Irish Teen Fears Execution in Egypt

end of the road · 02-12-2014 3:32pm

Sonderkommando wrote: »

Absolutely no sympathy for him at all. I don't wish for him to be executed but truly hope he never sets a foot in this country again.

he's an irish citizen. so lets hope he does set foot back where he belongs. in ireland

end of the road · 02-12-2014 3:34pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

He and his sisters have said that they were holidaying, shopping, but there were warnings about tourists staying away from areas of unrest. They were not innocently caught up in anything. They were posting on Facebook for weeks beforehand about it. They were actively involved and claiming now that they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. I don't agree with him being imprisoned this long without trial or being executed but they need to take some responsibility for their actions. They considered themselves Egyptian until they realised that the Irish government are far more likely to get them out of the mess that they wholeheartedly walked into.

they were protesting. so what. that is being innocent

R P McMurphy · 02-12-2014 3:36pm

Sonderkommando wrote: »

Absolutely no sympathy for him at all. I don't wish for him to be executed but truly hope he never sets a foot in this country again.

What exactly is it that you think he did in Egypt?

bucketybuck · 02-12-2014 3:38pm

R P McMurphy wrote: »

What exactly is it that you think he did in Egypt?

Walked like an Egyptian.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 3:41pm

Who let's a 17 year old go to a war zone?

Plus I love how the imagery has changed over the months - now he's pictured on a tricolour background wearing a track suit top!!

josip · 02-12-2014 3:53pm

Calibos wrote: »

...after I got mixed up in human rights protests or something.

So innocuous.
Much accidental.

wes · 02-12-2014 3:55pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Who let's a 17 year old go to a war zone?

There was war in Egypt at the time? Also, they arrived before the trouble started from what I understand. Either way it wasn't a war zone as you put it.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 3:59pm

wes wrote: »

There was war in Egypt at the time? Also, they arrived before the trouble started from what I understand. Either way it wasn't a war zone as you put it.

Yes, ok - there wasn't an interstate war going on, but let's face it there was severe civil disruption and they went there of their own volition.

Now they expect to baled out by the government.

If they want to help the disadvantaged and haven't we plenty here they could've worked with?

wes · 02-12-2014 4:04pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Yes, ok - there wasn't an interstate war going on, but let's face it there was severe civil disruption and they went there of their own volition.

Now they expect to baled out by the government.

If they want to help the disadvantaged and haven't we plenty here they could've worked with?

Again, my understanding was they were there before the unrest, and again all they did was get involved in a protest, and I find it bizarre that this seems to enrage people so much, with people saying he should be allowed back in the country etc. You would think he was murdering puppies for a laugh, the way some people are going on.

josip · 02-12-2014 4:04pm

Jawgap wrote: »

...If they want to help the disadvantaged and haven't we plenty here they could've worked with?

Most of us would be considered kafirs.

wes · 02-12-2014 4:06pm

josip wrote: »

Most of us would be considered kafirs.

You are basing this on what exactly? Has the lad who is prison said anything of the sort, or are you just making stuff up, to make him seem like some kind of villan. As it stands, he got involved in a protest, and there is feck all proof of him doing anything else, so people are left with making stuff up to justify there irrational hatred and anger and this guy. Utterly bizarre stuff.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 4:06pm

wes wrote: »

Again, my understanding was they were there before the unrest, and again all they did was get involved in a protest, and I find it bizarre that this seems to enrage people so much, with people saying he should be allowed back in the country etc. You would think he was murdering puppies for a laugh, the way some people are going on.

Yes and when it all kicked off the Irish ambassador arranged safe passage for them, they refused and opted to stay THEN they were arrested!

He's there because he was silly enough to go and not clever enough to come out when he had the opportunity.

RobYourBuilder · 02-12-2014 4:17pm

end of the road wrote: »

he's an irish citizen. so lets hope he does set foot back where he belongs. in ireland

He's also an Egyptian citizen and when the Halawas spoke at the Muslim Brotherhood rally, they referred to themselves as "Egyptians living outside". Well, one's no longer outside. He's home in Egypt.

wes · 02-12-2014 4:18pm

Jawgap wrote: »

He's there because he was silly enough to go and not clever enough to come out when he had the opportunity.

Ok, and I fail to see how that justifies people saying he shouldn't come back to Ireland, or the sheer amount of hatred being directed at the guy.

