ReMapping Advice needed

Bandara

Hi all,

Am considering getting my car remapped, its a 3 ltr TDI and gains are just over 15% more BHP and 20% more torque.

What I would like advice on is any potential damage to the vehicle as a result of these increases on 'workload' of the engine etc ? I am not mechanical in any way but am nervous that it will result in excessive wear and tear on seals etc. The only opinions I can find are the companies who sell this service and I take them with pinch of salt obviously. I'd love the opinions of any mechanics.

The company I am considering doing it are very reputable and it will be a standard ECU remap, nothing excessive.

Thanks for any help or opinion.


(p.s. I am not at all concerned about the effect on any warranty)

Tragedy

It 100% depends on the car.

Some cars come with gearboxes that can barely handle the torque put through them at stock, some come with ones that can handle an extra 50BHP.

Same with clutch and engine.

Bandara

Tragedy wrote: »

It 100% depends on the car.

Some cars come with gearboxes that can barely handle the torque put through them at stock, some come with ones that can handle an extra 50BHP.

Same with clutch and engine.

probably a stupid question: but if its an automatic does that matter?

Neilw

I would do an extra oil service between the standard service, i.e every 6k miles or so. Don't drive hard for the first 10mins or so until the oil (not coolant) comes up to operating temp. Also let the car idle for a few mins after a drive to allow the tutbo to cool down so it dosen't bake the oil in the turbo.

Other then that the car should be fine

Gumbo

Hammertime wrote: »

probably a stupid question: but if its an automatic does that matter?

i thought the auto boxes take more torque??????
BMW X1 with the 23d engine comes standard with the auto box, no option for a manual because of the torque.

Power 204@4400 bhp/rpm
Torque 295@2000-2250 lb/ft

vengeance52

I had it done in mine, and im not sure if it was at fault, but ended up having to get 3 fule injectors fixed cos the car broke down 2 weeks after getting it done....

also, my mechanics diagnostic software couldnt read the engine when it broke down, so had to get company that mapped it, to restore the old ECU map, and then the diagnostic software worked.

My Mechanic told me most engines can take a ECU remap....but its alot harder on the clutch esp if your an agressive driver.

JHMEG

kceire wrote: »

i thought the auto boxes take more torque??????
BMW X1 with the 23d engine comes standard with the auto box, no option for a manual because of the torque.

Power 204@4400 bhp/rpm
Torque 295@2000-2250 lb/ft

That's not huge torque.

Gearbox, be it manual or auto, and clutch, really depends on the car.

vengeance52 wrote:

also, my mechanics diagnostic software couldnt read the engine when it broke down,

That's kinda worrying. Unless he's a Honda mechanic your mechanic was probably using OBDII gear, which is basic and straightforward. I did read that aftermarket maps run the engine in open loop (i.e. ECU ignores the sensors) and the fact that the ECU wouldn't communicate with basic equipment would suggest there's some truth in it. (You might ask him was it OBDII or has he a HDS or a FLY100)

Darragh29

Hammertime wrote: »

Hi all,

Am considering getting my car remapped, its a 3 ltr TDI and gains are just over 15% more BHP and 20% more torque.

What I would like advice on is any potential damage to the vehicle as a result of these increases on 'workload' of the engine etc ? I am not mechanical in any way but am nervous that it will result in excessive wear and tear on seals etc. The only opinions I can find are the companies who sell this service and I take them with pinch of salt obviously. I'd love the opinions of any mechanics.

The company I am considering doing it are very reputable and it will be a standard ECU remap, nothing excessive.

Thanks for any help or opinion.


(p.s. I am not at all concerned about the effect on any warranty)

One thing that might be effected HT is the clutch system, as to what extent is hard to quantify. You might find yourself having to replace the clutch sooner than might otherwise be the case, but of course this depends on how you drive the car, etc...

There is an equation for clutch torque that a clutch assembly is designed to operate within...

Tcl=2(PI)RN, where:

R is the radius of the clutch disc.
PI is 3.14
and N is the clamping force provided by the diaphragm of the clutch pressure plate.

Tcl is the torque (in NM or Newton Metres) that the clutch is designed to handle. Typically it is multiplied by a safety factor of 1.2-1.4.

So the long and the short of it is that your clutch assembly has a ceiling value for the torque that it can transmit. When the torque delivered by the engine exceeds this value, the clutch starts slipping... You can see that if you increase your engine torque output, you can step outside of the operating parameters of the clutch assembly...

JHMEG

Darragh29 wrote: »

One thing that might be effected HT is the clutch system, as to what extent is hard to quantify. You might find yourself having to replace the clutch sooner than might otherwise be the case, but of course this depends on how you drive the car, etc...

