More Crap on Adams, Mod Warning in OP.

maccored · 17-10-2014 3:54pm

I dont doubt the woman is telling the truth about the abuse. Outside of that I'm not too sure as I still dont understand why she abandoned the court case, and why the case is now being tried by media rather than a court.

Even the documentary said no-one knows the complete truth bar ms cahill and the man accused. good to see you have supernatural powers of knowing things.

raymon wrote: »

I listened to the woman's account. It makes sense. Adams was asked to meet her because she had been allegedly raped by a senior IRA volunteer. Adams agreed to meet her.

Adams now says that they didn't discuss the fact that she was raped.

it just doesn't add up - he is lying

walshb · 17-10-2014 3:59pm

maccored wrote: »

Even the documentary said no-one knows the complete truth bar ms cahill and the man accused. good to see you have supernatural powers of knowing things.

Her claim is that Adams discussed the issue with her. He says he didn't. Why would she lie about that? She isn't saying that Adams knows the full truth of what happened.

robbiezero · 17-10-2014 4:08pm

Creative Juices wrote: »

I never said that was my only reason but I will not vote for FG/Lab/FF for several other reasons. The question is would SF put their money where their mouth is.

I would be worried that they would put my money where their mouth is.

maccored · 17-10-2014 4:13pm

Why would he lie though? And why is it in the media now, years after the court case - which she pulled out of? I dont understand that.

walshb wrote: »

Her claim is that Adams discussed the issue with her. He says he didn't. Why would she lie about that? She isn't saying that Adams knows the full truth of what happened.

Gatling · 17-10-2014 4:17pm

Didn't he say something similar when asked about a lad beaten to death by 10 Provos a while back .
after the victim was involved in a fight with a local ra head

Happyman42 · 17-10-2014 4:18pm

walshb wrote: »

Her claim is that Adams discussed the issue with her. He says he didn't. Why would she lie about that? She isn't saying that Adams knows the full truth of what happened.

I think you may have some facts wrong here.
Adams doesn't deny he discussed the issue...it is her version of the discussion that he disagrees with.

walshb · 17-10-2014 4:20pm

maccored wrote: »

Why would he lie though? And why is it in the media now, years after the court case - which she pulled out of? I dont understand that.

Because he would not want people knowing that this happened and he knew of it and did nothing. That is why he would deny it. Him admitting it is true is quite a damning thing. The girl was 16 when the abuse happened, wasn't she?

walshb · 17-10-2014 4:21pm

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think you may have some facts wrong here.
Adams doesn't deny he discussed the issue...it is her version of the discussion that he disagrees with.

Ok, I assumed that he denied that they discussed anything to do with sexual abuse? So, what did they discuss? I guess he thinks one thing and she thinks another.

Happyman42 · 17-10-2014 4:27pm

walshb wrote: »

Ok, I assumed that he denied that they discussed anything to do with sexual abuse? So, what did they discuss? I guess he thinks one thing and she thinks another.

In his RTÉ interview, Mr Adams said if there was an IRA investigation as alleged by Ms Cahill, it was totally wrong.
“I met Máiria in good faith, at the behest of her cousin and my late friend Siobhán O’Hanlon who was concerned for Máiria ’s welfare. My sole reason to meet her was to help.
“I am personally horrified at the allegation that I would make the comments Máiria has attributed to me.
“That the BBC would broadcast that allegation, without any attempt at balance whatsoever, is reprehensible. I would never make such remarks to anyone, much less an alleged victim of abuse.”

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/woman-appalled-at-adams-denial-of-her-account-of-rape-conversations-1.1966897

maccored · 17-10-2014 4:29pm

As the SF leader, Im not too sure what you think he could have done to an IRA member

walshb wrote: »

Because he would not want people knowing that this happened and he knew of it and did nothing. That is why he would deny it. Him admitting it is true is quite a damning thing. The girl was 16 when the abuse happened, wasn't she?

Heat_Wave · 17-10-2014 4:32pm

Her story did not add up.

She claimed that he raped her several times over the course of 1/2 years. When Vincent asked why she didn't leave the house, her response was 'I was protecting the other children. If he didn't rape me, he'd rape them' - what a weird mentality to have.

She also said she used to lay on the couch and he would come up behind her and rape her, all the while she continued to be asleep. She said this pattern of abuse would repeat itself. - Why would you pretend to be asleep?

There was something about her which I found to be quite disturbing to watch. I am with Adams on this one.

