How many people here know someone who committed suicide?

womanwithaplan · 11-09-2012 12:36am

Suicide is rampant in this country. Ireland has one of the highest suicide rates in Europe. Conversly, our closest neighbour has one of the lowest:o

Nuts! · 11-09-2012 12:39am

DuPLeX wrote: »

I had one person I knew who threw himself off an apartment block in London years ago . total shock to everyone. as for "the stigma" I believe there should be a stigma ..its there for a reason , it serves a purpose and if it makes a person think twice about killing themself then that is good .

I'm sorry but I disagree. The stigma doesn't make anyone reconsider dying - it just makes it harder for people to consider telling others that they are thinking about ending their life.

B.A._Baracus · 11-09-2012 12:41am

Heard there was something on in Ballyfermot tonight. An awareness night or there other. Loads of people were setting off chinese laterns.

kumate_champ07 · 11-09-2012 12:41am

friends/old school friends, neighbour, football coach. too many..

only 1 was female(23), 1 was 80's male, 1 was 40's male, the rest were early 20's male

kumate_champ07 · 11-09-2012 12:44am

imo there wasnt much that could have helped any of those I knew, its a product of our current modern lifestyle and all the pressures it brings

Augmerson · 11-09-2012 12:54am

womanwithaplan wrote: »

Suicide is rampant in this country. Ireland has one of the highest suicide rates in Europe. Conversly, our closest neighbour has one of the lowest:o

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

I'm not trying to be pedantic or anything, just thought some of ye might like to see this.

kumate_champ07 · 11-09-2012 1:00am

Augmerson wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

I'm not trying to be pedantic or anything, just thought some of ye might like to see this.

there are many suicides in Ireland that arent listed as 'suicide'

like in the west of Ireland, jumping off cliffs happens regularly, resulting in drowning or death from the impact on the rocks below

Smidge · 11-09-2012 1:16am

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Heard there was something on in Ballyfermot tonight. An awareness night or there other. Loads of people were setting off chinese laterns.

There was one of these ceremonies in Finglas as well tonight.
I can't help but wonder why the "underpriveleged" areas be it in Dublin, Limerick whatever have suicide rates that are massively disproportionate the oh, let's say Dalkey????

Poverty, neglect by society etc have been the reasons(along with many more but I haven't brought my soap box;)).

And now the people in power are going to hit the lowest echelon of society yet again in the up coming budget.
Not everyone on SW are scum, they are you neighbours, relatives even.
Does a sliced pan cost less for a person on SW that for a person on a decent wage?
Do the increased Gas, Electric, Fuel and Food costs not apply to people who maybe 5 years ago had a good job or ran their own business but everything went to hell, they are left with SW and they are now deemed "parasitic" by those who still have their jobs?

I would sadly predict that by next year if these cuts come in(and lets face it they will because hitting the lowest section of society is like kicking a lame dog)we shall all hear of more people taking their own lives having not been able to cope with this "existence" any longer.

11-09-2012 2:32am

Augmerson wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

I'm not trying to be pedantic or anything, just thought some of ye might like to see this.

Those figures are bull. The town I live in has less than a third of the county's population and yet I head of as many suicides in one year as apparently happened in the entire county. I strongly doubt I heard of all the ones in this town alone so assuming the same rate elsewhere (and rural areas are usually higher) there were about 4 times more suicides than were recorded.

evercloserunion · 11-09-2012 2:52am

Deleted User wrote: »

Those figures are bull. The town I live in has less than a third of the county's population and yet I head of as many suicides in one year as apparently happened in the entire county. I strongly doubt I heard of all the ones in this town alone so assuming the same rate elsewhere (and rural areas are usually higher) there were about 4 times more suicides than were recorded.

That's suicide rate, ie suicides per 100,000 people. So it means that approximately 531 suicides occurred in the country.

11-09-2012 3:06am

evercloserunion wrote: »

That's suicide rate, ie suicides per 100,000 people. So it means that approximately 531 suicides occurred in the country.

