Dunnes Stores to be sold

OPENROAD · 05-11-2008 12:58am

FreedomJoe wrote: »

Well I can tell you this.

Expect to see a price war between ASDA and Tesco.

In Short , massive price savings for customers.

Do you think so?

I would have thought we would have had a price war between Tesco and Dunnes but we never have, why do you think it will be different with Asda.

darrenh · 05-11-2008 12:59am

The rumor bout dunnes is around awhile. apparently they have been increasing they're retail space for the last few years with the intention of a buy-out.

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:00am

milly4ever wrote: »

asda could take over the drapery stores as they have non-food stores called Asda Living

They will trial 1 or 2 but nothing major.

As I say expect Debenhams to snap up a few.

Asda is currently expanding into the Republic of Ireland.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asda

johnnyrotten · 05-11-2008 1:01am

Unlikely That Dunnes will keep name
Remember Quinnsworth/Crazy Prices became Tesco &Roches Stores became Debenhams

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:06am

OPENROAD wrote: »

Do you think so?

I would have thought we would have had a price war between Tesco and Dunnes but we never have, why do you think it will be different with Asda.

Look at Asdas introduction into Northern Ireland.

They have hit Dunnes and Tesco hard to grap the share of the market.

Wallmarts policy is to makes less profit on products but more profit on footfall.

In other words make 10p profit on a tin of beans and expect 500 customers,
make 1p profit on a tin of beans and expect 5000 customers.

Asda and Tesco have been going at each other for years, and in Eniskillen you have 3 major retailers.

Tesco, Dunnes and Asda.

Which one is the busiest? ASDA. They have built a new store there since taking over the safeway/morrison site which is now M&S.

They have now realised that this site isnt big enough and are expanding.

And where do you think most of their customers are from? The South!

Dunnes were always Exspensive but since Tesco opened they have re=labled St michael as their discount line. But they and tesco never went to war.

Asda are big players and they want the market share, so they will attack the Irish market as if it was a war!

OPENROAD · 05-11-2008 1:09am

FreedomJoe wrote: »

Asda are big players and they want the market share, so they will attack the Irish market as if it was a war!

I really hope you are right but will believe it when I see it.

copacetic · 05-11-2008 1:12am

Corruptedmorals wrote: »

It is true, I work there and my store manager confirmed it. No word yet on how much money it was, definitely a good few billion anyway, or whether it'll continue trading as Dunnes or revamp completley and scrap homeware and scale down drapery.

a good few billion? lollers.

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:16am

johnnyrotten wrote: »

Unlikely That Dunnes will keep name
Remember Quinnsworth/Crazy Prices became Tesco &Roches Stores became Debenhams

No chance of Asda keeping the Dunnes name.

Wallmart want to Establish Asda as their European name, and are eager to expand as Tesco have throughout Europe.

Asda is a household name in the UK and the North, and Wallmart management have been eager to move into Ireland under the ASDA brand for the past few years.

It has since been re-enforced with the profits Asda has been making in the North.

As i understand it Asda where prepared to either build new stores or buy out a existing company, I.E Superquinn.

It was never considered buying Dunnes as they are financially too big, but I beleive that a agreement has been made for a further buyout of redundant dunnes stores by another retailer, paving the possible buy out of Dunnes.

I beleive Asda told Dunnes to take it or leave it, eitherway Asda were coming to Ireland and would take the Irish market one way or another.

Dunnes couldnt compete, and in recent times have opened up too many new stores trying to starve off the competition, but these stores arent trading and are loosing the company too much money.

they had to take the Asda deal.

I have also heard, and hopefully this will be confirmed in the next few days, that Asda are buying out the Grocery division of Dunnes, and infact Dunnes will continue to exist as a drapery only chain, and will keep the intown stores and convert them solely to Drapery, and the outtown stores going to Asda.

On a final note, Asda do treat their staff well, as good as Tesco.

However Asda do not tollerate unions nor care for them.

Super Sidious · 05-11-2008 1:26am

I for one welcome our new Asda/Walmart overlords...

obrien_jimmy · 05-11-2008 1:40am

So what do you think theyd do with part timers and what not? just toss em out alltogether (depending on service length and all that)

Im an employee in dunnes and this really does worry me a great deal as its a job I depend on a great deal to get me by.

