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Becoming a Real Runner

1131416181967

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,852 ✭✭✭pgmcpq


    Great run meno after a tough start. Good to see you (briefly!) again. Sorry I could not stick around at McGs I had to round up the the rest of my 'team'. We are idly thinking about Barcalona ....... It is flat :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,496 ✭✭✭Oisin11178


    When you going for 3.30 again bud?
    Straight back on the horse:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Yep Oisin, straight back on the horse. Hope to PB at the waterford Half, then it's all eyes on Barcelona and Conn Ultra. I am changing my mind by the hour on wether or not to go for a PB in Barcelona. I hear you are gonna attempt sub 3 out there?

    TOday I met up with Brainderunner in the park. Both our legs were still very heavy. We probably should have stopped at 5 or 6 as it felt like the last few were just miles for the sake of it.
    Anyway 9.7 miles @ 9:21 pace HR 141

    That's 162.8 for the month. I probably won't make 2000 miles this year :( maybe next year.


    Month|Miles
    January|112
    February|73.6
    March|117
    April|141.8
    May|155.7
    June|152
    July|201.1
    August|166
    September|215.7
    October |162.8
    Total|1497.9 miles


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    The last few days I have been using the weather as an excuse for not running :o

    I was determined to get back into it tonight, so straight after work, I went out in the cold dark, windy, rainy night for a very hilly 10k punishment run.
    The legs felt back to normal tonight. Strong on the uphills and downhills. I got absolutely soaked to the skin, but it felt great.

    6.3 miles Pace 8:40, HR 146.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    4.8 miles @ 9:05 pace. HR: somewhere between 239 and 110 :rolleyes:
    Conditions: torrential rain and wind, lovely :D.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭Aimman


    Where are you running these days? I take it you're not going around the park. I'll have to start running along the streets again, but not the same in the cold dark, having to watch out for traffic etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 174 ✭✭clubcard


    I think most people using the poor weather as an excuse.Did you take any kind of break after the marathon?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Aimman wrote: »
    Where are you running these days? I take it you're not going around the park. I'll have to start running along the streets again, but not the same in the cold dark, having to watch out for traffic etc.

    Yesterday up near ballycullen/Firhouse (handy for me after work). Tonight along the canal. Tomorrow I'll probably do a few hilly miles at lunchtime up the Dublin Mountains. I am thinking of investing in a head torch and going back to the park...haven't really found a route I like yet. I am open to suggestions if you want to meet up for a run any evening.

    By the way are you coming for the group run on saturday?
    clubcard wrote: »
    I think most people using the poor weather as an excuse.Did you take any kind of break after the marathon?

    In fairness I only did 3 short runs last week and will do 4 this (following p&D recovery plan)...The legs feel back to normal now so I might get a tempo run in next week,. I need a little bit of speed training ahead of the waterford half...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭Aimman


    menoscemo wrote: »
    By the way are you coming for the group run on saturday?

    Would love to, but I'll be out of Dublin from tomorrow till Wednesday evening. I think there'll be a good turn out for it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 174 ✭✭clubcard


    good man,on the topic of head torches I got a great one in snow and rock for around 35euro.few lads I runw ith have them but this seems to be alot brighter.Tikka I think is the brand


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    clubcard wrote: »
    good man,on the topic of head torches I got a great one in snow and rock for around 35euro.few lads I runw ith have them but this seems to be alot brighter.Tikka I think is the brand

    Is that in the shopping centre? Is it out by elverys? might get one so...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    4 miles at lunch time today up and down the Dublin Mountains (100m climbing). Pace 8:22, HR: messed up again.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    11 miles in the Park this morning with Gerard and Shels. 9:20 pace. gerard and I did an extra loop at the end so that he could make up his 1000 miles for the year, but it looks to me that he is still 4 miles short :pac:

    Legs a fair bit tired by the end. I might need another week of easy running, before beginning speed work...