Gatling · 17-10-2014 5:21pm

Heat_Wave wrote: »

Her story did not add up.

She claimed that he raped her several times over the course of 1/2 years. When Vincent asked why she didn't leave the house, her response was 'I was protecting the other children. If he didn't rape me, he'd rape them' - what a weird mentality to have.

She also said she used to lay on the couch and he would come up behind her and rape her, all the while she continued to be asleep. She said this pattern of abuse would repeat itself. - Why would you pretend to be asleep?

There was something about her which I found to be quite disturbing to watch. I am with Adams on this one.

It's pretty common in abuse situations one sibling will protect others by allowing the abuse to continue you might want to do some research before making statements as to how and why first

gallag · 17-10-2014 5:43pm

Heat_Wave wrote: »

Her story did not add up.

She claimed that he raped her several times over the course of 1/2 years. When Vincent asked why she didn't leave the house, her response was 'I was protecting the other children. If he didn't rape me, he'd rape them' - what a weird mentality to have.

She also said she used to lay on the couch and he would come up behind her and rape her, all the while she continued to be asleep. She said this pattern of abuse would repeat itself. - Why would you pretend to be asleep?

There was something about her which I found to be quite disturbing to watch. I am with Adams on this one.

wow, you and busted flat who thanked this sick diatribe need to educate yourselves.

Henlars67 · 17-10-2014 5:45pm

Gatling wrote: »

It's pretty common in abuse situations one sibling will protect others by allowing the abuse to continue you might want to do some research before making statements as to how and why first

Ya, it's a pretty common trend in abuse situations.

What I'd like to know is why when asked the same question on the Spotlight show she didn't give that answer.

One could be forgiven for thinking that O' Hanlon had coached her on how to answer it before her appearance on TV3

raymon · 17-10-2014 6:55pm

Happyman42 wrote: »

I think you may have some facts wrong here.
Adams doesn't deny he discussed the issue...it is her version of the discussion that he disagrees with.

Wrong

Adams denies that he discussed the rape claim during the meeting - I heard him say it in an interview

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/joan-burton-ira-rape-case-allegation-raises-serious-questions-30669977.html

He is lying........ tell the truth Gerry !

Happyman42 · 17-10-2014 7:09pm

raymon wrote: »

Wrong

Adams denies that he discussed the rape claim during the meeting - I heard him say it in an interview

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/joan-burton-ira-rape-case-allegation-raises-serious-questions-30669977.html

He is lying........ tell the truth Gerry !

Clarified on Six One News interview with Ms Cahill...He claimed he didn't discuss the 'detail' of her abuse.

Sindo being careless with the details again.

Banjoxed · 17-10-2014 7:19pm

Heat_Wave wrote: »

Her story did not add up.

She claimed that he raped her several times over the course of 1/2 years. When Vincent asked why she didn't leave the house, her response was 'I was protecting the other children. If he didn't rape me, he'd rape them' - what a weird mentality to have.

She also said she used to lay on the couch and he would come up behind her and rape her, all the while she continued to be asleep. She said this pattern of abuse would repeat itself. - Why would you pretend to be asleep?

There was something about her which I found to be quite disturbing to watch. I am with Adams on this one.

So, a woman to blame then.

Busted Flat. · 17-10-2014 7:27pm

This might sound stupid, on VB last night she said that she stayed to protect the children in his flat or house, who were these children. Were they his or who's.

conorh91 · 17-10-2014 7:37pm

Heat_Wave wrote: »

Her story did not add up.

She claimed that he raped her several times over the course of 1/2 years. When Vincent asked why she didn't leave the house, her response was 'I was protecting the other children. If he didn't rape me, he'd rape them' - what a weird mentality to have.

She also said she used to lay on the couch and he would come up behind her and rape her, all the while she continued to be asleep. She said this pattern of abuse would repeat itself. - Why would you pretend to be asleep?

There was something about her which I found to be quite disturbing to watch. I am with Adams on this one.

I really don't see the point of us sitting in judgement of people who make serious rape allegations. All the civilized world knows that victims of rape, sexual assault and domestic violence sometimes behave in ways that another person would not behave, under normal circumstances.

I know it's the internet age and we are rewarded for broadcasting every fleeting whim and notion we get, no matter how hurtful, but to go on an internet forum judging a woman's credibility on her being raped just seems like it's in really bad taste.

