Gardai prepare plan for Queen's arrival

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:03pm

KrazeeEyezKilla wrote: »

If it does happen there shouldn't be any protests as we could end up with a repeat of the 2006 riots when we had to spend the next week listening about how the bigots in Love Ulster were poor little innocent victims.

They were denied their right to free assembly. And denied it in a violent, undemocratic manner, by low life scum. As such, they were victims.

My name is URL · 05-10-2010 1:07pm

Einhard wrote: »

So all heads of state should stay at home? No to Obama, no to Putin, no to Jintao eh?

Apples and oranges.. the people you mentioned are political figureheads and having them visit opens up opportunities for Ireland. The Queen is in the same boat as Ratzinger or Gyatsu.. it may be a formal visit but it serves no purpose other than a ceremonial one

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 1:07pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Fine by me, but if why are you happy to welcome the PM but not the Monarch? Surely it should be all or nothing, I mean, its not like there is some big power struggle between the two.

Simple obvious answer, one is the democratically elected leader of GB, the other a parasitic fossil placed into her position by birth.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:08pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

As a Republic we should not be encouraging the woman. By all means have a state visit by the democratically elected head of GB, David Cameron. We should not welcome a parasite with nothing to offer

So we should tell the monarchs of Japan, Spain and Norway to take a running jump too eh?

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 1:10pm

Yes we are a republic, why should we waste money having these people come to visit. It is an unnecessary trapping of wealth and privilege

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:13pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Apples and oranges.. the people you mentioned are political figureheads and having them visit opens up opportunities for Ireland. The Queen is in the same boat as Ratzinger or Gyatsu.. it may be a formal visit but it serves no purpose other than a ceremonial one

And a symbolic one. As in symbolising that we are actually a mature nation, and not one still dragged down by the millstone of history.

me-skywalker · 05-10-2010 1:14pm

Not unless she apologises!

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:16pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Yes we are a republic, why should we waste money having these people come to visit. It is an unnecessary trapping of wealth and privilege

So it's nothing to do with the fact that she's a BRITISH monarch, and all to do with your disdain for inherited positions eh? How noble of you comrade. I'll let you know next time Akihito of Japan is over so we can protest together.

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 1:20pm

You got some some of chip on your shoulder or something? yes I am a republican and have little warmth for any monarchy

My name is URL · 05-10-2010 1:21pm

Einhard wrote: »

And a symbolic one. As in symbolising that we are actually a mature nation, and not one still dragged down by the millstone of history.

Symbolic to whom? And seeing it as a symbol of how we've moved on and matured as a nation is indicative of the idea that history is still what determines our opinions on these things. Not everyone who isn't pushed on the idea of her visit is caught up in the history.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:27pm

My name is URL wrote: »

Symbolic to whom?

To anyone with a functioning mind. It's symbolic of the fact that we're mature enough to accept a visit by the head of state of our nearest neighbour.

Not everyone who isn't pushed on the idea of her visit is caught up in the history.

I'm not advocating that she be welcomed by the entire country, just that we've surely rewached a stage where she can be accorded the same reception as any other head of state. And sorry, but most people who oppose her visit are caught up in history. Unless they oppose a) visits by all heads of state or b) visits by all hereditary monarches.

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 1:47pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Simple obvious answer, one is the democratically elected leader of GB, the other a parasitic fossil placed into her position by birth.

What position? As the head of state for a country that is happy having a democratic monarchy?
What gives Ireland the right to dictate to fellow democracies how they should and shouldn't run their countries?

Einhard · 05-10-2010 1:58pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

You got some some of chip on your shoulder or something?

It's like raaaaiiiiinnnn on your wedding day.....

who the fug · 05-10-2010 2:03pm

Given that the average Paddy supports an English football team, is hooked on UK Soaps, shops in Tesco’s, reads English red tops

What possible objection could ye have to a 86 year old woman coming over to have a look see

Can ye keep Biffo off the Sauce, whilst she is there?

aDeener · 05-10-2010 2:06pm

who the fug wrote: »

Given that the average Paddy supports an English football team, is hooked on UK Soaps, shops in Tesco’s, reads English red tops

What possible objection could ye have to a 86 year old woman coming over to have a look see

Can ye keep Biffo off the Sauce, whilst she is there?

really?

gurramok · 05-10-2010 2:26pm

Einhard wrote:

They were denied their right to free assembly. And denied it in a violent, undemocratic manner, by low life scum. As such, they were victims.

Extremists should not be allowed to march anywhere in my view.

