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Keep The Sabbath day holy

  • 02-07-2011 11:55am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,924
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    With the recent talk of people on low pay getting their premiums cut.

    Sunday is being treated like any other day by government & business.

    But many are required to work Sundays.

    Workers are very often given no choice but to work on Sundays.

    Where does religion stand with regards the Sabbath day?


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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,686 PDN
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    It's difficult to say where 'religion' stands since all religions (and religious people) are different.

    The Jewish religion observes the Sabbath Day (Saturday) along with a lot of other Old Testament commandments.

    The Christian religion purports to follow the New Testament which clearly states: "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day." (Colossians 2:16).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,267 gimmebroadband
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    The Church recognizes that legitimate reasons excuse from this obligation. The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) explains, “Family needs or important social service can legitimately excuse from the obligation of Sunday rest. The faithful should see to it that legitimate excuses do not lead to habits prejudicial to religion, family life, and health” (CCC 2185).

    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a3.htm


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,768 Manach
    Mod ✭✭✭✭


    Outside religion, I reckon for a stake-holder democracy it is important to hold one day which can be set aside for family and for meeting with fellow members of the community to discuss matters.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,924 Cork
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    I agree that Sunday is special.

    But many are now compelled to work on Sundays.

    Government/business see it like any other day.

    Workers are never asked if they have any objections to work Sunday.

    While, I find fault with the atitude of business and government with regards Sunday - I find it hard to fault workers - many who have no choice.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,587 Pace2008
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    From a business point of view, Sunday is not special and is indeed like any other day. It's up to the employee to request the day off it if their faith requires it, and if that means they are not the most suitable candidate for the job as a result, then such is business.

    Refer to gimmebroadband's quotation from the Catholic Catechism (which applies to the majority of Christians in Ireland) anyway. It seems the Church accepts certain reasons for not recognising Sunday as a day of rest.

    In any case, the majority of people work a Mon-Fri week and have Sunday off anyway.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,055 Onesimus
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    Pace2008 wrote: »
    From a business point of view, Sunday is not special and is indeed like any other day. It's up to the employee to request the day off it if their faith requires it, and if that means they are not the most suitable candidate for the job as a result, then such is business.

    Refer to gimmebroadband's quotation from the Catholic Catechism (which applies to the majority of Christians in Ireland) anyway. It seems the Church accepts certain reasons for not recognising Sunday as a day of rest.

    In any case, the majority of people work a Mon-Fri week and have Sunday off anyway.

    Point 1: Such is discrimination.


    Point 2: The Church does not accept people NOT recognising Sunday as a day of rest. All Catholics are to recognise Sunday as a day of rest. But the para of the Catechism is only giving leave to those who have exerted themselves in doing their best to try and get Sunday off but failed and must work that day to keep their family alive.

    Any employer who refuses a person to have the Sunday off when he requests it, is breaking the law and is discriminating. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    Onesimus


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,980 wolfsbane
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    Cork wrote: »
    With the recent talk of people on low pay getting their premiums cut.

    Sunday is being treated like any other day by government & business.

    But many are required to work Sundays.

    Workers are very often given no choice but to work on Sundays.

    Where does religion stand with regards the Sabbath day?
    I can't say what most religions hold, but Judaism and Islam hold a seventh day Sabbath (as far as I know) and most of Christianity holds the first day of the week (Sunday) as either the Sabbath or somehow special. Normal work, other than deeds of necessity and mercy, are not to be done on the Sabbath.

    Those Christians (like myself) who hold Sunday to be special, but not the Sabbath, would still prefer not to work on it. This is to be able to meet with our fellow Christians to worship God, and for the social benefits of a common day off for families.

    ***************************************************************************
    1 Corinthians 16:1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given orders to the churches of Galatia, so you must do also: 2 On the first day of the week let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when I come.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,878 Robert ninja
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    It's not practical or useful to stop anything just because it's Sunday, that's why people don't care. Can you imagine if everyone didn't work on sunday... it would cause so much trouble. It's just one of those religious things that no longer has any relevance to modern day living.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,055 Onesimus
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    It's not practical or useful to stop anything just because it's Sunday, that's why people don't care. Can you imagine if everyone didn't work on sunday... it would cause so much trouble. It's just one of those religious things that no longer has any relevance to modern day living.


    Claiming that ''if'' we were all to have Sundays off would cause so much trouble without evidence to prove your theory is silly. It means you've just conjured up in your mind a belief with no evidence for it and lo and behold used your gift of ''faith'' to believe in your own theory/fantasy tale. :confused:

    More proof that atheists do practice a little ''faith'' every now and again. They just are always putting it in the wrong direction.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    It's not practical or useful to stop anything just because it's Sunday, that's why people don't care. Can you imagine if everyone didn't work on sunday... it would cause so much trouble. It's just one of those religious things that no longer has any relevance to modern day living.

    Regardless of your beliefs, Sunday is still a great family day.
    If you want to throw that away to spite yourself, work away.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 Zombrex
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    Onesimus wrote: »
    Any employer who refuses a person to have the Sunday off when he requests it, is breaking the law and is discriminating. Correct me if I'm wrong.

    How is it discrimination? Can a non-Catholic demand Wednesday off work?

