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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

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alwald

It's great to login here for 5 minutes on this glorious bank holiday, and see that most anti lockdown restrictions merchants are confined in their homes debating waffling all day long...the lockdown is working :pac::D.

Nickindublin

https://www.businesspost.ie/ireland/state-could-face-surge-of-covid-19-legal-challenges-7d52de06

FintanMcluskey

alwald wrote: »

It's great to login here for 5 minutes on this glorious bank holiday, and see that most anti lockdown restrictions merchants are confined in their homes debating waffling all day long...the lockdown is working :pac::D.

As the law directs.

Can one assume those who are in favour of the restrictions here, are in fact, hypocritical liars who are endangering vunerable lives?

the kelt

Penfailed wrote: »

Why is it assumed that the problems in nursing homes are hampering the easing of restrictions?

Well when we are told the numbers are too high to ease restrictions deaths and new cases etc and a huge number of new cases and deaths are coming from nursing homes it’s probably a good guess to assume it has some bearing.

retro:electro

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

I got stopped and warned by the guards a couple of weeks back for driving my kids to the back 1.5km away (theyre 2 and 3). The beach was allowed as it was within the 2km zone, but driving there apparently wasnt as it wasnt an essential journey.

By that logic and with golf courses reopening, can people only play if the course is 2km from their house, and do they have to walk there? Im struggling to understand how opening these things take effect if the "non-essential journey" isnt redefined

That makes the sum total of minus sense. Surely driving there with your kids is actually safer and putting yourself and your children, as well as others, at less risk since it avoids you all congregating together on the journey to the beach? More makey uppy rules for the sake of making rules and they couldn’t be less practical if they tried

hmmm

retro:electro wrote: »

That makes the sum total of minus sense. Surely driving there with your kids is actually safer and putting yourself and your children, as well as others, at less risk since it avoids you all congregating together on the journey to the beach? More makey uppy rules for the sake of making rules and they couldn’t be less practical if they tried

It lowers the risk of widespread geographical spread of the virus, and most people in local communities don't want outsiders visiting them right now.

It also avoids having the roads full of cars, and people on here saying things like "everyone else is ignoring this, let's get the kids and go to the beach. Throw a set of golf clubs into the boot in case we're stopped."

Ginger n Lemon

retro:electro wrote: »

That makes the sum total of minus sense. Surely driving there with your kids is actually safer and putting yourself and your children, as well as others, at less risk since it avoids you all congregating together on the journey to the beach? More makey uppy rules for the sake of making rules and they couldn’t be less practical if they tried

Majority of Leo's plan is like that. His own party members disagree with it... I just hope that somehow, either through public pressure, political pressure or judicial pressure some of these questionable timelines can be revisited.

Like i said before, why is it unsafe for me to go to the barbers today, if my barber wears mask and single use gloves? Like i will sit there, i wont be touching furniture or anything really, just use my card for contact less payment and i am out. Will this cause SPIKE in infections and deaths?

Discodog

Pubs appealing to open early & proposing social distancing.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/vintners-propose-radical-plan-that-would-let-pubs-reopen-in-june-997536.html

conor2469

hmmm wrote: »

It lowers the risk of widespread geographical spread of the virus, and most people in local communities don't want outsiders visiting them right now.

It also avoids having the roads full of cars, and people on here saying things like "everyone else is ignoring this, let's get the kids and go to the beach. Throw a set of golf clubs into the boot in case we're stopped."

But he was a member of the local community? He said he lived 1.5km from the beach?
Yet according to his post the garda insisted that he make his 2 and 3 year old walk the 1.5 kms because of some technicality that I havent seen written in the plan. I have searched a lot and nowehere does it say that the KM restriction for exercise needs to be entirely on foot. If so, then that means cyclists can't go out for a cycle.

easypazz

Benimar wrote: »

Technically he is correct. Of course what he doesn’t mention is that it is only on 4 islands, who have had no new cases in a while. It also only relates to OUTDOOR areas and they can only have 30% occupancy of those outdoor areas.

Not exactly comparing apples with apples.

I said some bars are opening today in Spain. SOME.

I was accused of telling a lie.

Many more are opening next Monday with, as you said 30% occupancy outdoors.

But here in Ireland it is August 10th with social distancing restrictions in place.

hmmm

conor2469 wrote: »

But he was a member of the local community? He said he lived 1.5km from the beach?
Yet according to his post the garda insisted that he make his 2 and 3 year old walk the 1.5 kms because of some technicality that I havent seen written in the plan. I have searched a lot and nowehere does it say that the KM restriction for exercise needs to be entirely on foot. If so, then that means cyclists can't go out for a cycle.

