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Sexual assault...but sure he's a nice lad..Mod Warning Post 275

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    #152
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    _michelle_ wrote: »
    i thinking of starting a petition to give this lady a courage/bravery award as it seems time we really stood up & were counted in public!! lets just show this danny foley what we think of him & his supporters.

    It's a good idea but perhaps she doesn't wish to be named. Maybe an online petition for friends to donate to the Rape Crisis Centre thanks to the Listowel Girl would be more realistic?


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    #153
    Howjoe1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,666 ✭✭✭Howjoe1


    Weren't the priest regarded as upstanding citizens when the Altar boys were being abused.

    Now we have the Parish Priest & the gombeen culchies ignoring the facts and finding of the court & jury and patting and hugging the culprit.

    The victim is turned into the villain.


    makes me ashamed of this country again.


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    #154
    pookie82
    Registered Users Posts: 2,217 ✭✭✭pookie82


    suimhneas wrote: »
    i think you will find -michelle- isnt the only member on boards making comments like this their distain for "rural" peole is becoming very obvious. They must think everyone outside the pale are a class below themselves. We must turn a blind eye dont you know they are "high as kites".

    I come from a very rural area and am just as qualified as anyone to judge. The mentality that prevails in certain rural villages in Ireland is backward and unfortunately extremely narrow minded when it comes to issues like this and I can well imagine the same sh*t going on where I come from.

    So before you start assuming that anyone who holds distain for this kind of commonly-found rural community attitude must surely be city dwellers, think again.

    You don't have to come from an urban area to see this small minded bigotry for what it is. Let's call a spade a spade shall we.


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    #155
    Frogdog
    Registered Users Posts: 983 ✭✭✭Frogdog


    Just as an FYI to everyone out there - not everyone in Listowel, nor Kerry, turned up at the courthouse to shake the man's hand. There are people from Listowel who are on the girl's side also.

    So please lay off with the slagging of Listowel, North Kerry, Kerry etc. I don't know how many times I've seen the words "backward", "culchies", "gombeens", "boggers" etc. :mad:

    This could happen everywhere and anywhere in Ireland. Even in cities.

    How would you like to be on an international forum and someone from, say, England, says something like "Oh it's typical of those Irish", even if you're from Dublin, for example??? :mad::mad::mad:

    Ya, that made you think, didn't it?!


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    #156
    RodgerTheDoger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭RodgerTheDoger


    _michelle_ wrote: »
    i have no "distain" as you put it for rural people, however i do think rural places are more backward in their thinking in regards to these aspects.
    this is MY opinion so you are fully entitled to yours.

    I think this happens more in small towns also, but I think you logic to why it happens is flawed.

    Community can be a good thing, but in cases like these, the community likes to take care of their own or people that are maybe more activie or known in the comminuty, I do not think it is about being educated it is about being objective.


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    #157
    _michelle_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 107 ✭✭_michelle_


    herya wrote: »
    It's a good idea but perhaps she doesn't wish to be named. Maybe an online petition for friends to donate to the Rape Crisis Centre thanks to the Listowel Girl would be more realistic?

    yes that sounds like a great idea, im going to email joe duffy about it now & see if i get a reply.

    thanks


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    #158
    FC2009
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20 ✭FC2009


    _michelle_ wrote: »
    im not saying it wouldnt happen in cities but my point was i would expect it to be more prevlant in country areas.

    Because people in the country are uneducated and simple????


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    #159
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    panda100 wrote: »
    However, often in rape cases evidence can be easily dismissed or is lacking to begin with. In these cases character witnesses are very important and usually get the perpetrators off scot free. The law as it stands at the moment is allowing people to judge her morals without her being able to defend herself, as she is only a witness. This means that she can be discredited as a witness, the accused and his legal team is allowed to say anything about the witness they like and she is denied the right to reply.

    True but still I don't see the need for the assailant's character witnesses in the first place. What do they know if they haven't been there in person?


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    #160
    pookie82
    Registered Users Posts: 2,217 ✭✭✭pookie82


    Frogdog wrote: »

    How would you like to be on an international forum and someone from, say, England, says something like "Oh it's typical of those Irish", even if you're from Dublin, for example??? :mad::mad::mad:

    Ya, that made you think, didn't it?!

