Fibre up 24 hrs

kleefarr · 28-03-2015 6:47pm #1

Had it installed yesterday about 1:30pm.
Speeds are an improvement but again we have bad lagging issues especially when the boys are on xbox live.

When I was on the old adsl 8mb speed, we had the same thing, anything from a SNR down of 6-8 db which I guessed was causing the problem.

Now we are getting a reading of 5 db down.

Do I need to wait a few days for it to settle down or should I start trying something now?

line%20stats_zpstzumrpdo.jpg

ED E · 28-03-2015 7:00pm

Call vodafone and have them reprofile you to the next one down. Your DS is mangling data, real world performance should be a lot better at 40_10.

kleefarr · 28-03-2015 8:09pm

Thanks Ed.
Will contact them Monday.

I am only 490m from cab though, should shouldn't I be getting better results?

kaizersoze · 29-03-2015 7:01pm

kleefarr wrote: »

Thanks Ed.
Will contact them Monday.

I am only 490m from cab though, should shouldn't I be getting better results?

I'm 500m from the cab and getting 81 down/20 up with Eircom.

The first couple of days I was on a 50/20 profile though because of a bad prequal. I gave it a few days until my prequal improved and contacted them via Twitter. They upped it to the highest profile for my line.

mass_debater · 29-03-2015 7:10pm

kleefarr wrote: »

Thanks Ed.
Will contact them Monday.

I am only 490m from cab though, should shouldn't I be getting better results?

Cables don't route in straight lines, also, there could be metres of cable coiled up in the manholes. After 600m there's a huge drop in speeds on VDSL

kleefarr · 30-03-2015 12:49am

kaizersoze wrote: »

I'm 500m from the cab and getting 81 down/20 up with Eircom.

The first couple of days I was on a 50/20 profile though because of a bad prequal. I gave it a few days until my prequal improved and contacted them via Twitter. They upped it to the highest profile for my line.

Interesting. What is prequal?

mass_debater wrote: »

Cables don't route in straight lines, also, there could be metres of cable coiled up in the manholes. After 600m there's a huge drop in speeds on VDSL

Makes sense. But as kaizersoze has said above, sounds like I should not be expecting to go down in speed as they told me I could have 50mb when signing up.

Bog Standard User · 30-03-2015 2:17am

3 possible issues causing that poor snr

1. Line Fault - Either a major short fault at the ntu or a major earth fault outside)
2. Bridge Tapped line - (Bridge tapped lines is a line shared between two houses - was fine for adsl but no good for vdsl as both houses get half the bandwidth) so basically the line can take 80mb but each house gets 40mb
3. RFI on your line - Radio Frequency Interference - the line is picking up interference from either a high voltage line or some high power transmission system nearby)

at 490m you should be able to get 70 - 80mb

i'd ask for a tech to come out to test and fix your line

AyanPrince · 30-03-2015 6:58am

there could be metres of cable coiled up in the manholes. After 600m there's a huge drop in speeds on VDSL

_______________
Arslan1

mass_debater · 30-03-2015 7:28am

Bog Standard User wrote: »

2. Bridge Tapped line - (Bridge tapped lines is a line shared between two houses - was fine for adsl but no good for vdsl as both houses get half the bandwidth) so basically the line can take 80mb but each house gets 40mb

Eircom never tapped like this, every house gets a two pair dropwire and this goes to a distribution point. Bridge taps occur inside your house where the main pair is teed into before the NTU. The main pair has to feed the NTU before the rest of the sockets in the house, the sockets must be back feed from the NTU so they are filtered.

kleefarr · 30-03-2015 12:24pm

6 months ago on the old ADSL set up, they came out and tested the line and said there was nothing wrong.
When applying for the fibre upgrade they told me I would get 50mb. This would indicate that they had checked the line and come up with a safe speed for me.

Downstream SNR has been 4.6 for the last 24hrs +.

When they test the line speed I assume that there is no indication of the quality of the line just the speed that it can handle?

ED E · 30-03-2015 12:29pm

Prequals give an estimated max. Its not uncommon to have to undershoot it by one.

kleefarr · 30-03-2015 12:40pm

Yes that's what I would have thought to be on the 'safe' side.
So they probably came up with a profile of 60/20 when tested originally then.