The Guards are being reasonable about enforcing this. A cyclist stopped at the Sally Gap is likely to be outside their 5k, similarly there is no way for them to be sure that someone stopped at a checkpoint in a car is really only travelling a short distance. There was also the chaos back in March near beaches etc where large numbers of people drove to those locations, and they want to avoid this (for now).

So for practical purposes, they're not going to bother people walking, they'll stop cyclists in remote areas, and they can stop cars at any time.

hmmm

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Like i said before, why is it unsafe for me to go to the barbers today, if my barber wears mask and single use gloves? Like i will sit there, i wont be touching furniture or anything really, just use my card for contact less payment and i am out. Will this cause SPIKE in infections and deaths?

If the barber was outside, neither of you was speaking, neither of you was symptomatic, both of you wearing respirator masks, and cutting your hair with some sort of tree lopper from a few metres away, it's probably 100% safe. Anything else increases the risk of the virus being transmitted and the government will be acting on health advice.

Benimar

easypazz wrote: »

I said some bars are opening today in Spain. SOME.

I was accused of telling a lie.

Many more are opening next Monday with, as you said 30% occupancy outdoors.

But here in Ireland it is August 10th with social distancing restrictions in place.

And I said you are technically correct.

Now, do you accept that opening an outdoor section of a Spanish pub isn’t the equivalent to opening up an indoor Irish pub?

Penfailed

easypazz wrote: »

I said some bars are opening today in Spain. SOME.

I was accused of telling a lie.

Many more are opening next Monday with, as you said 30% occupancy outdoors.

But here in Ireland it is August 10th with social distancing restrictions in place.

So, how would that work over here? 30% in a smoking area? Hardly viable. It's still going to be only 50% in Spain from the beginning of June, with social distancing restrictions in place.

easypazz

Discodog wrote: »

Pubs appealing to open early & proposing social distancing.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/vintners-propose-radical-plan-that-would-let-pubs-reopen-in-june-997536.html

There are videos going around of housing estates in Ireland with everybody outside drinking cans, sitting on the greens, live bands playing etc.

Completely uncontrolled gatherings.

In Spain pubs have started to reopen with 30% outdoor capacity.

Cities around the world are planning on pedestrianizing streets and allowing restaurants and bars put tables along the road so people can spread out.

But here in Ireland we are keeping the bars closed until August 10th, allowing a free for all in housing estates and house parties with no control at all.

But some on here relentlessly support this without ever questioning it.

Ginger n Lemon

Discodog wrote: »

Pubs appealing to open early & proposing social distancing.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/vintners-propose-radical-plan-that-would-let-pubs-reopen-in-june-997536.html

Best news we ll see in a while.

easypazz

Benimar wrote: »

Now, do you accept that opening an outdoor section of a Spanish pub isn’t the equivalent to opening up an indoor Irish pub?

I am not disputing that at all.

Kermit.de.frog

Benimar wrote: »

And I said you are technically correct.

Now, do you accept that opening an outdoor section of a Spanish pub isn’t the equivalent to opening up an indoor Irish pub?

Spain does not have the same drinking culture/problem so it's far less risk for them.

Problem with pubs here is not distancing measures, its alcohol and the practicality of applying measures. Distancing would be out the window by 9 pm and good luck to staff trying to keep things in order.

Too much aggravation, won't work.

Also, advocating 6 to a table in fact means no changes because you see less than that around tables in pubs in Temple Bar on a nightly basis. It's totally disingenuous.

[Deleted User]

hmmm wrote: »

If the barber was outside, neither of you was speaking, neither of you was symptomatic, both of you wearing respirator masks, and cutting your hair with some sort of tree lopper from a few metres away, it's probably 100% safe. Anything else increases the risk of the virus being transmitted and the government will be acting on health advice.

That will remain the case until there is a vaccine, if we ever find one.

So what’s the solution? Lockdown forever?

Time to get on with things and accept the risk.

easypazz

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Spain does not have the same drinking culture/problem so it's far less risk for them.

Problem with pubs here is not distancing measures, its alcohol and the practicality of applying measures. Distancing would be out the window by 9 pm and good luck to staff trying to keep things in order.

Too much aggravation, won't work.

