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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

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No anti-vax stuff in this thread - it's to discuss the various vaccines available and how they are getting rolled out, as well as testing procedures

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Dempo1

I'm getting confused about what is really going on with the Roll out, particularly over 85"s.whilst the HSE senior management are adept at spin and positive narratives, it would seem on the ground this roll out is not as smooth as is being portrayed. Notwithstanding continuing reports from actual GP"s of no vacinne deliveries let alone communication, targets are being clearly missed. I've never felt setting targets was wise but it would seem tge HSE and Governments go to reason for delays is AZ, Whilst clearly AZ flagged delays in supply, surely this debacle is not all AZ fault, there's more to this than is being shared.

hmmm

Widescreen wrote: »

Can't believe the responses here on vaccines, it's a different story on the radio!

I suggest reading more and commenting less until you understand why there is a difference of opinion here to what is being said in the media.

The vaccine rollout in Ireland is going as fast as supply will allow, I've no substantive criticisms of it. The real test will be in May/June/July when supply is expected to be substantial.

There's unlikely to be a lockdown needed in Summer, people will be outdoors, vaccinations should be effective against circulating strains. Winter we will need to be more careful - hopefully we can avoid lockdowns if a large number are vaccinated, but some restrictions are likely.

lucernarian

DylanJM wrote: »

Bit of a shame to see the more pessimistic posters making there way into this thread. For me this is the most enjoyable thread for staying up to date because most of the time the news posted is backed up by actual scientific data there's minimal scaremongering.

That has a bit of an echo chamber vibe to it tbh.

Normally I wouldn't point it out, but after the bizaare fascist protesters on O'Connell Street in Dublin last weekend, I'll mention it's their, not there

It's probably best sticking to HSE briefings for updates etc as that avoids the emotive clickbait seen in RTÉ, Twitter and indeed here.

Widescreen

If you're happy with the present roll out of vaccines, enjoy the brief respite in April/May followed by another lockdown in summer and then again in winter and so on. If they don't start treating this as an emergency situation, get the hotel quarantine sorted and basically pull their fingers out in government, people won't be worrying about holidays or festivals for a long time yet. Ireland is a leaderless ship, listing dangerously as far as this virus goes.

Can't believe the responses here on vaccines, it's a different story on the radio!

stephenjmcd

Van.Bosch wrote: »

6,692 doses on Monday.

Not great - is this still impacted by AZ shortfall?

Yes they've said this week will also be impacted by AZ but Mondays are lower generally

Hmmzis

stefanovich wrote: »

I don't understand if this is being presented as good or bad news. Is this normal or are they taking a calculated risk?

They're applying the same approach as to flu vaccine updates (those are actually significantly larger changes). FDA has taken the same approach and I think EMA have stated the same as well.

stefanovich

Micky 32 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/hugogye/status/1367378647380811777?s=21

I don't understand if this is being presented as good or bad news. Is this normal or are they taking a calculated risk?

afatbollix

I've been trying for days to find a graph that was released in the UK in January to show how quickly deaths could come down, They said by mid-March it would be 10% of the peak of the 3rd wave or something to that effect.

Yesterday's deaths in the UK were 315 with 172 of them being deaths that were missing in Scotland's numbers from the past year.
315-172=143

It looks like that graph was correct as on Breakfast news this morning the news is deaths could be back to normal by Easter. This is really showing that after 1 jab you get a huge amount of protection and the results take months not years to show how quickly we can get on with our lives.

pc7

GLaDOS wrote: »

Hope we get some positive updates regarding supply this week. All the vaccine news has me very optimistic but disappointing to miss the target last week.

Also listening to Claire Byrne now and GP's struggling to get syringes for the vaccines and that

, just worries me that its the HSE having had past dealings with them.

GLaDOS

Hope we get some positive updates regarding supply this week. All the vaccine news has me very optimistic but disappointing to miss the target last week.

iamwhoiam

funnydoggy wrote: »

Billionth update: Granda got his first dose at 10am had his clothes ironed and ready for days

Thats wonderful to hear . And his clothes are ready and ironed is just so lovely

Micky 32

https://twitter.com/hugogye/status/1367378647380811777?s=21

funnydoggy

Billionth update: Granda got his first dose at 10am

had his clothes ironed and ready for days

dominatinMC

DylanJM wrote: »

Bit of a shame to see the more pessimistic posters making there way into this thread. For me this is the most enjoyable thread for staying up to date because most of the time the news posted is backed up by actual scientific data there's minimal scaremongering.

Exactly. Why bother indulging these posters. Any post with a line "this is life forever now" doesn't deserve a reply in my opinion. How anyone can actually believe that is beyond me, but anyway.
And lest we forget, amongst all the continued talk of variants and boosters, the current vaccines still work. Bottom line is they reduce hospitalisations and prevent death. People are obsessing over efficacy!

is_that_so

Hmmzis wrote: »

Got some news from my local GP that they're done and dusted (1st dose I'm assuming) with their 85+ category, starting 80+ next week.

Good news but not the kind of news some people like to hear!

is_that_so

DylanJM wrote: »

Bit of a shame to see the more pessimistic posters making there way into this thread. For me this is the most enjoyable thread for staying up to date because most of the time the news posted is backed up by actual scientific data there's minimal scaremongering.

TBH people have had questions all the way through this and links and information on this thread have been genuinely hard to make sense of. Some positions may seem irrational to you or me but however well some posters understand this we are all grasping a little at the significance of things and what it means to our own worldview.

