Kerry CC support permit system which allows rural people drink and drive

Dravokivich · 22-01-2013 11:21am

lintdrummer wrote: »

And by the same token a sober, perfectly able person could make a thousand safe journeys and on one occasion get momentarily distracted and cause an accident. That doesn't justify taking everybody off the road.
This argument is moot anyway because this proposal won't go any further. It's too open to abuse and hasn't been thought through. A solution is needed though, as I've said people are and will continue drink driving in rural areas.

:eek:

Ranicand · 22-01-2013 11:21am

efb wrote: »

I lived in rural Ireland 7 miles to town.

Taxis are available. People to scabby to use them and publicans want the money spent in their pub.

Country people being mean scroungers may be a stereotype with is a true one in many cases.

listermint · 22-01-2013 11:22am

Balmed Out wrote: »

listermint wrote: »

. So praytell why you want someone who has purposefully impaired themselves behind the wheel of a 2 ton death machine.
QUOTE]

Where did anyone say that they want drunks to be driving.

As a society we can either deal with a problem or stick fingers in our ears, shut our eyes and hope the problem fixes itself.
If were ever going to minimise drink related tests then we will have to create a culture in rural areas that wont tolerate dangerous behaviour. Unfortunately a zero tolerance approach isnt working and can never ever be enforced.

IT IS WORKING! Do you actually know where we are in relation to road deaths in Europe. Its hilarious that you are commenting on it and you havent a clue that we are right up the top of the list with road safety.

Why do YOU want us to go backwards by 'normalising' illegal and unsafe behaviour.

some stats for your perusal http://ec.europa.eu/transport/road_safety/pdf/observatory/historical_evol_popul.pdf

we are below the EU average which is a superb feat.

Noffles · 22-01-2013 11:26am

I also live rural and the rural pubs a ****ing **** anyway, it cost me 30 quid in taxis if I want to go to the town to drink and to be fair on the weekend it's worth it.

Balmed Out · 22-01-2013 11:28am

efb wrote: »

I lived in rural Ireland 7 miles to town.

Taxis are available. People to scabby to use them and publicans want the money spent in their pub.

Thats your particular town. Where I live there are numerous hotels catering for numerous weddings of people from all over the country and even some abroad most of the year. All the taxis get guaranteed business from them and as they are normally full rides are happy to spend the night doing that and collect others only at quiter times.. You can get a taxi weekends ok but you may be waiting two hours and you may then not be brought home any time soon. A few years ago a friend spent 3 hours been driven around the countryside as the taxi (all in area would be minibuses) brough anyone living closer home first and only dropped him home when he had a gang of 3 or 4 in that direction.

You would never ever consider the possibility of getting a taxi on a wednesday night unless you were drinnking in an actual main town.

listermint · 22-01-2013 11:29am

Balmed Out wrote: »

Thats your particular town. Where I live there are numerous hotels catering for numerous weddings of people from all over the country and even some abroad most of the year. All the taxis get guaranteed business from them and as they are normally full rides are happy to spend the night doing that and collect others only at quiter times.. You can get a taxi weekends ok but you may be waiting two hours and you may then not be brought home any time soon. A few years ago a friend spent 3 hours been driven around the countryside as the taxi (all in area would be minibuses) brough anyone living closer home first and only dropped him home when he had a gang of 3 or 4 in that direction.

You would never ever consider the possibility of getting a taxi on a wednesday night unless you were drinnking in an actual main town.

Get a Taxi license then. Sounds like they are screaming out for it there...........

gobnaitolunacy · 22-01-2013 11:30am

This is real-life Kilinascully stuff, beyond belief.

Balmed Out · 22-01-2013 11:34am

listermint wrote: »

IT IS WORKING! Do you actually know where we are in relation to road deaths in Europe. Its hilarious that you are commenting on it and you havent a clue that we are right up the top of the list with road safety.

Why do YOU want us to go backwards by 'normalising' illegal and unsafe behaviour.

some stats for your perusal http://ec.europa.eu/transport/road_safety/pdf/observatory/historical_evol_popul.pdf

we are below the EU average which is a superb feat.

