Motors Chat - Round 10

CIP4 · 02-05-2016 10:47pm

Some diesels have manual primer bulbs on the line but most of the 1.6 psa don't and most also don't have fuel lift pumps making them fcuking notoriously difficult to start when air gets into the system. If it had a primer on the line you could use that or if the lift pump runs on ignition start, turn on and off the ignition 10-15 times and hope the system primes itself with fuel. Ideally just don't run out of fuel :pac: but even changing a fuel filter on a 1.6 hdi can be an absolute nightmare and you end up towing it up and down the road like an idiot trying to get it to start. The dealers have a proper tool to suck the fuel up the line on them.

frozenfrozen · 02-05-2016 10:57pm

**** that so, would something like that be covered by the AA? I was googling trying to find out what to do but all that was there was ads for bleeding kits so I said **** that.

It was already booked in for a service tomorrow because of a weird noise as he said.. and from googling it looks like it could be a sludge thing or turbo on the way out... either way they're in for a world of pain I would say.

We were priming it over and over all right but it was push button to start so you had to keep pulling out the key and waiting a second and putting it back in to hear the pump start.. pain in the hole.

I think the moral of the story is definitely to never ever run out of diesel.

CIP4 · 02-05-2016 11:01pm

Afaik the AA would cover it. They would come out and try and sort it out if you have membership with them. I find the best policy is just keep over 1/4 of a tank at all times as it also means if you have to get somewhere in an emergency you will have enough fuel to get there.

Foxhole Norman · 03-05-2016 1:41am

It's been a month and 1,000 miles since I serviced the car and no oil light.... it feels very strange :pac:

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 7:37am

frozenfrozen wrote: »

he had someone show up who tried loosening fuel injectors and there was diesel spurting all over the place but they couldn't get it going and eventually gave up.

Ugh, I hate these clueless b*stards who treat commonrail diesels like 1980s Transit engines. Never ever should you loosen the injector line on a commonrail diesel unless you're replacing something.

It's possible for the pressure to bend the injector line. Most manufacturers will also say once you loosen the injector lines that you need to replace the seal/washer to make sure diesel doesn't leak.

The car should have started by putting on and off the ignition 1000 times and cranking for ages but I'd say the battery would have been drained.

nd · 03-05-2016 7:57am

I'm wondering has anyone ever inquired about this to the nct.

Say your car hasn't had an nct in 6 months. You get it ncted and it passes. It is then backdated so your new nct is out again in 6 months.
If you are willing to pay another 55 euros could you get another new nct right there with 12 months test(possibly without having to do the test again as it has just passed)? Or would you have to go home. Book it in online and wait a few weeks for an appointment.

Big Nasty · 03-05-2016 8:46am

No, you can't do that.

What you could do is have it tested three months later and then have 15 months test.

Mycroft H · 03-05-2016 10:21am

CIP4 wrote: »

Some diesels have manual primer bulbs on the line but most of the 1.6 psa don't and most also don't have fuel lift pumps making them fcuking notoriously difficult to start when air gets into the system. If it had a primer on the line you could use that or if the lift pump runs on ignition start, turn on and off the ignition 10-15 times and hope the system primes itself with fuel. Ideally just don't run out of fuel :pac: but even changing a fuel filter on a 1.6 hdi can be an absolute nightmare and you end up towing it up and down the road like an idiot trying to get it to start. The dealers have a proper tool to suck the fuel up the line on them.

Our old C5 had one, 2006 120bhp.

I think we're one of the lucky ones; it has a cigar shaped primer on the top of the engine. Few squeezes and it'll start.

Don't ask me what I did, amateur hour.

nd · 03-05-2016 10:33am

Big Nasty wrote: »

No, you can't do that.

What you could do is have it tested three months later and then have 15 months test.

But for example a car I tested recently and is not due a test until 01/01/2017, I seem to be able to book it online for a test.

I thought since they brought in the voluntary early test you could book it in any time you wanted.

Big Nasty · 03-05-2016 10:45am

You should only be able to book it up to three months early.

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 10:49am

I'd say manufacturers are removing the priming buttons/bulbs just to save money. I can't understand any other reason NOT to have them.

fancy pigeon · 03-05-2016 10:52am

shietpilot wrote: »

It's possible for the pressure to bend the injector line. Most manufacturers will also say once you loosen the injector lines that you need to replace the seal/washer to make sure diesel doesn't leak.
.