    Most of the people giving out about it being an event typical of the Irish are Irish themselves. Read the AH thread on this. You don't have to be outside of a paricular society or part of a society to condemn them.


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    #161
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    _michelle_ wrote: »
    yes that sounds like a great idea, im going to email joe duffy about it now & see if i get a reply.

    thanks

    I've just send an e-mail to the Rape Crisis Centre in Kerry, I hope it will be passed on. Here it goes - maybe it'll be useful for someone:

    Dear X,

    I'm sorry, I don't know your name but I just wanted to send you my support with regard to how you were treated by your assailant's supporters in the court this week. It required so much courage from you to go ahead with your case, to face your assailant and to present your case well and clear so that justice was served. I have no such experience myself but I know how hard it is to bring those people to justice and how many victims suffer in silence. I just wanted to applaud you for first putting this criminal away - possibly saving other women and girls - and also for making it easier for other victims to go ahead with their cases, to be heard and not judged.

    I hope you can draw some form of satisfaction from this court case and how you handled it - and please hold your head high. You've done the right thing.

    I hope you'll have a peaceful Christmas and will be surrounded by people you can rely on.

    Kind regards,
    [herya]

    PS. I have just donated a modest sum to the Rape Crisis Centre - I hope it will pay for some examination or legal advice for victims in need. I will also keep them in mind in the future. Thank you for indirectly bringing them to my attention.


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    #162
    bookworm007
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4 ✭bookworm007


    http://www.kerryman.ie/news/convicted-sexual-assaulter-claims-incident-was-consensual-1968412.html

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/bouncer-sexually-assaulted-barely-conscious-woman-1965641.html

    "Medical reports showed her back was considerably bruised, there were injuries to her thigh, wrist and arm which were compatible with being dragged but there was no clinical evidence of sexual assault."

    He was not convicted of rape but sexual assault. There was no clinical evidence of sexual assault. Only two people know exactly what went on that night, not the judge or the jury, or anybody posting here.
    If his friends wished to support him that was their right. It has nothing to do with being from the city or country.
    The judgments of the courts are not always right.
    Danny Foley was sentenced to 7 years, with two suspended, for sexual assault. Fr Naughton has been sentenced to three years in prison, 1 year suspended, for sexually abusing an altar boy.


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    #163
    Frogdog
    Registered Users Posts: 983 ✭✭✭Frogdog


    pookie82 wrote: »
    Most of the people giving out about it being an event typical of the Irish are Irish themselves. Read the AH thread on this. You don't have to be outside of a paricular society or part of a society to condemn them.

    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.


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    #164
    pookie82
    Registered Users Posts: 2,217 ✭✭✭pookie82


    Frogdog wrote: »
    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.

    To be fair I don't think that anyone is saying sexual assault is more prevalent in rural areas. Just that the community mindset necessary to get behind someone like this, and go to that courthouse in droves, and openly sympathise with someone who is now a convicted sex offender in front of his victim, could only really occur in rural areas, where everyone knows everyone else and people who lived all their lives next to Danny would feel they had a right to stand up for him and knew him inside out - well enough to be convinced he couldn't have done it.


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    #165
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    bookworm007 wrote: »
    Danny Foley was sentenced to 7 years, with two suspended, for sexual assault. Fr Naughton has been sentenced to three years in prison, 1 year suspended, for sexually abusing an altar boy.

    True, Fr Naughton's sentence is a disgrace.


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    #166
    FC2009
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20 ✭FC2009


    Frogdog wrote: »
    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.

    +1


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    #167
    _michelle_
    Closed Accounts Posts: 107 ✭✭_michelle_


    Frogdog wrote: »
    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.

    now hang on a minute i never said that! & people who dont read all that i said may well come to a conclusion that this is what i have said so i would appericate if you would take that back!

    also how do you know im not from a country area (not saying i am or not) but your presuming im not so please dont be so presumptive.


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    #168
    Howjoe1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,666 ✭✭✭Howjoe1


    Frogdog wrote: »
    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.