Im sorry but I think your not responding to anything anyone actually says just what you wish they said for the sake of an argument.
I know where we are.....
That doesnt mean I dont want us to improve.
We have successfully created a culture in urban areas of zero tolerance but we have created a situation in rural areas where people think a short journey home is fine no matter how drunk they are because they see it as being a ridiculous rule.
Unfortunately we ALREADY have normalised illegal and unsafe behaviour. I want us to change that.

I dont know what the answer is but were not there yet.

listermint · 22-01-2013 11:37am

Balmed Out wrote: »

listermint wrote: »

Im sorry but I think your not responding to anything anyone actually says just what you wish they said for the sake of an argument.
I know where we are.....
That doesnt mean I want us to improve.
We have successfully created a culture in urban areas of zero tolerance but we have created a situation in rural areas where people think a short journey home is fine no matter how drunk they are because they see it as being a ridiculous rule.
Unfortunately we ALREADY have normalised illegal and unsafe behaviour. I want us to change that.

I dont know what the answer is but were not there yet.

I think you will find you havent responded to anything legitimate what so ever. So I literally have no idea what you are talking about.

With each new post you advocating reversing our very good road safety stats of which i have linked to.

With each new post you contribute to my feelings that you have no idea what you are on about OR what point you are trying to convey.

Canis Lupus · 22-01-2013 11:40am

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Ya see, this sounds like arrogance. I mean. these are the same people who probably rang up Joe to get the head-sops closed down. And, of course, they all knew everything about the legal highs on offer at the time.

What's good for the goose, as they say...

No because the people he's referring to would ask why are they selling heads in a shop and wouldn't know who Joe is. You're still applying Dublin logic to a rural issue

I understand fully that drink driving is bad and this idea from HR is stupid but the simple fact is it's done out in the sticks. I appreciate people from the big city might not understand what it's like to have tiny roads with no lighting that can wind for miles without passing a house or places with no easy/cheap access to taxis or a bus service that comes along every ten minutes etc but it exists as do the lads that go to the local have a few drinks and potter home at 20mph. I know in my local if someone has had too much he'll get a lift home and won't be allowed to drive but as a rule they know what's what themselves.

I've never seen the harm in it and as already said the gardai know bloody well it goes on. They poke their heads out once or twice a year to let people know they exist but by and large they let it go on. There's no solution to this. The local pub is the social hub for farmers.

johnr1 · 22-01-2013 11:41am

Ridiculous idea by DHR. Should Could or Would never get further than it did. He'd be doing these people he's concerned about a bigger favour by just shutting up and letting the current 'blind eye' situation continue. The guards in each area know who is taking the piss and who isn't. Those who take the piss usually get caught.

Side issue: I wonder how many of those bleating outrage here would also be supportive of relaxation of drug laws.... after all they're soooo much cooler.:cool:

* I dont drink alcohol, I used to live in S Kerry, now Dublin, and have never voted for a Healy Rae.

efb · 22-01-2013 11:43am

Balmed Out wrote: »

Thats your particular town. Where I live there are numerous hotels catering for numerous weddings of people from all over the country and even some abroad most of the year. All the taxis get guaranteed business from them and as they are normally full rides are happy to spend the night doing that and collect others only at quiter times.. You can get a taxi weekends ok but you may be waiting two hours and you may then not be brought home any time soon. A few years ago a friend spent 3 hours been driven around the countryside as the taxi (all in area would be minibuses) brough anyone living closer home first and only dropped him home when he had a gang of 3 or 4 in that direction.

You would never ever consider the possibility of getting a taxi on a wednesday night unless you were drinnking in an actual main town.

Who drinks midweek?

Canis Lupus · 22-01-2013 11:44am

listermint wrote: »

Get a Taxi license then. Sounds like they are screaming out for it there...........

I lived relatively near to my local town with the only nightclub in the area. That was 12 miles. You find me a taxi that can offer an affordable rate to run a person out 12 miles+ and then return for another fare AND make a living when the only proper business will be on the Saturday night.....