The issue in this affair is how the allegations were dealt with by Adams. Not whether someone is a rape victim or not.

raymon · 17-10-2014 7:38pm

Happyman42 wrote: »

Clarified on Six One News interview with Ms Cahill...He claimed he didn't discuss the 'detail' of her abuse.

Sindo being careless with the details again.

Thats wrong Happyman

Please reference the actual interview rather than a secondary source before you determine what he said

http://www.rte.ie/news/player/news-at-one/2014/1016/

Gerry clearly says that he did not discuss the rape allegation .

Please go to 41:40/49:00

he is obviously lying through his teeth in this interview .

Creative Juices · 17-10-2014 8:30pm

Adams is digging another hole for himself.

walshb · 17-10-2014 10:25pm

maccored wrote: »

As the SF leader, Im not too sure what you think he could have done to an IRA member

I never said that I thought he should do anything to an IRA member. What I meant was that if he knew that a serious crime was being committed and he decided to do nothing about it, then he would not want anyone knowing this, especially with him being such an authoritative and impacting and influential leader of people. Isn't it a crime to not report a crime that you know is being committed, or was committed? Maybe not for all crimes.

Now, he says that the lady and him did not discuss her sexual abuse at the hands of an IRA member. She seems adamant that they did discuss this. Why is he denying it? Maybe because of what I wrote in the paragraph above this? If he comes out and says "yes I knew about the crime being committed against this 16 year old, but I decided not to alert the relevant authorities." That is damning! He won't hang himself here.

Happyman42 · 17-10-2014 10:42pm

walshb wrote: »

Why is he denying it?

You've already made up your mind.

Shakespeare's Sister · 17-10-2014 10:59pm

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

they were psychopathic murderers why are people surprised that they were raping kids as well?

Who's "they" and which kids were "they" raping?

Do answer now instead of leaving it at just a vague comment and running off.

I'm no fan of the IRA but saying any auld thing about them - or about loyalist paramilitaries, or the British army, or the RUC, is not good debating.

Barely There · 17-10-2014 11:09pm

Creative Juices wrote: »

Adams is digging another hole for himself.

Better that then him sending out his cohorts to dig holes for others.

Absolutely vile little man.

gunny558 · 18-10-2014 12:51am

Shakespeare's Sister wrote: »

Who's "they" and which kids were "they" raping?

Do answer now instead of leaving it at just a vague comment and running off.

I'm no fan of the IRA but saying any auld thing about them - or about loyalist paramilitaries, or the British army, or the RUC, is not good debating.

I presume "they" means IRA members.... as its alleged the person who raped a then 16 year old Mairia Cahill was supposedly an IRA member...

Heat_Wave · 18-10-2014 1:10am

conorh91 wrote: »

I really don't see the point of us sitting in judgement of people who make serious rape allegations. All the civilized world knows that victims of rape, sexual assault and domestic violence sometimes behave in ways that another person would not behave, under normal circumstances.

I know it's the internet age and we are rewarded for broadcasting every fleeting whim and notion we get, no matter how hurtful, but to go on an internet forum judging a woman's credibility on her being raped just seems like it's in really bad taste.

The issue in this affair is how the allegations were dealt with by Adams. Not whether someone is a rape victim or not.

I would 100% agree with you under normal circumstances but this situation is different as the people in question are well known public figures. People are entitled to pass judgement if it is the interest of the people.

For example, Cliff Richard has been in the media for child sex allegations. Majority of people reacted by saying 'Cliff Richard, no way, that couldn't be true'. Are these people disrespecting the child in question? No they're not. Yet Cliff Richards character has been dragged through the mud. This is the exact same thing imo. Without evidence no one can say the 'victim' is genuinely a victim, yet people are siding with her. What if she is lying? And based on the interview I watched she didn't come across genuine nor trustworthy imo.

Obviously if I didn't know either person I couldn't pass judgement nor would I, but based on her interview i find her story difficult to believe.

Innocent until proven guilty.

conorh91 · 18-10-2014 4:54pm

Heat_Wave wrote: »

For example, Cliff Richard has been in the media for child sex allegations. Majority of people reacted by saying 'Cliff Richard, no way, that couldn't be true'. Are these people disrespecting the child in question? No they're not.

[…]

Innocent until proven guilty.

False dichotomy. A presumption of innocence does not create an open-season for implying that victims are liars.

The question of whether Mairia Cahill was raped is 100% irrelevant.

The question is how senior republican figures responded to her claims, and whether they established some kind of kangaroo court.

walshb · 18-10-2014 8:14pm

Happyman42 wrote: »

You've already made up your mind.

