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"Leap" into the unknown: The feedback thread
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Would anybody know what the situation is with Broombridge Station, by any chance? I commute from/to there twice daily, and have till now, paid cash. It works out signifigantly cheaper for me to use my leap card, however the means to tag on/off are unavailable at Broombridge, so when I reach my destination, I'll be charged maximum fare rather than the €1.50 I should be. I've contacted Irish Rail, and in fairness to the helpful woman on the phone, all she could reccommend after inquiring was contacting the RPU so they would be aware of my card details, therefore not fine me, and Leap for a refund every time, which as you can imagne, will get time consuming and tedious very quickly
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When automatic top-ups* become available in the next few months, this will no longer be a problem.
* You might set it such that every time your balance drops to €10, as €20 top-up is applied.
But if you never used it at luas or IR stations, how would that update?
What is the difference than applying the credit manually once off? 0 -
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But if you never used it at luas or IR stations, how would that update?
What is the difference than applying the credit manually once off?
It looks like they are going to use the same method as London Bus which is very clever.
1) You apply online for automatic top-ups (enter bank details etc.)
2) To activate the automatic top-ups you have to bring it to a LUAS/Payzone/Irish Rail validator to activate. This validator basically sets a flag on your leap card saying automatic top-ups are applied. This only needs to be done once, the very first time.
3) Now every time you validate on the bus, it sees the flag and if it is set and you balance goes below x amount, the dublin bus validator adds y credit to your leap card.
4) At the end of the day the bus returns to the depot and your top-up is recorded in the central system and the cost deducted via direct debit.
Note this doesn't require the Dublin Bus validators to have an online connection to work.
It is unfortunate that auto-tops weren't enabled from the start. One off tops really aren't very useful and seem to only be causing confusion. I'm not sure I would have even bothered with enabling one off top-ups, given their limitations.
In particular it would have been great if auto-tops were available from day one and that you could have ordered leap cards with it enabled by default.0 -
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When automatic top-ups* become available in the next few months, this will no longer be a problem.
* You might set it such that every time your balance drops to €10, as €20 top-up is applied.
But if you never used it at luas or IR stations, how would that update?
What is the difference than applying the credit manually once off?
You would probably need to use it at a Luas or (coming soon) Irish Rail ticket vending machine or do a balance check in a shop to tell the card it now has auto top up capability but after that it shouldn't matter - IIRC it will then top itself up when needed including upon boarding a bus, the bus would then report the auto top up when it returns to the garage at the end of the day and it would be entered and charged.
Edit - as bk said above.0 -
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But if you never used it at luas or IR stations, how would that update?
What is the difference than applying the credit manually once off?
Currently when you top-up on-line you "push" the money to the card.
With auto top-up, once the card drops below the top-up trigger level (€X - this may be fixed, I don't know), it tells the validator "I'm an auto top-up customer, add €Y to my balance and debit my debit / credit card / bank account for €Y." The new balance on the cards will be €X+Y less and fare charged. The bus remembers that Card 123456789 was topped-up by €Y and at the end of the day, this is downloaded to the back office system, and charges the debit / credit card / bank account. In a way, this is "pulling" the money to the card.0 -
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Bought my first Leap card today so may as well detail my experiences here as I'm quite a frequent poster and lurker in this forum...
Buying: Very straightforward, bought it in the Centra beside Drumcondra Station. They guy there knew exactly what to do and was very helpful - asked if it was my first time buying one and he detailed everything [card is €5 and requires min €5 credit deposit]. I did check with him to ensure that the card was activated as that was a problem that occurred for some people on this thread iirc.
Using: Again thanks to reading the thread I pretty much knew exactly what to do. Avoid the validator as it would have swiped €2.40 automagically off the card for a €1.25 journey, placed the card flat on the drivers console told her €1.25 [though the Leap blurb says to state the destination to the driver and then they'll work it out] and away we go. The balance of your card shows up initally and after deduction which was handy I thought. Simples.
Website: For something they spent €40m on they really could have come up with a better website for the project. Onerous to register, by that I mean if I can't register in 2mins its taking too long. Difficult to navigate to see where to top up and check your balance etc. Needs to be simplified; I wouldn't consider myself technically 'handicapped' for want of a better phrase but if its causing me a headache then I'm pretty sure it'll do the same for a lot of people.
Thoughts: Needs less driver interaction. Needs more promotion. Needs a simpler website. From a DB pov I can't understand the need for driver interaction. I'm not a tech head so I don't know if this is on the money but it absolutely screams at me to rig up the validator to a tag on tag off mode whereby you get on validate the card and then x stops later tag off when you get off - i.e. get on at stage 77, get off at stage 79 = €1.25 debited from the card. Failure to tag off results in the max fare being charged. Obviously this is contingent on being tied into the stage system [which I think with the RTPI set up and each unique stop number shouldn't be a major issue] which unfortunately as Aleksmart and others have pointed out is an absolute disaster mired in ambiguity.
