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Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2013- Mod Warning Post #1

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    #7532
    Boom__Boom
    Registered Users Posts: 3,106 ✭✭✭Boom__Boom


    The former Kildare forwards' coach has cited the fact that the county board will not be in a position to support improved commitment to the footballers' preparations next year as the reason for his decision.

    He has also called for a new fundraising committee independent of Club Déise to be formed specifically for football.

    Pretty clear what he thinks of the county board's efforts in relation to football

    http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/carew-waterford-football-is-swimming-against-the-tide-30507363.html


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    #7533
    hardybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 5,167 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    Carew is coming from a well run county side and must have been appalled with what he saw coming down, even though I'm sure the likes of Jason Ryan would have advised him of what to expect.

    As someone who togged out with Waterford for a good number of years, I found the whole experience very frustrating. At underage level in particular you could see both yourself and your team going backwards every year when meeting the opposition. This is due to bad coaching, a lack of good quality club games, insufficient prep.

    The treatment of underage in recent times is nothing short of a disgrace. We know what type of structures and preparation which is required to win or challenge for underage hurling titles. We've basically decided that we don't ever want to compete for anything in football by not following suit.

    People will throw the argument out about limited resources, couldn't give a toss about football etc., but any team we send out wearing a Waterford jersey should represent the county in a positive light. We're sending out a message that we're sloppy and disinterested.

    I have seen club set ups which are much more professional than our county set up from underage to senior, that is no exaggeration.


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    #7534
    courty08
    Registered Users Posts: 36 ✭courty08


    Excuse my ignorance, but how does the county board get away with their blatant neglect of underage football when you can see a county like Tipperary improving drastically. In most counties for minor and u21 football, the teams begin getting together in November/December. In waterford the county board don't choose a management team until February, what reason can they give for this and how haven't they been pulled up on it?

    Also an aside statement, how has Waterford ended up with possibly the most incompetent group of people running the county board. Tom Cunningham and Timmy O'Keefe for god's sake - I don't even know what other useless people are on it. Is it due to the face that no one else is interested?

    Rant over


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    #7535
    Professey Chin
    Registered Users Posts: 51,054 ✭✭✭✭Professey Chin


    courty08 wrote: »
    Excuse my ignorance, but how does the county board get away with their blatant neglect of underage football when you can see a county like Tipperary improving drastically. In most counties for minor and u21 football, the teams begin getting together in November/December. In waterford the county board don't choose a management team until February, what reason can they give for this and how haven't they been pulled up on it?

    Also an aside statement, how has Waterford ended up with possibly the most incompetent group of people running the county board. Tom Cunningham and Timmy O'Keefe for god's sake - I don't even know what other useless people are on it. Is it due to the face that no one else is interested?

    Rant over
    Id say plenty interested if they felt they could make a difference. The problem is youd need to have a big enough group running to clear them all out in 1 swoop since theyre all backing each other. Getting a group organised and in agreement like that is easier said then done


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    #7536
    hardybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 5,167 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    courty08 wrote: »
    Excuse my ignorance, but how does the county board get away with their blatant neglect of underage football when you can see a county like Tipperary improving drastically. In most counties for minor and u21 football, the teams begin getting together in November/December. In waterford the county board don't choose a management team until February, what reason can they give for this and how haven't they been pulled up on it?

    Also an aside statement, how has Waterford ended up with possibly the most incompetent group of people running the county board. Tom Cunningham and Timmy O'Keefe for god's sake - I don't even know what other useless people are on it. Is it due to the face that no one else is interested?

    Rant over

    In fairness the rot set in a few years back, and continues to spread.

    The board executive are a reflection of the clubs. We all know we have useless delegates representing the clubs, useless people on commitees, leading to a useless executive. Incidentally our clubs normally get wiped out by any opposition they meet in provincial competitions. Ultimately everyone who is a member of a club has a certain amount of responsibility for the current situation.

    I'm sure many of the individuals are well meaning and are trying their best though.


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    #7537
    Slobbery
    Closed Accounts Posts: 340 ✭✭Slobbery


    I know having the minors competing in August in Croke park is new to us, I would like to know how counties like Kilkenny and Galway handle their senior club championship and the minor intercounty? would other counties have played a adult game the night before a minor semi finals?

    to me it sounds like we were sabotaging our own chances... why play those games? there is nothing holding up the games fro the rest of the summer??? maybe the county board desperately needed the gate receipts


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    #7538
    Mountainlad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,851 ✭✭✭Mountainlad


    Passage 3-18 Fourmilewater 1-18


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    #7539
    Cake Man
    Registered Users Posts: 2,829 ✭✭✭Cake Man


    DLS 2-19 Roanmore 0-11 aswell. Any reports on those two games?