I haven't made my mind up. I just think it's likely, unless the lady is a liar.

michael999999 · 18-10-2014 8:16pm

conorh91 wrote: »

False dichotomy. A presumption of innocence does not create an open-season for implying that victims are liars.

The question of whether Mairia Cahill was raped is 100% irrelevant.

The question is how senior republican figures responded to her claims, and whether they established some kind of kangaroo court.

Her uncle was/is a senior republican!

Can't imagine him taking no action against the alleged rapist!

walshb · 18-10-2014 8:35pm

michael999999 wrote: »

Her uncle was/is a senior republican!

Can't imagine him taking no action against the alleged rapist!

All this stuff is irrelevant. No matter what did nor did not happen as regards sanctions or punishment the issue is whether Adams was aware of what was allegedly happening to the 16 year .

michael999999 · 18-10-2014 8:37pm

walshb wrote: »

All this stuff is irrelevant. No matter what did nor did not happen as regards sanctions or punishment the issue is whether Adams was aware of what was allegedly happening to the 16 year .

Of course its relevant. Do you really believe her uncle wouldn't have killed him?

Xenophile · 18-10-2014 8:44pm

Worse thing that could happen here is that Gerry Adams steps down as leader and that Mary Lou McDonald is elected leader.

McDonald is more convincing putting forward Sinn Feinn's phoney policies and as a result they could do better in the next election!

Adams is a liability and better that he continues to be so.

Of course justice for Maria Cahill is of paramount importance, if she is telling the truth and I think that she is, it is important for her to be able to tell her story as part of her healing process.

Happyman42 · 18-10-2014 9:37pm

Xenophile wrote: »

Of course justice for Maria Cahill is of paramount importance.

In fairness, she had a chance for that and for whatever reason didn't take it.
Whatever else happens with the road she has decided on, 'justice' won't be one of the achievements sadly.

walshb · 18-10-2014 9:44pm

michael999999 wrote: »

Of course its relevant. Do you really believe her uncle wouldn't have killed him?

Do you really believe that he would have? Neither of us could know this. And, did her uncle know about the alleged abuse?

michael999999 · 18-10-2014 9:54pm

walshb wrote: »

Do you really believe that he would have? Neither of us could know this. And, did her uncle know about the alleged abuse?

I have no doubt he would have killed her rapist. He was one of the top Republicans in the country, he would have had no problem finding out who the man was.

walshb · 18-10-2014 10:36pm

Anyone got a link to the interview/spotlight programme?

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 10:47pm

Xenophile wrote: »

Worse thing that could happen here is that Gerry Adams steps down as leader and that Mary Lou McDonald is elected leader.

McDonald is more convincing putting forward Sinn Feinn's phoney policies and as a result they could do better in the next election!

Adams is a liability and better that he continues to be so.

Of course justice for Maria Cahill is of paramount importance, if she is telling the truth and I think that she is, it is important for her to be able to tell her story as part of her healing process.

Adams will only go on his terms. Do you think he's going to let Lou move in and take his position, not a chance!

Banjo String · 18-10-2014 10:54pm

walshb wrote: »

Anyone got a link to the interview/spotlight programme?

Lol.

You mean to tell me you're so opinionated on the whole subject and haven't actually watched it

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 10:54pm

As for the op and the people bashing adams, its all well and good saying all what's been said in hindsight but back then, there was a war on and the RUC couldn't be trusted by no one. As for the IRAs kangaroo courts, you have to look atbit from their perspective, she could have been lying and it isnt the first time a girl has came out and lied about rapes. For all they know she could be sent to say these allegations by handlers in the special branch.

Now in 2014 its OK to say Adams was wrong in how he dealt with it, so what, we all make mistakes in life and he was a man with quite alit of pressure in him. He is the god father of Irish Republicanism ffs and anyone who doesn't think there's someone pulling this girls strings is a fool IMO! As for the girl herself, something seems fishy about her to be totally honest with you all.

Busted Flat. · 18-10-2014 11:26pm

It is important to state at the outset that the man accused of the rape was cleared in a court of law when the case was presented because Mairia decided not to testify and also that police investigated the kangaroo court charge and found no evidence.