No seal in an injector line. It's flared and works in the same way as a brake line. Injectors have washers at the seat

shietpilot wrote: »

The car should have started by putting on and off the ignition 1000 times and cranking for ages but I'd say the battery would have been drained.

C220 CDI has no primer or pump before the filter. Easiest way is to remove the filter, fill it up and crank until it runs. It'd be difficult to retrofit a primer with the layout of the lines in the bay. By comparison, a black M57D29 330d has 2 pumps before the filter; a very low pressure sender and a 6 bar cigar under the passenger seat. Do turn the key with the line disconnected and you have diesel all over the headlight if you're unlucky...!

shietpilot wrote: »

I'd say manufacturers are removing the priming buttons/bulbs just to save money. I can't understand any other reason NOT to have them.

To force you to go to a garage and away from DIY methinks....

frozenfrozen · 03-05-2016 11:32am

all of the injection lines were loosened and tightened again over and over and the car was being cranked over and over again. They towed it to a garage last night.. well.. the dealer

There was a lot of putting the ignition off and on and off and on and cranking so it's a bit mad it didn't sort itself out at all

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 11:39am

fancy pigeon wrote: »

No seal in an injector line. It's flared and works in the same way as a brake line. Injectors have washers at the seat

I guess that's true. Just had a flick of the Volvo's service manual and they say that the flare bends when the injector line is sealed, so if you remove the injector line for a job you have to put in a new line or else it will be p*ssing diesel.

nd · 03-05-2016 11:39am

Big Nasty wrote: »

You should only be able to book it up to three months early.

they changed the rules a bit back though, although I thought it was only late last year

"Voluntary Early Testing
From July 28, 2014, car owners and members of the motor trade will be able to book an NCT test at any point throughout the year prior to their next mandatory test. Previously, NCT tests could only be booked within 90 days of a vehicle’s test due date."
http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Your-Vehicle/Your-Vehicle-/NCT/Voluntary-Early-Testing/

fancy pigeon · 03-05-2016 11:47am

shietpilot wrote: »

I guess that's true. Just had a flick of the Volvo's service manual and they say that the flare bends when the injector line is sealed, so if you remove the injector line for a job you have to put in a new line or else it will be p*ssing diesel.

I've never had to replace lines in all the years I've been rooting with diesel pumps; from low pressure IDI to CR lines. Never had a leak from the lines either. Only major leaks are when the washers go behind the delivery valve in VE pumps, thus they dribble.

Think of it this way; do they tell you to renew the metal brake lines when replacing a brake hose? Because a similar thing happens to the flare initially

To me, that sounds like crap they peddle at you to buy new parts...!

Interslice · 03-05-2016 11:55am

shietpilot wrote: »

I guess that's true. Just had a flick of the Volvo's service manual and they say that the flare bends when the injector line is sealed, so if you remove the injector line for a job you have to put in a new line or else it will be p*ssing diesel.

I've opened an injector on my own 1.8tdci to get it going again and no problem with the seal afterwards. Only a flared connection as FP says. Think I've an older style of common rail than your though. Filled the fuel filter, cracked an injector turned it over a few times, closed the injector nut, hooked it up to a mates van for extra starter spins and it fired up right away. It was after I purposely ran the whole system dry and took the battery out so no one would nick it. Only diesel leaks I've seen after tinkering was from the gaskets on the old distributor pumps.

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 1:10pm

Interslice wrote: »

I've opened an injector on my own 1.8tdci to get it going again and no problem with the seal afterwards. Only a flared connection as FP says. Think I've an older style of common rail than your though. Filled the fuel filter, cracked an injector turned it over a few times, closed the injector nut, hooked it up to a mates van for extra starter spins and it fired up right away. It was after I purposely ran the whole system dry and took the battery out so no one would nick it. Only diesel leaks I've seen after tinkering was from the gaskets on the old distributor pumps.

I've a 1.8 TDCI too. I was just quoting the service manual for the 2.4 D5 volvo engine :P I did the fuel filter on my 1.8 TDCI too and I just used a vacuum pump to get the air out by unhooking the return hose and plugging the vacuum pump onto the fuel filter housing. It started instantly and ran without hassle, no cranking needed :cool:

joujoujou · 03-05-2016 1:36pm

frozenfrozen wrote: »

[...]