Jeez, I remember when I was young. Waiting around for hours after a club trying to get a taxi/lift home... Not fun although got a few shifts so maybe it wasn't that bad.

Balmed Out · 22-01-2013 11:44am

listermint wrote: »

I think you will find you havent responded to anything legitimate what so ever. So I literally have no idea what you are talking about.

With each new post you advocating reversing our very good road safety stats of which i have linked to.

With each new post you contribute to my feelings that you have no idea what you are on about OR what point you are trying to convey.

Ive done so over and over again. You dont seem to realise that the current laws and law enforcement have not changed the culture of people in rural areas drink driving.

By constantly attacking what im saying I can only assume this to be something you would apparently be delighted in and feel the status quo is grand, sure if were the best in class we should sit on our heels and not attempt to improve.

seven_eleven · 22-01-2013 11:47am

CruelCoin wrote: »

Most country people drink drive.

errrr, no they don't. Maybe around your parish but certainly not around here.

seamus · 22-01-2013 11:49am

Balmed Out wrote: »

You dont seem to realise that the current laws and law enforcement have not changed the culture of people in rural areas drink driving.

But wait....the claim here is that our stricter drink-driving laws are causing the death of the rural pub and serious isolation because people are afraid to go to the pub. Therefore they want permits so people can drink-drive.

That's the point of this entire farce.

Yet here you are, claiming that nothing at all has changed.

So which is it? If nothing has changed, then why do we need a permit system?

listermint · 22-01-2013 11:50am

Balmed Out wrote: »

Ive done so over and over again. You dont seem to realise that the current laws and law enforcement have not changed the culture of people in rural areas drink driving.

By constantly attacking what im saying I can only assume this to be something you would apparently be delighted in and feel the status quo is grand, sure if were the best in class we should sit on our heels and not attempt to improve.

Of course they have, whats more is you know it. Gone are the days where Johnny Murphy from Timahoe would have 5-6 pints and drive home now. Go to any rural pub and the attitude IS changed. I am sure you are well aware of it. Yes of course there are people that will have 2-3 and risk it. But gone is the time of spending the whole night in there and driving.

The system has changed peoples outlook for the better. Get over it.

ejmaztec · 22-01-2013 11:50am

This is the sort of crap to be expected of the **** on Kerry County Council. All of them bar one (Toiréasa Ferris), recently voted for pay and expenses increases for themselves, despite Kerry and the rest of the country being in the sh1t.

Canis Lupus · 22-01-2013 11:51am

seamus wrote: »

But wait....the claim here is that our stricter drink-driving laws are causing the death of the rural pub and serious isolation because people are afraid to go to the pub. Therefore they want permits so people can drink-drive.

That's the point of this entire farce.

Yet here you are, claiming that nothing at all has changed.

So which is it? If nothing has changed, then why do we need a permit system?

Ask HR, he's the one that owns the pub :P

Old_-_School · 22-01-2013 11:54am

Ranicand wrote: »

Sure they are from Kerry what can we expect?

And before anybody starts trying to defend the hicks they voted for this their stupidly is on record for all to see.

Surely not as bad as the stupidity of Dublin people who voted for Charlie Haughey and Bertie Ahern, the stupidity of Cork people who voted for PJ Sheehan, etc.

listermint · 22-01-2013 11:55am

Old_-_School wrote: »

Surely not as bad as the stupidity of Dublin people who voted for Charlie Haughey and Bertie Ahern, the stupidity of Cork people who voted for PJ Sheehan, etc.

Any of these lads still in power ? ?

Balmed Out · 22-01-2013 11:56am

seamus wrote: »

But wait....the claim here is that our stricter drink-driving laws are causing the death of the rural pub and serious isolation because people are afraid to go to the pub. Therefore they want permits so people can drink-drive.

That's the point of this entire farce.

Yet here you are, claiming that nothing at all has changed.

So which is it? If nothing has changed, then why do we need a permit system?

