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My prison ideas: (Possibly Hitlerish) but read anyway

  • 24-01-2013 6:16pm
    #1
    Chemical Burn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭


    Sorry if this has been done before but my thread searching hasn't yielded anything similar ;)

    Prisons should be (for both men and women):

    7 a.m. wake up and have breakfast of porridge or cereal and a glass of water.

    8 a.m. off to work (for no pay, slave labour to save money for country)

    12 or 1 p.m. Lunch of porridge and a glass of water

    5 p.m. return and have dinner (meat and or veg) and a glass of water.

    6 p.m. back into cell (with bed folded up) prisoners must stand up in cell for 3 hours (this will be monitored by prison guards periodically passing through the corridors, got this idea from Locked Up Abroad, Japan).

    9 p.m. prisoner allowed to lie down.

    10 p.m. lights out.

    Visits once per week, 3 hours at a time.

    Radio and telly allowed 1 hour per week.

    Orange jumpsuits for uniforms

    What do you think ??

    As a by the way, if one was to come into some money, could he or she open up his or her own building and run a private establishment charge the government for housing inmates, and do it for a fraction of the price that the goverment-based prison services will do it for, again, creating jobs and saving government money.

    DISCUSS, and keep it civil (sorry for doing your job there mods <<<<< Hope the boards union won't mind :P :p )


«134

Comments

  • #2
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    Sorry if this has been done before but my thread searching hasn't yielded anything similar ;)

    Prisons should be (for both men and women):

    7 a.m. wake up and have breakfast of porridge or cereal and a glass of water.

    8 a.m. off to work (for no pay, slave labour to save money for country)

    12 or 1 p.m. Lunch of porridge and a glass of water

    5 p.m. return and have dinner (meat and or veg) and a glass of water.

    6 p.m. back into cell (with bed folded up) prisoners must stand up in cell for 3 hours (this will be monitored by prison guards periodically passing through the corridors, got this idea from Locked Up Abroad, Japan).

    9 p.m. prisoner allowed to lie down.

    10 p.m. lights out.

    Visits once per week, 3 hours at a time.

    Radio and telly allowed 1 hour per week.

    Orange jumpsuits for uniforms

    What do you think ??

    As a by the way, if one was to come into some money, could he or she open up his or her own building and run a private establishment charge the government for housing inmates, and do it for a fraction of the price that the goverment-based prison services will do it for, again, creating jobs and saving government money.

    DISCUSS, and keep it civil (sorry for doing your job there mods <<<<< Hope the boards union won't mind :P :p )


    "slave labour" costs other people jobs. The model of harsh punishment has been tried and didn't work.


  • #3
    kneemos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,492 ✭✭✭✭kneemos


    You want to treat people like animals for some reason?


  • #4
    Agricola
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,547 ✭✭✭Agricola


    The kind of shít that keeps feeble minds occupied never ceases to amaze me.


  • #5
    repsol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭repsol


    kneemos wrote: »
    You want to treat people like animals for some reason?

    I wouldn't be in favour of treating criminals like animals either. I think animals deserve better.


  • #6
    Sulla Felix
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,442 ✭✭✭Sulla Felix


    Anyone have a link to the nordic experimental open prison that cut recidivism by 80% our something really high? On the mobile so can't find out.
    Why not do that instead. High up front cost but lowers crime and the future associated cost.


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  • #7
    Temptamperu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭Temptamperu


    kneemos wrote: »
    You want to treat people like animals for some reason?

    Most of these "people" are animals.


  • #8
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    Humiliation and borderline torture lessens their chance of integrating into society on release. I think they should be given respect and care but only healthy food and some type of work.


  • #9
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,414 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.


  • #10
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,414 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    Most of these "people" are animals.

    Define most? Like 80%, 90%. So what have the other 10-20% done that they're not animals?


  • #11
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    Sulla Felix wrote: »
    Anyone have a link to the nordic experimental open prison that cut recidivism by 80% our something really high? On the mobile so can't find out.
    Why not do that instead. High up front cost but lowers crime and the future associated cost.

    Not sure. There is a prison in the UAE (Saudi Arabia) that is like a 5 star hotel with education etc. They have almost zero reoffending and very successful outcomes.

    However, the inmates are political prisoners rather than criminals so the results might not work in a normal prison.