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    #7540
    Mountainlad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,851 ✭✭✭Mountainlad


    Is Maurice playin for Lismore at the minute?


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    #7541
    OldBoro
    Registered Users Posts: 49 ✭OldBoro


    Mountainlad wrote: »
    Is Maurice playin for Lismore at the minute?

    Played the last day


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    #7542
    3ships
    Registered Users Posts: 354 ✭✭3ships


    Maurice got 2-4 last week 2-3 play and 0-1 a pressure free to win it at end,
    possibly the best contribution of last week.

    Big win for Passage puts them back in contention and leaves 4mile looking at avoiding relegation tho a lot of permutations in that group which is very tight outside DLS. Abbeyside Lismore should be a good one tonight, a lot at stake.

    Reports from last night via examiner

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/hurling/powerful-passage-back-in-title-hunt-281899.html


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    #7543
    Mountainlad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,851 ✭✭✭Mountainlad


    3ships wrote: »
    Maurice got 2-4 last week 2-3 play and 0-1 a pressure free to win it at end,
    possibly the best contribution of last week.

    Big win for Passage puts them back in contention and leaves 4mile looking at avoiding relegation tho a lot of permutations in that group which is very tight outside DLS. Abbeyside Lismore should be a good one tonight, a lot at stake.

    Reports from last night via examiner

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/hurling/powerful-passage-back-in-title-hunt-281899.html

    Don't see anyone getting relegated from that Division to be honest, if you don't make the quarters it's all the one really.


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    #7544
    thegambler2
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭thegambler2


    Good wins for Dungarvan & Abbeyside in fraher field tonight


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    #7545
    cul beag
    Registered Users Posts: 969 ✭✭✭cul beag


    Good wins for dungarvan and abbeyside in fraher field. Dungarvan never looked in danger against what must be said is a shocking ballyduff upper side. Donnelly was on fire again for the winners tormenting the ballyduff defense time and time again with his direct bursts at goal. I still think they're lacking a bit of physicality in the forward line to trouble ballygunner and DLS but they're definitely heading in the right direction. The Currans were very influential aswell on the scoreboard and if you were to add in they're wides tally( must have been into double figures) they would have been over the 25pts scoring mark.
    Abbeyside always seemed in control in the second game against a poor lismore outfit. The Hurneys caused havoc all night(the positioning of Brendan Landers on Gary hurney for so long was to cost the losers enormously)and add in ferncombe(lovely stick work)in the full forward line and they always looked comfortable. Maurice Shanahan and Ray Barry were by far the only 2 you would pick out of the lismore 15. Someone told that this was Abbeyside's first ever victory over lismore in the championship,I find that hard to believe but if there are any statisticians out there I'm open to correction!!
    Of all the club games I've seen over the last 2 weekends the overall standard has been alarmingly poor in my opinion. Nothing has convinced me otherwise that there's anyone else capable of troubling the big 2 unless dungarvan can maybe push on to the next level.


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    #7546
    cul beag
    Registered Users Posts: 969 ✭✭✭cul beag


    While waiting between games last night I spoke with a person from ballyduff and the conversation was all about hurling and the standard of the club championship. In his opinion,Tallow,Ballyduff and Lismore will all be fighting relegation over the next 3 years solely due to not having numbers coming through from underage. We included Ardmore in this for this year which in reality would only leave 3 competitive senior clubs in the west. We spoke about the parish rule which exists in Tipp and cork and its pros and cons but when he stated that in the parish of Cappoquin there are 4 clubs and in the parish of Lismore there are 2 it really is crazy to think that all can survive long term.


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    #7547
    deisedude
    Registered Users Posts: 4,842 ✭✭✭deisedude


    Was at the games last night too. Have to agree the standard of hurling was abysmal


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    #7548
    deisedude
    Registered Users Posts: 4,842 ✭✭✭deisedude


    Was at the games last night too. Have to agree the standard of hurling was abysmal


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    #7549
    The blue blaa
    Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭The blue blaa


    cul beag wrote: »
    While waiting between games last night I spoke with a person from ballyduff and the conversation was all about hurling and the standard of the club championship. In his opinion,Tallow,Ballyduff and Lismore will all be fighting relegation over the next 3 years solely due to not having numbers coming through from underage. We included Ardmore in this for this year which in reality would only leave 3 competitive senior clubs in the west. We spoke about the parish rule which exists in Tipp and cork and its pros and cons but when he stated that in the parish of Cappoquin there are 4 clubs and in the parish of Lismore there are 2 it really is crazy to think that all can survive long term.