Einhard wrote: »

And a symbolic one. As in symbolising that we are actually a mature nation, and not one still dragged down by the millstone of history.

Quoting maturity BS fails your argument.

On another note, a protest could be hijacked not by extremists but by an angry populace having a go at the authorities for bankrupting the country, it could be the spark to get people off their arses to protest.

I just doubt the Gardai have the ability to manage civil disobedience after the fiasco of 2006.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 2:39pm

gurramok wrote: »

Extremists should not be allowed to march anywhere in my view.

And who decides on who is an extremist? You? I think those erigi people are pretty extremist. Should I be allowed to withdraw their right to free assembly?

Quoting maturity BS fails your argument.

Getting all worked up about the visit of an 86 year old head of state from a country with whom we're at peace fails our nation.

gurramok · 05-10-2010 2:45pm

Einhard wrote: »

And who decides on who is an extremist? You? I think those erigi people are pretty extremist. Should I be allowed to withdraw their right to free assembly?

No. You obviously do not know who the extremists are in your limited knowledge of NI. Their right to free assembly should be abolished for the sake of keeping the peace.

Einhard wrote: »

Getting all worked up about the visit of an 86 year old head of state from a country with whom we're at peace fails our nation.

Hardly any protested when Blair & Brown were PM's.

We're at peace with the USA and yet thousands protested at the last Bush visit.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 3:03pm

gurramok wrote: »

No. You obviously do not know who the extremists are in your limited knowledge of NI. Their right to free assembly should be abolished for the sake of keeping the peace.

Ah right, you have no idea who I am or where I'm from, but you know me well enough to make assumptions about my knowledge of the North. That's a pretty neat trick. As for the other part, they were engaged in peaceful march. You may advocate the abolition of free assembly and free speech, but I'm not so flippant with basic civil rights. And, as I seem to remember, it wasn't the Love Ulster contingent who trashed o'Connell St. but "nationalist" scum.

BTW, do you believe erigi and the like should have their rights withdrawn in a similar fashion?

We're at peace with the USA and yet thousands protested at the last Bush visit.

They protested because of the policies he instituted, not simply because of the position he held.

gurramok · 05-10-2010 3:28pm

Einhard wrote: »

Ah right, you have no idea who I am or where I'm from, but you know me well enough to make assumptions about my knowledge of the North. That's a pretty neat trick. As for the other part, they were engaged in peaceful march. You may advocate the abolition of free assembly and free speech, but I'm not so flippant with basic civil rights. And, as I seem to remember, it wasn't the Love Ulster contingent who trashed o'Connell St. but "nationalist" scum.

BTW, do you believe erigi and the like should have their rights withdrawn in a similar fashion?

It was not "nationalist" scum that rioted. It was a skanger fest. even non-nationals were arrested that day.

Do Eirigi provoke violent opposition? Don't think there has ever been a protest at their protests?

Public order should be taken into account when approving marches that can provoke violent opposition. Pretty standard fare you should know.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 3:32pm

gurramok wrote: »

It was not "nationalist" scum that rioted. It was a skanger fest. even non-nationals were arrested that day..

I know. That's why I put nationalist in inverted commas.

Do Eirigi provoke violent opposition? Don't think there has ever been a protest at their protests?

Oh right. So people should have their rights curtailed based on the fact that others engage in acts of criminality as a means of stating their disagreement with their views. What a wonderful concept. So all the scumbags have to do when they want to shut a particular group up, is to go on a violent rampage, and hey presto, the group will have their rights curtailed. What wonderful logic!

Notorious97 · 05-10-2010 3:42pm

Love Ulster parade should never have been let go ahead, fact! They have no place marching down O Connell Street, same as they don’t through nationalist areas, but they do and trouble ensues. I don’t agree with the riot that year in Dublin, but anybody who thought it was going to be peaceful lives in a dream world.

Same goes for the British Monarch, she doesn’t deserve to be paraded through any street within the Republic of Ireland (id extend it to the whole island but people will just try point out the NI is in the UK, which unfortunately it is), if she does get paraded through the streets of ROI then protests are justified, peaceful ones though, but we know the peace wont last unfortunately. Shes a useless relic of the past, represents a horrible era in this countries history, and is the head of armed forces which have acted as terrorists in this island.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 3:56pm

Notorious97 wrote: »

I don’t agree with the riot that year in Dublin, but anybody who thought it was going to be peaceful lives in a dream world.

That's like blaming a rape victim for the fact that she was wearing a short skirt. Love Ulster were entirely within their rights to stage a march, as you and I would be also. The scum who vandalised o'Connell ST tried to deny them their right, and you would do likewise. The only difference is the process involved. I'd rather not have civil liberties accorded on such a subjective basis.