And what? It's still based off the initial flawed recorded statistics. If there were 4 times as many as recorded the rate will be 4 times higher.

evercloserunion · 11-09-2012 3:22am

Deleted User wrote: »

And what? It's still based off the initial flawed recorded statistics. If there were 4 times as many as recorded the rate will be 4 times higher.

I don't follow your logic from your last post, but regardless, you are right in that suicide is definitely under-reported. There are many instances where a death is widely considered to be a suicide but the official cause of death will be listed as an accident, because suicide can't be proven. So these will inevitably be lower than the reality. It's probably the same for most countries.

AskMyChocolate · 11-09-2012 5:07am

What a terribly sad and upsetting thread. I suppose I've never realised how fortunate I am, given that I come from a large family, and both my parents came from large families that I have never lost a sibling/cousin to suicide.

It's shocking to see the number of posters who have known numerous people who have taken their own lives. I have known numerous people myself, unfortunately, but I always assumed that it was due to having been committed to a mental institution on three occasions and having been in AA.

While all the people I've known have been terribly sad and tragic occurrences, there's one that sticks out in my mind. It was a man who I used to know from AA. His wife had finally shown him the door after years of alcoholism (I'd imagine for the kids' sake but I couldn't be sure.)

We'd gravitate towards each other after the meetings, even though on the surface, we had little enough in common, he was a married man with children, I was single, he was a good bit older than me, etc.

I just liked the way he'd say something like," The only miracle is that she didn't throw me out years ago" or "Aah shur, there's worse off than me."

He was incredibly honest and never tried to lay the blame for his misfortunes at anyone's door but his own. He simply just missed his wife and kids. I'll never forget the day I heard he'd taken his own life.

There's something so utterly fcuking heartbreaking about someone trying to fight a good fight as best they can, in those rooms night-in night-out, and finally just not being able to take any more pain.:(

I still think about him a lot. If ever there was a person who deserves to rest in peace.

RED PASSION · 11-09-2012 11:31am

Men die by suicide because life is harder for men, alcoholism, drugs, prison, homelessness, custody is a man problem, women are looked after like they are big kids everything in society is for them, burglar downstairs, man goes, date man pays, more pressure for a man to get a job than a woman, women do easier jobs, less physical. women have it easy, how many thousand more men will die before we stop it.

the above is a list of things i heard from 6 people who considered suicide, therefore not scientific survey, it is heart breaking, that men will help a woman but another man, a human being and we don't care. the idea is men find it harder to deal with life than women, we have more responsibilities, or when things go wrong it is the man who suffers ie child access. women are protected whereas who cares about men.

even some young college girls are poisonous in my experience, expect rings, cars, houses from men. get them yourself, provide for yourself.

from all the people here who have experienced suicide, other than get help. what advice would you give a suicidal person.

sidneykidney · 11-09-2012 12:13pm

Yeah I know someone that hung himself, a step brother. I hadnt spoke to him for a while, he was with his friends and gf.
So I and everyone else that was close to him, had no clue what was going thru his mind.

The biggest mistake was going in to see him in the coffin at the wake. Worst mistake of my life. I cant get that image out of my head.
I secretly wanted to shake him and ask why, seeing his devestated parents and sister. I still question if I or anyone else could have noticed something and possibly prevented it. Young men in this country dont speak/talk about their feelings. Sad really, but its true. We really need more resources pumped into this rapidly increasing trend.

I understand money is scarce in this country, but when I see junkies ( i work near a hostel) swanning around, without a care collecting dole etc, methadone or whatever it is. It does make me kad that money is given to resources to aid these people that have brought this upon themselves. Mental health in this country needs to be addressed ugrently, but I know, you reading this will know, it wont be.

Apologies for the rant, but this issue bothers me, with a 24yr old step brother of mine, takes his own life I need to understand,why? I also think young men and women with mental health issues need help.:mad:

Micky Dolenz · 11-09-2012 12:31pm

They are very very slow to announce a death as suicide unless there is a note left behind. Misadventure is a better sounding end.

Lelantos · 11-09-2012 12:36pm

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

They are very very slow to announce a death as suicide unless there is a note left behind. Misadventure is a better sounding end.

