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Suspended Sentences

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  • 27-05-2011 9:35pm
    #1
    Shelflife
    Registered Users Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭


    Whats the point of a suspended sentence?

    Ive noticed lately that a number of fraud/theft cases have resulted in the above. in one case where €170000 was defrauded from their employee the judge couldnt see what benefit could accure from a jail sentence.

    If all i face if im caught is a suspended sentence surely thats sending a message that its worth my while committing a crime.


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    #2
    Chnandler Bong
    Closed Accounts Posts: 572 ✭✭✭Chnandler Bong


    A suspended sentence is for low risk offenders, say you get a 12 month suspended sentence, you walk out a free man but if you so much as look at someone the wrong way your going to jail


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    #3
    end a eknny
    Closed Accounts Posts: 646 ✭✭✭end a eknny


    Chnandler Bong wrote: »
    A suspended sentence is for low risk offenders, say you get a 12 month suspended sentence, you walk out a free man but if you so much as look at someone the wrong way your going to jail
    if you get caught. it still means you can offend in the knowledge that there wont be any reprecussions


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    #4
    bath handle
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 370 ✭✭bath handle


    A major factor in that case ostensibly that the stolen money will be paid back. The guy has a condition for a criminal offence of dishonesty. He has lost his job and been disgraced. Putting him in jail could well result in some violent offender being released early. Who would you prefer to sit beside on the bus? A crazed rapist or a harmless middle aged pensioner?


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    #5
    end a eknny
    Closed Accounts Posts: 646 ✭✭✭end a eknny


    bath handle wrote: »
    A major factor in that case ostensibly that the stolen money will be paid back. The guy has a condition for a criminal offence of dishonesty. He has lost his job and been disgraced. Putting him in jail could well result in some violent offender being released early. Who would you prefer to sit beside on the bus? A crazed rapist or a harmless middle aged pensioner?
    surely we should make enough space for both. but surely the biggest anomoly in the legal system is the bail laws as offences commited while on bail are usually lumped in with the original crime and the offenders dont receive any extra time sure thats a license to commit crime


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    #6
    Shelflife
    Registered Users Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭Shelflife


    bath handle wrote: »
    A major factor in that case ostensibly that the stolen money will be paid back. The guy has a condition for a criminal offence of dishonesty. He has lost his job and been disgraced. Putting him in jail could well result in some violent offender being released early. Who would you prefer to sit beside on the bus? A crazed rapist or a harmless middle aged pensioner?

    But hes not harmless, had that being a small business instead of the govt he could have closed it down with the resulting hardship for all the owners and other employees.

    hes paying it back because he was caught, no other reason.

    If we dont hve enough jail places then proper community service for a long time should be the order.

    We need a deterrent, at the moment all we have is a slap on the wrist -dont do it again mentality from the judicary. where is the punishment for the crime? losing your job but keeping your great pension? if you are late every day you lose your job, i think that stealing €170k is slightly worse than that , yet he effectively gets off scott free.

    we need proper sentencing that will make people think twice about committing a crime. At the moment the two incidents this week would make people think about actually committing a crime because the downside is minimal.


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    #7
    bath handle
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 370 ✭✭bath handle


    By harmless i mean his current disposition to cause harm
    in terms of meriting leniency he ticked all of the boxes.
    First offence.
    Early admission of guilt.
    Co operation with investigation.
    Victim repaid.
    Extremely low likelihood of re-offending.

    The judge can't make more prison spaces.

    How many Civil Servants are now going to fiddle as a result of this? The same ner as if the guy got 20 years!


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    #8
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    end a eknny wrote: »
    if you get caught. it still means you can offend in the knowledge that there wont be any reprecussions

    you mean other than the activation of your custodial term?


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    #9
    end a eknny
    Closed Accounts Posts: 646 ✭✭✭end a eknny


    Seanbeag1 wrote: »
    you mean other than the activation of your custodial term?
    try reading the whole thing next time


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    #10
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    end a eknny wrote: »
    try reading the whole thing next time

    I did. You said a person could offend without worrying about the consequences. Not only do they have to worry about their suspended sentence being activated but also the addition of any time for their new crime,


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    #11
    charlemont
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    Chnandler Bong wrote: »
    A suspended sentence is for low risk offenders, say you get a 12 month suspended sentence, you walk out a free man but if you so much as look at someone the wrong way your going to jail

    Last bit is wrong, You could be still on a suspended sentence for a serious crime like Assault but if you got arrested for a relatively minor offence like Abusive Threatening and Insulting Behaviour you will still go to court and be sentenced for that offence, Its up to the judge what to do with the suspended sentence..

    People can be sentenced to, say 4 Years with 2 suspended for 2 Yrs on completion of sentence so therefore he has to do 2 Yrs inside which will be 1 Yr and 6 months with Remission and then the remaining 2Yr suspended will be in effect for 2 Yrs.


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    #12
    Shelflife
    Registered Users Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭Shelflife


    So would it be fair to say that seeing as i have a clean slate, it would be worth my while to defraud / steal from my employer/insurance co/state up to €200k secure in the knowledge that i will get away with it????

    And thats only if i get caught!


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    #13
    Naikon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭Naikon


    Shelflife wrote: »
    So would it be fair to say that seeing as i have a clean slate, it would be worth my while to defraud / steal from my employer/insurance co/state up to €200k secure in the knowledge that i will get away with it????

    And thats only if i get caught!

    How would you explain the criminal record though? That is basically a life sentance when it comes to the possibility of getting a job in the future. I would be FAR more worried about that then a paltry 12-24 month sentance.


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    #14
    bath handle
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 370 ✭✭bath handle


    Shelflife wrote: »
    So would it be fair to say that seeing as i have a clean slate, it would be worth my while to defraud / steal from my employer/insurance co/state up to €200k secure in the knowledge that i will get away with it????

    And thats only if i get caught!

    Only if you are in a position to pay back The money if caught. There is no way of knowing when it might be discovered. You are also running the risk that the judge you come before might see things differently.


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    #15
    Shelflife
    Registered Users Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭Shelflife


    Naikon wrote: »
    How would you explain the criminal record though? That is basically a life sentance when it comes to the possibility of getting a job in the future. I would be FAR more worried about that then a paltry 12-24 month sentance.

    true but apart from the stigma attached there is no penalty attached to the crime in these cases, its still effectively a slap on the wrists.

    There seems to be no deterrent to crime in this country, we seriously need to up our punishments handed out to criminals.


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    #16
    Resend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 292 ✭✭Resend


    A suspended sentence is a joke


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    #17
    bath handle
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 370 ✭✭bath handle


    The old suspended sentence was no joke.


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    #18
    Resend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 292 ✭✭Resend


    bath handle wrote: »
    The old suspended sentence was no joke.
    lol could be hardc to laugh....;)


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    #19
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Resend wrote: »
    A suspended sentence is a joke

    Not really. For a first time offender with a low chance of reoffending it provides incentive to stay on the right track.


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    #20
    BMRising
    Registered Users Posts: 48 ✭BMRising


    end a eknny wrote: »
    surely we should make enough space for both. but surely the biggest anomoly in the legal system is the bail laws as offences commited while on bail are usually lumped in with the original crime and the offenders dont receive any extra time sure thats a license to commit crime

    Not true. The judge must impose consecutive sentences (i.e. one on top of the other) if a further offence is committed while on bail. This is provided for by statute and the judge has no discretion.


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