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Miss Universe has a little secret...

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13567…16

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    #62
    davet82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    krudler wrote: »
    doctors who know more than you?

    Thats not what Dr. Nick Riveria says :cool:


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    #63
    midlandsmissus
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,838 ✭✭✭midlandsmissus


    The King of Moo wrote: »
    It won't really change things: it's all rigged anyway.

    No-one from outside Earth has ever won it.

    First thing I actually ever logged in to thank. Brilliant!


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    #64
    The King of Moo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭The King of Moo


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Perception and reality are different.

    Michael Jackson thought he was white and disguised himself to match his wrapped self image... doesn't mean he was going to get accepted into the Klu Klux Klan.



    Says who?
    Gender is based on the XX/XY chromosomes, and more simplistically whether they have male/female genitalia.

    It's generally based on that, but not defined by it. Your genitalia and your chromosomes determine your sex, but not your gender.
    Sex is purely biological, but gender is a much more complex identity based on a combination of your psychological and physical characteristics, as well as social constructs about gender norms.
    Most of us, if we were honest with ourselves, would admit to having gender identities which comprise characteristics traditionally considered both masculine and feminine.
    It's like a spectrum.
    It seems entirely plausible that though most people have a gender identity close to the end of the spectrum which would align with their biological identity, a minority of people would identify their mind as being at the opposite end of the spectrum to their body.


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    #65
    Seachmall
    Registered Users Posts: 7,041 ✭✭✭Seachmall


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Perception and reality are different.

    But you're defining the reality of someone's gender to mean solely their physical self.

    To decide their physical body is the most important, or only, factor is arbitrary.


    I'm a man because I have a male reproductive system (and a fine one at that) but also because in my head I am a man. If I felt more like a woman it would be easier to change my physical appearance than to try to convince myself of something I probably can't be convinced of.


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    #66
    armitage_skanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 114 ✭✭armitage_skanks


    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.


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    #67
    The King of Moo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭The King of Moo


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.

    Even if it's a woman who dresses in men's clothes, like Marlene Dietrich?


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    #68
    Stiffler2
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,536 ✭✭✭Stiffler2


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.

    Ahh Armittage Shanks.

    1.2.3.4.5
    1.2.3.4.5
    spins around, counts toilet bowl letters A.R.M.I.T.T.A.G.E S.H.A.N.K.S

    Armittage has anyone ever told you before it's Shanks and not Skanks, although duhh, you already knew that.

    such is my obsession with toilet bowls. Read it many a time as I hugged the bowl for comfort


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    #69
    Hamhide
    Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭Hamhide


    I'm transgendered and full time felame.i think this is a great idea and its about time.for anyone who thinks its a little odd and trans girls arnt real women,i suggest you goggle image search ''Bailey Jay'' ^_^


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    #70
    The King of Moo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭The King of Moo


    Hamhide wrote: »
    I'm transgendered and full time felame.i think this is a great idea and its about time.for anyone who thinks its a little odd and trans girls arnt real women,i suggest you goggle image search ''Bailey Jay'' ^_^

    If you're Bailey Jay, PM sent.


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    #71
    davet82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.

    transvestites and transgenders are totally different conditions for want of a better word... i maybe mistaken though?


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    #72
    CreepingDeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭CreepingDeath


    The King of Moo wrote: »
    It's generally based on that, but not defined by it. Your genitalia and your chromosomes determine your sex, but not your gender.

    Then such misalignments are psychological defects and I don't think it's right that the rest of society have to play along with the crazy peoples delusions.


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    #73
    Gummy Panda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,920 ✭✭✭✭Gummy Panda


    Hamhide wrote: »
    I'm transgendered and full time felame.i think this is a great idea and its about time.for anyone who thinks its a little odd and trans girls arnt real women,i suggest you goggle image search ''Bailey Jay'' ^_^

    Remember to turn on safe search first :mad:


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    #74
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,771 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    But the whole point of 'Miss' is that they are pure and chaste maidens.

    or since it's AH are beauty contests still based on sleeping with judges ?





    They all have lovely bottoms.


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    #75
    armitage_skanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 114 ✭✭armitage_skanks


    davet82 wrote: »
    transvestites and transgenders are totally different conditions for want of a better word... i maybe mistaken though?

    I never heard transgender until a few years ago. People used to always use transvestite for some who got a sex-change operation.


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    #76
    davet82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    Hamhide wrote: »
    ''Bailey Jay''

    stop messing with my head :(


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    #77
    Hamhide
    Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭Hamhide


    But the whole point of 'Miss' is that they are pure and chaste maidens.

    or since it's AH are beauty contests still based on sleeping with judges ?





    They all have lovely bottoms.[/QUOTE]

    I doubt any of the Miss's are pure and chaste.its not compulsory to wear white at these things


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    #78
    krudler
    Registered Users Posts: 34,788 ✭✭✭✭krudler


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.

    transvestites are cross dressers, transexuals are people who get a sex change, its a different thing


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    #79
    GLaDOS
    Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,205 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    I don't have any ill will towards them but I don't consider a transvestite to be an actual women.
    Being pedantic, but transvestism and transgender are completely different things.

    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



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    #80
    The King of Moo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭The King of Moo


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Then such misalignments are psychological defects and I don't think it's right that the rest of society have to play along with the crazy peoples delusions.

