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But they'll have to give up 25% of their country a bit like we did in the north. The Donbass and Crimea of particular economic importance.
Ukraine needs to adapt to life without the US directly, but through EU, AND NATO they can still obtain all they need from US
Om Today with Pat Kenny, it emerged that when reports of the plan emerged, Witkoff tweeted 'K must have leaked it' before deleting the tweet. Who is "K"? They think it's Kirill Dmitriev.
The United States has threatened to cut intelligence sharing and weapons supplies for Ukraine to press it into agreeing to the framework of a U.S.-brokered peace deal, two people familiar with the matter said.The sources, speaking on condition of anonymity, said that Kyiv was under greater pressure from Washington than during any previous peace discussions, and that the U.S. wanted Ukraine to sign a framework of the deal by next Thursday.
Provisions in this ultimatum would help Russia vassalise what's left of Ukraine. The ban on foreign diplomats landing there, as mentioned by the Daily Telegraph. Can you imagine Michael Collins accepting such terms in 1922?
Probably because there'd be a nuke on Kiev before a drone would get to Moscow?
Unfortunately the Kremlin pounced just as the scandal in Ukraine happened and with the help of there man in the WH get it done before TG.
The surrender is the end for Ukraine spoils go to russia and usa with felon picking up a few 100ms.
Now europe has an embolden russia threating at every chance it gets we will have untouchable spy ships on our coastline when ever russia wants to remind us
You are talking about the Anglo-Irish treaty of 1921, right?
The one where Ireland had to accept the King of England was the head of the Irish state, that Ireland was part of the British Empire? That all elected representatives of the Irish people had to swear an oath of loyalty to the English King? That the British military would continue to occupy military bases in Ireland? That the island would be partitioned? That the Irish state would continue to pay for the debts of the British state - including the pensions of the British armed forces that occupied Ireland? Which stated that any Irish law would be subservient to the terms of the treaty?
Whatever terms are imposed on Ukraine it is unlikely that they will be required to recognise Putin as their head of state, that Ukraine is part of Russia, or that their elected representatives must swear loyalty to Putin, or that Ukraine must take on the debts of Russia. The Anglo-Irish treaty was incredibly brutal in its terms. Arguably, it locked in a nominal British victory in which Ireland remained under the British crown and empire. And yet Irish patriots with the best interests of the Irish people in mind recognised that it was the best option for Irish interests. It conceded mostly ceremonial aspects such as the head of state, and an oath which even Dev later dismissed as mere words and in exchange granted real tools to establish de-facto and by extension de-jure independence.
This is what baffles me about the unrealistic warmongering in Ireland particularly. We should know better. We know what it is to live alongside a neighbour that is vastly stronger than we are. And yet we demand the Ukrainians die to the last person, when we know from our own experience.
Yeah and it's exactly why the Russians with Trump are making their move now.
Every leader in EU is a snowflake, and that's the biggest issue with helping Ukraine. UK bombed Dresden killing 30k men women and children, to teach Hilter a lesson. Todays leaders dare not scratch a Lada for fear of the consequences . France, UK, Poland should be invading Ukraine tomorrow, raise their flags, then fill the country with their troops. Or Ukraine should sell, sell it, get it into EU hands, not rocket science how to end this war.
why are the Ukraine not targeting the Kremlin with a few drones or missiles?
Point 14 remarkably demands Russia pay 100 billion USD to the United States for some reason
Shur, why not 🤨
Keep off Putins dandruff, say bollox to RuZZian cocaine! Smash the tankies!
I stopped reading after you mentioned point 11.
So according to you Ireland is also a quasi-NATO member (despite clearly and inexplicably being a state not outfitted for a such membership).
Zelenskys corruption scandal has shattered any chance of war time unity
https://www.politico.eu/article/volodymyr-zelenskyy-ukraine-corruption-scandal/
Baloney and balderdash.
So you say you are "concerned" for the ordinary folk of Ukraine and the billions of euros spent supporting their country men dying on the front lines. What's your feelings on the thousands of ordinary Ukrainian women and children being murdered and seriously wounded in their homes by putin's terrorists attacking their country in an illegal war of conquest started by putin?
Anyway in spite of your concern Ireland has continued to help Ukraine with supplies of some equipment that can be of use in air defense from putin's terrorist state attacks.
Also lots of the Euros invested by the EU in Ukraine has contributed to valuable work in killing terrorists sent by putin to attack and kill ordinary Ukrainians.
it doesnt matter how corrupt ukraine is - europe cant let russia be rewarded and emboldened for their war
how would the UK and churchill or Stalin and USSR have reacted if the US told them to kowtow and surrender in WW2
Can anyone imagine a scenario where Ireland had to cede a load of its sovereignty to the UK, allow it to take over several Irish counties, have the UK dictate the size of our military and who our allies are, tell us what languages it wants spoken in Ireland etc? The vatniks and their hero Putin can take a running jump.
If one was so inclined one might think the talking points are fed to them.
Payments to deceased soldiers families in Russia are disappearing.
Local authorities say they don't have the money.
"It turns out that ministries and departments are dragging their feet on disbursing the required funds. It's very upsetting that they sign a contract and, leaving to defend the Motherland, can't wait for months for regional payments of so-called lifting allowances. I won't voice everything they wrote to me because there aren't enough censored words in it, and I have proposals for them. Well, the censored part is the whole point. Please convey to them what officials have to say. The budget is complicated, they don't have the money. Therefore, on behalf of the People's Front, on behalf of all participants and properties of the Khakassi people, we ask you to reconsider this approach."