Hmmzis

Got some news from my local GP that they're done and dusted (1st dose I'm assuming) with their 85+ category, starting 80+ next week.

DylanJM

Bit of a shame to see the more pessimistic posters making their way into this thread. For me this is the most enjoyable thread for staying up to date because most of the time the news posted is backed up by actual scientific data there's minimal scaremongering.

Hmmzis

seamus wrote: »

Efficacy data I think is what they're mainly going for.

They can do considerably smaller (or sometimes skip) phase 2 & 3 trials provided there's no material change to the ingredients. In these cases you're really making sure that the new vaccine is more effective than the old one. They always monitor for side-effects, but they can assume they're at least as safe as the previous generation because nothing measurable has changed.

If I'm understanding it right, it's the other way around. They're looking at immunogenicity not in the field efficacy as there is a clear relationship between immunogenicity (nAB titers and T cell counts) and protection. What they're looking for in these booster shots and influenza shots is safety, i.e. no unexpected side effects. That effectively only requires an expanded phase 1/2 trial with a 2 month observation period after the last dose.

timsey tiger

Deleted User wrote: »

Do you think we will stop vaccinating when cases drop?

Also - its global supply that's lethargic as manufacturers have ramped production in Q1. Only a few countries have secured large supplies. If all countries had been as on the ball as UK and Israel, supply issues would exist everywhere

and the cost would be stratospheric.

seamus

Van.Bosch wrote: »

6,692 doses on Monday.

Not great - is this still impacted by AZ shortfall?

It's twice as many as the previous Monday

Mondays are always lower because of the delivery cycle.

iamwhoiam

Widescreen wrote: »

Sorry if mentioned before but is anyone else worried that this wave will peter out in the next 5-6 weeks and then nowhere near enough vaccines will have been administered and we will be goosed with another wave then?

i think one day last week only 35, yes 35!!! second doses were administered.

Don't think I could handle another cycle of watching the cases going up again and watching the same updates from the same old boring( clever I know) people .

It's obvious now why they didn't appoint a minister for vaccines here- there should be political accountability for this lethargic roll out, but they are too clever for that.

I would much prefer to see experts in virology and Immunologists and an expert panel guiding the vaccine rollout instead of a politician who knows nothing about anything . Possibly his/ her way to being a Minister is because his/ her daddy was .
Take our Minister for Education as an example , as useless as a chocolate tea pot

Van.Bosch

6,692 doses on Monday.

Not great - is this still impacted by AZ shortfall?

hmmm

Hector Savage wrote: »

Impressive ? entering phase 1 trials ? so essentially will take a year + to be approved.

The variants will be endless, so essentially this is life now, infinite restrictions as new vaccines for the variants are WIP....

As they are approved, next batch of variants are ready - more lockdown.

The boosters will be available in the Autumn, the regulators will not require full phase 3 trials for changes to existing vaccines.

I've read a good bit of informed speculation that the virus is constrained in the number of mutations it can have without becoming unstable, and because we're seeing the same mutations appear independently in different parts of the world it suggests that a booster targeting those mutations would be very effective (on top of the existing vaccines).

[Deleted User]

Widescreen wrote: »

Sorry if mentioned before but is anyone else worried that this wave will peter out in the next 5-6 weeks and then nowhere near enough vaccines will have been administered and we will be goosed with another wave then?

i think one day last week only 35, yes 35!!! second doses were administered.

Don't think I could handle another cycle of watching the cases going up again and watching the same updates from the same old boring( clever I know) people .

It's obvious now why they didn't appoint a minister for vaccines here- there should be political accountability for this lethargic roll out, but they are too clever for that.

Do you think we will stop vaccinating when cases drop?

Also - its global supply that's lethargic as manufacturers have ramped production in Q1. Only a few countries have secured large supplies. If all countries had been as on the ball as UK and Israel, supply issues would exist everywhere

Widescreen

Sorry if mentioned before but is anyone else worried that this wave will peter out in the next 5-6 weeks and then nowhere near enough vaccines will have been administered and we will be goosed with another wave then?

i think one day last week only 35, yes 35!!! second doses were administered.

Don't think I could handle another cycle of watching the cases going up again and watching the same updates from the same old boring( clever I know) people .

It's obvious now why they didn't appoint a minister for vaccines here- there should be political accountability for this lethargic roll out, but they are too clever for that.

seamus

Probes wrote: »

I don't think it does take that long. They probably need safety data more than anything. The flu vaccines are done in less than a year.

Efficacy data I think is what they're mainly going for.

They can do considerably smaller (or sometimes skip) phase 2 & 3 trials provided there's no material change to the ingredients. In these cases you're really making sure that the new vaccine is more effective than the old one. They always monitor for side-effects, but they can assume they're at least as safe as the previous generation because nothing measurable has changed.

Probes

Hector Savage wrote: »

Impressive ? entering phase 1 trials ? so essentially will take a year + to be approved.

The variants will be endless, so essentially this is life now, infinite restrictions as new vaccines for the variants are WIP....

As they are approved, next batch of variants are ready - more lockdown.

I don't think it does take that long. They probably need safety data more than anything. The flu vaccines are done in less than a year.

funnydoggy

D.Q wrote: »

This comment gave me covid-20

It'll be hard to make a vaccine for that but one will arrive all of a sudden.

Cork2021

Rolling review starting on Sputnik 5

https://twitter.com/ema_news/status/1367401232885837827?s=21