Seriously, he got involved in a protest and stayed when he should have probably returned to Ireland, and thats it. The amount of crap being thrown at him on this thread, would lead someone to think as per the example I gave earlier that he was killing puppies or something.

**EDIT**
Looks like what your saying was untrue, so again people making stuff up. Honestly, did this guy insult posters mothers or something?
**END EDIT**

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 4:20pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Yes and when it all kicked off the Irish ambassador arranged safe passage for them, they refused and opted to stay THEN they were arrested!

That never happened. There was no need for safe passage because flights were running without problem. The Irish government offered to help when it learnt of their arrest and detention.

Also they all consider themselves Irish, I know people that are close to them.

Why do you feel the need to lie and make things up? It's sad that you try push a disgusting agenda on a thread about an Irish teen who risks execution.

Rubberchikken · 02-12-2014 4:22pm

at 17 and an irish citizen maybe something should have been done, irrespective of why he was in egypt in the first place.
i figure nothing's been done for the simple reason that ireland hasn't the connections/interest to deal with it.

wes · 02-12-2014 4:24pm

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

He's also an Egyptian citizen and when the Halawas spoke at the Muslim Brotherhood rally, they referred to themselves as "Egyptians living outside". Well, one's no longer outside. He's home in Egypt.

Now, it would far more accurate to say he is in prison for protesting, and is also an Irish citizen, and not as you put it "He's home in Egypt. ".

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 4:29pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

That never happened. There was no need for safe passage because flights were running without problem. The Irish government offered to help when it learnt of their arrest and detention.

Also they all consider themselves Irish, I know people that are close to them.

Why do you feel the need to lie and make things up? It's sad that you try push a disgusting agenda on a thread about an Irish teen who risks execution.

Really? Because according to the story in the Irish Times

Irish Ambassador Isolde Moylan managed to obtain a safe passage out of the mosque where Mr Halawa and his three sisters - Somaia (28), Fatima (23), and Omaima (21)- were trapped and their exit to Ireland. However, they refused and were arrested.

They are Irish citizens - I'm not denying that. But they had consular assistance - very good consular assistance if the ambassador was involved - and didn't avail of the opportunity. They wanted to make a political point - well they're making it.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 4:30pm

wes wrote: »

Ok, and I fail to see how that justifies people saying he shouldn't come back to Ireland, or the sheer amount of hatred being directed at the guy.

Seriously, he got involved in a protest and stayed when he should have probably returned to Ireland, and thats it. The amount of crap being thrown at him on this thread, would lead someone to think as per the example I gave earlier that he was killing puppies or something.

**EDIT**
Looks like what your saying was untrue, so again people making stuff up. Honestly, did this guy insult posters mothers or something?
**END EDIT**

I don't hate him and don't think he should be executed. It's sad that Egypt isn't as tolerant and liberal a society as the one we live in. I believe in the right to protest, but unfortunately the Egyptians didn't at the time. The Halawas went to Egypt with the intention of demonstrating, in fact spearheading the demonstrations. Now they're claiming they were the integrated Irish children of expats returning to visit their family.

wes · 02-12-2014 4:38pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

I don't hate him and don't think he should be executed. It's sad that Egypt isn't as tolerant and liberal a society as the one we live in.

I was talking about the general vitriol being fired his way.

denhaagenite wrote: »

I believe in the right to protest, but unfortunately the Egyptians didn't at the time.

There were dozens of protests before and after, and the country was briefly before that time a democracy.

denhaagenite wrote: »

The Halawas went to Egypt with the intention of demonstrating, in fact spearheading the demonstrations. Now they're claiming they were the integrated Irish children of expats returning to visit their family.

Again, last I checked they were there before the protests happened, as for spear heading the demonstrations, that sounds like hyperbole.

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 4:39pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Really? Because according to the story in the Irish Times

They are Irish citizens - I'm not denying that. But they had consular assistance - very good consular assistance if the ambassador was involved - and didn't avail of the opportunity. They wanted to make a political point - well they're making it.

Out of the mosque where they were already being detained by a surrounding police force. They refused because they feared that those not in the same position would be slaughtered by police once the non-nationals had vacated.

I commend them for that sort of courage, its a shame we don't have more young Irish teens like them, what a credit to our country.