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  • #12
    wp_rathead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,071 ✭✭✭✭wp_rathead


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    9 p.m. prisoner allowed to lie down.

    LIBERAL PANSY


  • #13
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    Grayson wrote: »
    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.

    His proposal is a deterrent towards repeating criminal activity.

    Where's the rehabilitation bit in the current system? Prison in Ireland is neither a deterrent nor does it perform rehabilitation.


  • #14
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    At least you Godwin'd the thread in the title anyway.


  • #15
    repsol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭repsol


    Grayson wrote: »
    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.

    I think the whole ,that was awful,I NEVER want to go back there part might rehabilitate a few.


  • #16
    fasttalkerchat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,652 ✭✭✭fasttalkerchat


    repsol wrote: »
    I think the whole ,that was awful,I NEVER want to go back there part might rehabilitate a few.

    Criminals don't think like that. At best they'll think "I never want to get caught again".


  • #17
    CrazyRabbit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,659 ✭✭✭CrazyRabbit


    Grayson wrote: »
    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.

    Agreed. Rehabilitation and solving the issues surrounding the offending behaviour is critical. But for those who repeatedly offend and have shown no willingness or capability of becoming decent citizens, I've no problem in them getting extremely harsh punishment.

    And OP...prisons are expensive to build and the limited capacity means a revolving door system. How about a large tarmac covered area surrounded by 20 foot fences and some tents for the inmates? Similar setup is used in a Texas prison and it works great (Though that prison is used for people on remand/1st time offenders/minor offenders etc which is unjust).


  • #18
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,414 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    repsol wrote: »
    I think the whole ,that was awful,I NEVER want to go back there part might rehabilitate a few.

    And that works in Japan? They have no repeat offenders and no organised crime.


  • #19
    Chancer3001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,480 ✭✭✭Chancer3001


    What if instead of work or standing up, they say fvck off?


  • #20
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Another fascist fantasy thread.

    What a surprise.


  • #21
    landsleaving
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,345 ✭✭✭landsleaving


    Chemical Burn wrote: »

    12 or 1 p.m. Lunch of porridge and a glass of water

    5 p.m. return and have dinner (meat and or veg) and a glass of water.


    That's one hell of a bowl of porridge.


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  • #22
    repsol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭repsol


    fasttalkerchat wrote: »
    Criminals don't think like that. At best they'll think "I never want to get caught again".

    Wrong.There are very few prisoners over 50 years in jail for minor thefts etc.Most of them get weary from going in and out for years and missing out on relationships and kids growing up etc.If things were harder inside they would just cop on a few years sooner and decide prison wasn't something they were prepared to go through.


  • #23
    ITS_A_BADGER
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭ITS_A_BADGER


    cows are treated better at abattoirs


  • #24
    Rubber_Soul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,726 ✭✭✭Rubber_Soul


    CrazyRabbit wrote: »
    How about a large tarmac covered area surrounded by 20 foot fences and some tents for the inmates?

    We already have that, it's called the Oxegen music festival.


  • #25
    Chemical Burn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Chemical Burn


    Would a criminal scumbag be more afraid of committing his or her first offence if prisons were run in the fashion outlined in my OP or the liberal pansy girls' blouse way things are run in Halden Prison Norway ???

    If someone (God forbid) raped and or battered a young child or old person, especially if this was a family member of yours, would you want them to live like a King ?? In better conditions than some elderly people are living in or homeless ?? Cop on. They deserve no better than the most squalid conditions.


  • #26
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,414 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    I think the OP knew he was a bit batsh1t when he described his ideas as a "bit Hitlerish". Anything that can be described like that by it's proponent is obviously crazy.


  • #27
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,414 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    Would a criminal scumbag be more afraid of committing his or her first offence if prisons were run in the fashion outlined in my OP or the liberal pansy girls' blouse way things are run in Halden Prison Norway ???

    If someone (God forbid) raped and or battered a young child or old person, especially if this was a family member of yours, would you want them to live like a King ?? In better conditions than some elderly people are living in or homeless ?? Cop on. They deserve no better than the most squalid conditions.

    So, are you saying that prison sentences deter rapists or child molesters? If we just lengthened the sentence larry murphy would never have committed a crime?