    Sunday work is actually given special place in Irish labour law because of our Christian heritage, if you work Sundays you are entitled to special benefits that you don't get working other days.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 Zombrex
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    Regardless of your beliefs, Sunday is still a great family day.
    If you want to throw that away to spite yourself, work away.

    Tell that to the person who's family is in India and they are more than happy to get the extra hours to send money back to them. :)

    The reality is that if people really don't want to work Sundays they can probably find jobs to accommodate this. But a lot of people do wish to work Sundays, particularly if they have other days of the week that they would rather have time off.

    It is far more important that we protect laws that limit the amount of time a person can work in a row, rather than worry about protecting a particular day simply because one particular religion views it as important. If a non-Christian wants to work Sundays, so long as they have their time off protected and are given suitable rest time, who are Christians to say that they shouldn't be able to do that because to the Christian Sunday is holly.

    As PDN points out Christians shouldn't even be getting hung up about Old Testament traditions like the Sabbath.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    Wicknight wrote: »
    Tell that to the person who's family is in India and they are more than happy to get the extra hours to send money back to them. :)

    The reality is that if people really don't want to work Sundays they can probably find jobs to accommodate this. But a lot of people do wish to work Sundays, particularly if they have other days of the week that they would rather have time off.

    It is far more important that we protect laws that limit the amount of time a person can work in a row, rather than worry about protecting a particular day simply because one particular religion views it as important. If a non-Christian wants to work Sundays, so long as they have their time off protected and are given suitable rest time, who are Christians to say that they shouldn't be able to do that because to the Christian Sunday is holly.

    As PDN points out Christians shouldn't even be getting hung up about Old Testament traditions like the Sabbath.

    My point has nothing to do with religion, hence the Labour laws and trade agreements about Sunday working etc. You can dissolve Sundays and Sunday working allowances if you like, and make it the same as every other day in the week regarding sporting events etc., greedy employers will be delighted ,and then it will be rare that family will be off on the same day for activities etc., but as I said, work away, it will be your own loss in the long run.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,568 candy-gal1
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    I get Sundays off, its the reiligous hoilday of maximum occupancy :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 Zombrex
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    My point has nothing to do with religion, hence the Labour laws and trade agreements about Sunday working etc.

    Yes but why Sunday. Why not Monday or Wednesday? It is Sunday because of Christian tradition, a tradition that means little to someone who isn't Christian.
    You can dissolve Sundays and Sunday working allowances if you like, and make it the same as every other day in the week regarding sporting events etc., greedy employers will be delighted ,and then it will be rare that family will be off on the same day for activities etc., but as I said, work away, it will be your own loss in the long run.

    That doesn't make any sense. Sunday working allowances are for people who work on Sunday, dissolving them (which I wasn't calling for by the way) wouldn't have any effect on the family being off on the same day for activities.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,091 furiousox
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    Onesimus wrote: »
    ...It means you've just conjured up in your mind a belief with no evidence for it and lo and behold used your gift of ''faith'' to believe in your own theory

    Oh the irony......:D

    CPL 593H



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    Wicknight wrote: »
    Yes but why Sunday. Why not Monday or Wednesday? It is Sunday because of Christian tradition, a tradition that means little to someone who isn't Christian.

    That doesn't make any sense. Sunday working allowances are for people who work on Sunday, dissolving them (which I wasn't calling for by the way) wouldn't have any effect on the family being off on the same day for activities.

    You don't have to be Christian to enjoy a nice Sunday family day / sporting events day. If you want everyone to change it to Wednesdays or Mondays, be my guest to start a campaign. Knock yourself out.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 Zombrex
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    You don't have to be Christian to enjoy a nice Sunday family day / sporting events day.

    No you don't, but equally you don't need Christianity telling you to do that on Sunday. It is up to the employer and the employee to work out what days to work, not for the Christian church to dictate it to everyone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    Wicknight wrote: »
    No you don't, but equally you don't need Christianity telling you to do that on Sunday. It is up to the employer and the employee to work out what days to work, not for the Christian church to dictate it to everyone.

    Most people are off work on a Sunday. So what day of the week, do you suggest should we all move to for sporting events, family days, community events etc. ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 Zombrex
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    Most people are off work on a Sunday. So what day of the week, do you suggest should we all move to for sporting events, family days, community events etc. ?

    What ever day the person works out with his employer that suits him and his family best, obviously.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    Wicknight wrote: »
    What ever day the person works out with his employer that suits him and his family best, obviously.

    But different family members work with different employers.
    Also what day are you proposing to move the large Sunday sporting and community events etc. to ? Ever wonder why they are on a Sunday ? - The largest number of people are off on a Sunday.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,686 PDN
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    But different family members work with different employers.
    Also what day are you proposing to move the large Sunday sporting and community events etc. to ? Ever wonder why they are on a Sunday ? - The largest number of people are off on a Sunday.

    Those would be the same large Sunday sporting events that oblige thousands of people to work on a Sunday? :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 401 Bob Cratchet
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    PDN wrote: »
    Those would be the same large Sunday sporting events that oblige thousands of people to work on a Sunday? :)

    What % would be working ?
    What's the problem with working on a Sunday if you have to ?
    You get a nice shift allowance for the inconvenience.


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