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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

Beasty

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No anti-vax stuff in this thread - it's to discuss the various vaccines available and how they are getting rolled out, as well as testing procedures

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MrStuffins

PTH2009 wrote: »

Numbers getting moved around again

If at this point you don't realise that these numbers are fluid, that they are estimates depending on a multitude of different factors, then that's on you.

smurfjed

Given the choice to take the 2nd AZ dose at 4 weeks or 12 weeks, do the benefits exist to make it worthwhile waiting for 12 weeks ?

hynesie08

PTH2009 wrote: »

Numbers getting moved around again

How so?

ACitizenErased

smurfjed wrote: »

Given the choice to take the 2nd AZ dose at 4 weeks or 12 weeks, do the benefits exist to make it worthwhile waiting for 12 weeks ?

The longer between doses the better in that particularly technology

Goldengirl

smurfjed wrote: »

Given the choice to take the 2nd AZ dose at 4 weeks or 12 weeks, do the benefits exist to make it worthwhile waiting for 12 weeks ?

The interval for AZ doses is 12 weeks . No choice here or in EU with that .

It is the mRNA vaccines that are 4 weeks between first and second dose .

UK are doing a longer interval because they went by their own regulatory body's advice or " off piste "

smurfjed

A single standard dose of vaccine provided 76% protection overall against symptomatic covid-19 in the first 90 days after vaccination with protection not falling in this time frame. It is not clear, however, how long protection might last with a single dose as there were too few cases after 90 days to make any meaningful judgment.

The analyses suggest that it is the dosing interval and not the dosing level which has the greatest impact on the efficacy of the vaccine. This is in line with previous research supporting greater efficacy with longer intervals with other vaccines such as influenza and Ebola.

The study found vaccine efficacy reached 82.4% after a second dose in those with a dosing interval of 12 weeks or more (95% confidence interval 62.7% to 91.7%). If the two doses were given less than six weeks apart the efficacy was only 54.9% (CI 32.7% to 69.7%).

If AZ provides 76% up to 90 days, increasing to 82.4% after 84 days. How does the efficiency suddenly drop to 54.9% if the 2nd dose is taken within 42 days?

REF: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n326

Chuck Noland

Goldengirl wrote: »

The interval for AZ doses is 12 weeks . No choice here or in EU with that .

It is the mRNA vaccines that are 4 weeks between first and second dose .

UK are doing a longer interval because they went by their own regulatory body's advice or " off piste "

A person I know who got their first AZ dose today was told 12 weeks until second dose also

[Deleted User]

There were some very good slides in the UK Briefing, have to say if I was under 30 and healthy and offered AZ, I would turn it down at this point.

eoinbn

smurfjed wrote: »

If AZ provides 76% up to 90 days, increasing to 82.4% after 84 days. How does the efficiency suddenly drop to 54.9% if the 2nd dose is taken within 42 days?

REF: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n326

The US trials were done with a 4 week gap with an efficacy of 76%. It is very hard to find any consistency in their trial data. Will be interesting to see what conclusion the FDA come to. I don't see it been approved. The US doesn't need it. If that is their decision hopefully it can be sent to South America to get them out of the hell they are in.

caveat emptor

stephenjmcd wrote: »

EMA’s safety committee (PRAC) has concluded today that unusual blood clots with low blood platelets should be listed as very rare side effects of Vaxzevria (formerly COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca).

https://twitter.com/EMA_News/status/1379794539456688137?s=19

If someone already has a low platelet condition like ITP, are they more at risk of this adverse affect? Would the vaccine exasperate it or is it unrelated. I know it's extremely rare just wondering if it's related.

smurfjed

Goldengirl wrote: »

The interval for AZ doses is 12 weeks . No choice here or in EU with that .
"

I have that choice, so which is better, take it at 4 weeks or wait until 12?

lbj666

smurfjed wrote: »

I have that choice, so which is better, take it at 4 weeks or wait until 12?

I think that's definitely in the realm of medical advise

is_that_so

smurfjed wrote: »

I have that choice, so which is better, take it at 4 weeks or wait until 12?

AZ was tested at 12 weeks in the clinical trials and what authorities are adopting.

cameramonkey

How heard immunity works.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/02/18/967462483/how-herd-immunity-works-and-what-stands-in-its-way?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&t=1617819526505

is_that_so

cameramonkey wrote: »

How heard immunity works.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/02/18/967462483/how-herd-immunity-works-and-what-stands-in-its-way?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&t=1617819526505

I heard it's herd immunity!

smurfjed

lbj666 wrote: »

I think that's definitely in the realm of medical advise

Thanks, so 4 weeks it is !

I guess that the answer I’m looking for is why does the protection level go down with the 2nd dose if taken early ? Or is all of this based on that inconclusive South African study.

embraer170

Deleted User wrote: »

There were some very good slides in the UK Briefing, have to say if I was under 30 and healthy and offered AZ, I would turn it down at this point.