  • #28
    Rubber_Soul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,726 ✭✭✭Rubber_Soul


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    If someone (God forbid) raped and or battered a young child or old person, especially if this was a family member of yours, would you want them to live like a King ??

    Of course you wouldn't, you would be completely irrational due to anger. We can't base our legal system on how irrational people react, it'd be fcuking chaos. And why is the only two options on table to either, make them live like a king or live in absolute squalor. Why is there never anything in between?


  • #29
    opti0nal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 892 ✭✭✭opti0nal


    Grayson wrote: »
    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.
    That would cut off the supply of cheap labour.


  • #30
    opti0nal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 892 ✭✭✭opti0nal


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    ...Cop on. They deserve no better than the most squalid conditions.
    Would you buy their products?


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  • #31
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,070 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Apart from the 'slave labor' and standing up for 3 hours per day (wtf?!) it doesn't sound overly excessive to me.

    Other countries have introduced work-like placements for prisoners and it is shown to help them. Other jobs needn't be lost as a result, because in most cases other people are not employed to do whatever it is anyway.


  • #32
    Dr Turk Turkelton
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,977 ✭✭✭Dr Turk Turkelton


    ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »
    cows are treated better at abattoirs

    And why wouldn't they be?A cow is not a thieving or raping or murdering scumbag so they should of course be treated with more dignity than a common criminal.


  • #33
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    Nice attempt at the 'string 'em up, it's the only language they understand!!' approach.

    How about this: society shouldn't treat those it has incarcerated like animals, because we as a society should be attempting to help and/or rehabilitate those who do commit crime. It may not work in most or even many cases, but that doesn't mean the solution is to mistreat them.


  • #34
    indough
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,857 ✭✭✭indough


    Temptamperu wrote: »
    Most of these "people" are animals.

    all people are animals
    repsol wrote: »
    Wrong.There are very few prisoners over 50 years in jail for minor thefts etc.Most of them get weary from going in and out for years and missing out on relationships and kids growing up etc.If things were harder inside they would just cop on a few years sooner and decide prison wasn't something they were prepared to go through.

    or perhaps they just get better at not getting caught


  • #35
    repsol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭repsol


    StarshipPooper wrote: »
    Of course you wouldn't, you would be completely irrational due to anger. We can't base our legal system on how irrational people react, it'd be fcuking chaos.

    There is a certain amount of satisfaction for the general public and comfort for the victims/victims family if they know that a sexual predator or murderer will spend his time in jail in total misery and discomfort and dread each day beginning. Its not going to rehabilitate him but ,lets face it he can refuse treatment like Larry Murphy did or tell the "experts" treating him what they want to hear.No amount of talking to these lowlife is going to stop them fancying kids or whatever floats their boat. If you are a man attracted to women,nobody can change that so what is the difference? You like what you like and no doctor is going to change that.


  • #36
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,564 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    Grayson wrote: »
    Define most? Like 80%, 90%. So what have the other 10-20% done that they're not animals?

    We are all animals , homo sapiens to be exact.


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  • #37
    newmug
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,571 ✭✭✭newmug


    I like your thinking OP. I once had a similar post, and I got ridiculed for it. But here it is anyway:


    Originally Posted by newmugviewpost.gif
    Here's my solution:

    1) Build a massive underground jail, the biggest jail in the world, fit to hold 1 million people.

    2) Put every joyriding, junkie, fraudster, banker, paedophile, illegal immigrant, shoplifting, lying politicians, dishonest, violent scumbag in Ireland into it.

    3) Take in prisoners from other countries. Charge the other countries for keeping their scum. This will keep more good people of the world safe, dilute crime levels worldwide, and help our economy.

    4) Have treadmills in the jail. Make the scum run on them and generate electricity.

    5) Sell the electricity, which will not only boost our economy evenfurther, but will help the global warming crisis aswell.

    6) Scrap all previous laws, and start from scratch. Publish a book called "The Law". Make it available to everybody in Ireland. Teach it in schools. Leave no excuse for criminal behaviour.

    7) In this book, state the sentences. Rape of children = rest of your life in jail. Not 4 years with 2 suspended, not 18 months and a donation to charity, minimum of 100 years just to be sure. Same for dealing drugs. This is both as a punishment, and to keep criminals away from normal people. Normal people dont rob, do drugs, or rape. Also, longer sentences = more electricity produced.

