ballsbridge/Rathmines/Booterstown/Dun Laoghaire and hence left the country after independence. (you can check the national archives for this)

sink

What should we really be celebrating? Those brave souls who died in 1916 helped replace the tyranny of an oligarchical minority with a theocratic majority! There was very little in the way of increased quality of life or freedom for the original free state was an isolationist socialist theocracy where the will of church and state being one and the same were absolute and dissension was not tolerated. Frankly the 1916 rising and proceeding war of independence left a lot to be desired.

It wasn't me!

gurramok wrote: »

I strongly disagree with you

Home rule was on the cards if i remember correctly from history for 44 years before 1916 occurred. It was promised by successful British govts through generations.

The all-important difference, of course, is that the legislation was in fact passed in 1914.

gurramok

It wasn't me! wrote: »

The all-important difference, of course, is that the legislation was in fact passed in 1914.

Do you honestly think that would have been implemented without conditions?

They attempted to give Home Rule on one condition in 1918, extend conscription to Ireland.

It wasn't me!

gurramok wrote: »

Do you honestly think that would have been implemented without conditions?

They attempted to give Home Rule on one condition in 1918, extend conscription to Ireland.

Do you honestly think hundreds of dead civilian non-combatants to achieve a partitioned state in much the same timeline is better? Serious answer please. Do you think hundreds dead for a lesser achievement is the more desirable path?

José Alaninho

It wasn't me! wrote: »

Do you honestly think hundreds of dead civilian non-combatants to achieve a partitioned state in much the same timeline is better? Serious answer please. Do you think hundreds dead for a lesser achievement is the more desirable path?

Do you honestly think that a 32 county Republic was possible through Home Rule, not forgetting the little problem of UNIONISM and its entrenched anti-Irish, anti-freedom, bigotry? Partition was inevitable, it was always going to happen, armed force was the only option left to try and end it, and even that did not succeed. Home Rule was merely giving the natives the allowance of a puppet parliament so they could be seen to be managing their own affairs, while at the same time making no difference to Ireland's part in the empire. And, by the time the empire collapsed in the early 60's British rule would have been so entrenched here as to leave us in the same position as Scotland and Wales, with the added millstone of significant loyalist numbers which would have made partition, if not even actual separation, impossible.

monosharp

Celebrate what exactly ?

If its celebrating the last time some Irish people stood up for themselves against the foreign ruler then OK.

It its celebrating our "independence" and our "country" then I'd rather spend the time watching re-runs of glenroe.

We got our country, at least most of it, and what did we do with it ? Look at the country, the culture and the government we have today. If any of the people who actually fought and died for that cause were around today they'd be so ashamed they'd wish they never bothered.

Honestly, look at our "politicians", you need to go to the deepest darkest swamp in Africa to find diseased scum like them and I mean every single solitary one of them.

Look at our "culture", 90% of it an exact copy of British culture. Tracksuit knackers walking the streets doing what they please to who they please. Fat drunks walking around with Man Utd jerseys.

Look at our "police", the most useless crowd of eejits in uniform the world has ever seen. Honestly, anyone even remotely familiar with police forces in REAL country's know that they actually DO serve and protect the public. I presently live in the middle of a city in the middle of a metropolitan area, population 23 million. You can walk anywhere any time of the day or night and NEVER get harrassed, theres no knackers standing on street corners asking you for a "light bud".

Look at our economy. Needs no explanation.

Look at our mindset. Greedy, grabbing, selfish bastards the lot of us and the worst thing is, when one of us gets into power or money by been a greedy, grabbing selfish bastard he is now above us. Average Joe gets **** on but Average Joe wants to become the guy taking the ****, he doesn't want to change the system, he wants to get higher up the food chain.