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New Green Tax for motorists - threads merged

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    #152
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Prospects list is a showroom for those tired of life.

    Mike.


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    #153
    JoeA3
    Registered Users Posts: 7,417 ✭✭✭JoeA3


    prospect wrote: »
    Here is a full list (based on the SIMI list) of all cars that will be in the €100 p/a bracket:

    Audi A2 1.4 TDI 75 BHP
    Citroen C1 1.0i 3dr
    Citroen C1 1.0i 5dr
    Citroen C1 1.0i SX 5dr
    Citroen C3 1.4HDi
    Daihatsu Charade 1.0L 5 Door Manual
    Fiat Multijet Dynamic
    Fiat 1.3 Multijet 75 Active 3dr
    Fiat 1.3 Multijet 75 Active 5dr
    Fiat 1.3 Multijet 75 Dynamic 3dr
    Fiat 1.3 Multijet 75 Dynamic 5dr
    Ford Ka 5 Dr 1.4 TDCi FINESSE
    Ford Fiesta 5 Dr 1.4 TDCi LX
    Ford Fiesta Fusion 1 5Dr 1.4 TDCi
    Ford Fiesta Fusion Steel 5Dr 1.4 TDCi
    Honda Civic Hybrid
    Peugeot 107 S 1.0 3dr
    Peugeot 107 SE 1.0 3dr
    Peugeot 107 S 1.0 5dr
    Peugeot 107 SE 1.0 5dr
    Peugeot 107 SE 1.0 2-Tronic
    Peugeot 206 SE 1.4 Hdi
    Peugeot 1007 S 1.4 Hdi
    Peugeot 1007 SE 1.4 Hdi
    Peugeot 206 SW XT 1.4 Hdi ABS + A/C E/W Fr Fogs E/ Mirrors
    Renault Clio 1.5 dCi 86 SPORT+
    Renault Clio 1.5 dCi 86 DYNAMIQUE
    Renault Clio 1.5 dCi 86 AUTHENTIQUE
    Renault Clio 1.5 dCi 86 SPORT+
    Smart ForTwo pure 698cc 50bhp
    Smart ForTwo pure 698cc 61bhp
    Smart ForTwo pulse 698cc 61bhp
    Smart ForTwo passion 698cc 61bhp
    Toyota MC PRIUS 1.5 5DR HSD
    Toyota PRIUS 1.5 5DR HSD
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 3DR AURA
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 5DR AURA
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 3DR STRATA MM
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 3DR STRATA
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 5DR STRATA MMT
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 5DR STRATA
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 3DR TERRA
    Toyota AYGO 1.0 5DR TERRA
    Toyota YARIS D4D 3DR TERRA VAN
    Toyota YARIS 1.4 D4D 5DR LUNA MC
    Toyota YARIS 1.4 D4D 5D LUNA FOG
    Toyota NG YAR 1.4 D4D 5DR TERRA

    Interestingly, the Germans are not exactly market leaders.

    Suddenly, walking looks like an attractive option ;)


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    #154
    Villain
    Registered Users Posts: 15,944 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    JoeA3 wrote: »
    Suddenly, walking looks like an attractive option ;)
    LOL Very good


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    #155
    Sabre Man
    Registered Users Posts: 2,029 ✭✭✭Sabre Man


    The new system seems to favour diesels. Would it not be better if the VRT rates took into account particle emissions as well as CO2?


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    #156
    prospect
    Registered Users Posts: 4,791 ✭✭✭prospect


    Sabre Man wrote: »
    The new system seems to favour diesels. Would it not be better if the VRT rates took into account particle emissions as well as CO2?

    No,

    Over all (including the manufacturing of the fuels), diesels are the greener option.


    LOL @ Mike65 & JoeA3. Although I wouldn't mind the Panda MultiJet as our #2 car.