RobYourBuilder · 02-12-2014 4:40pm

wes wrote: »

Now, it would far more accurate to say he is in prison for protesting, and is also an Irish citizen, and not as you put it "He's home in Egypt. ".

I'm not interested in getting into a banal argument with you. Let's look at the legal aspect to this.

"Let's say you're an Egyptian citizen as well as a Canadian citizen. The authorities would probably be emboldened to take more aggressive action because you're subject to laws of that country as a citizen."

When it comes to international law and the treatment of dual nationals, some countries have signed on to a 1930 Hague convention. That treaty states that a state "may not afford diplomatic protection to one of its nationals against a state whose nationality such person also possesses."

"It's not a treaty that obliges the government to provide protection," said Macklin. "It's simply one that says in these circumstances if you sign this treaty you are saying you won't [provide protection] when the person is in the country of their other nationality."

But Canada is not a signatory to that treaty.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mohamed-fahmy-case-dual-citizenship-can-complicate-diplomatic-protection-1.2684357

But Ireland is a signatory. Ergo, for all intents of purposes he will be treated as an Egyptian citizen. Other than ensuring that he's being humanely treated, I think that there is little the state can do.

Whether he prefers Mido or Robbie Keane matters not a jot.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 4:45pm

wes wrote: »

Again, last I checked they were there before the protests happened, as for spear heading the demonstrations, that sounds like hyperbole.

Did you not watch the video on the previous page? Addressing a crowd on behalf of the Muslim Brotherhood? They were there before the protests, correct. But they intentionally went to protest and that is a fact. As I said they made no secret of this fact on social media before they went.

I completely believe in the integration and assimilation of those who wish to be Irish citizens but involvement in the Muslim Brotherhood doesn't suggest to me a family that are overly interested in their Irish heritage. They're not even interested in the safety of their 17 year old boy.

Having said that, they are Irish citizens. The consulate went to their assistance and were told that it wasn't wanted. That, I believe, is as much as they are owed as Irish citizens.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 4:51pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

Out of the mosque where they were already being detained by a surrounding police force. They refused because they feared that those not in the same position would be slaughtered by police once the non-nationals had vacated.

I commend them for that sort of courage, its a shame we don't have more young Irish teens like them, what a credit to our country.

So they placed themselves in that position? They were given a choice and decided to stay?

What business has an Irish citizen protesting in a country they don't live in?

And I'm glad we don't have too many teens silly enough to go into authoritarian regimes to protest - it rarely ends well, for them or their families.

wes · 02-12-2014 4:55pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

Did you not watch the video on the previous page? Addressing a crowd on behalf of the Muslim Brotherhood?

Protests that has a lot of people speaking at them. Speaking at a protest isn't the same as spear heading them.

denhaagenite wrote: »

They were there before the protests, correct. But they intentionally went to protest and that is a fact. As I said they made no secret of this fact on social media before they went.

No one is denying that they decided to protest, when they were already there.

denhaagenite wrote: »

I completely believe in the integration and assimilation of those who wish to be Irish citizens but involvement in the Muslim Brotherhood doesn't suggest to me a family that are overly interested in their Irish heritage. They're not even interested in the safety of their 17 year old boy.

He was involved in what were arguable pro-democracy protests, and I fail to see why integration has to do with anything.

denhaagenite wrote: »

Having said that, they are Irish citizens. The consulate went to their assistance and were told that it wasn't wanted. That, I believe, is as much as they are owed as Irish citizens.

Hardly justifies the some of the comments on here, about how he shouldn't be allowed back etc now does it?

wes · 02-12-2014 4:59pm

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

I'm not interested in getting into a banal argument with you.

Then, maybe don't trot stuff like that on a internet message board if you don't want to get into arguments then......

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

Let's look at the legal aspect to this.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/mohamed-fahmy-case-dual-citizenship-can-complicate-diplomatic-protection-1.2684357

But Ireland is a signatory. Ergo, for all intents of purposes he will be treated as an Egyptian citizen. Other than ensuring that he's being humanely treated, I think that there is little the state can do.

Well, if we are going to talk about legality, then I am pretty sure a military junta is completely illegal........

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:01pm

Jawgap wrote: »

And I'm glad we don't have too many teens silly enough to go into authoritarian regimes to protest - it rarely ends well, for them or their families.

