Formula 1 2013: General Discussion Thread

kneemos · 14-04-2013 7:38pm

It's probably been said before but the tyre situation has ruined F1 it used to uncompromising racing start to finish now it's all about saving tyres,they even have to get permission to try and pass someone.It's farcical.

frostie500 · 14-04-2013 8:14pm

kneemos wrote: »

It's probably been said before but the tyre situation has ruined F1 it used to uncompromising racing start to finish now it's all about saving tyres,they even have to get permission to try and pass someone.It's farcical.

I've said before that it's ironic that sportscar racing is now 100% flat out driving for 6,8,12 or 24 hours whereas F1 is now as you said about driving as fast you dare without overusing the tyres. Personally I don't mind at all we are in the midst of the best races in the history of the sport.

Don't agree with me? Simply download a full of season of races from any of the "golden eras" of the sport. The eighties and ninties had lots of utterly terrible races with the season punctuated by one or two superb races. Over the last two years we have had the opposite with most races featuring lots of overtaking, strategic variation and close action.

Yes it's not ideal that in the world's greatest sport (obviously I have a very biased viewpoint on that!) that it's premier series doesnt feature flat out racing at all times but does that really affect us as fans? When you go to a race you are still amazed by the speed of the cars and the intensity of the driving.

When you look at a race on TV do you really notice that the drivers are so much slower than in qualifying? If you watch a race without live timing and graphics (maybe just the onboard channels even) do you really notice the differences in lap times?

The races at the moment may feature drivers having to drive around certain problems with the tyres but are they really "compromised" by this given that we have such exciting races? Think back to the Bridgestone era where it was possible to do a full race on one set of tyres and ask yourself which tyres you would want to see used in the race next weekend in Bahrain?

14-04-2013 8:22pm

Agreed on that Frostie, even when they're not going flat out they're still driving the wheels off the thing. Any time they show on-boards near the start of the race the wriggling and squirming of all the cars is fantastic.

The race is pretty brilliant right now and it has to be said we're blessed with the quality of the field right now, the top 5 today are all former world champions and the lad in 6th was robbed another time. :pac:

Frank Bullitt · 15-04-2013 9:45am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22083547

Moss showing himself to be a bit of a chauvinistic git in this article, saying he would blow a kiss at Maria Teresa de Filippis when he lapped her.

Please, if there is one thing he can do for all of us, take off your rose tinted glasses and shut up.

cherryghost · 15-04-2013 9:50am

Sounds like something out of a Harry Enfield 'Women! Know Your Limits' skit. What a narrow-minded man.

Myrddin · 15-04-2013 9:51am

Gintonious wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22083547

Moss showing himself to be a bit of a chauvinistic git in this article, saying he would blow a kiss at Maria Teresa de Filippis when he lapped her.

Please, if there is one thing he can do for all of us, take off your rose tinted glasses and shut up.

Thats a fairly shocking statement to make, "Women do not have the mental aptitude for F1". Why would he come out with something so stupid like that? I'd say its only a matter of time before we see it happening, & bring it on I say!

Rascasse · 15-04-2013 10:00am

Will Buxton said it well;

Hold on. The BBC asked an 83 year old racing driver for a comment about women? And it was politically incorrect? I’m staggered.

And Susie Wolff would be better keeping her own council. She'd never get anywhere near an F1 car (nor DTM) if she wasn't screwing the (former) boss.

There is a conversation to be had as to why there hasn't been any decent female F1 drivers. I remember Damon getting his chance after Amati was sacked. In the US Danica & di Silvestro have hardly set the world on fire. I'm struggling to think of a decent female driver other than Michele Mouton.

Myrddin · 15-04-2013 10:09am

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Only a matter of time before a women gets a drive purely because she is a women and not on talent, goes out and makes a fool of herself and sets women back 10 years in the process. Wolff has got some neck since she slept her way into her current position.

Well that would be unfortunate, but surely there are women out there who if given the same opportunities & development paths as the lads would be able to stick it up to them?

I know nothing about Wolff, nor her sleeping habits :P

Brian_Zeluz · 15-04-2013 10:36am

I think Moss is wrong when he says "Women do not have the mental aptitude for F1" however since the sport has not had any evidence so far to counter that argument (unlike the WRC with Mouton) I feel that he does in a way have a valid point. It's like the classic school yard situation of one child boasting about something to another, until the first one backs it up with evidence then frankly it's bull###t.

mickdw · 15-04-2013 10:41am

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Of course there is and I`d argue its easier for a women to go up the path these days than a guy. I say this due to the fact they get more advertising and write ups due to the fact they are women in motorsport.

Whats the story with wolf. Didnt she work at mondello? Was she super quick?