    8) Aim to build a society which mimics that of "The Girl From Tomorrow". The only people who should be walking around freely are those responsible enough to know how to use their freedom properly.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVS376aIVqQ&amp;feature=related


  • #38
    Herb Powell
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,097 ✭✭✭Herb Powell


    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    7 a.m. wake up and have breakfast of porridge or cereal and a glass of water.

    8 a.m. off to work (for no pay, slave labour to save money for country)

    12 or 1 p.m. Lunch of porridge and a glass of water

    5 p.m. return and have dinner (meat and or veg) and a glass of water.

    Yeahhhhhhhhhhh.................good luck with that nutrition working long term.
    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    As a by the way, if one was to come into some money, could he or she open up his or her own building and run a private establishment charge the government for housing inmates, and do it for a fraction of the price that the goverment-based prison services will do it for, again, creating jobs and saving government money.

    The "prison industry" is growing in America, and it is good news for no one. It showing one of capitalism's worst and most disgusting aspects.
    Chemical Burn wrote: »
    Would a criminal scumbag be more afraid of committing his or her first offence if prisons were run in the fashion outlined in my OP or the liberal pansy girls' blouse way things are run in Halden Prison Norway ???

    If someone (God forbid) raped and or battered a young child or old person, especially if this was a family member of yours, would you want them to live like a King ?? In better conditions than some elderly people are living in or homeless ?? Cop on. They deserve no better than the most squalid conditions.

    Wouldn't a better solution to that be to deal with the conditions that the elderly are in? And deal with the problem of homelessness? Rather than trying to serve some sick fantasy of justice?


  • #39
    Rubber_Soul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,726 ✭✭✭Rubber_Soul


    repsol wrote: »
    There is a certain amount of satisfaction for the general public and comfort for the victims/victims family if they know that a sexual predator or murderer will spend his time in jail in total misery and discomfort and dread each day beginning.

    That's revenge, not justice.


  • #40
    ITS_A_BADGER
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭ITS_A_BADGER


    Cuchulainn1. wrote: »
    And why wouldn't they be?A cow is not a thieving or raping or murdering scumbag so they should of course be treated with more dignity than a common criminal.

    You cant let your heart rule your head, If you had a penal system based on OPs post ireland would be no better than the other countries that violate human rights laws, The push them until they break approach is no way to treat any human being. Rehabilate them and make them attend psycologists /councellers whoever, keep them in untill they respond


  • #41
    repsol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭repsol


    StarshipPooper wrote: »
    That's revenge, not justice.

    Yeah I know. Revenge is sweet.


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  • #42
    Technoprisoner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,314 ✭✭✭Technoprisoner


    this i weird..i had only been talking to a friend and telling him how America has a couple of hundred private prisons. The problem with this is, they set targets and the prisons have to be kept 98% full at all times. Kind of sounds like concentration camps to me. The uk also have private prisons but also have the biggest inmate population in Europe . Im kinda of seeing a similarity now between the 2 different country's and i dont like where it is going


  • #43
    OctavarIan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭OctavarIan


    I like how the OP makes his/her proposal without giving any reasoning behind it whatsoever and then says 'go discuss'.


  • #44
    Chemical Burn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Chemical Burn


    newmug wrote: »
    I like your thinking OP. I once had a similar post, and I got ridiculed for it. But here it is anyway:


    Originally Posted by newmugviewpost.gif
    Here's my solution:

    1) Build a massive underground jail, the biggest jail in the world, fit to hold 1 million people.

    2) Put every joyriding, junkie, fraudster, banker, paedophile, illegal immigrant, shoplifting, lying politicians, dishonest, violent scumbag in Ireland into it.

    3) Take in prisoners from other countries. Charge the other countries for keeping their scum. This will keep more good people of the world safe, dilute crime levels worldwide, and help our economy.

    4) Have treadmills in the jail. Make the scum run on them and generate electricity.

    5) Sell the electricity, which will not only boost our economy evenfurther, but will help the global warming crisis aswell.

    6) Scrap all previous laws, and start from scratch. Publish a book called "The Law". Make it available to everybody in Ireland. Teach it in schools. Leave no excuse for criminal behaviour.