    Weekly total: 4 Runs 26.1 miles


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,612 ✭✭✭gerard65


    menoscemo wrote: »
    11 miles in the Park this morning with Gerard and Shels. 9:20 pace. gerard and I did an extra loop at the end so that he could make up his 1000 miles for the year, but it looks to me that he is still 4 miles short :pac:
    Nope, a 1000mls exactly. I had done 4 on Thurs which I hadn't updated.:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    5.3 miles today at 8:17 pace. This was still supposed to be a recovery run (loosely following P&D recovery programme) but I felt good and my pace was well above recovery pace. I upped the pace again for the last 2 miles (both under 8 minutes).
    I think I will do a real recovery run tomorrow and try a tempo session on wednesday or thursday. I really need to get an idea of pace for the waterford half so I am guessing whatever pace I can hold for 3 or 4 mile in training at this stage should be about right.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    5 miles recovery tonight. 9:30 pace. Proper recovery pace tonight, despite the freezing wind and rain I kept it real slow. I tested out my new headtorch for the first time, I can see it coming in very useful over the winter.

    The HRM strap is definately screwed t this stage. I took it out for the first time in a few runs. It has me at 152Av HR for the first mile and 93 for the third (dropping as low as 60 in places...).


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,366 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    menoscemo wrote: »
    HR for the first mile and 93 for the third (dropping as low as 60 in places...).

    Maybe you're just REALLY fit :confused:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Maybe you're just REALLY fit :confused:

    Maybe, but fit and unfit in the same run? Peak Heart rate 185, low HR 60 - all in the same run and at the same pace :confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,991 ✭✭✭metamorphosis


    Is it the garmin HR giving you those HR readings? when my strap was going when i used to use a polar it started givingme crazy ass readings. start showing my RHR at 90, even though my own pulse checked showed this as wrong and then would jump up to 190 then 150. Jaysus if i was ever at 190 id be dead.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    ULstudent wrote: »
    Is it the garmin HR giving you those HR readings? when my strap was going when i used to use a polar it started givingme crazy ass readings. start showing my RHR at 90, even though my own pulse checked showed this as wrong and then would jump up to 190 then 150. Jaysus if i was ever at 190 id be dead.

    No, it's a garmin HRM strap.
    It had worked for the most part but did have the the odd off day. Battery is new.
    Anyway this was the 5th run in a row where it went wrong, and it went wrong majorly. In the past when it messes up it measures the HR High (has silly spikes up) but has never measured me at 60 BPM while running...you can check out the HR stats for today here


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭Brianderunner


    menoscemo wrote: »
    I really need to get an idea of pace for the waterford half so I am guessing whatever pace I can hold for 3 or 4 mile in training at this stage should be about right.

    I would think the pace you can hold for 6-7 miles in training would be a better indicator of hm pace. About 7:05-7'10 pace for you sounds about right. Points to a 1'32 ish finish which is what i'd predict. Leave the HRM at home tomorrow and run by feel, you should know at this stage what LT pace feels like.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    I would think the pace you can hold for 6-7 miles in training would be a better indicator of hm pace. About 7:05-7'10 pace for you sounds about right. Points to a 1'32 ish finish which is what i'd predict. Leave the HRM at home tomorrow and run by feel, you should know at this stage what LT pace feels like.

    I don't look at the HRM anymore during runs, only after so it makes no difference.
    1:32 is 7:02 pace and 1:34 is 7:10 pace, so Allowing for a bit of extra distance as is normal I'll be needing 7 minute miles to make 1:32. So I'll be trying to hold 7's or under on thursday.
    I hear what you are saying about 6-7 miles in training but I don't feel 100% yet from the marathon. I'll be building up the tempos to 6-7 miles over the next few weeks.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    I was going to do this tomorrow, but with the break in weather and the possibility that tomorrow will be brutal, I decided to get it done tonight. The plan was 3 or 4 miles @ at PHMP (7minutes/mile). I have to say I felt really comfortable so I did the 4 and felt like I could have done a few more. Splits: 6:53, 6:53, 6:56, 6:55

    With warm up and cool down the total tonight was 6.8 miles @ 7:40 pace (HR Apparently 133 :pac:).

    So it seems like all good news, well there's always a catch. I have had pains in both feet since the weekend. In the left foot, it is in the ball of the foot (forefoot), in the right it is in the outstep (mid foot). It almost feels like bruising around the bone in both cases. I rolled both feet over golf balls last night and they felt better today. I didn't feel pain at all during the faster miles but I really felt both feet in the cool down. Perhaps it was just that I was wearing the lunar racers tonight over the bulkier Lunarglides which offer more cushioning, I don't know. I am hoping a little more rolling will sort it out, but I really have no clue what is causing the problems....