Same goes for the British Monarch, she doesn’t deserve to be paraded through any street within the Republic of Ireland (id extend it to the whole island but people will just try point out the NI is in the UK, which unfortunately it is)

First off, she won't be paraded through the streets of Ireland. She'll be accorded much the same reaction as any other head of state. As, for example the German chancellor would get in Jerusalem. I for one will be lining the route she passes with my little Union jack, not because I'm particularly fond of her or her country, but just to piss the narrow minded natioanlists off.

, if she does get paraded through the streets of ROI then protests are justified, peaceful ones though, but we know the peace wont last unfortunately.

And anyone who causes a peaceful protest to degnerate into violence should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Protest if you want. It's your right. But don't try to curtail the rights of others just because you happen to disagree with them.

Shes a useless relic of the past, represents a horrible era in this countries history, and is the head of armed forces which have acted as terrorists in this island.

She's the head of state of our nearest neighbout, largest trading partner, and a nation with which we share huge cultural similarities.

Notorious97 · 05-10-2010 4:07pm

Einhard wrote: »

that's liek blaming a rape victim for the fact that she was wearing a short skirt. Love Ulster were entirely within their rights to stage a march, as you and I would be also. The scum who vandalised o'Connell ST tried to deny them their right, and you would do likewise. The only difference is the process involved. I'd rather not have civil liberties accorded on such a subjective basis.

No common sense should have prevailed and the Gardai should have known this march is to simply provoke people. Common sense would tell me not to allow an OO march through the nationalist areas within Ulster in order to avoid trouble, save money and save people from being injured. Common sense sadly doesn’t prevail and we are left with this scumbag organisation the OO shoving their sectarian sh*te down peoples throats. Like i said i don’t agree with a violent riot like that year, but i wasn’t surprised it happened.

First off, she won't be paraded through the streets of Ireland. She'll be accorded much the same reaction as any other head of state. As, for example the German chancellor would get in Jerusalem. I for one will be lining the route she passes with my little Union jack, not because I'm particularly fond of her or her country, but just to piss the narrow minded natioanlists off.

There you go provoking trouble, i don’t want to hear from you if somebody starts a row with you, go looking for trouble and you probably will find it.

And anyone who causes a peaceful protest to degnerate into violence should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Protest if you want. It's your right. But don't try to curtail the rights of others just because you happen to disagree with them.

I agree people can protest peacefully, its what i said, and again i said unfortunately there will be trouble, ie i don’t want there to be but no doubt there will be. Dont talk to me about rights though, the Queen nor her government or armed forces ever afforded irish people equal rights, she oversaw all the trouble during the last 40 odd years, its her uniform they wear when they deny native irish people their right to self determination, equal status for work, voting, social housing etc. Im aware most of this is on the road to recovery now with the progress we have but they denied people their rights for long enough.

She's the head of state of our nearest neighbout, largest trading partner, and a nation with which we share huge cultural similarities.

Yes and like i said above shes the head of a state which terrorised this land for how many years! I don’t get the whole ‘oh we are mature society’ shi*e people roll out when it comes to the UK, yes im aware we have alot of progress and my wish is it keeps getting better for all, but to expect people to not be annoyed over this is ridiculous. I for one am disgusted my hard earned tax money will go towards her protection.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 4:33pm

Notorious97 wrote: »

There you go provoking trouble, i don’t want to hear from you if somebody starts a row with you, go looking for trouble and you probably will find it.

So if I wave a Union Jack and get assaulted, it's somehow my fault. God, I hope you're not a judge.

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 4:34pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

What position? As the head of state for a country that is happy having a democratic monarchy?
What gives Ireland the right to dictate to fellow democracies how they should and shouldn't run their countries?

If Britain is happy with the antiquated system then fair enough for them, but why should we have an official state visit from her when what she represents is against the ideals of republicanism. We are a Republic and did away with that stupidity. Will leave you and your ilk to be her subjects

Einhard · 05-10-2010 4:35pm

Notorious97 wrote: »

I for one am disgusted my hard earned tax money will go towards her protection.

I for one am disgusted that she needs so much protection. Disgusted thaat so called nationalists would wish to murder an 86 year old woman.

Notorious97 · 05-10-2010 4:37pm

Einhard wrote: »

So if I wave a Union Jack and get assaulted, it's somehow my fault. God, I hope you're not a judge.

No but would common sense not tell you there are going to be stupid idiots at this looking for trouble, why would you wish to attract it?