There is an equation for clutch torque that a clutch assembly is designed to operate within...

Tcl=2(PI)RN, where:

R is the radius of the clutch disc.
PI is 3.14
and N is the clamping force provided by the diaphragm of the clutch pressure plate.

Tcl is the torque (in NM or Newton Metres) that the clutch is designed to handle. Typically it is multiplied by a safety factor of 1.2-1.4.

So the long and the short of it is that your clutch assembly has a ceiling value for the torque that it can transmit. When the torque delivered by the engine exceeds this value, the clutch starts slipping... You can see that if you increase your engine torque output, you can step outside of the operating parameters of the clutch assembly...

-->

Hammertime wrote:

probably a stupid question: but if its an automatic does that matter?

Bandara

Darragh29 wrote: »

One thing that might be effected HT is the clutch system, as to what extent is hard to quantify. You might find yourself having to replace the clutch sooner than might otherwise be the case, but of course this depends on how you drive the car, etc...

There is an equation for clutch torque that a clutch assembly is designed to operate within...

Tcl=2(PI)RN, where:

R is the radius of the clutch disc.
PI is 3.14
and N is the clamping force provided by the diaphragm of the clutch pressure plate.

Tcl is the torque (in NM or Newton Metres) that the clutch is designed to handle. Typically it is multiplied by a safety factor of 1.2-1.4.

So the long and the short of it is that your clutch assembly has a ceiling value for the torque that it can transmit. When the torque delivered by the engine exceeds this value, the clutch starts slipping... You can see that if you increase your engine torque output, you can step outside of the operating parameters of the clutch assembly...

Hi Darragh

thanks to you and everyone else for the replies.

As mine is a autobox would your concerns be less?

Matt Simis

The problems Ive seen on a non-TDI autobox was the TCU (transmission control unit) on VAGs (maybe only older ones) used the Torque value as a trigger to change gear. On A4 and A6 class vehicles with the 5speed Auto the TCU used to get confused when accelerating from 65mph, and hop between 4th and 5th. This was with an Upsolute map. Some American tuners remap the TCU to which fixes this.

The Phaeton (6 speed Auto) TDI I had remapped didnt have any problems at all and it was pushing a manly 600ft/lbs of torque. On the question of Manual vs Autobox, Manual Gearboxes generally can take more torque as its rather easy to uprate the clutch and they have no TCU screwing things up. A remap should account for this regardless though, shouldnt be a factor unless you know otherwise.


Basically, your engine isnt going to implode from a remap. If you have remap issues, just go back and get it tweaked or removed.
Your driving style and attitude to servicing will have a bigger impact on its wellbeing than a little more boost.

voxpop

The 2 main issues with remaps are the clutch and hoses blowing off because of the extra boost pressure. As yours is an automatic, the extra wear and tear will be on the autobox (whether its much extra is prob down to how you drive)

Ive heard of many ppl running remapped cars for years without problems and I think, by and large, engines as standard are run well within their tolerances - so once the remap isnt super aggressive, the main engine components should still be within tolerances after the map.

If you are getting the remap done by a reputable guy, there should also be a bit of checking after the remap by the mapper and an option to remove the map if required.

If you are going to get it done - the best advice is to choose a good remapper, there are only 2 in ireland I would go with.

Bandara

voxpop wrote: »

The 2 main issues with remaps are the clutch and hoses blowing off because of the extra boost pressure. As yours is an automatic, the extra wear and tear will be on the autobox (whether its much extra is prob down to how you drive)

Ive heard of many ppl running remapped cars for years without problems and I think, by and large, engines as standard are run well within their tolerances - so once the remap isnt super aggressive, the main engine components should still be within tolerances after the map.

If you are getting the remap done by a reputable guy, there should also be a bit of checking after the remap by the mapper and an option to remove the map if required.

If you are going to get it done - the best advice is to choose a good remapper, there are only 2 in ireland I would go with.

Could you tell me the 2 your would recommend pls? I was looking at using AutoRemap in Dublin.

you can PM if you'd prefer

thanks

voxpop

Hammertime wrote: »

Could you tell me the 2 your would recommend pls? I was looking at using AutoRemap in Dublin.

you can PM if you'd prefer

thanks

Yeah - autoRemap are one and chippedIRE. Personally, I have a vag and would go with joe@chippedIRE just because he specialises in vags. Both guys are good though.

There was a boards remapping day at autoremap a while back - im sure those guys will give you some feedback (all positive Id expect)