Something wrong somewhere and it does not seem to be in house according to the tests they carried out 6 months ago.

kaizersoze · 30-03-2015 1:22pm

kleefarr wrote: »

6 months ago on the old ADSL set up, they came out and tested the line and said there was nothing wrong.
When applying for the fibre upgrade they told me I would get 50mb. This would indicate that they had checked the line and come up with a safe speed for me.

Downstream SNR has been 4.6 for the last 24hrs +.

When they test the line speed I assume that there is no indication of the quality of the line just the speed that it can handle?

These are my stats....
VDSL Port Details Upstream Downstream
Line Rate: 20.341 Mbps 79.985 Mbps
Actual Net Data Rate: 20.305 Mbps 79.847 Mbps
Trellis Coding: ON ON
SNR Margin: 6.1 dB 6.1 dB
Actual Delay: 7 ms 7 ms
Transmit Power: 0.6 dBm 13.0 dBm
Receive Power: -18.4 dBm -9.3 dBm
Actual INP: 2.0 symbols 2.0 symbols
Total Attenuation: 18.9 dB 22.4 dB
Attainable Net Data Rate: 21.634 Mbps 90.400 Mbps

kleefarr · 30-03-2015 1:31pm

That is not a particularly high SNR margin either. Although it is higher than mine at the moment. Do you do much gaming on that connection?

kaizersoze · 30-03-2015 1:42pm

kleefarr wrote: »

That is not a particularly high SNR noise margin either. Although it is higher than mine at the moment. Do you do much gaming on that connection?

Zero gaming.

kleefarr · 27-04-2015 3:32pm

Finally got around to asking them to drop my profile down to 40/10 and they have just done it.

Downstream line rate (kbit/s) 40956
Upstream line rate (kbit/s) 10239
Downstream SNR (dB) 10
Upstream SNR (dB) 20.2

Looks ok so far.

kleefarr · 02-05-2015 10:30am

Ok, since the profile reduction, can you believe it...... LAG actually seems worse.

I am guessing, just as my first suspicions months ago, that this is more than a profile issue.

mass_debater · 02-05-2015 10:56am

kleefarr wrote: »

Ok, since the profile reduction, can you believe it...... LAG actually seems worse.

I am guessing, just as my first suspicions months ago, that this is more than a profile issue.

Crazy amount of error correction going on there, something's not right. Was your main pair redirected, i.e. the NTU moved? Are you back feeding a phone over the same cable as the fibre comes in on another pair? Do you have an ETU (external box), if so remove the NTU and fit it to the pair at the ETU and see how it performs there

kleefarr · 02-05-2015 1:03pm

mass_debater wrote: »

Crazy amount of error correction going on there, something's not right. Was your main pair redirected, i.e. the NTU moved? Are you back feeding a phone over the same cable as the fibre comes in on another pair? Do you have an ETU (external box), if so remove the NTU and fit it to the pair at the ETU and see how it performs there

No idea what you mean about all that.

Ordered Fibre.
Engineer came out did a couple of tests.
Went to cabinet.
Came back.
Connected.
50/20 as shown in first post.

mass_debater · 02-05-2015 1:14pm

kleefarr wrote: »

No idea what you mean about all that.

Ordered Fibre.
Engineer came out did a couple of tests.
Went to cabinet.
Came back.
Connected.
50/20 as shown in first post.

Do you have an ETU? If so do what I said above to eliminate there being a problem with your own internal cabling. If it's fine at the ETU then there's a problem with your own cabling they will offer to run a new cable from the ETU to a new NTU. You need to find where the black Eircom dropwire ends and test there, it could even be in the attic depending on the age of the house.

kleefarr · 02-05-2015 1:25pm

mass_debater wrote: »

Do you have an ETU? If so do what I said above to eliminate there being a problem with your own internal cabling. If it's fine at the ETU then there's a problem with your own cabling they will offer to run a new cable from the ETU to a new NTU. You need to find where the black Eircom dropwire ends and test there, it could even be in the attic depending on the age of the house.

They tested the internal wiring and said there was no problem. But then they also tested the line coming into the house and said there was no problem.

The main socket comes in at the front door.
What is an ETU?

mass_debater · 02-05-2015 1:35pm

kleefarr wrote: »

They tested the internal wiring and said there was no problem. But then they also tested the line coming into the house and said there was no problem.

The main socket comes in at the front door.
What is an ETU?

External termination unit, it's a smaller version of the ESB meter cabinet. If your cable comes in the front door it's most likely you've not got one.