Also, advocating 6 to a table in fact means no changes because you see less than that around tables in pubs in Temple Bar on a nightly basis. It's totally disingenuous.

You are right, better off sticking to gatherings in housing estates and house parties where there is no oversight at all.:rolleyes:

seamusk84

Still don't get it.

Tomorrow can I drive to a non essential shop in my 5km radius? Lets say I want to go to pick up food in the Italian I like but which is further away from a closer one I don't like.

IE: Can I make unnecessary car journeys within a 5km radius of my gaf? What do I say to the Garda if I get stopped. Can I say: I'm out for a drive but am within a 5km radius of my house so jog on.

Irish Aris

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Does anyone know of the distance measures in other countries? In the last 4 months I havent heard of any country restricting movement of up to 2km or any sort of limit. Ive heard of France Spain & Italy whereby you cant leave your house kind of thing.

But actual distance restrictions?

I can confirm that no distance measures in Greece, although the enforcement of restrictions was stricter than here in Ireland. They didn't allow people to travel in other parts of the country to avoid spreading the virus. As of today people are allowed out and some shops reopen - and I understand travelling will also be allowed in 2 weeks time, May 18th.
I will stress again though, for balanced argument, that Greece is in single digits of new cases and deaths - though with less testing than Ireland.

Kermit.de.frog

easypazz wrote: »

You are right, better off sticking to gatherings in housing estates and house parties where there is no oversight at all.:rolleyes:

Would you like to be a member of staff trying to ensure social distancing in pubs on a Friday night in the middle of Dublin?

Didn't think so.

Penfailed

How many people on here bitching about the restrictions have actually done anything constructive about it? How many of you have lobbied your local TD? How many of you have contacted your local councillor to speak to a TD on your behalf? If the sum total of your frustration is posting on Boards, then you have achieved nothing.

normanoffside

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Spain does not have the same drinking culture/problem so it's far less risk for them.

Problem with pubs here is not distancing measures, its alcohol and the practicality of applying measures. Distancing would be out the window by 9 pm and good luck to staff trying to keep things in order.

Too much aggravation, won't work.

Also, advocating 6 to a table in fact means no changes because you see less than that around tables in pubs in Temple Bar on a nightly basis. It's totally disingenuous.

You've clearly not lived in Spain.

Ever been to Botellón?

[Deleted User]

Deleted User wrote: »

That will remain the case until there is a vaccine, if we ever find one.

So what’s the solution? Lockdown forever?

Time to get on with things and accept the risk.

The risk of a second wave of infection is still too great.

JRant

Penfailed wrote: »

How many people on here bitching about the restrictions have actually done anything constructive about it? How many of you have lobbied your local TD? How many of you have contacted your local councillor to speak to a TD on your behalf? If the sum total of your frustration is posting on Boards, then you have achieved nothing.

Well I have sent a number of emails to the minister of transport regarding the seemingly illegal conclusion between government, banks, and airlines. Guess what, that "minister" lost his seat already and has absolutely no mandate to be making shoddy deals that affect 10's of thousands of Irish citizens.

In case you hadn't noticed we don't actually have a functioning government at the moment.

Irish Aris

hmmm wrote: »

If the barber was outside, neither of you was speaking, neither of you was symptomatic, both of you wearing respirator masks, and cutting your hair with some sort of tree lopper from a few metres away, it's probably 100% safe. Anything else increases the risk of the virus being transmitted and the government will be acting on health advice.

Interestingly enough, barbers are one of the first type of businesses to re-open in Greece today. Indoors, one customer at a time, masks for both customer and barber, proper cleaning of equipment in between customers.
My local barber has blacked out the windows and put up a note that they are going through refurbishment. I reckon they prepare the place to meet social distancing requirements.

VonLuck

seamusk84 wrote: »

Still don't get it.

Tomorrow can I drive to a non essential shop in my 5km radius? Lets say I want to go to pick up food in the Italian I like but which is further away from a closer one I don't like.

IE: Can I make unnecessary car journeys within a 5km radius of my gaf? What do I say to the Garda if I get stopped. Can I say: I'm out for a drive but am within a 5km radius of my house so jog on.

5km is for exercise only.

lawrencesummers

growleaves wrote: »

You post is clever but silly.

Travel restrictions are how pandemics were dealt with in the past, i.e. people were prevented from entering a country or if let in they were quarantined.

They didn't have airports in the past. Doesn't really alter what we're talking about.

Are you seriously advocating for treating pandemics like they have in the past? Seriously?