We Irish have an incredibly proud history of standing up to bullies. There are a number of Irish human rights activists on the front lines in China, Israel, Nepal and of course Egypt.

I am incredibly proud at how courageous these teens were, they risked their lives for a worthwhile cause. I'm sure a lot of those who were with them will think of Ireland very fondly as a result.

I think people like you are a blight on the country. Too afraid to stand up for anything and perfectly content to criticize those brave enough to risk their lives. I am glad some of our youth has more backbone than the likes of you.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 5:05pm

wes wrote: »

Protests that has a lot of people speaking at them. Speaking at a protest isn't the same as spear heading them.

They would not be speaking at a protest on behalf of the Muslim Brotherhood if they were not members of the Muslim Brotherhood. Protests don't usually have anyone jumping up on the podium to speak. You'd want to have some clout to be afforded the podium. They were part of the organisation, not poor tourists that accidentally got locked in a mosque.

wes wrote: »

No one is denying that they decided to protest, when they were already there.

It was on their Facebook pages before they left to go to Egypt that this was their intention.

wes wrote: »

He was involved in what were arguable pro-democracy protests, and I fail to see why integration has to do with anything.

Pro Muslim Brotherhood protests. Hardly as Irish as soda bread, and I don't believe that a protest in favour of a Muslim society could be argued democratic.

wes wrote: »

Hardly justifies the some of the comments on here, about how he shouldn't be allowed back etc now does it?

I don't agree with those comments. I just think that since they rebuffed the previous attempts of the Irish government to assist there's not a whole lot that can be done about it now.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:09pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

We Irish have an incredibly proud history of standing up to bullies. There are a number of Irish human rights activists on the front lines in China, Israel, Nepal and of course Egypt.

I am incredibly proud at how courageous these teens were, they risked their lives for a worthwhile cause. I'm sure a lot of those who were with them will think of Ireland very fondly as a result.

I think people like you are a blight on the country. Too afraid to stand up for anything and perfectly content to criticize those brave enough to risk their lives. I am glad some of our youth has more backbone than the likes of you.

You strike me as the equivalent of a politician who sends soldiers off to war but won't go themselves.....

.......and I don't mind adults making decisions to go protest, but teens?? You advocate sending teens to protest authoritarianism?

If you admire them so much, why don't you go?

.....and you've no idea about me. I've spent nearly half my working life in the service of the State helping real people solve real everyday problems, not to mention the voluntary work I do now. And, yes I've done my protesting.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:11pm

BTW, if people want to protest, why not protest the homelessness crisis, the HSE, child poverty, educational disadvantage......right here.

Knasher · 02-12-2014 5:17pm

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

But Ireland is a signatory. Ergo, for all intents of purposes he will be treated as an Egyptian citizen. Other than ensuring that he's being humanely treated, I think that there is little the state can do.

That isn't technically true. Ireland is a signatory to that treaty, but being a signatory doesn't actually make a treaty binding, it simply indicates an intention to ratify it at some point in the future.

According to http://eudo-citizenship.eu/databases/international-legal-norms/?search=1&stype=2&country=Ireland we haven't actually ratified this, ergo it isn't binding.

wes · 02-12-2014 5:18pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

They would not be speaking at a protest on behalf of the Muslim Brotherhood if they were not members of the Muslim Brotherhood. Protests don't usually have anyone jumping up on the podium to speak. You'd want to have some clout to be afforded the podium. They were part of the organisation, not poor tourists that accidentally got locked in a mosque.

No one said they were't part of the protests, but again speaking at protest doesn't equal spear heading it, and I have no idea whether they are member of the Muslim Brotherhood. Again, I fail to see what is wrong with protesting exactly?

denhaagenite wrote: »

It was on their Facebook pages before they left to go to Egypt that this was their intention.

I have the exact opposite.

denhaagenite wrote: »

Pro Muslim Brotherhood protests. Hardly as Irish as soda bread, and I don't believe that a protest in favour of a Muslim society could be argued democratic.

The democratically elected governmenet were removed by a military junta and not free and fair elections. So yeah, they were protesting for democracy, as they were protesting against the military junta.

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:18pm

Jawgap wrote: »

BTW, if people want to protest, why not protest the homelessness crisis, the HSE, child poverty, educational disadvantage......right here.