Can you please quote where I said we need a permit system??
I do think the issue of drink driving in rural areas is something we need to examine logically rather then emotively in order to reduce road deaths. The system at present doesnt seem to work from the rural areas I have experience of.
Nobody has died or been in an alcahol related accident there but I cant help but worry that so many people completely disregarding a law that they view as being irrelevant to them as it takes no regard for their circumstances could lead to a normalisation of drink driving and lead certain people to more and more risky behaviour.

Cavehill Red · 22-01-2013 11:58am

Someone should remind Kerry council that one never goes full retard.

veryangryman · 22-01-2013 11:59am

Democracy at work.

Leftist · 22-01-2013 12:02pm

seven_eleven wrote: »

errrr, no they don't. Maybe around your parish but certainly not around here.

parish

what a term, haven't heard that in years. So quaint and perochial. First name terms with the parish priest?

Old_-_School · 22-01-2013 12:02pm

listermint wrote: »

Any of these lads still in power ? ?

No, but most of those who voted for them are still alive and still part of the electorate.
To switch to incumbent politicians so:
The stupidity of Tipperary people to vote for Michael Lowry.
The stupidity of Limerick people to vote for Willie O'Dea.

listermint · 22-01-2013 12:04pm

Old_-_School wrote: »

No but most of those who voted them are still alive and still part of the electorate.
To switch to incumbent politicians so:
The stupidity of Tipperary people to vote for Michael Lowry.
The stupidity of Limerick people to vote for Willie O'Dea.

Whats this debate about. As soon as the electorate find out about these people they get ousted.

Doesnt appear to happen in local parishes but thats for another debate which you may want to start a thread on.

seamus · 22-01-2013 12:05pm

Balmed Out wrote: »

Can you please quote where I said we need a permit system??

...that's what the entire topic of the thread is. I didn't say you were advocating the permit system.

I do think the issue of drink driving in rural areas is something we need to examine logically rather then emotively in order to reduce road deaths. The system at present doesnt seem to work from the rural areas I have experience of.

Drink-driving causes a massive and demonstrable increase in the risk of crashing. Therefore logically it should be stamped on.

Rural isolation is an issue and the pub has long been a source of socialising. Many rural dwellers choose to drive to the pub. These two are not compatible.
Therefore logically the solution is to encourage means of socialising which do not involve alcohol or which do not involve vehicles.

Nippledragon · 22-01-2013 12:10pm

super_furry wrote: »

Eight of their 27 councillors bothered their arse to vote. The people of Kerry should be hounding those who didn't vote right now.

That's the problem right there, too many cooks spoil the broth. 27 councillors for one county? :eek: Our political system is overloaded with absolute Muppets.

efb · 22-01-2013 12:16pm

Kerry- the place they shake hands with convicted sex offenders

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 22-01-2013 12:16pm

Canis Lupus wrote: »

No because the people he's referring to would ask why are they selling heads in a shop and wouldn't know who Joe is. You're still applying Dublin logic to a rural issue

Oh, they know who Joe is, beleive me.

I understand fully that drink driving is bad and this idea from HR is stupid but the simple fact is it's done out in the sticks. I appreciate people from the big city might not understand what it's like to have tiny roads with no lighting that can wind for miles without passing a house or places with no easy/cheap access to taxis or a bus service that comes along every ten minutes etc but it exists as do the lads that go to the local have a few drinks and potter home at 20mph. I know in my local if someone has had too much he'll get a lift home and won't be allowed to drive but as a rule they know what's what themselves.

I've never seen the harm in it and as already said the gardai know bloody well it goes on. They poke their heads out once or twice a year to let people know they exist but by and large they let it go on. There's no solution to this. The local pub is the social hub for farmers.

Not saying it isn't - everyone breaks some law at some point. And the problem is there, granted, but legalising it simply isn't the solution and demanding that the law be changed simply to suit oneself is arrogant.

BrensBenz · 22-01-2013 12:27pm

I think, rather than an initiative by KCC, this is their attempt to formalise the current "stroke" by which all / most / many drunks continue to drive because "shure, Yur Onnor, Oi was only goin up de road an de Gards know me an evrybody knows Oi only have a few poynts an shure God help me Oi'd be feersh lonely if Oi can't have me few jars ova neevnin'."