Local papers say tragic accident or tragic circumstances

sidneykidney · 11-09-2012 4:00pm

IMHO they need to say suicide, yes its a stigma still, which is stupid with such a high rate of young males taking their own lives.
If it reported as suicide it might open some eyes to the fact we have an epidemic.:(

Eoin · 11-09-2012 4:11pm

mishkalucy wrote: »

There was one of these ceremonies in Finglas as well tonight.
I can't help but wonder why the "underpriveleged" areas be it in Dublin, Limerick whatever have suicide rates that are massively disproportionate the oh, let's say Dalkey????

Is this the case? I thought the divide was more along the lines of rural/urban.

sidneykidney wrote: »

IMHO they need to say suicide, yes its a stigma still, which is stupid with such a high rate of young males taking their own lives.
If it reported as suicide it might open some eyes to the fact we have an epidemic.:(

I think the issue is with the word "commit", not "suicide". Personally I don't really think it equates it with a crime at all, but obviously people who've lost closer relatives and friends do.

AskMyChocolate · 11-09-2012 4:11pm

RED PASSION wrote: »

Men die by suicide because life is harder for men, alcoholism, drugs, prison, homelessness, custody is a man problem, women are looked after like they are big kids everything in society is for them, burglar downstairs, man goes, date man pays, more pressure for a man to get a job than a woman, women do easier jobs, less physical. women have it easy, how many thousand more men will die before we stop it.

the above is a list of things i heard from 6 people who considered suicide, therefore not scientific survey, it is heart breaking, that men will help a woman but another man, a human being and we don't care. the idea is men find it harder to deal with life than women, we have more responsibilities, or when things go wrong it is the man who suffers ie child access. women are protected whereas who cares about men.

even some young college girls are poisonous in my experience, expect rings, cars, houses from men. get them yourself, provide for yourself.

from all the people here who have experienced suicide, other than get help. what advice would you give a suicidal person.

I'm afraid I'm no interwebz whizz, so, I still haven't learned how to embed a video. (yeah I'm lookin' at you Master.:mad::pac:)

But, if someone could throw up "Everybody Hurts" by R.E.M., or "Don't Go" by The Hothouse Flowers, it would be better advice than anything I could ever give you.

I used to listen to "Country Feedback" by R.E.M.

Still don't know why.:o

Choco

fenris · 11-09-2012 4:30pm

sidneykidney wrote: »

IMHO they need to say suicide, yes its a stigma still, which is stupid with such a high rate of young males taking their own lives.
If it reported as suicide it might open some eyes to the fact we have an epidemic.:(

A verdict of suicide will potentially have big implications for the family / dependents left behind from an emotional not to mention an insurance perspective.

If there is any shadow of doubt then verdict will most likely not be suicide. You can't help the dead but you can minimise the damage to the living.

Wibbs · 11-09-2012 4:40pm

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

They are very very slow to announce a death as suicide unless there is a note left behind. Misadventure is a better sounding end.

Even when there's a note left behind MD. IME anyway, though in fairness this was a decade or more ago, so maybe things have changed somewhat? Of the five men* I knew who took their own lives, only one was officially marked down as suicide. All where obvious suicide cases and off the top of my head at least 3 left notes and one rang a few of his mates and his girlfriend to announce his intentions. Pretty clear cut cases and very sad with it.

*I've known nearly double that number in women who attempted it but thankfully were caught in time/unsuccessful. IME women tend to have more warning signs, more half attempts leading up to the full blown and use less final and destructive methods so are more likely to get help, be saved in time.

Micky Dolenz · 11-09-2012 5:09pm

Wibbs wrote: »

Even when there's a note left behind MD. IME anyway, though in fairness this was a decade or more ago, so maybe things have changed somewhat? Of the five men* I knew who took their own lives, only one was officially marked down as suicide. All where obvious suicide cases and off the top of my head at least 3 left notes and one rang a few of his mates and his girlfriend to announce his intentions. Pretty clear cut cases and very sad with it.

*I've known nearly double that number in women who attempted it but thankfully were caught in time/unsuccessful. IME women tend to have more warning signs, more half attempts leading up to the full blown and use less final and destructive methods so are more likely to get help, be saved in time.