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:55am

obrien_jimmy wrote: »

So what do you think theyd do with part timers and what not? just toss em out alltogether (depending on service length and all that)

Im an employee in dunnes and this really does worry me a great deal as its a job I depend on a great deal to get me by.

Asda loves part timers.

Its employee base is made up of Flexi "Collegue" workers. (part Timers.)

Its the full timers that will loose their jobs, and the long service staff.

Of course Asda wont just sack them, but they will p them off enough within the employment rules to make people leave.

For instance someone who has had it easy propping up a counter will now find themselves asked to replenish the freezers. (Which means spending several hours a day entering and exiting the large warehouse freezers).

So imagine the old dears been with Dunnes 40 years or so waiting for their pension and have a better contract than most managers, and when asked to do something outside of their normal working day run to the unions. There day will be long gone, and in fact will now find themselves spending a lot of time doing jobs they hate, and constantly being "collegue accounted".

Ham'nd'egger · 05-11-2008 3:27am

icdg wrote: »

The company that owns Superquinn, Select Retail Holdings Limited, is not listed and there is no public share register. However, its fronted by a retailer, Simon Burke, but several property developers are involved.

As for UK based potential acquirers. Waitrose would be the best fit. Superquinn does (or until recently did) already stock some of its products and it is a similar upmarket style. Waitrose's parent John Lewis already wants to enter the Irish market. M&S might be another potential acquirer and at this stage is nearly bigger in Ireland than Superquinn (which hasn't really expanded that much in years).

However I have a feeling that the eventual acquirer might be none other than J Sainsbury, even though they have said a couple of times that they're not interested in the Irish market.

Dunnes isn't listed either and doesn't declare it's worth, earnings or tax returns; always bear it in mind the next time Ben Dunne tells us how to vote or about spending taxes:rolleyes:

Superquinn tend to either own or hold most of their own premises so in some respects given the capital required to buy into them, they are less prone to takeover and rebranding as Quinnsworth/Crazy Prices were in the mid 90's; back then Tescos literally walked in on a Monday and had a deal sealed come the Thursday unbeknownst to the retail world for IR£647 million; Superquinn went for €450 million with far less retail trade pro rata but crucially with property value. They have gone a long way to expand and rebrand in the last few years (Tons of refittes shops and some new ones, more on the way) though they needed to expand their chain years back when Fergal Quinn was too busy in the Seaníd.

While property prices have fallen as of late, the Select Group took on a business with a decent brand name, a decent cash flow, good sites, a long and dedicated customer base, a good reputation in the European trade for innovation and a more stable market position than most other multiples in Ireland insofar as they are considered the sole quality retailer in Ireland; the customer perception of them is that their competition is the high street butchers, bakers etc. Super Valu in the country towns is most similar to their shops in terms of shopping feel so if they were to expand anywhere, this is their next step in the smaller locations that have not become Tesco Towns.

I agree than Waitrose is their best match in the UK but I suspect that their size and character will serve to protect them at the minute in the market. They seem to have a loyal customer and supplier base and to be honest, they are hacking at some of the prices as much as the others.

OPENROAD · 05-11-2008 3:31am

Hamndegger wrote: »

I agree than Waitrose is their best match in the UK .

Whose match? Are you saying that Waitrose are a similar type of supermarket as Dunnes?

Frelance · 05-11-2008 4:09am

OPENROAD wrote: »

I really hope you are right but will believe it when I see it.

He is right.

Like he said, If you go to Enniskillen you can see it first hand. Both Tesco and Asda built new stores just over a year ago. Being close to the border they both pull in quite alot of business.

Before i left we were making around 1.2 million a week, if there was a southern bank holiday we'd easily make far more.

Tesco will finally have some hardcore competition so it can only benefit the consumers in the long run.

btw, joe how ya know so much about asda? your right about it expanding in enniskillen. Larger clothes and alcohol section and i think they were talking about a filling station as well.

OPENROAD · 05-11-2008 4:22am

Frelance wrote: »

He is right.

Like he said, If you go to Enniskillen you can see it first hand. Both Tesco and Asda built new stores just over a year ago. Being close to the border they both pull in quite alot of business.