I think the moral of the story is definitely to never ever run out of diesel.

I think the moral of the story is definitely to never ever own a diesel.

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 1:40pm

joujoujou wrote: »

I think the moral of the story is definitely to never ever own a diesel.

Well it's a lot worse running out of fuel than driving a diesel powered car :P You get plenty of warnings when you are low on fuel.

My Focus will beep every time you start it with the fuel light on :pac: I don't hear it often so every time it happens my initial reaction is "WTF was that?!"

Mycroft H · 03-05-2016 1:56pm

Speaking of terrible things that happen when you own a diesel.

Kildare - Wexford - Waterford - Kildare. Not bad for a 13 year old lump of an estate.

And it passed it's NCT today. No schmoke laaaaad.

(Limit is 3m)

bear1 · 03-05-2016 2:00pm

Renault?

Mycroft H · 03-05-2016 2:12pm

bear1 wrote: »

Renault?

Citroen C5.

One of the best bang for your bangernomics money out there.

Cupra280 · 03-05-2016 2:25pm

nd wrote: »

But for example a car I tested recently and is not due a test until 01/01/2017, I seem to be able to book it online for a test.

I thought since they brought in the voluntary early test you could book it in any time you wanted.

There is a voluntary early testing period, but that is limited to 3 months before the car is due the NCT. Therefore, getting an appointment from 01/10/2016 onwards will satisfy the early testing and then the date of the next test will be 01/01/2019 (assuming that the car is under 10 years old).

You can still book a test, if you wanted, anytime from now, but then you are beyond the voluntary testing period, so the next test will be due 2 years from that test.

The Black Oil · 03-05-2016 7:29pm

This evening was the second time I've seen a pedestrian wandering northbound on the M1, whilst I've been sitting on a bus. Should I just ring the Guards in these situations..?

polan · 03-05-2016 7:42pm

I really want to take part in Gumball 3000 at some stage.. got my car design ready!

GvidoR · 03-05-2016 8:03pm

OSI wrote: »

It doesn't shout douchebag enough.

Racist!

166man · 03-05-2016 8:30pm

OSI wrote: »

My deepest apologies to the people of the United Sates of Douchbagia

Ah now surely the badge on the front is enough...?

CIP4 · 03-05-2016 9:04pm

shietpilot wrote: »

Well it's a lot worse running out of fuel than driving a diesel powered car :P You get plenty of warnings when you are low on fuel.

My Focus will beep every time you start it with the fuel light on :pac: I don't hear it often so every time it happens my initial reaction is "WTF was that?!"

Most newer diesel's give loads of warning and beeps to the point where it is impossible to ignore the fact your low on fuel and most from the light coming on will comfortably do 100km some even up on 140km. A big exception is my Megane. It has an 8 bar digital gauge which is a bad start.

But a few weeks ago I nearly ran out of fuel. Getting on the motorway in Carlow light comes on no beep no drama. For people unfamiliar with the mk3 Megane when the gauge drops from 1/4 to 1/8 the light immediately comes on and the range goes ---km (the one time you need a range reading) but anyway I think Carlow to Kilkenny that nothing sub 40km no problem. ~30km later still ~10km from petrol station and on the motorway gauge drops to no bars. I'm like there oh fcuk no bars supposedly means you have essentially no fuel and will get 5-10km. I made it but it was very tense and there was a lot of don't run out of fuel please being shouted.

But that's just bad design from the light 40km and your fcuked and a digital fuel gauge should have at least 10-12 intervals 8 is not enough when you start getting low you want accuracy. Also interesting fact the reason why the range reads ---km when the light comes on is because someone took Renault to court when there car ran out reading 20km range and so Renault put a software update on all mk3 Meganes to read no range when light is on to stop lawsuits.

shietpilot · 03-05-2016 9:09pm

CIP4 wrote: »

Also interesting fact the reason why the range reads ---km when the light comes on is because someone took Renault to court when there car ran out reading 20km range and so Renault put a software update on all mk3 Meganes to read no range when light is on to stop lawsuits.

Another stupid person who cannot handle their responsibilities as a driver looking for someone to blame ruining it for everyone else :mad:

*********Motors Chat - Round 10 *********

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Motors Chat - Round 10