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,366 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    I'd say it was the lunaracers. I assume the toebox in the racers is narrower than in the glides aswell? If so, that could add to the irritation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    I'd say it was the lunaracers. I assume the toebox in the racers is narrower than in the glides aswell? If so, that could add to the irritation.

    No doubt and i definately laced one of them up too tight, but what is the problem in the first place? It's no worse now than any other night this week, but there is a definate dull pain in both feet when walking.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭Aimman


    menoscemo wrote: »
    No doubt and i definately laced one of them up too tight, but what is the problem in the first place? It's no worse now than any other night this week, but there is a definate dull pain in both feet when walking.

    Dont worry, it's just your feet evolving for Ultra running in 2011, its normal and will pass quickly. Also, you'll soon find yourself counting in 10's of miles instead of 1's, setting the video to record stuff you'll miss in 5 hours time while your still out training and eventually, looking far far into the distance and thinking "Thats grand, nearly there now" :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Aimman wrote: »
    Dont worry, it's just your feet evolving for Ultra running in 2011, its normal and will pass quickly. Also, you'll soon find yourself counting in 10's of miles instead of 1's, setting the video to record stuff you'll miss in 5 hours time while your still out training and eventually, looking far far into the distance and thinking "Thats grand, nearly there now" :D

    Haha. Yes Much like RQ's back injury, the feet are fine when running. So I guess I'll just have to avoid walking and run more from now on :pac:. Are you on for that run in Tymon on friday? You can test out my headtorch before buying one of your own....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭Aimman


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Haha. Yes Much like RQ's back injury, the feet are fine when running. So I guess I'll just have to avoid walking and run more from now on :pac:. Are you on for that run in Tymon on friday? You can test out my headtorch before buying one of your own....

    Yeah, I'll be around on the Friday night, what time?

    I'm thinking of ditching the beach race on Saturday. Is there a 'meet and train' session planned for Saturday morning in the Phoenix Park or anything? I might head out and do miles there instead.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Aimman wrote: »
    Yeah, I'll be around on the Friday night, what time?

    I'm thinking of ditching the beach race on Saturday. Is there a 'meet and train' session planned for Saturday morning in the Phoenix Park or anything? I might head out and do miles there instead.

    I'm thinking 5 on friday at 6pm (could make 5.30 if necessary) in Tymon, recovery pace with torch.

    Yep there'll be a group on saturday morning at 9.30 for 10-13 miles meeting at papal carpark. I think there is a fair bit of interest. I'll pop up a post in the group training thread later.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Since wednesday my right foot has been pretty painful on the outstep. I am thinking in the worst case scenario I have a stress fracture in the 5th metatarsal. I ended up not running last night for fear of not being able to do the group run today.
    So this morning I met up with Brianderunner, aimman and RK in the park for an 'LSR'. I wore the DS trainers to see if the extra support helped the foot, but I think they made it worse since they have such a hard sole and little cushioning. I ended up dropping out after 8 miles and the foot is pretty swollen now. I was just on to my physio and he recommended going to the GP and getting a referral letter for an MRI Scan just to see what the problem is. I'll do that on monday.
    Pretty pissed off about all this. I am in good form I feel and I think I am am capable of a good half, but more importantly I really hope this doesn't mess up my medium term goals (Barcelona and Conn Ultra)

    Anyway. 8 miles @9:54


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 504 ✭✭✭maria74


    Take care and hopeful its not as bad as your worst case scenario. Better to get it diagnosed and sorted tho.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭Brianderunner


    Check out this thread from a month ago. Insist on a quick scan, i was waiting 6 weeks for mine, not much use then.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2056063225


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,545 ✭✭✭tunguska


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Since wednesday my right foot has been pretty painful on the outstep. I am thinking in the worst case scenario I have a stress fracture in the 5th metatarsal. I ended up not running last night for fear of not being able to do the group run today.
    So this morning I met up with Brianderunner, aimman and RK in the park for an 'LSR'. I wore the DS trainers to see if the extra support helped the foot, but I think they made it worse since they have such a hard sole and little cushioning. I ended up dropping out after 8 miles and the foot is pretty swollen now. I was just on to my physio and he recommended going to the GP and getting a referral letter for an MRI Scan just to see what the problem is. I'll do that on monday.
    Pretty pissed off about all this. I am in good form I feel and I think I am am capable of a good half, but more importantly I really hope this doesn't mess up my medium term goals (Barcelona and Conn Ultra)