Do you have a link you could share?

[Deleted User]

embraer170 wrote: »

Do you have a link you could share?

I was watching it on a UK news channel, might be on the sky news website

Azatadine

Vaccination having a big impact on death rate in UK.

https://twitter.com/laoneill111/status/1379861206228467712?s=09

[Deleted User]

Azatadine wrote: »

Vaccination having a big impact on death rate in UK.

https://twitter.com/laoneill111/status/1379861206228467712?s=09

It's about time in fairness, their death rate in general during this has been shameful.

It does bode well for the two vaccines they're using though and as they're just starting second doses now and will have about 20million fully vaxxed by end of May, you'd hope they will see minimal deaths from now.

stephenjmcd

HPRA update

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1379879371775881223?s=19

NH2013

Azatadine wrote: »

Vaccination having a big impact on death rate in UK.

https://twitter.com/laoneill111/status/1379861206228467712?s=09

Interesting statistics given Hungary's higher rate of vaccination than the rest of Europe (37% for Hungary vs~18% for Europe) due to the use of the Sputnik vaccine what is causing the spike in deaths there? Policy matters, a backdated notification of deaths or just the guard being lowered due to higher vaccination rates?

hmmm

Interesting debates going on in Slovakia about Sputnik. I'm no expert on Slovakian politics and someone here might know more, but it appears that the PM went on a solo run and bought 200,000 doses of the Russian vaccine. The Slovakian regulator isn't happy with the data they have received from the manufacturer, and aren't authorising it for use:

https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-slovakia-vaccines/slovak-drug-agency-says-it-cannot-back-sputnik-v-vaccine-due-to-lack-of-data-idUSL8N2LZ4JA

Manach

Given that there many hundreds of housebound over 85 year olds that have not been vaccinated with no communications strategy in place by the various state agencies beyond a reiteration of the phrase "None left behind", then perhaps one can be forgiven for being a tad sceptical of their PR output.

Goldengirl

Deleted User wrote: »

There were some very good slides in the UK Briefing, have to say if I was under 30 and healthy and offered AZ, I would turn it down at this point.

Saw those slides later on BBC news .
It makes it much clearer about not giving the AZ jab to under 30s based on their now low risk of severe illness and death compared with their risk of a severe outcome statistically from the vaccine if they suffer this severe clotting response .

It would be good to see the same modelling for different age groups in Ireland, but what risk level would be considered to be at now compared to the UK?
Probably moderate, but not high.

hmmm

Manach wrote: »

Given that there many hundreds of housebound over 85 year olds that have not been vaccinated.

Where are you getting these stats from?

snotboogie

NH2013 wrote: »

Interesting statistics given Hungary's higher rate of vaccination than the rest of Europe (37% for Hungary vs~18% for Europe) due to the use of the Sputnik vaccine what is causing the spike in deaths there? Policy matters, a backdated notification of deaths or just the guard being lowered due to higher vaccination rates?

Hungary hit a massive spike in cases just when vaccination started. Huge drop in cases once they hit the magic 30 vaccines per 100. Deaths lag but there should be a big drop there in a few weeks too.

Qrt

I'd be in the early 20s cohort, and tbh I would still have no issue getting the AZ jab. I've been on medication since birth for an ongoing illness, and if I'd taken heed of everything listed on the "rare: 1 in 10,000" adverse effects list, I'd have gone blind by now. I'd have had strokes, heart attacks, lupus, and even a bendy willy. I do sometimes wonder what it's like to have the privilege of not having a chronic illness.

Chris_5339762

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

I know I've banged on about this before, but my parents GP has not finished the 75-80 group yet and hasn't even started on the 70 - 75. They also will not get vaccine deliveries AT ALL apparently until Monday 12th. And they have to get 2nd doses out of that too.

From my experience, mid April is a bit of a pipe dream at the moment. But I would love to be proved wrong.

For anyone who is following or recognises my rantings -

The GP finally rang today. Both are scheduled for Tuesday 20th for their first dose, at long last (ages 73 and 74).

But with a major caveat.

The GP are consistently getting less doses than expected. They vaccinated yesterday (Tue 6th) and got 70 less than they had anticipated, so had to bump 70 patients by two weeks to the 20th. They said there is a reasonable chance my folks will be bumped a further two weeks to May 4th - as they only get a delivery every two weeks.

They're happier now, but worried they'll be pushed out. Hopefully the 20th will happen, but even the 20th is taking the piss a little when it comes to "All over 70s will be offered a dose by mid April" and if they get pushed to the 4th May it'll be a right mockery of the whole thing. Fingers crossed though.

embraer170

I've also been ranting a bit in this thread.

My mom (75, multiple pre existing conditions) got an appointment for her first dose on the 14th of April.

No way all over 70s will get their first dose by mid-April, at least not in this very large GP practise in Kerry.