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Council vote on new Westside Tesco

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    #122
    ladhrann
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭ladhrann


    JustMary wrote: »
    Indeed - do we know if Tesco actually had "interns" stacking shelves, or if the idea was stopped before any where hired?


    Also, what does anyone think should happen to the big block of land that used to be O'Higgins factory? Leave it fallow for 50 years - or forever? Houses (but we don't need an more of them)? Car park (more traffic)? Another factory (just what would be ok so close to residential areas now)?


    How about a community garden, a proper mental health clinic, properly designed accommodation for the elderly or disabled?

    Land and property are there for the people, not just the current owner. I strongly encourage everyone reading this thread to make an objection to this development.

    It is highly likely that this will replicate every other shoddy development of the past years. And be built to the worst specification by the lowest tender.

    So: green pre-patinated copper everywhere, poor quality badly laid paving, shiny slippery steps, roof angles like a drugged protractor, gammy ersatz 'public art', no public space, no landscaping, cheap plaster/render that grows red/brown fungus or if it doesn't then rusts. It will also be another excercise in getting as many people as possible to drive everywhere in an area that actually is on fairly human scale, close to town and should be accessed on foot/by bicycle.


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    #123
    snubbleste
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 31,117 ✭✭✭✭snubbleste


    :confused:
    Would you prefer if there was an out-of-town hypermarket with no bus service only accessible from a motorway ramp?


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    #124
    Jack_Plumber
    Registered Users Posts: 38 ✭Jack_Plumber


    If you have the courage of your conviction, you can object to the proposed development.

    File number: 11/312
    Applicant: T. O'Higgins and Company Ltd.
    Development Address: On the site of the former, T. O'Higgins Manufacturing Facility, Seamus Quirke Rd., & Rahoon Rd., Galway.
    Planner: John Doody
    Final date for submitting observations/objections: 2nd February, 2012

    Go the plans by puttin in the filename on this web page:
    http://gis.galwaycity.ie/ePlan/InternetEnquiry/rpt_QueryBySurForRecLoc.asp

    So, if you want to object you must shell out €20 and you'll need to get your skates on. Talk is cheap!


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    #125
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,676 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Doc Ruby wrote: »
    So we should let car thieves off with a warm hug because they got caught before they went through with it? And I would characterise shelf stacking christmas interns as thievery, from both taxpayer and interns.


    I wasn't aware there was such a shortage of land in and around Galway to make the use of that patch a pressing issue.

    Don't get too high-and-mighty: I heartily disapprove of unpaid internships. But if I refused to do any business with companies that had used 'em, I might find myself a bit short of a huge number of goods a services.

    And yes - if someone had intention to steal a car, but is prevented from doing so, then I believe that will be "let off with a warm hug". There are very few crimes where the intention, as opposed to the action, is illegal.


    Re the land: this is a big patch, with a history of manufacturing use, in between two residential areas and walkable from them both. So yes, I believe we should be using it for a community purpose (not necessarily non-profit), rather than not using it and building on the outskirts of the city of land previously used for farming.

    AFAIK, Shantalla already has a community centre, health centre and community garden, and UGH has a lot of (badly used) space. Westside certainly has lots of community facilities (library, church, community centre, sports centre, enterprise centre, boxing clubs, pitches ...)

    I don't know about demand for accommodation for the elderly and disabled - although for the latter the trend overseas is away from large clusters of such housing, towards smaller units throughout the whole community.

    A private hospital may be interesting - but the city already has two, so again, I'm not sure what the demand would be like. A nursing home may have potential too (though it would have "retarded biddies" driving there to visit their friends!) - and the elderly are a growing section of the community, so there would be demand over time.

    Office space for a gaming company, or others that support them, may have potential - would be interesting to see the community reaction to a proposal for a 4-story office building. That said, there's already a fair bit of empty office space around that side of the city, so the demand may not be there.


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    #126
    fishy fishy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,456 ✭✭✭fishy fishy


    i have heard that this is going to be a massive shop and it will be up on a platform like stilts. The back of the shop will be facing rahoon road and so delivery vans will be heading up and down a residential road at all hours of the night and morning delivering into the place. Very large trucks - very small road.

    That together with the council wanting to take the shantalla park and sell it off to a "private" medical company will surely be the downfall of one of the oldest communites in the city.

    I'm glad I don't live there, and I fell sorry now for those that do. Teh council seem adament on barricading them in with concrete


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    #127
    Robbo
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 10,555 Mod ✭✭✭✭Robbo


    fishy fishy wrote: »
    i have heard that this is going to be a massive shop and it will be up on a platform like stilts. The back of the shop will be facing rahoon road and so delivery vans will be heading up and down a residential road at all hours of the night and morning delivering into the place. Very large trucks - very small road.