From the speech above.
The ruzzians are desperate.
We went from Kyiv in three days to five oblasts and now to three and a bit oblasts.
While the Ukrainians dig their feet in and refuse to compromise on territorial integrity, the ruzzian demands weaken.
Now ask yourself why is that? Is it because their army has been wrecked, the economy is in tatters and the number of casualties is well past a million? Or is it because ruzzia is winning? 😄
Now is the time for Ukraine to dig in once more and for Europe to back them. Just keep killing orcs and I guarantee that the next "peace deal" will be more favourable. Eventually there will be no more "peace deals". The ruzzians will be defeated and Ukraine wins.
Interesting to see so many of the vatniks here now being activated to push this "peace deal" almost as if it's some benevolent act on the behalf of the orcs.
I think you're right its designed for a domestic US audience. But it doesn't offer much to Russia that they don't already have. The vast majority of the terms are either irrelevant or contradictory to Russian interests.
Point 7 promises Ukrainian neutrality, but there is no possible enforcement mechanism. Point 11 demands Russia accepts Ukrainian membership of the EU which is at this point indistinguishable from NATO. In Point 8, NATO promises not to deploy troops in Ukraine but there is no bar on the EU, or some ad-hoc coalition of the willing doing so. Point 13 only offers to hold talks about lifting sanctions. Sanctions would remain fully in force indefinitely. Point 14 remarkably demands Russia pay 100 billion USD to the United States for some reason. Point 19 demands they hand over control of the Zaporizhzhya Nuclear Power Plant to the US. Point 21 only offers Russia de-facto recognition of the territory they already de-facto control, while demanding a freezing of the conflict that the Russians have ruled out.
Clearly the deal is going to be unacceptable to the Ukrainian regime but its going to be unacceptable to the Russians as well. So far all Putin has said is it can form the basis for further discussions which is a fairly clear rejection of the terms as they are.
The only obvious winner out of the terms would be the US who gets paid by everyone - Europe, Ukraine, Russia - for dubious reasons. This seems to have been dreamed up by the same amateurs in the White House who thought they could bully China in a trade war.
The phrase 'The emperor has not clothes' comes to mind.
Pointing out Zelenskyy's obvious weakness as a politician, his bad decisions like the K. Harris boo boo. How he is being played by Trump and by others like NATO. His total lack of control of his ruling corrupt regime at home etc. etc. This is not pro Russian, it's concern for the future of the ordinary folk of Ukraine - their political masters can cut and run to their safe havens and fat bank accounts in western Europe and through out the world while.
Also bear in mind that Ireland is a net contributor to the EU. The EU has pumped billions of euro (and continue to do so) in supporting Ukraine's war effort, of which we make a contribution. Handing over billions to what is evidently a very corrupt regime who are lining their own pockets while thousands of their countrymen are dying at the front line trying in vain to defend their country is hard to stomach.
Russia's weakest link is their size and their dependence on railways.
One coal train derailing affected numerous rail lines and journeys by five hours.
even Nigel farage says the deal is unacceptable for Ukraine.
It’s kinda sad seeing all the Vatniks get their hopes up… surely they’ve boxed Zelensky in, with the “leader” of the most powerful country in their pocket (who knew those compromising photos of nobody of much significance would be so useful all these years later) Zelensky will capitulate. And dear leader will be known as Putin the Great for all time. And the West will know its place, beneath Russia.
I’ve one famous quote for you, not from Churchill or Oscar Wilde, just a comedian turned politician… 6 words that should shatter your delusions.
“I need ammunition, not a ride”
This "proposal", while something the Russians will be very happy with, has to be designed for the domestic US audience.
The US knows there isn't a hope in hell of being accepted, and it's a million miles away from anything which could be considered, so what's the point in it ?
Presumably it's job is to gain attention in the US media and provide a distraction from the Epstein file stuff.
I know it's perhaps your purpose to post pro Russia stuff here (and it's an exciting time for you people), but can you try and stick to facts?
He did not "endorse" Harris afair - though who could blame him for having a preference?
It is playing out even worse than most expected with Donald Trump in the White House.
Further backstabbing of Ukraine (and Europe) by a disgrace + shambles of a US govt. that seems to be in Russia's pocket.
I like your style.
Russia is flailing, smashed broke and down to the dregs of their fighting men after well over a million casualties of their own folly.
Europe must now humiliate Putin in every way at our disposal. Kicking dirt in his face is the only thing he and the Russian people understand.
If it takes Europe disavowing this corrupt American proposal, so be it. If it takes Europe providing a unilateral security ring around Ukraine, without America, so be it. If it takes Europe underpinning Ukraine's financial exposure to the war, so be it.
Putin cannot weather at home the problems of his catastrophic mistake for much longer. His paranoia and desperation grows every day. There is an evident rift with Lavrov. Lavrov is tight with many of the most powerful oligarchs, and those oligarchs see that life and economics for them is only getting worse and worse. Not to mind ordinary people who have seen price inflation and sanctions put goods and services they considered routine, now out of reach.
The global west has far more resources to wait it out than Putin does, even without America.