Oh I know they have pulled in a huge amount of business from the South.

Hopefully,as you said if they come in here it will be real competition to such an extent that we see a significant fall in prices and it won't be a case of the same goods still being significantly cheaper in the North.

phasers · 05-11-2008 9:54am

Walmart coming to Ireland? What about Dunnes clothing and home stuff? they do nice stuff

Fratton Fred · 05-11-2008 10:10am

This is great news. Tesco and Asda going head to head should mean big cost cuts. They hate each other.

Asda do their own range of clothing which I would consider to be on a par with Dunnes, I think they are the biggest clothing retailer in the UK. The George brand is named after the guy who re0invented the Asda clothing range a few years back, he was previously head of something or other at Next and style wise they are similar i would say, but lower cost and a less prestigious brand.

I would say Waitrose and Quinns are fairly similar but the john Lewis group has a very unique corporate structure and I'm not sure well that suits buying out companies. Waitrose are a very high quality supermarket though, in the same sort of range as M&S, but they aint cheap.

05-11-2008 10:13am

I really couldn't care less if something is irish-owned. If they are ripping me off then screw them. I would gladly get my weeks shopping from Lidl or Aldi for half the price than from Dunnes.

This can only be a good thing.

Dragan · 05-11-2008 10:36am

Overheal wrote: »

The last thing you want is Walmart swooping in.

Bollix and you know it.

The best chance we have of legalisation around the ready sale of firearms in this country is to get a Walmart on ever corner!

Guns ftw.

mountainyman · 05-11-2008 10:39am

As soon as it is sold the Criminal Assets Bureau should being investigating the Dunnes family trust. They were so close to Haughey that this could net a few billion for the state.

chaotic_vr · 05-11-2008 11:28am

I heard Sainsbury's bought Dunnes yesterday.

Fratton Fred · 05-11-2008 12:04pm

chaotic_vr wrote: »

I heard Sainsbury's bought Dunnes yesterday.

hhmmm, that would be interesting. I like sainsburys.

ToxicPaddy · 05-11-2008 12:09pm

Superquinn have gone to the dogs since they were taken over.. their selection of products have dropped dramatically, quality of service has nose dived and they whole thing is now a joke.. wouldnt touch one where as up to about 3 years ago it was the only place I shopped..

Bring on a take over by someone who knows what they are doing..!!

As for Dunnes, well that writing has been on the wall for ages, it was only a matter of time before they were taken over, I'm just surprised its taken so long.

Tox

Our man in Havana · 05-11-2008 12:19pm

FreedomJoe wrote: »

So imagine the old dears been with Dunnes 40 years or so waiting for their pension and have a better contract than most managers, and when asked to do something outside of their normal working day run to the unions. There day will be long gone, and in fact will now find themselves spending a lot of time doing jobs they hate, and constantly being "colleague accounted".

They should be retired and pensioned off if they don't like the regime change. One thing for sure is that the union will be given the road as soon as the ink is dry on the sale. If the workers strike Asda will sack them and hire in non union workers immediately. Problem solved.

mountainyman · 05-11-2008 12:28pm

Bond-007 wrote: »

They should be retired and pensioned off if they don't like the regime change. One thing for sure is that the union will be given the road as soon as the ink is dry on the sale. If the workers strike Asda will sack them and hire in non union workers immediately. Problem solved.

Bond if you don't know what you're talking about don't bother to type anything. Your comment adds nothing to the discussion and is legally inaccurate.

Our man in Havana · 05-11-2008 12:47pm

The can refuse to recognise the union and refuse to talk to them. Nothing illegal about that. Ryanair is a good example.

What use is a union that management won't talk to?

It BeeMee · 05-11-2008 12:47pm

No sign of Iceland taking anything over, so at least we won't have that Kerry CatFadden wan trying to hawk us frozen sprouts...

Our man in Havana · 05-11-2008 12:49pm

It BeeMee wrote: »

No sign of Iceland taking anything over, so at least we won't have that Kerry CatFadden wan trying to hawk us frozen sprouts...