It is also worth noting that Mairia Cahill has met Fianna Fail leader and Adams opponent Michael Martin and is set to meet Northern Ireland First Minister DUP leader Peter Robinson on Monday, making this a very political issue

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCMQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishcentral.com%2Fopinion%2Fniallodowd%2FLatest-media-attack-on-Gerry-Adams-fails-the-reality-test.html&ei=A-hCVI6bFI-S7AbphIGoDA&usg=AFQjCNGgZEsrwbr6H5swJ_Wso0J6kKGRGg

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 11:41pm

Busted Flat. wrote: »

It is important to state at the outset that the man accused of the rape was cleared in a court of law when the case was presented because Mairia decided not to testify and also that police investigated the kangaroo court charge and found no evidence.

It is also worth noting that Mairia Cahill has met Fianna Fail leader and Adams opponent Michael Martin and is set to meet Northern Ireland First Minister DUP leader Peter Robinson on Monday, making this a very political issue

https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCMQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishcentral.com%2Fopinion%2Fniallodowd%2FLatest-media-attack-on-Gerry-Adams-fails-the-reality-test.html&ei=A-hCVI6bFI-S7AbphIGoDA&usg=AFQjCNGgZEsrwbr6H5swJ_Wso0J6kKGRGg

Seems very fishy to me.

michael999999 · 18-10-2014 11:45pm

Excellent piece.

It seems eilish o Hanlon and fine Gaels mouth piece aka Denis o Brien's INM are playing dirty!

Barely There · 18-10-2014 11:49pm

duckcfc wrote: »

As for the op and the people bashing adams, its all well and good saying all what's been said in hindsight but back then, there was a war on and the RUC couldn't be trusted by no one. As for the IRAs kangaroo courts, you have to look atbit from their perspective, she could have been lying and it isnt the first time a girl has came out and lied about rapes. For all they know she could be sent to say these allegations by handlers in the special branch.

Now in 2014 its OK to say Adams was wrong in how he dealt with it, so what, we all make mistakes in life and he was a man with quite alit of pressure in him. He is the god father of Irish Republicanism ffs and anyone who doesn't think there's someone pulling this girls strings is a fool IMO! As for the girl herself, something seems fishy about her to be totally honest with you all.

I love posts like this.

It gives everyone a glimpse into the horrible warped mindset of the IRA's version of 'Republicanism'.

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 11:50pm

I don't usually vote but this Adams bashing will get me of my are and defo out voting for SF when time comes! They think this is damaging SF, well anyone ive talk to its having the opposite

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 11:51pm

Barely There wrote: »

I love posts like this.

It gives everyone a glimpse into the horrible warped mindset of the IRA's version of 'Republicanism'.

You have to understand the situation these guys where under while were down here living in a normal society, well as normal as can be.

18-10-2014 11:51pm

I don't think its a stretch to imagine that the IRA dealt with this kind of thing themselves.
They like to hand out their own type of punishment and have for years.
They also hold their own kangaroo courts.

The way I see it, its a typical Irish thing.
The church dealt with things their way.
The GAA dealt with things their way, both back in the day.
Thankfully those days are gone now, but I can see very easily how the IRA would've dealt with this ' their own way'

Of course, Gerry Adams, having never been a member if the IRA, wouldn't have any idea about this...........!!!!

duckcfc · 18-10-2014 11:55pm

bubblypop wrote: »

I don't think its a stretch to imagine that the IRA dealt with this kind of thing themselves.
They like to hand out their own type of punishment and have for years.
They also hold their own kangaroo courts.

The way I see it, its a typical Irish thing.
The church dealt with things their way.
The GAA dealt with things their way, both back in the day.
Thankfully those days are gone now, but I can see very easily how the IRA would've dealt with this ' their own way'

Of course, Gerry Adams, having never been a member if the IRA, wouldn't have any idea about this...........!!!!

The IRA did deal with it and if that guy was found guilty, he'd have been shot in ankles, kneecaps and elbows. Warranted for such people IMO

18-10-2014 11:58pm

duckcfc wrote: »

The IRA did deal with it and if that guy was found guilty, he'd have been shot in ankles, kneecaps and elbows. Warranted for such people IMO

Exactly.
The IRA are not the law enforcement in either this country or northern Ireland, but they act like they are, and always have.

Banjo String · 19-10-2014 12:01am

bubblypop wrote: »

Exactly.
The IRA are not the law enforcement in either this country or northern Ireland, but they act like they are, and always have.

Believe me. Back in 97 (when this allegedly occurred) the ruc weren't exactly "law enforcers" for a sizable amount of the population in the north.

As someone who was born, and lived there for 26 years, I feel I'm experienced enough to make that statement tbh.

More Crap on Adams, Mod Warning in OP.

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