    That together with the council wanting to take the shantalla park and sell it off to a "private" medical company will surely be the downfall of one of the oldest communites in the city.

    I'm glad I don't live there, and I fell sorry now for those that do. Teh council seem adament on barricading them in with concrete

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfSi0D7KESk

    Artists impression at 0:54.


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    #128
    citycentre
    Registered Users Posts: 262 ✭✭citycentre


    Im all for it, Galway is extremely poorly served for decent supermarkets - All of the Dunnes Stores are useless, badly stocked, overpriced and with generally poor customer service - I really wouldnt mind at all if this knocked a couple of them out of business. Its in a logical location for retail on a major distributor road, still within walking catchment of a large population and the design looks alright, similar to this: http://www.wdr-rt-taggart.com/HTML/Architecture/Projects/Retail/Tesco%20Craigavon/Tesco-1.html Unfortunately this has random stone and render cladding instead of the larch they used in Craigavon but the scale wont be much greater than the existing factory and there is a well considered landscaping scheme included in the plans.

    Heres hoping it'll be passed.


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    #129
    celty
    Registered Users Posts: 370 ✭✭celty


    I'm completely against it.

    Is it really 'proper planning' to build this without proper access roads and infrastructure? To put it into a residential area?

    Will it not just lead to a loss of jobs elsewhere? Will it really be a good news story if Tesco opens and the Westside Shopping Centre closes down?

    I'd like to know more about the role of our City Councillors in this, specifically in rezoning a site to enrich a former FF Mayor in defiance of the wishes of planners.

    Is that what we elect them for? Instead of looking at the overall development of the city, they have viewed one site in isolation which many people feel is ill equipped to host an 8,500 square foot supermarket?


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    #130
    fishy fishy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,456 ✭✭✭fishy fishy


    Ive also heard that the bus service will be cut on this route now (red bus) and will use alternative route, thus cutting off the route for the people of the highfield and shantalla areas, a lot of whom are elderly. nice on councillors. Does anyone know if this is true


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    #131
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    fishy, let's stick to discussing what can be verified from online sources.


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    #132
    Storm 10
    Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Storm 10


    citycentre wrote: »
    Im all for it, Galway is extremely poorly served for decent supermarkets - All of the Dunnes Stores are useless, badly stocked, overpriced and with generally poor customer service - I really wouldnt mind at all if this knocked a couple of them out of business. Its in a logical location for retail on a major distributor road, still within walking catchment of a large population and the design looks alright, similar to this: http://www.wdr-rt-taggart.com/HTML/Architecture/Projects/Retail/Tesco%20Craigavon/Tesco-1.html Unfortunately this has random stone and render cladding instead of the larch they used in Craigavon but the scale wont be much greater than the existing factory and there is a well considered landscaping scheme included in the plans.

    Heres hoping it'll be passed.

    Rubbish if you want Tesco they are on the headford road, Dunnes is a fully owned Irish supermarket company great prices etc, support our own and not a blow in company like Tesco who will destroy all of the smaller shops in the area, there is no reason for this massive complex in the centre of residental areas when you have loads of supermarkets within a mile or two of each other the City is too small for this.


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    #133
    what_traffic
    Registered Users Posts: 4,869 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    fishy fishy wrote: »
    Ive also heard that the bus service will be cut on this route now (red bus) and will use alternative route, thus cutting off the route for the people of the highfield and shantalla areas, a lot of whom are elderly. nice on councillors. Does anyone know if this is true

    You could be right - may have reduced services in the Shantalla area but I dont believe it has anything to do with this "Westside Tesco" development. Anyhow they would have to apply to the NTA if they want to drop services on a route to the best of my knowledge? When the new bus lanes on Seamus Quirke/Bishop O Donnell Rd are up and running City Direct will be providing services along this corridor, from the article they are talking about purchasing extra buses(double deckers) for their fleet so I would be surprised if services where reduced in Shantalla. See the following link http://www.galwaynews.ie/23631-new-%E2%80%98express-buses%E2%80%99-every-half-hour-knocknacarra-galway-city


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    #134
    antoobrien
    Registered Users Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭antoobrien


    There's a benefit to this project which is being overlooked - it provides a shopping option on the west side of the river, so it's not required to cross the river if you don't like dunnes or joyces. On that basis this is required for balanced development of Galway, providing facilities and jobs on the western part of Galway.