They are in no position to buy out anything.

getz · 05-11-2008 1:00pm

keep your heads guys and gals if ASDA walmart buy DUNES it wont be all that bad for a start prices will drop and TESCO will have to drop there prices as well my wife has worked for ASDA over 20 years{before it was WALMART] and finds it a good place to work --low prices good for ireland

obrien_jimmy · 05-11-2008 1:05pm

I think that having a union that management wont recognise is preety much illegal. I dont think thats going to happen. I mean thats sheer insanity.. if that was the case whats the point in even having or joining the union?

Dunnes workers have striked before, in the 90's I think it was and it was everywhere. customers kinda sided with them aswell though. but one things for certain times have changed.

If customers are promised lower prices they wont care as much about the workers that are employed in the place, especially in a recession.

I think we can only wait and see what happens.
I mean I work in the place, im as worried as much as anyone right now if not more so. Anything thats been said right now is just all speculation, for all we know it could be that its a change of managership, or just rebranding the name and policies from dunnes to asda as many have said in previous posts.

Rozabeez · 05-11-2008 1:25pm

Ahhh...they can't take the footwear department away from me!

Skyuser · 05-11-2008 1:32pm

The Dunne family don't know how to run a business. To be the No.1 supermarket in the country only to be beat by Tesco within 5 years of them entering the Irish market. Dunnes just simply lied down and let them take over.

ps. WWW.ASDA.IE is active and forwarding to walmart.com

snorlax · 05-11-2008 1:40pm

they´ll have to rename us New England! the amount of english owned stores here..

Dudess · 05-11-2008 1:40pm

m@cc@ wrote: »

Bout time. Their way of doing business and their decor is like something from the 80's. Just the shake up it needs.

Oh I don't know. I think the interior looks pretty good these days - it used to be grim, but that was pre Celtic Tiger.

Our man in Havana · 05-11-2008 1:42pm

Skyuser wrote: »

The Dunne family don't know how to run a business. To be the No.1 supermarket in the country only to be beat by Tesco within 5 years of them entering the Irish market. Dunnes just simply lied down and let them take over.

ps. WWW.ASDA.IE is active and forwarding to walmart.com

domain: asda.ie
descr: Wal-Mart Stores, Inc.
descr: BODY CORPORATE (LTD,PLC,COMPANY)
descr: Discretionary Name
admin-c: AAP720-IEDR
tech-c: CCA7-IEDR
renewal: 19-March-2009
status: Active
nserver: NS1.MARKMONITOR.COM
nserver: NS3.MARKMONITOR.COM
source: IEDR

Looks like it could be a goer.

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:44pm

Frelance wrote: »

He is right.

Like he said, If you go to Enniskillen you can see it first hand. Both Tesco and Asda built new stores just over a year ago. Being close to the border they both pull in quite alot of business.

Before i left we were making around 1.2 million a week, if there was a southern bank holiday we'd easily make far more.

Tesco will finally have some hardcore competition so it can only benefit the consumers in the long run.

btw, joe how ya know so much about asda? your right about it expanding in enniskillen. Larger clothes and alcohol section and i think they were talking about a filling station as well.

Family connections at Wallmart HO in the US, that know a lot about the Europe side of the business.;)

Oh and I work for Tesco, who are very worried about the effects of ASDA on the republic of Ireland market!

jessbeth · 05-11-2008 1:54pm

I think it will be great if it happens. I'm bought stuff from Dunnes a few times only to take it home and find out it was gone off even though the date was good. It really put me off shopping there.

FreedomJoe · 05-11-2008 1:56pm

ASDA will try to work with the unions, its in their interest.

But they will not be told how to run their business by them.

Wallmart have great plans for Ireland, and no union will get in wallmarts way.

It will be either work with Asda, or ASDA will find a union that will.

And eitherway Dunnes would have gone bust will all staff loosing their jobs, so the unions will have to except the best offer on the table with minimal job cuts.

Ive heard that there are to be about 8000 job cuts, but 4,000 new positions offered. The new positions will be part time only.

The other 4000 job loses will be offered employment in the new company that takes over the non Asda old Dunnes stores.

getz · 05-11-2008 2:20pm

snorlax--dont knock it -its about time us english , had our own ethnic stores over here

Our man in Havana · 05-11-2008 2:24pm

getz wrote: »

snorlax--dont knock it -its about time us english , had our own ethnic stores over here

For sure.