    Do you think lismore & ballsaggart would remain as one club as they do upto U21 as St.Carthages makes complete sense to an outsider they have a few nice lads comi g through underage. As for Cappoquinn could they not do similar an join up an play as an area rather then a parish, its a sticky one I know but if a lad is to have any chance of making it as a county hurler he needs to be offered the best opportunities and put the whole Bull McCabe crack behind them (ducks for cover)

    How would it work in the city??
    I dont know is it a problem with majority of clubs having enough numbers,but for me as is said many a time on here what is needed is a county board who understand GAA.What we need is all county championship for all adult ages. The county aint a massive one so I can't see why its not after being done.


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    #7550
    Slobbery
    Closed Accounts Posts: 340 ✭✭Slobbery


    cul beag wrote: »
    While waiting between games last night I spoke with a person from ballyduff and the conversation was all about hurling and the standard of the club championship. In his opinion,Tallow,Ballyduff and Lismore will all be fighting relegation over the next 3 years solely due to not having numbers coming through from underage. We included Ardmore in this for this year which in reality would only leave 3 competitive senior clubs in the west. We spoke about the parish rule which exists in Tipp and cork and its pros and cons but when he stated that in the parish of Cappoquin there are 4 clubs and in the parish of Lismore there are 2 it really is crazy to think that all can survive long term.

    For the clubs mentioned it's is a harsh reality that any up and coming prospect has to be lucky enough to get work locally, which is not always the case. Lots of players been lost that way.

    I think the clubs may need to alfalfa mate to survive - but they may prefer to drop down to junior to maintain their own identity.

    It's a Shame because lismore/Ballysaggart and Cappoquin (who is with them?) all play together at underage successfully and many are than denied the opportunity to play at the highest level in the county as the players get split up and diluted....

    What are the four clubs around cappoquin by the way? Not that familiar with the story up there


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    #7551
    Mountainlad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,851 ✭✭✭Mountainlad


    Slobbery wrote: »
    For the clubs mentioned it's is a harsh reality that any up and coming prospect has to be lucky enough to get work locally, which is not always the case. Lots of players been lost that way.

    I think the clubs may need to alfalfa mate to survive - but they may prefer to drop down to junior to maintain their own identity.

    It's a Shame because lismore/Ballysaggart and Cappoquin (who is with them?) all play together at underage successfully and many are than denied the opportunity to play at the highest level in the county as the players get split up and diluted....

    What are the four clubs around cappoquin by the way? Not that familiar with the story up there

    Tourin, Cappoquin and Glen Rovers (Mellary, think they still have a team) not sure who else.


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    #7552
    cul beag
    Registered Users Posts: 969 ✭✭✭cul beag


    The blue blaa wrote: »
    Do you think lismore & ballsaggart would remain as one club as they do upto U21 as St.Carthages makes complete sense to an outsider they have a few nice lads comi g through underage. As for Cappoquinn could they not do similar an join up an play as an area rather then a parish, its a sticky one I know but if a lad is to have any chance of making it as a county hurler he needs to be offered the best opportunities and put the whole Bull McCabe crack behind them (ducks for cover)

    How would it work in the city??
    I dont know is it a problem with majority of clubs having enough numbers,but for me as is said many a time on here what is needed is a county board who understand GAA.What we need is all county championship for all adult ages. The county aint a massive one so I can't see why its not after being done.

    Couldn't agree with you more re our county board but as regards those clubs joining id say it wouldn't happen because of all sides looking to hold their identity instead of thinking outside the box.
    we have a situation at junior level in the east where there are only 5 teams and 4 of them qualify for the semi finals! These championships are crying out to be played on a county basis but then that draws up the old argument of the need of both eastern and western boards.


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    #7553
    cornerboy
    Registered Users Posts: 255 ✭✭cornerboy


    Mountainlad wrote: »
    Tourin, Cappoquin and Glen Rovers (Mellary, think they still have a team) not sure who else.

    Also Modeligo was formed a few years ago. Up to then Modeligo lads played with Cappoquin.


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    #7554
    Slobbery
    Closed Accounts Posts: 340 ✭✭Slobbery


    cornerboy wrote: »
    Also Modeligo was formed a few years ago. Up to then Modeligo lads played with Cappoquin.

    I thought Modeligo played underage with Tourneena? I cant remember the name of their combination, Tom devine didnt play with Cappoquin underage anyway


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    #7555
    Slobbery
    Closed Accounts Posts: 340 ✭✭Slobbery


    http://www.waterfordgaa.ie/news/332085/Deise_Og_Development_Squads_Fundraiser


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    #7556
    skaface
    Registered Users Posts: 886 ✭✭✭skaface


    cornerboy wrote: »
    Also Modeligo was formed a few years ago. Up to then Modeligo lads played with Cappoquin.