    On the other hand the traffic impact will be significant if this isn't done properly (Dunnes in Briarhill). It says in the application that they are to provide access to the SQR & Rahoon road (and a through), so it'll be interesting to see how this fits in with the current road works, especially as it looks like it'll may to be a new entracne (not sure if they they have enough frontage at Bothar le Cheile).

    From the description on the planning application, this looks like Tesco Clarehall in Dublin (off the N32), but the site looks to be significantly smaller (there's a former gym on the site).


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    #135
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,676 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    fishy fishy wrote: »
    Ive also heard that the bus service will be cut on this route now (red bus) and will use alternative route, thus cutting off the route for the people of the highfield and shantalla areas, a lot of whom are elderly. nice on councillors. Does anyone know if this is true


    If the plan is to "[close the ]current Rahoon road junction with Seamus Quirke at the ESB substation,"

    then yes, the route 33 bus will need to change. It may just change to go through this new complex.

    And either way, strange as it seems, providing bus services is not something that local councils have responsibility for or control over in this country.


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    #136
    Webbs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Webbs


    Storm 10 wrote: »
    Rubbish if you want Tesco they are on the headford road, Dunnes is a fully owned Irish supermarket company great prices etc, support our own and not a blow in company like Tesco who will destroy all of the smaller shops in the area, there is no reason for this massive complex in the centre of residental areas when you have loads of supermarkets within a mile or two of each other the City is too small for this.

    The loads of supermarkets are however predominantly Dunnes, which is not cheap and as a blow in myself I am used to the selection on the shelves that Tesco Sainsburys etc offer Dunnes has an awful selection.

    Dunnes is just a capable of destroying smaller shops in the area with their alleged nefarious practices in getting to be anchor tenants seemingly everywhere in Galway, reducing competition and therefore negatively affecting you as a customer in price, choice etc.


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    #137
    antoobrien
    Registered Users Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭antoobrien


    Storm 10 wrote: »
    Rubbish if you want Tesco they are on the headford road, Dunnes is a fully owned Irish supermarket company great prices etc, support our own and not a blow in company like Tesco who will destroy all of the smaller shops in the area, there is no reason for this massive complex in the centre of residental areas when you have loads of supermarkets within a mile or two of each other the City is too small for this.

    IIRC Tesco don't own the unit in GSC, so what's to say if this (and/or the one they're buying/have bought land for in Briarhill) goes ahead they won't move from or downgrade the GSC store.


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    #138
    what_traffic
    Registered Users Posts: 4,869 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    JustMary wrote: »
    And either way, strange as it seems, providing bus services is not something that local councils have responsibility for or control over in this country.

    True - especially for local city/town services. NTA i.e the Dublin Transport Office have responsibility.


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    #139
    galwayrush
    Registered Users Posts: 12,815 ✭✭✭✭galwayrush


    antoobrien wrote: »
    IIRC Tesco don't own the unit in GSC, so what's to say if this (and/or the one they're buying/have bought land for in Briarhill) goes ahead they won't move from or downgrade the GSC store.

    Tesco will be upgrading their Headford road branch as part of the redevelopement of the G.S.c. Tesco are the main driving force seeking to have the work start within 2 years.


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    #140
    schween
    Registered Users Posts: 444 ✭✭schween


    Storm 10 wrote: »
    Rubbish if you want Tesco they are on the headford road, Dunnes is a fully owned Irish supermarket company great prices etc, support our own and not a blow in company like Tesco who will destroy all of the smaller shops in the area, there is no reason for this massive complex in the centre of residental areas when you have loads of supermarkets within a mile or two of each other the City is too small for this.

    So Dunnes is a fully owned Irish supermarket? And what's your point? The money from Dunnes goes to the Dunne family and some directors I believe. What's so much better about that? A lot of Tesco staff have shares in the company, so more Irish people benefit.

    Then there's the argument that Dunnes sells more Irish products. Funny, because most of what I buy in Tesco, or Aldi or Lidl is from Ireland (or so the packaging says at least, god knows really). Tesco might have more products from abroad, but it's my choice if I buy them.

    And do you naively think that a Dunnes doesn't affect small shops? Or is it that the likes of Tesco have some sort of virus that that small shops are susceptible to that has a high mortality rate?

    The proposed supermarket will be in the vicinity of a petrol station/car dealership, Aldi, a toystore, post office, Dunnes, Xtravision, a credit union, McDonald's, a butchers etc. Is this in the middle of a residential area? It's beside one, as was Dunnes Briarhill and Knocknacarra, but hardly in the middle of it.
    celty wrote: »
    Will it really be a good news story if Tesco opens and the Westside Shopping Centre closes down?