Different people will feel connected to different issues. The teens in question were witnesses to horrible human rights abuses and this obviously affected them.

RobYourBuilder · 02-12-2014 5:18pm

wes wrote: »

Then, maybe don't trot stuff like that on a internet message board if you don't want to get into arguments then......

Well, if we are going to talk about legality, then I am pretty sure a military junta is completely illegal........

Once he entered Egypt, his Irish citizenship became irrelevant. Simple as. Hes an Egyptian citizen locked up in an Egyptian jail. It's not our problem.

The Irish state has already went above and beyond in trying to help him.

In a bold diplomatic move, the Irish ambassador to Egypt, Isolde Moylan, flanked by a number of consular staff from the Irish Embassy in Egypt and members of the EU delegation in Cairo, are set to attend the court hearing.

This unprecedented show of high-level support is believed to be a tactical, yet subtle, flexing of diplomatic muscle intended to put pressure on the Egyptian authorities to release Ibrahim.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/diplomatic-team-to-attend-jailed-teenagers-cairo-trial-30427033.html#sthash.ZpV6EvaX.dpuf

Halawa has been visited 19 times by consular staff

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/trial-in-cairo-of-irish-national-ibrahim-halawa-postponed-until-august-1.1867527

If they didn't attend the Muslim Brotherhood rally and instead took up the Irish consulates offer of transport out of Egypt, then they wouldn't be in this predicament today. A rally where the Halawas proudly declared that they are "Egyptians from outside".

Now they are trying to wrap themselves in the green. Laughable.

wes · 02-12-2014 5:19pm

Jawgap wrote: »

BTW, if people want to protest, why not protest the homelessness crisis, the HSE, child poverty, educational disadvantage......right here.

I may as well ask, why are even commenting on this thread, when you could just as easily comment on the HSE, child poverty, etc as well, and it would make about as much sense.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 5:19pm

wes wrote: »

Now, it would far more accurate to say he is in prison for protesting, and is also an Irish citizen, and not as you put it "He's home in Egypt. ".

Have to counter this also. He described himself as being an Egyptian outside. I consider him Irish but he considers himself Egyptian. So that is what the poster meant.

wes · 02-12-2014 5:21pm

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

If they didn't attend the Muslim Brotherhood rally and instead took up the Irish consulates offer of transport out of Egypt, then they wouldn't be in this predicament today. A rally where the Halawas proudly declared that they are "Egyptians from outside".

They are dual citizens, so I fail to see how that statement some how justifies any of this, and its certainly good to see our government doing what they can to help, but again I really do fail to see why so many people seem to be against them.

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

Now they are trying to wrap themselves in the green. Laughable.

How dare, they state that they are Egyptian being dual nationals and all. Laughable for you to somehow take issue with this.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:23pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

Different people will feel connected to different issues. The teens in question were witnesses to horrible human rights abuses and this obviously affected them.

Fair enough - but they chose to go, they chose to stay when they could've come out - as I said they wanted to make a point, they're making it.

If they wanted to help the people in Egypt why not stay here and fund raise, then channel the money towards community projects there?

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:25pm

Jawgap wrote: »

You strike me as the equivalent of a politician who sends soldiers off to war but won't go themselves.....

I have spent my hard earned money to travel with fellow Irish and to protest against human rights abuses in Israel.

.......and I don't mind adults making decisions to go protest, but teens?? You advocate sending teens to protest authoritarianism?

They were visiting relatives. The protests hadn't even started when they arrived.

.....and you've no idea about me. I've spent nearly half my working life in the service of the State helping real people solve real everyday problems, not to mention the voluntary work I do now. And, yes I've done my protesting.

And yet you display a disgustingly cold attitude to an Irish teen who faces the death penalty for protesting for democracy, what a great attitude you have.

wes · 02-12-2014 5:25pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

Have to counter this also. He described himself as being an Egyptian outside. I consider him Irish but he considers himself Egyptian. So that is what the poster meant.

He can consider himself both, seeing he is a Egyptian national as well, as seeing as he was at a protest in Egypt they would clearly talk that up. Again, all we have is an example of someone of dual citizenship saying as such.

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:28pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Fair enough - but they chose to go, they chose to stay when they could've come out - as I said they wanted to make a point, they're making it.