I suppose the coroner has to be absolutely sure. No doubt many families would contest a verdict of suicide. Denial, life assurance claims and many other reasons.

True about women opting for less violent ends, drug od's etc. Where men seem to favour more violent methods ultimately resulting in more male deaths.

EZ24GET · 11-09-2012 5:14pm

I think women tend more to seek help than men in most matters. Our society has customarily instilled a belief that men should just shoulder through. We allow girls to seek help and assistance - almost expect it-but we have repeatedly told little boys to "tough it out", "man up" and 'be strong'. There is a strong tendency for men to feel it isn't manly to ask for help. It's a double standard that often causes men to internalize their pain and seek to hide what they see as shortcomings.

flyswatter · 11-09-2012 5:26pm

Why do men often opt for more violent means while women might od for example in a parasuicide? Is it more hesitation on the womens part or just one of those things? Obviously each case is different.

fenris · 11-09-2012 5:35pm

The site below has some very illuminating statistics and analysis

http://lostallhope.com/suicide-statistics

suicide_statistics_01.png

There is also an important page called Surviving today that makes the case for giving it at least three days between making a decision and acting on it, this ties in very nicely with the statistics above.
http://lostallhope.com/help-me/surviving-today
The basic argument is that dead if forever so why the rush and is three more days not a short enough period of time to spend considering things.

kumate_champ07 · 11-09-2012 6:59pm

mishkalucy wrote: »

There was one of these ceremonies in Finglas as well tonight.
I can't help but wonder why the "underpriveleged" areas be it in Dublin, Limerick whatever have suicide rates that are massively disproportionate the oh, let's say Dalkey????

Poverty, neglect by society etc have been the reasons(along with many more but I haven't brought my soap box;)).

And now the people in power are going to hit the lowest echelon of society yet again in the up coming budget.
Not everyone on SW are scum, they are you neighbours, relatives even.
Does a sliced pan cost less for a person on SW that for a person on a decent wage?
Do the increased Gas, Electric, Fuel and Food costs not apply to people who maybe 5 years ago had a good job or ran their own business but everything went to hell, they are left with SW and they are now deemed "parasitic" by those who still have their jobs?

I would sadly predict that by next year if these cuts come in(and lets face it they will because hitting the lowest section of society is like kicking a lame dog)we shall all hear of more people taking their own lives having not been able to cope with this "existence" any longer.

India is a poorer country with less suicides, correct me if Im wrong?

John Mason · 11-09-2012 7:02pm

3.5 weeks ago, my wonderful cousin. cleaned the house, went in to the shed, drilled the door closed behind him, put the drill away neatly on the shelf and hung himself on a rig, he had built.

leaving behind a wife, a 4 year old daughter and a 7 year old son.

and hundreds of devastated people, some of whom will never recover

what is happening in this country?? i had stayed the night in his house 2 weeks before, we a great night and not a word was said. why not?

a girl i worked with, went out on her lunch break last christmas, bought a bottle of wine, drank and threw herself in the liffey. no one noticed she was missing from work until 2 days later when the police arrived.

7 people i went to school with have taken their own lives

Lelantos · 11-09-2012 7:10pm

irishbird wrote: »

3.5 weeks ago, my wonderful cousin. clean the house, went in to the shed, drilled the door closed behind him, put the drill away neatly on the shelf and hung himself on a rig, he had built.

leaving behind a wife, a 4 year old daughter and a 7 year old son.

and hundreds of devastated people, some who will never recover

what is happening in this country?? i had stayed the night in his house 2 weeks before, we a great night and not a word was said.

But that's just it, no one knows what that person is thinking. I was drinking with an old school friend, we had a good nite, said our goodbyes & went home, only he didn't, hung himself in a wooded area, no clue, no note, no signs (admittedly, this was many years ago & I may not have been able to recognise signs) but people we think are happy, inside they are dieing & just cannot go on. Incredibly sad, soul destroying for the people left behind, I wish I had answers for you, but I don't, all you can do is support that family as best you can.

Wibbs · 11-09-2012 7:14pm

Jesus IB that's tough

How many people here know someone who committed suicide?

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