    Think Affane would be the other one Afaik


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    #7557
    The blue blaa
    Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭The blue blaa


    Slobbery wrote: »
    I thought Modeligo played underage with Tourneena? I cant remember the name of their combination, Tom devine didnt play with Cappoquin underage anyway

    Is it Naomh Brid or St. Patricks


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    #7558
    Slobbery
    Closed Accounts Posts: 340 ✭✭Slobbery


    The Senior club championship is gone very bad, I think it should be 8 teams the with the possibility of even reducing it to six and have just one group - too many of the games are over in ten minutes and there are too many dead rubbers - some clubs can beat the whipping boys in their group and then win one other game and they are safe, it is not competitive enough.

    Initially I think we should be aiming for an 8 team senior championship. (possibly even a six team group)
    under that we should have an All-County 10-12 team premier intermediate section.
    Below that an intermediate section.
    than the rest in Junior.

    In both senior and intermediate there are too many teams just making up the numbers, if the cannon fodder was cut down it would make every match very competitive.
    I am just picking the next six teams based on the current standings in the group, not on who I think should be in the new senior division (the tables will change by the end of the year so it will be a different 6 then I am sure, dont see this as a post as relegating certain clubs or ranking them, I am not, just take it as an example to see my general point), but imagine a championship of the following teams;

    Ballgunnar, Mt.Sion, Dungarvan, DLS, Abbeyside, Passage.

    Five games, each teams plays the other once, top four to semis (1 v 4, 2 v 3) and the other two contest relegation, it would be so competitive - all those teams will be capable of beating each other on any given day - every game would mean something, plus the GAA public in the county might start to than pay to see these games, why would anyone want to pay to see the trouncing's we were witnessing this weekend?

    The premier intermediate grade would also be a very competitive grade in this set-up if it was all county,


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    #7559
    Mountainlad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,851 ✭✭✭Mountainlad


    The blue blaa wrote: »
    Is it Naomh Brid or St. Patricks

    St pats football and Naomh Brid hurling. Modeligo, Touraneena and Colligan make up that team afaik.


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    #7560
    hardybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 5,167 ✭✭✭hardybuck


    Slobbery wrote: »
    The Senior club championship is gone very bad, I think it should be 8 teams the with the possibility of even reducing it to six and have just one group - too many of the games are over in ten minutes and there are too many dead rubbers - some clubs can beat the whipping boys in their group and then win one other game and they are safe, it is not competitive enough.

    Initially I think we should be aiming for an 8 team senior championship. (possibly even a six team group)
    under that we should have an All-County 10-12 team premier intermediate section.
    Below that an intermediate section.
    than the rest in Junior.

    In both senior and intermediate there are too many teams just making up the numbers, if the cannon fodder was cut down it would make every match very competitive.
    I am just picking the next six teams based on the current standings in the group, not on who I think should be in the new senior division (the tables will change by the end of the year so it will be a different 6 then I am sure, dont see this as a post as relegating certain clubs or ranking them, I am not, just take it as an example to see my general point), but imagine a championship of the following teams;

    Ballgunnar, Mt.Sion, Dungarvan, DLS, Abbeyside, Passage.

    Five games, each teams plays the other once, top four to semis (1 v 4, 2 v 3) and the other two contest relegation, it would be so competitive - all those teams will be capable of beating each other on any given day - every game would mean something, plus the GAA public in the county might start to than pay to see these games, why would anyone want to pay to see the trouncing's we were witnessing this weekend?

    The premier intermediate grade would also be a very competitive grade in this set-up if it was all county,

    I'd agree strongly with a lot of this. I'd go with an eight team senior and possible an 8 team intermediate premier/senior B.

    In the premier/senior b i'd take the four bottom senior teams, as well as the eastern and western finalists. Any more would dilute this championship also in my opinion. As things stand, you could have a DLS, Ballygunner or Mount Sion second string in that group.

    Rest of the intermediate teams in one all county championship. Not sure about junior - travel might be an issue for junior players.


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    #7561
    SkipFC
    Registered Users Posts: 27 ✭SkipFC


    It's beyond stupidity that a county the size of Waterford has three county boards, one board looking after all the fixtures should be more than enough.

    It's left the county in a situation where competitions become redundant, take the Western Junior Hurling Premier with only 4 teams, the Eastern equivalent has only 5 leaving 9 teams altogether but instead of an all-county competition for it, the clubs are left playing the same clubs year after year.

    I heard a theory recently that suggests draws are fixed because of Cappoquin and Tourin always being drawn in the same group, the reason given for this theory was because it has been one of the biggest gates for the Western Intermediate.

    I'm sure everyone has some grievance with the boards so that should surely be a sign for a drastic overhaul


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