    Anyway. 8 miles @9:54

    Niall I have to be careful about verging into medical advice territory here but I seriuosly doubt its a stress fracture. I had a similar problem and its just one of those things that happens to runners. Get a bag of ice from the supermarket, throw the ice in a bucket and slap your foot in it for 10mins. Also massage the foot where it hurts with your thumbs.
    I mean if it'll put your mind at ease, get an MRI, but thats at least 250quid. Try the ice and massaging first see what happens.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Check out this thread from a month ago. Insist on a quick scan, i was waiting 6 weeks for mine, not much use then.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=2056063225

    Yep I saw that. Euromedic in Dundrum would be good for me, with internet booking it's €195. Still have to get a GP referal letter even though it's private.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    tunguska wrote: »
    Niall I have to be careful about verging into medical advice territory here but I seriuosly doubt its a stress fracture. I had a similar problem and its just one of those things that happens to runners. Get a bag of ice from the supermarket, throw the ice in a bucket and slap your foot in it for 10mins. Also massage the foot where it hurts with your thumbs.
    I mean if it'll put your mind at ease, get an MRI, but thats at least 250quid. Try the ice and massaging first see what happens.

    Thanks for the Advice Eoin. You may well be right. The problem is There is no specific spot where it hurts, more a general area (and only when standing on it). It really feels like something well under the surface, but I am at a complete loss to what the problem is, it just feels like there's something wrong. I'll keep icing and see what the GP says first before booking an MRI.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,366 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    I was thinking stress fracture when you posted the other day. Wouldn't necessarily jump straight to that though. If you've got any other injuries or niggles, even ones you don't notice, possibly just tired legs from the marathon causing you to run on the outside of your foot a bit. When I had problems with my foot earlier in the year I was getting pains on the outside of the foot because I'd changed my gait to protect the injury.

    Hope the MRI goes well.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    I was thinking stress fracture when you posted the other day. Wouldn't necessarily jump straight to that though. If you've got any other injuries or niggles, even ones you don't notice, possibly just tired legs from the marathon causing you to run on the outside of your foot a bit. When I had problems with my foot earlier in the year I was getting pains on the outside of the foot because I'd changed my gait to protect the injury.

    Hope the MRI goes well.

    Thanks, and what you say makes a lot of sense. It's very possible that I have just changed my gait subconsciously to protect a hidden injury. I have a bruise on the ball of the left foot since last saturday too, but that seems to have gone away. Those 11 miles I did with Gerard65 last saturdayseem to have done neither of us any good.
    I'll give it a good few days and maybe another few short uns before actually booking an MRI.

    Some of the post marathon runs were done on very heavy legs in fairness. It has really made me contemplate the idea of racing barcelona and then conneamara 5 weeks later :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,551 ✭✭✭chinguetti


    You mightn't have a bad injury at all Meno, your body might be telling you in its own way that it wants a rest. You've done alot of miles this year and alot of long runs and if you haven't taken much time off after Dublin, it might just want a rest.

    I know its annoying (i haven't run myself since the marathon, bloody cracked rib that won't heal) but a break you will have to take until its better. Mind yourself.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    chinguetti wrote: »
    You mightn't have a bad injury at all Meno, your body might be telling you in its own way that it wants a rest. You've done alot of miles this year and alot of long runs and if you haven't taken much time off after Dublin, it might just want a rest.

    I know its annoying (i haven't run myself since the marathon, bloody cracked rib that won't heal) but a break you will have to take until its better. Mind yourself.