    Hardly going to happen.
    antoobrien wrote: »
    IIRC Tesco don't own the unit in GSC, so what's to say if this (and/or the one they're buying/have bought land for in Briarhill) goes ahead they won't move from or downgrade the GSC store.

    This is highly unlikely also.

    The only reason why I can see why this shouldn't go ahead is the traffic one, which I think is valid. The area is highly congested, but, that is a citywide problem, and the fault of public transport providers, the council and others. I think rather than stopping development, they should do something about traffic congestion, but pigs will fly.

    I wish there was this much fury when Dunnes Briarhill was proposed! Then that awful junction outside it wouldn't have been created.


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    #141
    factual lies
    Registered Users Posts: 120 ✭✭factual lies


    antoobrien wrote: »
    IIRC Tesco don't own the unit in GSC, so what's to say if this (and/or the one they're buying/have bought land for in Briarhill) goes ahead they won't move from or downgrade the GSC store.


    Correct, tesco owns the land across from dunnes briarhill (where the burnt out houses are). They are still actively trying to get planning permission to build a hypermarket here to, but are getting rejected until a proper traffic management plan is in place, as well as issues that would have to be agreed apon with the local community living nearby.


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    #142
    celty
    Registered Users Posts: 370 ✭✭celty


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by celty viewpost.gif
    Will it really be a good news story if Tesco opens and the Westside Shopping Centre closes down?

    Hardly going to happen.

    Really Schween?

    There has been talk of Dunnes pulling out of Westside SC ever since the Knocknacarra branch opened. It is not seen as a viable supermarket by Dunnes management themselves, I've heard.

    If Dunnes Westside was to close, what future would there be for the butcher shop, electrical shop, health food shop, pharmacy, etc. in Westside SC? None, I'd imagine.

    Of course it is likely that Dunnes would close if a bigger Tesco opened right across the road, especially if they have a bigger and newer branch barely a mile away in Knocknacarra.

    Also, it is spurious to suggest that Tesco source as many Irish suppliers as Dunnes, which is an Irish rather than a UK firm.

    Plus, if you still think there is an Xtravision in the Westside then you obviously spend very little time in the area as the shop closed down last year as a 'cost cutting' measure by the company.

    If you live in Rahoon and want to rent a video you have to go across to the Headford Road branch these days.


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    #143
    antoobrien
    Registered Users Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭antoobrien


    celty wrote: »
    If Dunnes Westside was to close, what future would there be for the butcher shop, electrical shop, health food shop, pharmacy, etc. in Westside SC? None, I'd imagine.

    They could move to said tesco (or elsewhere), opening up Westside SC for one of ladhrann's ideas.
    ladhrann wrote: »
    How about a community garden, a proper mental health clinic, properly designed accommodation for the elderly or disabled?

    Land and property are there for the people, not just the current owner. I strongly encourage everyone reading this thread to make an objection to this development.


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    #144
    GekkePrutser
    Closed Accounts Posts: 673 ✭✭✭GekkePrutser


    celty wrote: »
    If you live in Rahoon and want to rent a video you have to go across to the Headford Road branch these days.

    The Xtravision near Joyce's is also open, which would be closer to Rahoon.

    Edit: Personally I'd love to see a tesco on the west side of town. Having a Tesco would really add much variety to the area because they have such a different range of brands. The bridge is such a mess traffic-wise that it's not really worth going over there for a quick run to the shop.

    I do hope the proposed location won't make it though, I don't think Tesco should inconvenience the locals who have been living there a lot longer.

    In my view the ideal location would be this massive unsightly hole in the ground in Knocknacarra. The road access is there and it's far from residential areas. It would even add value to the shopping centre that's there already. I don't think Dunnes should be allowed to block that.

    I believe the whole idea of not letting a shop X come somewhere because shop Y might lose sales is very uncompetitive and exactly the reason why we're being so ripped off so badly. On the mainland you don't even pay half as much for groceries.


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    #145
    Saoirse G
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6 ✭Saoirse G


    I think its a bad idea for it to open in that location, there is so much free land which I believe is zoned commercial beside Dunnes Knocknacarra also I have heard that the building will be on stilts of some sort, that sounds very unattractive to me and who wants an eyesore on such a busy road...:eek:


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    #146
    antoobrien
    Registered Users Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭antoobrien


    Saoirse G wrote: »
    I have heard that the building will be on stilts of some sort, that sounds very unattractive to me and who wants an eyesore on such a busy road...:eek:

    So's this one and it's on a far busier road (just off the M50). Just like with this one you'll only see the slits from one or two sides.