    7) In this book, state the sentences. Rape of children = rest of your life in jail. Not 4 years with 2 suspended, not 18 months and a donation to charity, minimum of 100 years just to be sure. Same for dealing drugs. This is both as a punishment, and to keep criminals away from normal people. Normal people dont rob, do drugs, or rape. Also, longer sentences = more electricity produced.

    8) Aim to build a society which mimics that of "The Girl From Tomorrow". The only people who should be walking around freely are those responsible enough to know how to use their freedom properly.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVS376aIVqQ&amp;feature=related


    Genuinely not being sarcastic, that's a brilliant idea !! :D


  • #45
    Rubber_Soul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,726 ✭✭✭Rubber_Soul


    Technoprisoner wrote: »
    this i weird..i had only been talking to a friend and telling him how America has a couple of hundred private prisons. The problem with this is, they set targets and the prisons have to be kept 98% full at all times.

    And leads to shíte like this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kids_for_cash_scandal


  • #46
    Dr Turk Turkelton
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,977 ✭✭✭Dr Turk Turkelton


    ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

    You cant let your heart rule your head, If you had a penal system based on OPs post ireland would be no better than the other countries that violate human rights laws, The push them until they break approach is no way to treat any human being. Rehabilate them and make them attend psycologists /councellers whoever, keep them in untill they respond

    Hah if I let my heart rule my head anyone on their fourth conviction would be getting tied to a big metal chair,doused with water and a big lightning conducter strapped to it in the middle of a storm!

    If you were too stupid to learn the first three times this is what you deserve.Instead we hear crap about some lads 82nd conviction but this time he pinky promises to be good your Honour.


  • #47
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Grayson wrote: »
    Where's the rehabilitation bit? you know, to stop them doing it again.

    Prison is about rehabilitation? :confused:


  • #48
    3ndahalfof6
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,184 ✭✭✭3ndahalfof6


    This is a very easy fix, if the powers that be would let it happen, promise me you wont do it again, but the most important thing is to make sure they are holding the bible, it works in court,.............. this is true.


  • #49
    Chemical Burn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Chemical Burn


    newmug wrote: »

    2) Put every joyriding, junkie, fraudster, banker, paedophile, illegal immigrant, shoplifting, lying politicians, dishonest, violent scumbag in Ireland into it.
    StarshipPooper wrote: »
    And leads to shíte like this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kids_for_cash_scandal

    newmug's idea would take account of that


  • #50
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 52,807 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Prison should only be for people who are too dangerous to be on the streets i.e. murderers, rapists and paedos.
    The rest should have to do community service like cleaning streets, cutting hedges, maintaining parks, painting out graffiti etc while well supervised. If they refuse then send them to prison.
    Prison should not be a picnic but not too harsh either as they have already lost their freedom.


  • #51
    Pat Mustard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,554 ✭✭✭Pat Mustard


    I have no doubt that money could be saved without inflicting needless punishments on prisoners.

    If Alan Shatter was up for it, I'd say an entrepreneur could find up one of those now empty newish hotels built from reinforced concrete during the last ten years, buy it from NAMA, convert it to accommodate the necessary security arrangements, and have it up and running as a prison in no time flat.

    As far as I am concerned, the punishment is imprisonment, so there is no need for any unnecessarily harsh regimes or any other wanton carry-on.

    I'd be all for renting the fc*kers Playstations to use in their cells/rooms, provided that someone could pay by credit card. If they wanted to bring in their own Playstations, I'd have no problems with that. If they wanted to bring in their own laptops, I wouldn't have any problem with that, provided that there was no illegal activity or access to the net for paedos.

    I'd even be on for giving them wifi for their laptops, if the price wasn't prohibitive.

    I'd be on for facilitating Fás courses in the prison, if that could be done

    If the prisoners/guests break the rules, they get sent to the punishment floor, no Playstations, no laptops, no internet, no luxuries, no prison pay, nothing.

    Where would you save money? Wages and pensions. Staff could be paid reasonable private sector style wages, without massive pensions. Overtime could be strictly limited.

    You could probably outsource the food to a local caterer, at least temporarily, until you get up and running.

    I reckon you could save a fortune and pacify the prisoners to make life easy at the same time. If it was allowed, the problem with lack of prison spaces could be fixed very soon.

    And someone could make a fortune at the same time.


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