    But but but but, the waterford half is just 4 weeks away :pac:
    Hope you get better soon yourself. Are you about next saturday?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭kennyb3


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Thanks for the Advice Eoin. You may well be right. The problem is There is no specific spot where it hurts, more a general area (and only when standing on it). It really feels like something well under the surface, but I am at a complete loss to what the problem is, it just feels like there's something wrong. I'll keep icing and see what the GP says first before booking an MRI.
    Have a look at peroneal tendon injury on google. had it myself last year as did seanynova, was thinking stress fracture myself when i got it. 2 - 3 weeks was all it took to get right


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,598 ✭✭✭shels4ever


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Since wednesday my right foot has been pretty painful on the outstep. I am thinking in the worst case scenario I have a stress fracture in the 5th metatarsal. I ended up not running last night for fear of not being able to do the group run today.
    So this morning I met up with Brianderunner, aimman and RK in the park for an 'LSR'. I wore the DS trainers to see if the extra support helped the foot, but I think they made it worse since they have such a hard sole and little cushioning. I ended up dropping out after 8 miles and the foot is pretty swollen now. I was just on to my physio and he recommended going to the GP and getting a referral letter for an MRI Scan just to see what the problem is. I'll do that on monday.
    Pretty pissed off about all this. I am in good form I feel and I think I am am capable of a good half, but more importantly I really hope this doesn't mess up my medium term goals (Barcelona and Conn Ultra)

    Anyway. 8 miles @9:54
    prob due the 26 mile of pounding, i'd rest up for a while and with a bit of luck you'll be back running soon. Marathons have a way of showing up in the body. If you miss a week or 2 now I think you would sill run well in Waterford .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    kennyb3 wrote: »
    Have a look at peroneal tendon injury on google. had it myself last year as did seanynova, was thinking stress fracture myself when i got it. 2 - 3 weeks was all it took to get right

    Who did you go to to get that diagnosed?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭kennyb3


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Who did you go to to get that diagnosed?
    Physio, could tell the tendon running down the ankle wasnt right even though it wasnt sore there, only under the foot. Worth going to physio first anyway before spending a packet on a scan.

    I just felt like i had a bruised foot or bone but couldnt see anything or feel anything digging my finger in. just sounds very similar to what you describe


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    I have been mulling over the advice given. I am really not sure it is a break now, it could easily be a tendon issue as well. I have decided to save my money for the meantime and just take a break from running. Plan at the moment is to give the foot a rest until monday week, so 9 days off :eek:

    I really do need to get training properly after that though as I have a lot of events coming up. I have been icing the foot and rolling it over golf balls for the last 2 days and it does feel a bit better. I might visit the physio next week If I am still feeling pain midweek.

    Don't know what I'll do with myself next week. I might have to go back to the gym (haven't been since february) just to keep myself sane!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,551 ✭✭✭chinguetti


    I'ld visit the physio for piece of mind. And to do in your spare time, a good book or perhaps time for a bit of cooking:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,832 ✭✭✭littlebug


    Sorry to hear about your foot meno :(
    When I had my funny toe thing going on last year my GP gave me a letter in which he may have ;) exaggerated my pain and sent me off into A&E telling me to tell them how much pain I was in ;)... instant x ray and result before I left the hospital. I had to go back a week later to get it x rayed again (due to stress fractures taking time to show up). They even called me in a 3rd time. All it cost was the GP charge and gave me peace of mind within a week that there was no stress fracture.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,724 ✭✭✭kennyb3


    I'd go to the physio too, no point sitting around for a week wondering what it is or isnt. Plus any decent physio will speed up the recovery process significantly.

    A break now is no bad thing anyway, will keep you running injury free next year. Everybody should have a few weeks off season imho to keep them fresh and make them realise they miss running.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,156 ✭✭✭jcsmum


    Really sorry to hear about your injury, hope you get better real soon. :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,852 ✭✭✭pgmcpq


    Sorry to hear this meno, but hopefully the rest will take care of it an you'll come back buzzing, I'm beginning to regret not taking a longer break post Dublin.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,545 ✭✭✭tunguska


    menoscemo wrote: »
    I have been mulling over the advice given. I am really not sure it is a break now, it could easily be a tendon issue as well. I have decided to save my money for the meantime and just take a break from running. Plan at the moment is to give the foot a rest until monday week, so 9 days off :eek:

    I really do need to get training properly after that though as I have a lot of events coming up. I have been icing the foot and rolling it over golf balls for the last 2 days and it does feel a bit better. I might visit the physio next week If I am still feeling pain midweek.

    Don't know what I'll do with myself next week. I might have to go back to the gym (haven't been since february) just to keep myself sane!!

    Im injured at the moment myself and what I do is get on the bike and head up the mountains do some hill intervals. Very tough training trust me. I know its not sports specific but it'll keep the heart and lungs ticking over nicely until you can run again. Also the stationary bike in the gym can be very good if you're creative enough.


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