    Assuming they're psychological defects (which I don't agree with), what do you think should happen?

    Should such people be forced to live in a body they feel no sense of identity with?
    Even though our identity is a combination between our physical and mental selves, our bodies are hugely important to our sense of self. Imagine waking up and looking like a different person.

    Why not let them have the operation if it gives them peace of mind and makes them feel at home in their bodies, and doesn't affect other people in any way?

    I can understand why people don't consider transgendered people to be of the gender they identify with, but I don't understand why people get so worked up about it.
    They're not harming anyone.


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    #81
    Paulie Gualtieri
    Closed Accounts Posts: 420 ✭✭Paulie Gualtieri


    I think this is polital correctness or liberal socialist bullsh1t gone mad,

    theres a dog show in England called crufts as you may all know , and the aim of the competition is to give great examples of the breed of dog.

    thats all these pagents really are , good looking WOMEN !, ...and the only difference is they talk about world peace, and god and bla bla bla.

    no cats in crufts ! no men in Miss Universe!


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    #82
    davet82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    krudler wrote: »
    transvestites are cross dressers, transexuals are people who get a sex change, its a different thing

    thanks for clearing that up, i knew Oscar dela Hoya wasnt gonna chop his sausage off :)


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    #83
    Hamhide
    Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭Hamhide


    oh you think Baily jay is a mindf*ck? what about ''sarina valentina'' try not to get bains on your keyboard when your head explodes..and dont forget safe search


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    #84
    armitage_skanks
    Closed Accounts Posts: 114 ✭✭armitage_skanks


    ScienceNerd wrote: »
    Being pedantic, but transvestism and transgender are completely different things.

    Well they're not completely different, surely a transgender is just a transvestite who went all the way and got a sex-change op.


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    #85
    hondasam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,419 ✭✭✭✭hondasam


    Paulie Gualtieri wrote: »
    .

    no cats in crufts ! no men in Miss Universe!

    They are not men now. it's a bit different.


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    #86
    CreepingDeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭CreepingDeath


    The King of Moo wrote: »
    Assuming they're psychological defects (which I don't agree with), what do you think should happen?

    Electroshock treatment is really the most cost effective and humane treatment.
    The King of Moo wrote: »
    Why not let them have the operation if it gives them peace of mind and makes them feel at home in their bodies, and doesn't affect other people in any way?

    It does if they expect the State to pay for the purely cosmetic and non health related operation.
    If they pay for it themselves, fine, go knock yourself out.

    But it doesn't end there.
    They push to force the rest of society to accept them through legislation.
    Why should we be forced to play along with someone else's delusion?


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    #87
    The King of Moo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,207 ✭✭✭The King of Moo


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    Well they're not completely different, surely a transgender is just a transvestite who went all the way and got a sex-change op.

    Not necessarily. Some people like to crossdress for sexual kicks, some just like the clothes.

    It doesn't necessarily mean they want to change gender.

    I think Eddie Izzard, though he doesn't crossdress so much these days, is pretty comfortable being a straight man, and he's often spoken about being a mix of laddish and stereotypically feminine characteristics. Or a "male lesbian," as he's described himself in the past.

    He'd make a crap woman anyway: too big.

    Originally posted by CreepingDeath
    Electroshock treatment is really the most cost effective and humane treatment.

    Can you point me to some of the research on that?
    Originally posted by CreepingDeath
    It does if they expect the State to pay for the purely cosmetic and non health related operation.
    If they pay for it themselves, fine, go knock yourself out.

    But it doesn't end there.
    They push to force the rest of society to accept them through legislation.
    Why should we be forced to play along with someone else's delusion?

    According to the latest figures I could find, the state paid for 14 gender-reassignment procedures between 2006 and 2011. Not a huge expense, is it, and if it provides major psychological help to people that's great.

    Also, why shouldn't we accept transgender people?
    What harm will accepting them do?
    If a man who had a gender reassignment procedure gets to put her gender down as female on her passport, what's the big deal?
    The world will keep on turning and your life won't change in the slightest.


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    #88
    GLaDOS
    Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,205 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    Well they're not completely different, surely a transgender is just a transvestite who went all the way and got a sex-change op.
    Transvestite is essentially a man who likes to dress as a woman, they still see themselves as a man.

    Transgender is someone who was born a man but considers themselves a woman.

    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



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    #89
    krudler
    Registered Users Posts: 34,788 ✭✭✭✭krudler


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Electroshock treatment is really the most cost effective and humane treatment.



    It does if they expect the State to pay for the purely cosmetic and non health related operation.
    If they pay for it themselves, fine, go knock yourself out.

    But it doesn't end there.
    They push to force the rest of society to accept them through legislation.
    Why should we be forced to play along with someone else's delusion?

    fcuking hell


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    #90
    davet82
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,753 ✭✭✭davet82


    armitage_skanks wrote: »
    Well they're not completely different, surely a transgender is just a transvestite who went all the way and got a sex-change op.

    Tell that to Oscar de la Hoye ;)

    Its not about gay or being a woman as far as i can tell but feel free to correct me on this anyone


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    #91
    Hamhide
    Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭Hamhide


    why is CreepingDeath allowed to be on this planet?.. sorry but the biggots belong somewhere else


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