Myrddin · 15-04-2013 10:47am

Brian_Zeluz wrote: »

I think Moss is wrong when he says "Women do not have the mental aptitude for F1" however since the sport has not had any evidence so far to counter that argument (unlike the WRC with Mouton) I feel that he does in a way have a valid point. It's like the classic school yard situation of one child boasting about something to another, until the first one backs it up with evidence then frankly it's bull###t.

But surely then the lack of evidence means you can't argue against the possibility either? He's obviously just a product of his era, but its still a fairly ignorant thing to say

Bullseye1 · 15-04-2013 11:01am

There are less talented drivers getting seats purely based on their ability to bring sponsorship and big advertising, if a woman can bring these with her I see no reason why she cannot be given an opportunity. There are plenty of talented drivers who will never get a chance particularly in the smaller teams. The bigger teams do have younger drivers coming up through the ranks, i wonder how many women even apply?

Tea 1000 · 15-04-2013 11:30am

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Only a matter of time before a women gets a drive purely because she is a women and not on talent, goes out and makes a fool of herself and sets women back 10 years in the process. Wolff has got some neck since she slept her way into her current position.

Did she sleep with Frank? That's kind of a scary thought! How does Claire feel about working with some chick close to her own age who slept with her daddy?

SilverScreen · 15-04-2013 12:12pm

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Did she sleep with Frank? That's kind of a scary thought! How does Claire feel about working with some chick close to her own age who slept with her daddy?

Cannot... unsee... *shudder*

Infoanon · 15-04-2013 1:34pm

Rascasse wrote: »

Will Buxton said it well;
I remember Damon getting his chance after Amati was sacked. In the US Danica & di Silvestro have hardly set the world on fire. I'm struggling to think of a decent female driver other than Michele Mouton.

Amati was not sacked - rather the money ran out at Brabham, while Danica was a regular contender and finished 5th in the Indycar championship. Simona finally has a decent car (HVM's Porkchop was 5/6years old) and was 3rd on the grid at St.Pete and was top of qualifying at Barber until KV Racing went the wrong direction with the set up and tyres.

Sarah Fisher also had 2 pole positions to her name and Ana Beatriz is no slouch.
I am reminded of the time that Sarah Fisher passed Salazar for 2nd place and Salazar team owner AJ Foyt screamed over the radio 'you have just been passed by a girl'.

As for Stirlings comments - he has obviously never seen Danica & Kanann going wheel to wheel at 200mph on an oval for 20 laps - a battle which Danica won btw

Scotty # · 15-04-2013 1:50pm

Rascasse wrote: »

She'd never get anywhere near an F1 car (nor DTM) if she wasn't screwing the (former) boss.

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Wolff has got some neck since she slept her way into her current position.

Wow!! What unfair comments!! Rascasse you make it sound so seedy. She is actually married to the guy. And Lightning, you know who she has slept with and who she hasn't?

She's had 6 years in the DTM, give her some credit!

smellslikeshoes · 15-04-2013 2:13pm

Scotty # wrote: »

Wow!! What unfair comments!! Rascasse you make it sound so seedy. She is actually married to the guy. And Lightning, you know who she has slept with and who she hasn't?

She's had 6 years in the DTM, give her some credit!

Sorry but if she was a male driver who at 30 had only picked up a handful of points in 6 years in DTM there wouldn't be a hope in hell of them getting a Williams test slot on merit. She is a good driver but not F1 material.

Just for the record I'm all for women drivers in the sport but because of the lower numbers of women getting into motorsport early on there just isn't the same talent getting through. More of an effort needs to be done to get women into Karting and other entry level categories and less on trying to push women up the categories because they are women. If Susie Wolff was given a race seat it would only give ammunition to people like Stirling Moss because frankly I don't think she would be quick enough.

paddy147 · 15-04-2013 2:36pm

Well at least there is Danica Patrick in NASCAR.....:pac:

"do not hit anything"........:D

15-04-2013 4:34pm

Infoanon wrote: »

Amati was not sacked - rather the money ran out at Brabham, while Danica was a regular contender and finished 5th in the Indycar championship. Simona finally has a decent car (HVM's Porkchop was 5/6years old) and was 3rd on the grid at St.Pete and was top of qualifying at Barber until KV Racing went the wrong direction with the set up and tyres.

Sarah Fisher also had 2 pole positions to her name and Ana Beatriz is no slouch.
I am reminded of the time that Sarah Fisher passed Salazar for 2nd place and Salazar team owner AJ Foyt screamed over the radio 'you have just been passed by a girl'.