    Frogdog,

    The only person purporting to know the two parties..is given the line that he is innocent and she is a liar!

    If more were online saying that what happened in court was wrong..we might feel are small towns have moved on


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    #169
    BobbyJo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭BobbyJo


    I have read all the postings on this topic and totally agree that it is an appaling situation.
    My heart goes out to the victim - I don't know how she must have felt sitting feet from the guy who sexually assualted her while he received sympathy from approx 50 men.

    But my point is this: If the man was convicted of sexual assualt, and was in the court awaiting sentance he was obviously a ward of the court and in the company of prison officers.
    How were 50 men allowed to approch the prisoner, shake hands with him, hug him and contact him????

    I do not have any experience of how the courts work and how prisoners are treated - but surely if the security around this man, or any other convicted prisoner, was so lax he could have absconded and legged it whenever he wanted. FFS was he allowed go make coffee for himself??

    I'm a lil confused..................:rolleyes:


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    #170
    Frogdog
    Registered Users Posts: 983 ✭✭✭Frogdog


    pookie82 wrote: »
    To be fair I don't think that anyone is saying sexual assault is more prevalent in rural areas. Just that the community mindset necessary to get behind someone like this, and go to that courthouse in droves, and openly sympathise with someone who is now a convicted sex offender in front of his victim, could only really occur in rural areas, where everyone knows everyone else and people who lived all their lives next to Danny would feel they had a right to stand up for him and knew him inside out - well enough to be convinced he couldn't have done it.

    Well if she worded it as nicely as you do I'd have no problem! :D

    But there is a community spirit in cities also. I live in Dublin and I've experienced it. And also, take for example if the man was part of a rugby club in South Dublin. I've seen those guys protect their own before. And that's just one example. I'm sure it's prevalent in a lot of clubs/societies/schools/colleges/religous beliefs etc in cities.

    If anything, _michelle_ was showing her ignorance. In my opinion, of course.


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    #171
    humanji
    Registered Users Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    That confused me too. It seems like a weird scene in a film or something. I'd of thought people would have to keep out of the main court area.


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    #172
    Howjoe1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,666 ✭✭✭Howjoe1


    Frogdog,

    I hope you are listening to the girl's aunt on the Radio telling how she is being snubbed by the community.

    Explain that one please?


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    #173
    pookie82
    Registered Users Posts: 2,217 ✭✭✭pookie82


    Frogdog wrote: »
    Well if she worded it as nicely as you do I'd have no problem! :D

    But there is a community spirit in cities also. I live in Dublin and I've experienced it. And also, take for example if the man was part of a rugby club in South Dublin. I've seen those guys protect their own before. And that's just one example. I'm sure it's prevalent in a lot of clubs/societies/schools/colleges/religous beliefs etc in cities.

    Yes I agree, especially about the rugby cliques etc, I suppose (without trying to be inflammatory or derail the thread in any way) the Brian Murphy case would be a good example of that.

    Of course I don't assume that everyone in Kerry/Listowel agrees with what happened. I also accept that there's clearly a lot more background to this than I'll ever hear about. it's a very very bizarre case.


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    #174
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    Frogdog wrote: »
    But there is a community spirit in cities also. I live in Dublin and I've experienced it. And also, take for example if the man was part of a rugby club in South Dublin. I've seen those guys protect their own before. And that's just one example. I'm sure it's prevalent in a lot of clubs/societies/schools/colleges/religous beliefs etc in cities.

    You're absolutely right, but 50 men in a Listowel size town is not exactly the same as 50 men in Dublin proportion-wise, that's where part of the impression comes from I'm afraid.


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    #175
    RodgerTheDoger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭RodgerTheDoger


    Frogdog wrote: »
    That's not what I'm saying, and that's not what is happening.

    What is happening is a City v Country debate, where posters such as _michelle_ is of the opinion that this is more prevalent in a rural location, and that we're all country bumpkins, uneducated and that sexual assault is rife and commonplace. Now that's not a direct quote, but it's quite plain to see that's what she's saying.

    Have a read of her posts and you'll see for yourself. Further evidence will be provided by a couple of posts previous to your post above.