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    #157
    port
    Registered Users Posts: 144 ✭✭port


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Then my car will seriously depreciate as a new car will only pay 430 euro as opposed to 1200 for a year old car:mad: and any one who buys a low emmission car in the next 6 months will be a fool as in 6 months nobody will want them!! you are better off buying a high emission car in terms of depreciation. green idiots

    Totally agree with you that the way of implementation is idiotic e.g.2008 520d taxed Feb to June will cost at least €590 pa while the same car taxed new from July will cost €150 pa.It will make financial sense to defer deal to July from Jan....stupid system....car dealers should be up in arms.


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    #158
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    unkel wrote: »
    You and me both :D

    And then drive it for 24/7 at the redline in an attempt to break the world record of CO2 production :D


    ...'sfunny you should say that - guess what just got voted COTY2008 ? http://www.caroftheyear.org/pages/Coty08.htm


    maybe life's not so bad after all........

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #159
    Mailman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭Mailman


    galwaytt wrote: »
    ...'sfunny you should say that - guess what just got voted COTY2008 ? http://www.caroftheyear.org/pages/Coty08.htm


    maybe life's not so bad after all........

    Yes, there's no reason to get depressed at all.
    wait until the 110 bhp 900cc twin cylinder turbo version appears in 2009/2010.


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    #160
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,026 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    galwaytt wrote: »
    guess what just got voted COTY2008 ?

    Do a wee search. You'll find that I reported this news before anybody else did in this country. In fact it was several days before it was official. Anyways, I can't wait to drive a sporty new 500 :D


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    #161
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,026 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    mike65 wrote: »
    Prospects list is a showroom for those tired of life.

    LOL, wise words, Mike.


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    #162
    Blue850
    Registered Users Posts: 2,560 ✭✭✭Blue850


    Are imports over 30 years old going to be left as is after July 08?


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    #163
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,026 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Blue850 wrote: »
    Are imports over 30 years old going to be left as is after July 08?

    I was wondering about that one myself. If so I'd be tempted to get something like this lovely 450 SEL 6.9

    450SELI_0411.jpg


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    #164
    astraboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭astraboy


    ^^^^^^^Class^^^^^^^^. Cheap tax too! What is it, about 50 euro a year on a classic? We shoudl all go out and buy the biggest, dirtiest 30 year old cars we can find. An interesting alternative would be importing a load of US muscle cars. Imagine Gormelys face if he started seeing people comuting to work in the General lee!:D


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    #165
    MadsL
    Registered Users Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    Must say I'm pretty disgusted with the two-tier system. I bought a Smart myself in 03 as I do low mileage, live in the city centre and just wanted a basic commuter car that was low tax and low emissions (green conscience)

    The effect of the two tier on me is that now I have to consider if I want to continue to pay an increased rate of motor tax on the 301cc I dont own :D (1000cc rate or less) or buy a new car which I do not want to do.

    Come July I'm seriously thinking of exporting and then re-importing and re-regging this car ;) will that work? Or will I just get clobbered on tax (VRT?)

    Good tax bands (I support CO2 tax bands) Stupid two tier system.


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    #166
    astraboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭astraboy


    MadsL wrote: »
    Must say I'm pretty disgusted with the two-tier system. I bought a Smart myself in 03 as I do low mileage, live in the city centre and just wanted a basic commuter car that was low tax and low emissions (green conscience)

    The effect of the two tier on me is that now I have to consider if I want to continue to pay an increased rate of motor tax on the 301cc I dont own :D (1000cc rate or less) or buy a new car which I do not want to do.

    Come July I'm seriously thinking of exporting and then re-importing and re-regging this car ;) will that work? Or will I just get clobbered on tax (VRT?)

    Good tax bands (I support CO2 tax bands) Stupid two tier system.

    If you export and reimport the car then you will revert back to the old Irish reg, therefore you'll still be on the old system. Better to sell the smart and buy new after June in your case I would say. I'm lucky, I have a 1.8 alfa and road tax would be 1000E a year under the new system as its emissions are over 200G/Km! Glad to stick to the old system.