Like for me, i love Celtic, and no not because im republican, i just happen to have supported that club since i was a young child and i don’t come from a republican family, but i also love going to Belfast and other parts of Ulster, but i don’t wear a celtic top because i don’t want to attract unwanted trouble, id hope to God you wouldn’t be attacked, but come on, you know there is idiots who the mere sight of say a union jack (or tri colour for other sides of the community) will give them the excuse they need to harm somebody.

Thats what i meant

Einhard · 05-10-2010 4:38pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

If Britain is happy with the antiquated system then fair enough for them, but why should we have an official state visit from her when what she represents is against the ideals of republicanism. We are a Republic and did away with that stupidity. Will leave you and your ilk to be her subjects

So we should refuse visits from China then? I mean, it's an autocracy and surely offends our Republican and democratic sensibilities after all. And we'll be telling Spain and Norway that their heads of state aren't welcome either of course. In the name of our Republican spirit of course...

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 4:42pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

If Britain is happy with the antiquated system then fair enough for them, but why should we have an official state visit from her when what she represents is against the ideals of republicanism. We are a Republic and did away with that stupidity. Will leave you and your ilk to be her subjects

What are the ideals of Republicanism, to consider themselves superior to people of other countries?

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 4:42pm

Of course we should not be accepting state visits from China given its atrocious civil rights record. Monarchy from any country could come here as long as its on holidays and not on official visits. State visits should only be afforded to democratically elected heads of states. If you want to bow down to someone go right ahead, know your place boy

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 4:44pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

to consider themselves superior to people of other countries?

Now you are starting to grasp monarchy and your place in relation to it, very good

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 4:44pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Of course we should not be accepting state visits from China given its atrocious civil rights record. Monarchy from any country could come here as long as its on holidays and not on official visits. State visits should only be afforded to democratically elected heads of states. If you want to bow down to someone go right ahead, know your place boy

So you do claim to be superior then? or just uber patronising?

R P McMurphy · 05-10-2010 4:46pm

Do you know anything of republicanism, the ill-gotten feelings of superiority belong to monarchies

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 4:51pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

Do you know anything of republicanism, the ill-gotten feelings of superiority belong to monarchies

I know what the basic concept of Republicanism is, after that, you can make it up to suit your own beliefs.

I'm not sure where in the manual it says that people not from republics should be mocked.

Einhard · 05-10-2010 4:51pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

State visits should only be afforded to democratically elected heads of states. If you want to bow down to someone go right ahead, know your place boy

Who's bowing down to anyone? I don't really think it's our place to tell other nations how they choose their heads of state. Especially as our current one wasn't even elected to her second term.

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 4:53pm

Einhard wrote: »

Who's bowing down to anyone? I don't really think it's our place to tell other nations how they choose their heads of state. Especially as our current one wasn't even elected to her second term.

and is everybit the waste of space any other monarch is.

AAAAAAAHHH · 05-10-2010 4:54pm

Rebelheart wrote: »

And what "Queen" would that be? The one and only "Queen" on the planet? Is this the same "Queen" that Dutch people speak of? That Norwegians speak of? That Spaniards speak of?

Let me guess: of all these foreign monarch you mean the British queen when you say "the Queen"? Are you Irish, or merely Oirish?

Unsurprisingly given this mentality your source is the most trashiest pro-British/anti-Irish rag in all of the Oirish media (including The Sun and The News of the World), the Sunday Independent. Horrendous shít altogether.

What a rebel. *swoon*

giles lynchwood · 05-10-2010 4:55pm

I wonder will she meet our Queen.David Norris.:rolleyes::D:P

gurramok · 05-10-2010 5:21pm

Einhard wrote: »

Oh right. So people should have their rights curtailed based on the fact that others engage in acts of criminality as a means of stating their disagreement with their views. What a wonderful concept. So all the scumbags have to do when they want to shut a particular group up, is to go on a violent rampage, and hey presto, the group will have their rights curtailed. What wonderful logic!

Its disturbing that you put the rights of extremists above public safety.

You be happy waving a union jack so we know what camp your in. Never crossed your mind to wave a tricoluour, the flag of our nation?

You must really be ashamed to be Irish.:mad::(

Wolfe Tone · 05-10-2010 5:31pm

Einhard wrote: »

So if I wave a Union Jack and get assaulted, it's somehow my fault. God, I hope you're not a judge.

Well he was advocating the basic "don't be a retard" rule. You know, things like it is advisable to carefully pick your apparel before sauntering down the falls.