    You are missing the argument, its not that it happens more in cities or the country, it is how the community has reacted to it!

    I am a "Bogger" as you put it, I think this kind of "bad community gathering" will happen more so in rural areas simply because there tends to be a much larger sense of comminuty is small areas and less of a community in the bigger cities!


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    #176
    Kimia
    Registered Users Posts: 2,897 ✭✭✭Kimia


    bookworm007 wrote: »
    http://www.kerryman.ie/news/convicted-sexual-assaulter-claims-incident-was-consensual-1968412.html

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/bouncer-sexually-assaulted-barely-conscious-woman-1965641.html

    "Medical reports showed her back was considerably bruised, there were injuries to her thigh, wrist and arm which were compatible with being dragged but there was no clinical evidence of sexual assault."

    He was not convicted of rape but sexual assault. There was no clinical evidence of sexual assault. Only two people know exactly what went on that night, not the judge or the jury, or anybody posting here.
    If his friends wished to support him that was their right. It has nothing to do with being from the city or country.
    The judgments of the courts are not always right.
    Danny Foley was sentenced to 7 years, with two suspended, for sexual assault. Fr Naughton has been sentenced to three years in prison, 1 year suspended, for sexually abusing an altar boy.

    Hmmm why is no one commenting on this?

    So you clearly think Danny Foley (poor thing :rolleyes:) should have gotten a lighter sentence?


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    #177
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,232 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    herya wrote: »
    You're absolutely right, but 50 men in a Listowel size town is not exactly the same as 50 men in Dublin proportion-wise, that's where part of the impression comes from I'm afraid.

    Look, I'm from the country, and if there's one thing I know, its that different places are different. Why are both sides generalising the other? What does it matter? People obviously liked the guy, and so they went to support him. Why? I don't know. But I doubt it would have been any different whether it was in the country, the city, or an oil rig

    Also, just in case it hasn't been mentioned here, the Facebook page has been taken down. I don't know if they closed it down themselves or Facebook made them (the page had been reported by a few of the users in the AH thread)


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    #178
    Vegeta
    Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭Vegeta


    http://www.irishelection.com/2009/12/sympathies-yet-again/comment-page-1/


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    #179
    herya
    Registered Users Posts: 1,571 ✭✭✭herya


    paddyirishman85 wrote: »
    Look, I'm from the country, and if there's one thing I know, its that different places are different. Why are both sides generalising the other? What does it matter? People obviously liked the guy, and so they went to support him. Why? I don't know. But I doubt it would have been any different whether it was in the country, the city, or an oil rig

    Yes of course, sorry my wording was wrong. I didn't mean the general impression of rural communities, I meant my impression in this particular case. 50 men in a town the size of Listowel is a huge crowd, that's what jumped at me. I'm sure such an act of "support" would be possible anywhere else as you state.


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    #180
    Barname
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,084 ✭✭✭Barname


    AntiRip wrote: »
    I know Danny very well and I know the victim also. If you lived in the area you'd know the full story that isn't been in the media. I am very shocked and upset with this story. It's very sad when you know the people involved.

    emotions have no place in justice

    danny was caught on cctv

    he is now a convicted sex offender


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    #181
    Knightfall
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭Knightfall


    I only heard about this terrible incident this morning, and I'm still stunned by the manner in which it all happened.

    I don't care, to be quite honest, under what circumstances the case occurred, or who thinks who is wrong or who is right. At the end of the day, all that matters is that this individual (he doesn't deserve the title of "man") was arrested under suspicion of sexual assault/rape, was tried by a jury of his peers and convicted. Therefore, he is not deserving of any sympathy from anyone, I mean anyone! :mad:

    This brave lady is suffering the slings and arrows of an obviously orchestrated campaign either by the convicted individual or someone connected to him. I live in a rural area, though not one as apparently backward as this area. (And, in light of these events, I will make no apology for saying that). And, I can say that in small areas like that an orchestrated campaign like that can ruin a person's life, and is often seen to be done by people who, generally in their own opinion, have a high standing in that society.

    As regards the priest getting involved, and for that matter, coming on radio today to defend himself..........he's not a man of God, he's just another leech on that society


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