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    #167
    jackofalltrades
    Registered Users Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭jackofalltrades


    Madsl wrote:
    Stupid two tier system.
    Without the "stupid" two tier system people driving family cars could see themselves paying €1000 a year motor tax on a worthless car.


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    #168
    astraboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭astraboy


    jackofalltrades wrote: »
    Without the "stupid" two tier system people driving family cars could see themselves paying €1000 a year motor tax on a worthless car.

    I'm in that boat. My road tax would more then double if forced onto the new scheme! :eek: I don't like the old way of taxing by CC and overall I agree with the new system, but I think the right call was made by not forcing people on the new system that have bought their cars already based on running costs etc by the old system. 10-15 years time how many 06 cars will still be on the roads?


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    #169
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    MadsL wrote: »
    Must say I'm pretty disgusted with the two-tier system.


    yeah for some the two tier system suck. I see the above points about people being hit hard without warning if it was applicable to all cars from July 08.


    Those who bought low emissions cars in recent years get hit with a 9.5% increase in tax.

    And whats the % of the fleet of cars that are less than a year old anyway?
    Is it a case where most of the fleet get hit with the increase, shouldnt we be encouraging people to hold onto their cars longer especially the cleaner emissions?

    Should car tax be based on your emissions from the NCT? and then you cant tax your car without an NCT? safety and clean? I think the bands are too wide in the new tax system also, but maybe its the way forward!

    But what about the driver who uses an older diesel using biofuel or is converted to sunflower oils? I think the only reason they changed the VRT is because Europe was at them. So they altered it but upped tax for most motorists regardless of their emissions to make up for the tax they could lose :D
    maybe im too cynical :D:D:D


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    #170
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Jebus unkel, never buy a US spec old Merc. Hideous bumpers and lights

    mercedes_benz_W116_2.jpg

    Mmmmmm! :)

    Mike.


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    #171
    E92
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,147 ✭✭✭E92


    There is no reason in the earthly world why Gormless Gormley can't have the new tax system go back to any car registered after 2000. Somebody said, I don't know who, that the EU has CO2 data for all new cars from 2001-present. This new idea is the most ill thought out idea ever, I'm not going to say why because I think anyone who has read this thread will know the reason why it is so badly thought out and I don't see the point in repeating for repeating's sake.


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    #172
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 65,026 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    mike65 wrote: »
    Jebus unkel, never buy a US spec old Merc. Hideous bumpers and lights

    Aye. Tbh I just linked to the first 6.9 google spitted out, never even noticed those 70s US bumpers :)


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    #173
    ninty9er
    Registered Users Posts: 9,366 ✭✭✭ninty9er


    E92 wrote: »
    There is no reason in the earthly world why Gormless Gormley can't have the new tax system go back to any car registered after 2000. Somebody said, I don't know who, that the EU has CO2 data for all new cars from 2001-present. This new idea is the most ill thought out idea ever, I'm not going to say why because I think anyone who has read this thread will know the reason why it is so badly thought out and I don't see the point in repeating for repeating's sake.

    It's cos you're a blueshirt and ye weren't the ones introducing the idea (which would have been word for word the same) isn't it...

    sorry couldn't resist:D:D


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    #174
    bbability
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,504 ✭✭✭bbability


    Well I think there should be some sort of voluntary system out in place for anyone re-newing their road tax from the old system to this new greener way of taxation after july next year. Its quite simple when you think about it. I'm driving a 1.9tdi b6 passat with Co2 levels @136g/100km. That's my car taxed at €251euro under the new system rather than €511 prior to the 9.5% increase. So what am i getting for driving a diesel car... feck all by the looks of it:mad:


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    #175
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    bbability wrote: »
    So what am i getting for driving a diesel car... feck all by the looks of it:mad:


    your gettin somethin allright

    an increase :D

    Im similiar - up to 591euros. Using a second hand diesel. The second hand part is what makes it even more environmentally friendly :P
    this encourages buying new cars which is not!