You get sick of cabbage and bacon and potatoes real quick.

Jip · 05-11-2008 2:27pm

Baahhh, it'll be nothing after all the speculation here, just announcements about Christmas opening hours and a reduction in staffs Christmas bonus's or some other non-event thing.

delly · 05-11-2008 2:43pm

A few months back Dunnes cancelled a few new shops being opened, at the time it was said to be due to cutting back etc., but it makes sense now that it was because they were putting a price tag on the company.

Where I live they are supposed to be opening at the end of the month, as of yet I haven't seen any Dunnes hoarding, so who knows.

getz · 05-11-2008 2:47pm

dont knock irish food most of it is fresh --o lot better than chip butties

Fratton Fred · 05-11-2008 2:47pm

snorlax wrote: »

they´ll have to rename us New England! the amount of english owned stores here..

yep, Walmart, Spar, Starbucks, Lidl, Pennys, Vero Moda, Jack & jones, even Ikea are opening up not to mention 3 and O2. Even eircom and Meteor are English owned.

Seriously though, it is an easy place to British based retail outlets to open up, everyone here supports Man United, or watches UK television so the brands are well enough known. For example, Eircell was one of the best known brands in Ireland, but Vodafone was better known even though they didn't actually trade in Ireland at the time, so when voda bought eircell they changed the name quickly. In Germany it went from D2 to D2Vodafone, then to VodafoneD2 then to Vodafone over the space of 12 to 18 months.

Pennys, or Primark as it in called in the UK, is one of the leading retailers, so the Irish are holding their own. Real Estate Opportunities, one of the most active development companies in London (Who are behind the £300m redevelopment of Battersea Power Station) are Irish owned and look at Kerry foods, they aint doing so bad.

Asda/Walmart buying Dunnes is just another example of how big business is getting more and more global and in my opinion, this can only be good news for the Irish consumer.

Steyr · 05-11-2008 3:00pm

Jip wrote: »

Baahhh, it'll be nothing after all the speculation here, just announcements about Christmas opening hours and a reduction in staffs Christmas bonus's or some other non-event thing.

I work for Dunnes too, and i read more or less the above in the Indo this morning, something to do with giving Mgt better communication between eachother.

Here ya go:http://www.independent.ie/national-news/union-fears-dunnes-will-be-sold-1521706.html

Union fears Dunnes will be sold

By John Mulligan

Wednesday November 05 2008

The Mandate trade union last night demanded to know whether Dunnes Stores had been sold as intense speculation mounted about the future of the store chain.

The union has asked Dunnes, headed by matriarch Margaret Heffernan, to clarify the speculation but the store, which opened its first shop in 1944 and is notoriously tight-lipped, failed to reply to a plea by Mandate.

Industry sources at Dunnes Stores last night dismissed speculation that UK retailer Asda had bought the 120-strong Irish chain.

Speculation was rife yesterday that Dunnes is set to announce that it has been acquired by a competitor following a flurry of calls by concerned workers at the retail giant to Mandate.

Asda, which is owned by US-based retailing giant Wal-Mart, declined to comment, but expressed surprise that the rumours had resurfaced. For at least eight years, there has been occasional speculation that Asda and Dunnes were about to link up.

Last week, Dunnes Stores regional managers were told to ensure that store managers and other key personnel were in place today for a series of meetings and this fuelled the speculation.

Meetings

However, it's understood that the planned meetings have now been cancelled. The meetings were likely to concern an update on the retailer's plans for Christmas trading hours, as well as staff rosters and sales targets for the period.

Dunnes Stores is known to have been under intense pressure in the retail market from Tesco, with German chains Lidl and Aldi also piling on the competition as the recession forces more shoppers to make their wages go further.

Earlier this year Tesco also launched a new range of value-priced products in an effort to keep shoppers who might otherwise have opted to visit Lidl or Aldi.

All grocery retailers, including the Musgrave-owned SuperValu chains and Superquinn, have been waging price battles in recent weeks to lure customers.

Traditionally, Dunnes Stores has followed the lead of other retailers such as Tesco in determining its store opening hours over Christmas.