I'm going to take a wild guess that this being Ireland, it'll take ~3yrs for the kinks to be ironed out and driver interaction eradicated. In my idealistic head it'll be a serene system then as the minimum fare will probably be €4 and everyone will be using Leap.
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Why on earth do they need my date of birth when I register? Can only assume it's something to do with adult/child tickets, but seems like way too much information.
That it accepted my date of birth as being in the 11th century is another issue.
That is content, not design!partyatmygaff wrote: »Speaking of idiotic website design...
https://www.leapcard.ie/PageSetting/ContentViewer.aspx?Val=Zk1kXuXjSAmKm4PZmr2wZB3Wfgg5muBAOtzUDB2WjQ9aj7n17vcc%2bKCQDK2%2fwDJHmmmBaDgh987lU62F30yF84i4VqUmgFkXDRaEZm3gf3OwoRQIzTCw4yyRPGaW6G3yN4OcqD428vNC8GTLZOXKG%2f3xNGMT7yBERZXOeD6VbF4%3d
Does anyone know what any of Irish rail's "Distance Categories" mean? It's the first time i've ever heard of it. All it says is "Full details available on irishrail.ie" and when you check out Irish Rail's website, they say "For full information, go to www.leapcard.ie".
Funnilly enough, according to Google the words "Distance Category" don't even show up once on Irish Rail's website.
See here: http://www.railusers.ie/passenger_info/fares_matrix.php
The Distance Categories / fare bands / fare code approximate with the distance between stations. However, this isn't perfect as Connolly, Tara Street and Pearse are treated as one station and there may be other anomalies.0 -
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theskeptic wrote: »UPDATE: I finally got a refund on the 4 January 2012 - I suppose that is not too long to wait considering intervening Christmas / New Year holidays. Unofficial postings have suggested that one of the ticket validating machines at Harmonstown was not working correctly and instead of tagging me off, tagged me on a second time and I incurred 2 max fares of e4.30.
Specifically with regard to Leap Card - their customer care did bounce me to Irish Rail who then bounced me back to Leap Card customer care who (presumably) then got IR to issue the refund. Going forward it would be good if Leap Card customer care acted as the front end to all Leap Card issues and dealt with IR, DB, Veolia as and when necessary.theskeptic wrote: »I topped up my Leap Card online with 20euro - giving a balance of 25euro. Screen asked me if I wanted to apply this top up at a Payzone outlet, Luas ticket validator or Irish Rail validator. I chose the Irish Rail option. The web site says it can take up to 48 hours for payment to go through (WTF?).
Over 48 hours later... I tried my Leap card in an Irish Rail ticket issuing machine in Clontarf Rd it didn't work (ok they kinda implied it would only work on ticket validator at gate). I went through gate and whey hey machine said my card had 25euro on it as expected. I got off at Harmonstown (2 stops away) and tagged-off - I saw the figure 16 flash past the validator and thought uh-oh... When I got home and looked up my Leap Card balance I got a screen saying that the balance on my card was 16.39euro - i.e. the trip from Clontarf Rd to Harmonstown had cost me >8.6 euro.
I contacted Leap Card customer care via email and they said that the excessive fare was an issue for Irish Rail and I should contact them! They said the balance can take 24 hours to update online - despite the fact that I checked the topup > 48 hours later and the trip DART trip > 24 hours later.
This has all the signs of a system that is NOT ready to be rolled out. Be warned: use Leap Card at your own risk. As for the promised future feature of being able to link the Leap Card to a direct debit - eh, no thanks...
I spoke too soon - I stupidly / naively thought the problem was fully resolved...
In order to claim my refund for the original overcharge I tagged on at Harmonstown on my way into work. A 10e refund was successfully added to my card. When I tagged off at my destination the correct fare for the journey was deducted. However on my return journey I was unable to tag off at Harmonstown and the system tagged me on a second time resulting in 2 max fares (2 x 4.30) being deducted from my card - i.e. the exact same problem as the original overcharge!
BTW: I have been successfully using Luas and IR smart cards for a number of years, so I do actually know how to tag on and off
In summary:
REASONS FOR USING LEAP CARD WITH IRISH RAIL- You like to gamble - you might pay the correct fare or the maximum fare.
- You feel that the recent Irish Rail fare increase was not enough and that Irish Rail deserve more money.
- You don't mind keeping a small notebook with you and writing down the numbers that appear on the ticket validators ever time you tag on or off.
- The Leap Card has been in planning for over 10 years and it is understandable if it takes another few years to resolve any glitches in the system.
REASONS FOR NOT USING LEAP CARD WITH IRISH RAIL- You cannot afford to pay the maximum fare for all rail journeys.
FYI: I have given up on Leap Card - it is simply not worth the expense or the hassle of constantly having to double check the amounts on the ticket validators.0 -
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