As for Stirlings comments - he has obviously never seen Danica & Kanann going wheel to wheel at 200mph on an oval for 20 laps - a battle which Danica won btw

Danica finishing 5th probably flattered her a bit in terms of ability, she was with one of the top teams at the time and had the advantage of being lighter.

Infoanon · 15-04-2013 5:10pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Danica finishing 5th probably flattered her a bit in terms of ability, she was with one of the top teams at the time and had the advantage of being lighter.

There is a minimum weight limit in Indycar thus being lighter didn't come into it.

Btw BBC 5 live discussion on female drivers is on tonight (15th April) at 9.30

15-04-2013 6:52pm

Infoanon wrote: »

There is a minimum weight limit in Indycar thus being lighter didn't come into it.

Btw BBC 5 live discussion on female drivers is on tonight (15th April) at 9.30

Could've sworn when she was there it was minimum car weight only, so being lighter meant a lighter total weight.

Brian_Zeluz · 15-04-2013 7:56pm

EnterNow wrote: »

But surely then the lack of evidence means you can't argue against the possibility either? He's obviously just a product of his era, but its still a fairly ignorant thing to say

It's absolutely ignorant of him for sure and I'm in no way arguing that there is no possibility of there ever being a woman good enough to win and challenge for championships in F1 like Mouton did in the WRC. My point is simply that until the time where there is a woman in the sport capable of winning races and being in the hunt for the championship then people who say that women cannot succeed in F1 for whatever reason unfortunately have ammo to use in their argument, no matter how misguided it is.

I'm the sort of person who needs to see something actually happen to fully buy into it, so talking about Danica etc and saying she is good enough to win in F1 because she won 1 indycar race in 115 starts doesn't cut it for me. The prospect of any driver being good enough in my opinion is nonsense until proven. Like anything in life people should be judged and in this case given an F1 drive on their skill alone. Until the point that a woman is in F1 for no other reason than because she is good enough then there will be people saying similar things to what Moss did.

Scotty # · 15-04-2013 8:21pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Ah yes six years in DTM with not one podium...

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

Sorry but if she was a male driver...

lol.... she's been taken on to help develop the simulator ffs! She doesn't hold a super licence. I don't think she'll even put on a pair of overalls this year. Hardly "screwing your way to the top" is it?

Lots of drivers in Formula 1 these days who are not there because of their outstanding ability to drive. Both Sutil and Perez have their seats because they bring a lot of money with them. This womans husband is one of the most powerful men in motorsport but I suspect this is as close as she will ever get racing F1.

PopePalpatine · 15-04-2013 9:47pm

Sutil and Perez are good drivers. Not Raikkonen/Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel good, but they do have talent. At least they're not Max Chilton. :P

SilverScreen · 15-04-2013 10:00pm

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Sutil and Perez are good drivers. Not Raikkonen/Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel good, but they do have talent. At least they're not Max Chilton. :P

Agreed. Perez was impressive last year for Sauber (has yet to impress this year though) and I was delighted that Sutil got a seat with Force India. I remember seeing the interview with Chilton in Australia and he came across as a spoiled, privileged Daddy's boy.

Infoanon · 15-04-2013 10:22pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Could've sworn when she was there it was minimum car weight only, so being lighter meant a lighter total weight.

I recall it being changed a few years ago to being car and driver - it was seen as an anti Danica move at the time - Robby Gordon had been making a big deal of it.

Don't know if a similar rule exists in Nascar though given the weight of the cars the advantage would be minimal.

Scotty # · 15-04-2013 11:45pm

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Sutil and Perez are good drivers.

I agree. My point is that to be good is no longer enough. You must be good and rich. Teams are regarding the financial package a potential driver brings to be as important as driving ability. Eddie Jordan touched on it the other day when he said that's why the super licence is so important - that drivers can't simply buy a seat, they must have a certain ability too.

christy c · 15-04-2013 11:50pm

Scotty # wrote: »

drivers can't simply buy a seat, they must have a certain ability too.

Wasn't there some guy in the 90's who basically bought a seat for one race with someone like Pacific Ford and radioed that he was coming in to the pits cause he had too much grip!!

Max_Charger · 15-04-2013 11:58pm

Scotty # wrote: »

Eddie Jordan touched on it the other day when he said that's why the super licence is so important - that drivers can't simply buy a seat, they must have a certain ability too.

Not sure Sebastien Loeb would agree with that.

Jordan 199 · 16-04-2013 12:06am

christy c wrote: »

Wasn't there some guy in the 90's who basically bought a seat for one race with someone like Pacific Ford and radioed that he was coming in to the pits cause he had too much grip!!

Jean-Denis Deletraz

Formula 1 2013: General Discussion Thread

Comments