Last year Dunnes, which has a roughly 24pc share of the country's €15bn grocery market, is understood to have held a meeting in the Burlington Hotel in Dublin at which senior managers were informed of trading plans for the season.

No such group meeting is taking place this year, and instead in-store meetings will take place.

The initiative may have been an attempt to actually improve communications between the head office and senior staff in the field that instead backfired.

It's believed that Ms Heffernan's son, Michael, who is in his mid-thirties, is now being groomed to eventually take over the helm at the supermarket giant.

- John Mulligan

ongarite · 05-11-2008 3:34pm

Jip wrote: »

Baahhh, it'll be nothing after all the speculation here, just announcements about Christmas opening hours and a reduction in staffs Christmas bonus's or some other non-event thing.

You are correct. This morning meeting was about just that, nothing to do with the rumoured ASDA take-over.
Budget cut-backs and staff reductions..

Jip · 05-11-2008 3:52pm

So did the meeting happen this morning ? I thought it was put off until Thursday ?
The reason why I said what I did was that I have alot of contacts between the 2 biggest multi nationals and it was in fact the non-Dunnes staff who were jumping to the conclusion that Dunnes has been sold.

Having said that I'm still open to correction until the official word comes from Dunnes who are usually tight lipped about anything to do with the company.

SimpleSam06 · 05-11-2008 4:01pm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

yep, Walmart, Spar, Starbucks, Lidl, Pennys, Vero Moda, Jack & jones, even Ikea are opening up not to mention 3 and O2. Even eircom and Meteor are English owned.

Seriously though, it is an easy place to British based retail outlets to open up, everyone here supports Man United, or watches UK television so the brands are well enough known.

Bahaha, Fratton Fred in his one man quest to recolonise the west country, a book should be wrote. Just to knock down one of the several fallacious claims, Eircom is owned by an Australian.

jesus_thats_gre · 05-11-2008 4:08pm

snorlax wrote:

they´ll have to rename us New England! the amount of english owned stores here..

Fratton Fred wrote: »

yep, Walmart, Spar, Starbucks, Lidl, Pennys, Vero Moda, Jack & jones, even Ikea are opening up not to mention 3 and O2. Even eircom and Meteor are English owned.

Seriously though, it is an easy place to British based retail outlets to open up, everyone here supports Man United, or watches UK television so the brands are well enough known. For example, Eircell was one of the best known brands in Ireland, but Vodafone was better known even though they didn't actually trade in Ireland at the time, so when voda bought eircell they changed the name quickly. In Germany it went from D2 to D2Vodafone, then to VodafoneD2 then to Vodafone over the space of 12 to 18 months.

Pennys, or Primark as it in called in the UK, is one of the leading retailers, so the Irish are holding their own. Real Estate Opportunities, one of the most active development companies in London (Who are behind the £300m redevelopment of Battersea Power Station) are Irish owned and look at Kerry foods, they aint doing so bad.

Asda/Walmart buying Dunnes is just another example of how big business is getting more and more global and in my opinion, this can only be good news for the Irish consumer.

Walmark - America
Spar - Dutch I think
Starbucks - America
Lidl - Germany
Pennys - UK
Vero Moda - Denmark
Jack & Jones - Denmark
Ikea - Sweden
Three - God knows, asia somewhere
O2 - Spannish
Eircom and Meteor - Australian I think

Hmmm, damn those English companies indeed..

As for Eircell and Vodafone when Vodafone took over. I worked for Eircell at the time and the company was called Eircell Vodafone for nearly a year if I remember correctly.

IIRC, Pennys are or were owend by Power Supermarkets. These are the crowd that sold Crazy Prices and Quinnsworth to Tesco. You will probably have noticed that there was always a Penny's and a Crazy Prices or Quinnsworth as the anchor tenants in new Shopping Centres back in the day.

Anyway, no real point to this post other than identifying where you went astray.

Linku · 05-11-2008 4:12pm

Ugh, ASDA is gross. Totally doesn't fit in with what Dunnes have been doing the last few years, what will become of the new Georges St. or Henry St. stores? ASDA is all about big-box out of town cheap ass buildings, it doesn't fit.
Sainsbury's would be a better match, but they can't match Wal-Mart's cash. They've been rumoured to take over Superquinn for a while too.

Dunnes Stores to be sold

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