If they wanted to help the people in Egypt why not stay here and fund raise, then channel the money towards community projects there?

They have already stated that they stayed in the mosque because they and other non-nationals to Egypt felt that the army would storm and kill everyone inside once the foreigners had vacated. I absolutely commend them for being so brave and flying our countries flag so honourably.

I believe they were in Egypt when the protests were happening and took to the streets. Once again the courage they showed was tremendous.

Like I've said, an absolute credit to our little island. Makes me proud to share the island with such brave, young people.

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:30pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

Have to counter this also. He described himself as being an Egyptian outside. I consider him Irish but he considers himself Egyptian. So that is what the poster meant.

That is complete and utter bollix. I know people close to the family. He tells people he's Irish and considers himself Egyptian-Irish (an Irish national of Egyptian heritage). Always has done.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:31pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

I have spent my hard earned money to travel with fellow Irish and to protest against human rights abuses in Israel.

They were visiting relatives. The protests hadn't even started when they arrived.

And yet you display a disgustingly cold attitude to an Irish teen who faces the death penalty for protesting for democracy, what a great attitude you have.

Ah yes, I'd be willing to guess what you protested against in Israel - and it wasn't the same thing I protested here.

I hope he gets out, soon and is home with his family - my objection is to way the narrative of what happened is being corrupted. It takes the rest of us for mugs and that's annoying.

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:37pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Ah yes, I'd be willing to guess what you protested against in Israel - and it wasn't the same thing I protested here.

I hope he gets out, soon and is home with his family - my objection is to way the narrative of what happened is being corrupted. It takes the rest of us for mugs and that's annoying.

The only disgusting narrative is the one trying to paint them as trouble-making islamists who are leeches on the country and not *really* Irish because of their skin colour.

And there are massive undertones of that in a lot of posts.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:41pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

The only disgusting narrative is the one trying to paint them as trouble-making islamists who are leeches on the country and not *really* Irish because of their skin colour.

And there are massive undertones of that in a lot of posts.

.....and where did say any of that?

Putinovsky · 02-12-2014 5:43pm

Jawgap wrote: »

.....and where did say any of that?

I didn't single out you personally. I would have to review your posts to see if that was present and I don't really want to do that.

Considering your response just now its obvious you don't think they were trouble makers, or islamists and agree they are as Irish as you and me and that's good enough for me.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 5:45pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

The only disgusting narrative is the one trying to paint them as trouble-making islamists who are leeches on the country and not *really* Irish because of their skin colour.

And there are massive undertones of that in a lot of posts.

Nope, I don't care what their ethnicity is and I think there are very few here that do. People are annoyed that they are pretending that they had no idea of the protests and were in no way involved. It's not true and I would have a lot more respect for them if they would just come out and say that. It would entitle them no less to Irish citizenship. Fact is, they went in knowing exactly the consequences that they were leaving themselves open to.

Nodin · 02-12-2014 5:48pm

denhaagenite wrote: »

Nope, I don't care what their ethnicity is and I think there are very few here that do. People are annoyed that they are pretending that they had no idea of the protests and were in no way involved. It's not true and I would have a lot more respect for them if they would just come out and say that. It would entitle them no less to Irish citizenship. Fact is, they went in knowing exactly the consequences that they were leaving themselves open to.

As already pointed out, they went to Egypt before the protests started and before any travel warnings were issued.

Jawgap · 02-12-2014 5:51pm

Putinovsky wrote: »

I didn't single out you personally. I would have to review your posts to see if that was present and I don't really want to do that.

Considering your response just now its obvious you don't think they were trouble makers, or islamists and agree they are as Irish as you and me and that's good enough for me.

I don't think they were agitators or Islamicists - misguided perhaps and certainly stupid for not getting out when they could - but again, if they want to garner public support they'd do better to be more honest about why they were there and what their intentions were.

denhaagenite · 02-12-2014 5:59pm

Nodin wrote: »

As already pointed out, they went to Egypt before the protests started and before any travel warnings were issued.

How many times do I have to reiterate, they were aware that there was unrest and travelled with full intent on joining it when they got to Egypt. There is really no point in me linking to their Facebook pages now as it was 7/ 8 months ago, but his sisters were constantly posting about it. Posted about nothing else except their "activism" if memory serves me correctly.

Irish Teen Fears Execution in Egypt

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