Einhard wrote: »

I for one am disgusted that she needs so much protection. Disgusted thaat so called nationalists would wish to murder an 86 year old woman.

Tell me, even if she was uber loved by all and not just by people like Myers, would she need as much protection? Yes she would. Sure the pope did, did he not? Cant blame republicans for that can you? If it was not republicans it would be Bin Ladin.

Do you even think that the dissies even have the capability to assassinate the old bag? Considering they struggle to make a working pipe bomb? Do they have the logistical ability to attack her? No they don't.

Personally as a republican I do not want to see some old woman dead, I would rather she would remain outside of this country.

Tell me, we got on grand trade wise with Britain for how long without a visit? What will this accomplish?

Why is she coming? Coming here to apologize for acts carried out by her armed forces on this island during her reign? To apologize for giving said scum honors?

It sickens me that people have such short memories. She is the head of Britains armed forces. They are still occupying this island. She gave the fcuking bloody sunday paras honors ffs, and you want to roll out the red carpet?

The only thing this visit will accomplish is to create a huge bill, and huge protests of which I will be part of. We do not need nor want her here. This proposed visit will have no positive outcome, I promise you that.

Coeurdepirate · 05-10-2010 5:45pm

giles lynchwood wrote: »

I wonder will she meet our Queen.David Norris.:rolleyes::D:P

OMG! He's gay so you called him a girl! ROFLZ YOU'RE SO FUNNY! How long did it take to come up with a pun like that? :rolleyes::D:p

AskMyChocolate · 05-10-2010 5:48pm

Einhard wrote: »

And who decides on who is an extremist? You? I think those erigi people are pretty extremist. Should I be allowed to withdraw their right to free assembly?

Getting all worked up about the visit of an 86 year old head of state from a country with whom we're at peace fails our nation.

No. But they should not be allowed parade past the Omagh or Enniskillen bomb sites in black balaclavas, and if a civic government is too stupid to realise this and lets them, when the following inevitable hiding ensues I would not consider them innocent victims nor compare them to a girl wearing a short skirt being raped.

Wolfe Tone · 05-10-2010 5:49pm

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

No. But they should not be allowed parade past the Omagh or Enniskillen bomb sites in black balaclavas, and if a civic government is too stupid to realise this and lets them, when the following inevitable hiding ensues I would not consider them innocent victims nor compare them to a girl wearing a short skirt being raped.

As far as I know, Eirigi have no association with any armed group.

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 5:54pm

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

It sickens me that people have such short memories. She is the head of Britains armed forces. They are still occupying this island.

where?

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

She gave the fcuking bloody sunday paras honors ffs, and you want to roll out the red carpet?

what, she gave them medals for what they did on Bloody Sunday, or did she give one of the officers a completely unrelated OBE?

AskMyChocolate · 05-10-2010 5:54pm

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

As far as I know, Eirigi have no association with any armed group.

Sorry mate. Didn't mean to imply that they did. I was trying to get the analogy of parading in front of the G.P.O across to Einhard.

Wolfe Tone · 05-10-2010 5:57pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

where?

I said "this island". It is not really that big, I am sure you can figure out.

what, she gave them medals for what they did on Bloody Sunday, or did she give one of the officers a completely unrelated OBE?

You think that in light of what they did it should still have been given?

A case of "you did grand up until you murdered all them people, so will will give you a medal for that, and shure we will say no more about them killings"'

Wolfe Tone · 05-10-2010 5:59pm

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

Sorry mate. Didn't mean to imply that they did. I was trying to get the analogy of parading in front of the G.P.O across to Einhard.

No problem. The 32 county solidarity movement would be a more suitable comparison perhaps.

Fratton Fred · 05-10-2010 6:00pm

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

I said "this island". It is not really that big, I am sure you can figure out.

admittedly I haven't been to all of it, but I had a trip around the northern parts a while back and there was no army of occupation there as far as I could tell.

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

You think that in light of what they did it should still have been given?

A case of "you did grand up until you murdered all them people, so will will give you a medal for that, and shure we will say no more about them killings"'

With what we know now, no it shouldn't. But that's not my point, my point is more about your constant dramatisation of events.

Wolfe Tone · 05-10-2010 6:09pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

admittedly I haven't been to all of it, but I had a trip around the northern parts a while back and there was no army of occupation there as far as I could tell.

Notice the barracks? Soldier in there.

With what we know now, no it shouldn't. But that's not my point, my point is more about your constant dramatisation of events.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

What we know NOW. FFS everyone knew all along. You mean with what has been ADMITTED now.

Gardai prepare plan for Queen's arrival

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