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    #176
    Villain
    Registered Users Posts: 15,944 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Can anyone with some knowledge of the VRT syste, help me out here, my Aunt is due to buy a Honda Accord 2.2 i-CTDi Diesel Executive next year, now the Honda website states the price as €43,100 and the Carbon emmisions are 143g/km so I'm managed to figure out that the new VRT rate is 20% the old I think was 30%.

    Car tax will go from 827 to 290 a year I believe, can anyone work out the VRT saving if she waits after July.


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    #177
    astraboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭astraboy


    bbability wrote: »
    Well I think there should be some sort of voluntary system out in place for anyone re-newing their road tax from the old system to this new greener way of taxation after july next year. Its quite simple when you think about it. I'm driving a 1.9tdi b6 passat with Co2 levels @136g/100km. That's my car taxed at €251euro under the new system rather than €511 prior to the 9.5% increase. So what am i getting for driving a diesel car... feck all by the looks of it:mad:

    Voluntary changing over to the new system is a great idea. You then get to opt for the system which is cheapest for you. For instance you would make a huge saving over several years. My alfa 156 1.8 would go to 1,000E a year to tax however as its emissions are high for the engine size! Thats more then double what it is now. It would be a bit of a paperwork nightmare but I'm sure it could be done.

    In fact the government should have give far more advanced warning of the changes so people would not be ordering cars for Januray that will be cheaper to tax and buy in June.


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    #178
    wingnut
    Registered Users Posts: 1,939 ✭✭✭wingnut


    Come next year I will picking up a 2.0 TDCI Mondeo. The 90 ps falls into the €290 bracket, a lot cheaper to tax than my current 1.6 petrol!! The 130 ps is 4 g/km over :(


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    #179
    blackbox
    Registered Users Posts: 4,165 ✭✭✭blackbox


    prospect wrote: »
    No,

    Over all (including the manufacturing of the fuels), diesels are the greener option.


    LOL @ Mike65 & JoeA3. Although I wouldn't mind the Panda MultiJet as our #2 car.

    Prospect, your definition of "green" is different to mine...

    Dirty, dirty, smelly Diesel fuel with toxic smoke (carinogenic particulates) - not to mention the slippery deposits on the roads and the smell it puts on my shoes at the filling station.

    not for me thanks....


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    #180
    E92
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,147 ✭✭✭E92


    blackbox wrote: »
    Prospect, your definition of "green" is different to mine...

    Dirty, dirty, smelly Diesel fuel with toxic smoke (carinogenic particulates) - not to mention the slippery deposits on the roads and the smell it puts on my shoes at the filling station.

    not for me thanks....


    Living in the past there blackbox I think. A new diesel has up to 15% less CO2, the limit for Carbon Monoxide for paraffin stoves is half what the same limit for petrols is. Euro 5 will solve the big pollution issue associated with diesels, namely PM, the limit is 20% what the Euro 4 limit is. Though they still will pollute more Nitrous Oxide than a petrol. A petrol with the same CO2 emissions as a diesel is greener than a diesel no question though, but as I mentioned earlier, that rarely happens(BMW's EfficientDynamics models are one of the very rare cases where this occurs the 325i Auto 170 g/km, the 325d Auto does 169 g/km, 330i Auto 173 g/km, 330d Auto 175 g/km, but the diesels have the advantage when you go back to a manual gearbox).


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    #181
    JHMEG
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,686 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    E92 wrote: »
    Living in the past there blackbox I think.
    BB is realistic. Right now, today, Euro 4 diesels are dirty and dangerous. Due to the overbuilding of diesel engines, Euro 4's will unfortunately remain with us for another 10 or 15 years. Oh and car makers will be churning out Euro 4 diesels till 2011.


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