Rant.....sorry but......three of my wife's cousins and their friend killed by a drunk driver who didn't even stop!

Oh, and it's not fair to blame morons for being morons. Ask WHO put them in roles of responsibility.

Old_-_School · 22-01-2013 12:27pm

listermint wrote: »

Old_-_School wrote: »

No, but most of those who voted for them are still alive and still part of the electorate.
To switch to incumbent politicians so:
The stupidity of Tipperary people to vote for Michael Lowry.
The stupidity of Limerick people to vote for Willie O'Dea.

Whats this debate about. As soon as the electorate find out about these people they get ousted.

Doesnt appear to happen in local parishes but thats for another debate which you may want to start a thread on.

What do you mean? They both topped the poll in their first election after their indiscretions came to light.
Bertie's financial indiscretions had also been well highlighted before he also topped the poll.

My point was in relation to a previous post where it was said that Kerry people were stupid because they voted these morons into power, while the same could be said about Dublin, Cork, Tipperary, Limerick, etc. electorates who have also voted in morons/crooks.

MJ23 · 22-01-2013 12:31pm

The Healy-Rae gobsh!tes again. They are an embarrassment.

crockholm · 22-01-2013 12:32pm

efb wrote: »

Kerry- the place they shake hands with convicted sex offenders

pretty sure that's not the official slogan
looking forward to some juicy offaly related stories:D

efb · 22-01-2013 12:37pm

crockholm wrote: »

pretty sure that's not the official slogan
looking forward to some juicy offaly related stories:D

I'm sure there's thickos in Offaly too- no mention of passing drink driving motions or shaking hands with sex offenders

Cienciano · 22-01-2013 12:37pm

efb wrote: »

I lived in rural Ireland 7 miles to town.

Taxis are available. People to scabby to use them and publicans want the money spent in their pub.

I'd fully believe it, I head over to the west fishing for a week in summer and a week in winter, very small town, but has a taxi service. But the town is wedged with cars on a friday, saturday and sunday night. More cars than during the day. And it's not because the taxi driver is to busy, I never had to wait for more than 10 minutes to get into town, or 30 minutes to get home.

Some people are making the excuse that people drive down small boreens. Boreens aren't the only roads in rural ireland.
Also, gardai know it's going on and do nothing about it. That's because a garda that pushes heroin on schoolkids would probably be thought of higher than one that has a drink driving checkpoint set up outside the town every friday and saturday night.

Aidric · 22-01-2013 12:39pm

A number of the councillors who passed the motion are publicans, but Mr Healy-Rae denied that the councillors' professions influenced the vote.

Sure it didn't. This is the nub of the matter.

I am both angry and embarrassed by this decision. It is a short sighted motion to dig out the poor mouth publicans in rural Kerry. I suppose its no coincidence it comes at the same time as the phasing out of rural garda stations.

snickerpuss · 22-01-2013 12:43pm

I was on holiday in Kerry last Summer and coming around a country road when I saw a woman standing next to her car which had been scraped all down one side. She said that a local guy had driven into the side of her car, in which she had two disabled children no less.

She said he was drunk and that this wasn't the first time he had crashed into someone while drink driving but that nothing was ever done about it because his brother was a garda. I was shocked, surely it's only a matter of time before someone is seriously injured or killed by him? It was only 4pm. How long can a blind eye be turned?!

Kerrydude1981 · 22-01-2013 12:46pm

Aidric wrote: »

Sure it didn't. This is the nub of the matter.

I am both angry and embarrassed by this decision. It is a short sighted motion to dig out the poor mouth publicans in rural Kerry. I suppose its no coincidence it comes at the same time as the phasing out of rural garda stations.