You might need to get them to replace the dropwire and possibly build you a new path to the cab. You are at a huge disadvantage being a Vodafone customer, the tech Eircom send will not want to touch your internal cabling, will most likely put his meter on the NTU, confirm it's working take a photo and disappear. Sounds like they already did this

notahappycamper · 02-05-2015 1:37pm

I'm having similar problems - see attached pic. Couple of Eircom techs out who separated the line i.e. we have 2 sockets in use and a dialler on the alarm that uses the phone line. Broadband disconnects at least once a day - loads of errors although I thought the higher amount of CRC errors are worse than FEC errors. Anyway, I'm getting commbiz.ie out to look at the internal wiring.

kleefarr · 02-05-2015 1:42pm

mass_debater wrote: »

External termination unit, it's a smaller version of the ESB meter cabinet. If your cable comes in the front door it's most likely you've not got one.

You might need to get them to replace the dropwire and possibly build you a new path to the cab. You are at a huge disadvantage being a Vodafone customer, the tech Eircom send will not want to touch your internal cabling, will most likely put his meter on the NTU, confirm it's working take a photo and disappear. Sounds like they already did this

Is the line to the house not Eircoms responsibility?
I should get them to fix if so.

notahappycamper wrote: »

I'm having similar problems - see attached pic. Couple of Eircom techs out who separated the line i.e. we have 2 sockets in use and a dialler on the alarm that uses the phone line. Broadband disconnects at least once a day - loads of errors although I thought the higher amount of CRC errors are worse than FEC errors. Anyway, I'm getting commbiz.ie out to look at the internal wiring.

Are commbiz a private company? What's that costing you?

mass_debater · 02-05-2015 1:57pm

kleefarr wrote: »

Is the line to the house not Eircoms responsibility?
I should get them to fix if so.

Yes but getting Eircom to accept there is a problem is the hard bit, remember you are not their customer.

notahappycamper · 02-05-2015 2:05pm

kleefarr wrote: »

Is the line to the house not Eircoms responsibility?
I should get them to fix if so.

Are commbiz a private company? What's that costing you?

Yeah they are. Not sure what they'll charge.

kleefarr · 02-05-2015 4:51pm

mass_debater wrote: »

Yes but getting Eircom to accept there is a problem is the hard bit, remember you are not their customer.

Indirectly we all are, via payment from whichever provider we use that pay Eircom for the line rental.

notahappycamper wrote: »

Yeah they are. Not sure what they'll charge.

Let me know how it goes please.

lucernarian · 03-05-2015 1:20pm

Everybody who has broadband problems and a phone alarm, especially with eFibre: Hand the techie this or make sure yourselves it's wired this way!! http://www.reci.ie/Portals/0/Documents/eircominterface.pdf

This is very important and the only way that both the alarm will work according to spec AND your broadband speed won't suffer.

Anyway, I find it hard to believe but I got my family's line tested and the exchange based test indicated a bridge tap at about 4.5 km (line is over 6 km long.) As it's not near the exchange or the modem it doesn't make much if any difference in that case as 3 mbit is still reliably achieved. Bridge taps or spurs on lines are a much bigger issue near the socket (like with extension sockets wired incorrectly when it was okay for voice or especially phone monitored alarms).

mass_debater · 03-05-2015 3:08pm

lucernarian wrote: »

Everybody who has broadband problems and a phone alarm, especially with eFibre: Hand the techie this or make sure yourselves it's wired this way!! http://www.reci.ie/Portals/0/Documents/eircominterface.pdf

This is very important and the only way that both the alarm will work according to spec AND your broadband speed won't suffer.

Re alarm, only if it's an Eircom Phonewatch alarm that has a feed and return, an alarm from a private alarm company could have it's own filter and need to be backfed with the rest of the phone sockets

jasper1 · 03-05-2015 4:31pm

I think this is a RECI guideline for all autodialler alarms that use a fixed line

mass_debater · 03-05-2015 6:33pm

jasper1 wrote: »

I think this is a RECI guideline for all autodialler alarms that use a fixed line

It's also completely outdated advising people to loop a three pair phone cable from room to room instead of at least cat5e all returning to a central location which should be the standard guideline. I've come across lots of situations where clueless electricians loop cat5e from room to room expecting it's the right thing to do.

Fibre up 24 hrs

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