    CLAREHALL_SC_medium.jpg


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    #147
    schween
    Registered Users Posts: 444 ✭✭schween


    celty wrote: »
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by celty viewpost.gif
    Will it really be a good news story if Tesco opens and the Westside Shopping Centre closes down?

    Hardly going to happen.

    Really Schween?

    There has been talk of Dunnes pulling out of Westside SC ever since the Knocknacarra branch opened. It is not seen as a viable supermarket by Dunnes management themselves, I've heard.

    If Dunnes Westside was to close, what future would there be for the butcher shop, electrical shop, health food shop, pharmacy, etc. in Westside SC? None, I'd imagine.

    Of course it is likely that Dunnes would close if a bigger Tesco opened right across the road, especially if they have a bigger and newer branch barely a mile away in Knocknacarra.

    Also, it is spurious to suggest that Tesco source as many Irish suppliers as Dunnes, which is an Irish rather than a UK firm.

    Plus, if you still think there is an Xtravision in the Westside then you obviously spend very little time in the area as the shop closed down last year as a 'cost cutting' measure by the company.

    If you live in Rahoon and want to rent a video you have to go across to the Headford Road branch these days.

    There have been rumours about everywhere closing down for the last few years. If Dunnes Westside close, then as you've pointed out, it will be because there are too many of them. It is Dunnes fault on their quest for domination, not because a rival wants to open a store.

    I could write a long list of places that were rumoured to close, because people have heard things, that are still open. And another list of places that closed suddenly without notice. So I'll take the "I've heard..." thing with a pinch of salt.

    I never suggested that Tesco source as many Irish suppliers. I simply said I can easily buy Irish if I shop there.

    And you got me on the Xtravision one. I haven't rented a DVD in years.


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    #148
    inisboffin
    Registered Users Posts: 4,386 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    GekkePrutser wrote: »
    . On the mainland you don't even pay half as much for groceries.

    Emm.. 'The Mainland'???

    Pardon? :p


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    #149
    celty
    Registered Users Posts: 370 ✭✭celty


    inisboffin wrote: »
    Emm.. 'The Mainland'???

    Pardon? :p

    I didn't know there was a Tesco on the Aran Islands. Must get out more :D


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    #150
    celty
    Registered Users Posts: 370 ✭✭celty


    GekkePrutser wrote: »
    The Xtravision near Joyce's is also open, which would be closer to Rahoon.

    Edit: Personally I'd love to see a tesco on the west side of town. Having a Tesco would really add much variety to the area because they have such a different range of brands. The bridge is such a mess traffic-wise that it's not really worth going over there for a quick run to the shop.

    I do hope the proposed location won't make it though, I don't think Tesco should inconvenience the locals who have been living there a lot longer.

    In my view the ideal location would be this massive unsightly hole in the ground in Knocknacarra. The road access is there and it's far from residential areas. It would even add value to the shopping centre that's there already. I don't think Dunnes should be allowed to block that.

    I believe the whole idea of not letting a shop X come somewhere because shop Y might lose sales is very uncompetitive and exactly the reason why we're being so ripped off so badly. On the mainland you don't even pay half as much for groceries.

    While I take your point about competition being good (Ryanair did bring down Aer Lingus prices, even though I hate the buggers) it's the very way this is being brought about that makes me angry.

    It's not proper planning for this site to be foised on the locals as a 'hypermarket' just because our City Councillors defied the officials and rezoned it for a former FF Mayor.

    It's not proper planning for it to be built across the road from the Westside SC, where businesses are already struggling. I don't think the Westside Dunnes is any great shakes but if that w as to close down when the Tesco's opens there would be no net jobs gain and we'd be left with a big shell of unused units.

    As for the 'mainland', could you let us know where that is. I thought we are on the 'mainland'


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    #151
    antoobrien
    Registered Users Posts: 6,106 ✭✭✭antoobrien


    celty wrote: »
    It's not proper planning for this site to be foised on the locals as a 'hypermarket'

    The hypermarket label was brought up by RGDATA to make this look overly large, when it isn't. It's a multi storey building that will probably take up less space than footprint of the existing factory - 65*130=8450 sq meters for what looks like a single storey building vs the proposed multi storey of approx 8,510 sq meters.

    For a rough (but not fair) comparison imagine what GSC would be like if it were multi storey instead of across several buildings that have become linked together over time (GSC is well over 10,000 sq meters footprint).

    Also I'm going to point out that Hypermarket doesn't refer to size, but essentially a one stop shop, which Dunnes Terryland has had pretensions of being for over 20 years - so the concept isn't exactly alien to Galway, even if the term hasn't been used here before.


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