Thats what the Councillors should be more worried about and be doing there best to stop the rural Garda stations closing instead of wasting their time voting on these half arsed motions by gombeen men.

enda1 · 22-01-2013 12:46pm

Could the council have the power to overturn state criminal legislation locally? Sounds peculiar.

crockholm · 22-01-2013 12:49pm

efb wrote: »

I'm sure there's thickos in Offaly too- no mention of passing drink driving motions or shaking hands with sex offenders

a motion that will be quashed and a rapist who was convicted.Jimbus chrimbus, do people in Ireland really believe that artificial boundaries planned for easy governance by english surveyors 400 years ago have any bearing on this? that people on one bank of the blackwater are different from those 15 feet away on the other side?maybe the 1 degree latitude difference puts them with sub-saharan africa and the good offaly folk in with the scandanavians.

AnonoBoy · 22-01-2013 12:50pm

snickerpuss wrote: »

How long can a blind eye be turned?!

Well they're dealing with the situation now aren't they?

Giving them permits will mean an end to illegal drink-driving! Yay!

No more worries about being prosecuted for being over the limit!

That'll sort everything out.

And the deaths that it'll cause? Ah sure, we all have to die sometime and something something about I know a guy that's actually better at driving when he's drunk than when he's sober so y'know, there's that as well and like, I'm friends with publicans so I'm going to listen to them above anybody who's actually talking sense and who has the welfare of others at heart. Sure isn't that how politics has worked for generations and the country's doing grand, isn't it? Sure we'll be grand like, what are you making a fuss for like some sort of woman? Jaysus - women, wha? Am I right? Wha? HAH!??? AM I RIGHT? SURE WHO ARE WE HARMING? NOBODY THAT'S WHO. WHA? WHA? WHA? WHA?

And so ends the part political broadcast on behalf of the F*cking Moron Party.

Thank you and goodnight.

Lollipops23 · 22-01-2013 12:53pm

God this infuriates me so much- the law is there for a reason.

It's like me bitching and moaning that not being allowed pickpocket curtails my social life... if people in rural or isolated areas are that desperate for social interaction (which is completely understandable) then they can go to the pub and have a soft drink.

People give out about younger generations having a sense of entitlement, but this is the worst I've seen. Nobody is entitled to drive drunk.

Balmed Out · 22-01-2013 12:55pm

Cienciano wrote: »

That's because a garda that pushes heroin on schoolkids would probably be thought of higher than one that has a drink driving checkpoint set up outside the town every friday and saturday night.

The checkpoints dont really work. Once one is set up the local pubs will be phoned by the first person to see it and all are warned. A lot of rural areas have a dozen ways of going from A to B and everyone can just go home a different route.

who the fug · 22-01-2013 1:05pm

Canis Lupus wrote: »

I lived relatively near to my local town with the only nightclub in the area. That was 12 miles. You find me a taxi that can offer an affordable rate to run a person out 12 miles+ and then return for another fare AND make a living when the only proper business will be on the Saturday night.....

Jeez, I remember when I was young. Waiting around for hours after a club trying to get a taxi/lift home... Not fun although got a few shifts so maybe it wasn't that bad.

12 miles, bugger all sympathy, walk it and you would be home in three hours

Grew up in a rural area and by the time I had left people were **** scared of losing their license.

Day of a brick under the accelerator and traipse home at 20 mile an hour were well over, people took it turn and turn about each weekend to do the driving.

Chorcai · 22-01-2013 1:06pm

I don't know what to say really, what planet are these guys on ?

tritium · 22-01-2013 1:13pm

I see the obnoxious pr1ck tried to justify it by linking it to the issue of suicide

seriously, does the asshole actually know anything about the statistics on suicide and the sections of society most affected by it?

omega666 · 22-01-2013 1:28pm

tritium wrote: »

I see the obnoxious pr1ck tried to justify it by linking it to the issue of suicide seriously, does the asshole actually know anything about the statistics on suicide and the sections of society most affected by it?

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/drink-driving-laws-increase-suicides-179244.html

greenpilot · 22-01-2013 1:28pm

Maybe its time to blow up all the Bridges across the Shannon and let them off...

Kerry CC support permit system which allows rural people drink and drive

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