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Abusing candidates/canvassers - where is the line?

  • 29-04-2014 09:23PM
    #1
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭


    Just saw this video posted on the Dublin Says No facebook page, which seems to show a young Labour Party candidate getting bollocked/harassed (depending on what way you want to look at it) out of an estate by two people from this group.

    Having looked a bit more into it, there have been several such videos of similar carry on put up by this group - which makes for an interesting question: where is the line here, and is it being crossed?

    These protestors have a right to freedom of speech and freedom to protest no doubt, but I can't help but feel slightly angry when I see this video. Surely in a democratic country any candidate from any party has the right to set out their stall in an election and not be harassed out of an estate?

    Having looked a bit further into it, this woman is a first time candidate - does that matter? Should that matter?

    It's an interesting one - what say you philosophers of AH?


«13456

Comments

  • #2
    Lapin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 18,184 ✭✭✭✭Lapin


    No one deserves abuse no matter who they represent.


  • #3
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    There is no line. There is no excuse for attacking, even verbally, somebody canvassing. Simply ignore them or say no thanks!


  • #4
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    What a hero. :rolleyes:


  • #5
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    I think if you have to revert to any type of abuse, whether physical or verbal, then you have well and truly crossed the line. If you can't get your point across without acting the cnut, keep it to yourself.


  • #6
    Gbear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,775 ✭✭✭✭Gbear


    Lapin wrote: »
    No one deserves abuse no matter who they represent.

    How about the North American Man-Boy Love Association?


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  • #7
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    The comments on that page are disgusting. I'd also rather them not call themselves "Dublin Saysno", they have nothing to say for me and the city I live in. Brain-dead morons.


  • #8
    Andy-Pandy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,848 ✭✭✭Andy-Pandy


    These type of people are morons, they only act this way because it's the only way they can make themselves feel important. They don't have the ability to rationally verbalise an argument.


  • #9
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    The comments on that page are disgusting. I'd also rather them not call themselves "Dublin Saysno", they have nothing to say for me and the city I live in. Brain-dead morons.

    They come across as slightly unhinged IMO


  • #10
    Whosthis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Whosthis


    The line for me would be getting physical, anybody involved with any of the big 3 parties in this country deserve everything they get. They've done nothing but lie to and cheat the people of this country for at least the last 7 years and its about time we stood up to them.


  • #11
    Davarus Walrus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭Davarus Walrus


    You always get those dumb fúckers sticking their camera phones into peoples faces, hectoring them, before uploading it to facebook. That candidate is trying to become a Councillor out of some sense of civic duty. She's a member of a party who had to make some hugely difficult decisions to try and restore economic sovereignty to this country. You'd think the Labour Party were doing this out of malice and spite. People are annoyed.

    It doesn't give scum like those abusing her on camera the right to do that though.


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  • #12
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    Whosthis wrote: »
    The line for me would be getting physical, anybody involved with any of the big 3 parties in this country deserve everything they get. They've done nothing but lie to and cheat the people of this country for at least the last 7 years and its about time we stood up to them.

    You don't seem to have any knowledge of current affairs outside the few paragraphs in The Star that you read.


  • #13
    Whosthis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Whosthis


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    You don't seem to have any knowledge of current affairs outside the few paragraphs in The Star that you read.

    What makes you think that?


  • #14
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,692 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    Davarus Walrus wrote: »
    You always get those dumb fúckers sticking their camera phones into peoples faces, hectoring them, before uploading it to facebook. That candidate is trying to become a Councillor out of some sense of civic duty. She's a member of a party who had to make some hugely difficult decisions to try and restore economic sovereignty to this country. You'd think the Labour Party were doing this out of malice and spite. People are annoyed.

    It doesn't give scum like those abusing her on camera the right to do that though.

    Meh, I think Labour have proven themselves to be completely devoid of any principle or political philosophy. They certainly don't represent the left or the working class anymore. Moreover, their actions in government seem to be driven most simply by a desire to remain in government, nothing more or less.


  • #15
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    Whosthis wrote: »
    What makes you think that?

    Your post is factually incorrect and full of cliched soundbytes that don't really mean anything.


  • #16
    Whosthis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Whosthis


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    Your post is factually incorrect.

    Explain.


  • #17
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    Whosthis wrote: »
    The line for me would be getting physical, anybody involved with any of the big 3 parties in this country deserve everything they get. They've done nothing but lie to and cheat the people of this country for at least the last 7 years and its about time we stood up to them.

    Presumably the way to "stand up to them", if that's what you want done, is to refuse to vote for them when the time comes - as opposed to harassing a young woman trying to make her point off the street?

    I'm not from the area and I don't know what she stands for aside from being a candidate for the Labour Party - but that sort of behaviour isn't on IMO. The funny thing is, if I was living in that area, I now wouldn't get a chance to hear what she stands for because two unhinged "campaigners" with a cameraphone bollocked her off my estate.

    What's democratic about that?


  • #18
    Troy Lumberjack
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 38 ✭Troy Lumberjack


    Round here, dropping the hand is frowned on anyway.


  • #19
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,692 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    I'm not suggesting such aggressive harassment of a young local elections candidate is ever warranted mind, but Labour won't ever get a preference from me barring some major turnaround in their politics.


  • #20
    Dick phelan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,701 ✭✭✭Dick phelan


    Davarus Walrus wrote: »
    You always get those dumb fúckers sticking their camera phones into peoples faces, hectoring them, before uploading it to facebook. That candidate is trying to become a Councillor out of some sense of civic duty. She's a member of a party who had to make some hugely difficult decisions to try and restore economic sovereignty to this country. You'd think the Labour Party were doing this out of malice and spite. People are annoyed.

    It doesn't give scum like those abusing her on camera the right to do that though.

    Are you Joking Labor are Traitors to this country, they have lied and lied to to the people, Labor so against Water charges the scumbag now introduces them, so against property tax, guess what introduced it, Labor have done nothing but make life even tougher on already suffering people, while they still gladly ride the gravy train. Not saying what these people did necessarily was right but if any Labor candiate comes to my door they will get a swift **** off and the door slammed on them. They have betrayed the people and should be booted out of power ASAP


  • #21
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    Whosthis wrote: »
    Explain.

    "Anybody involved the in the big 3 parties...have done nothing but lie to and cheat the people of this country for the last 7 years".

    Look, my main problem with that sort of argument is that it's wrong, and makes the anti-Government side look pretty stupid. I'm not a FG, FF or Labour supporter. I've never voted for any of them. I'd rather an alternative Government. Verbally abusing people based on lies and hyperbole adds nothing.

    Criticise candidates for flawed policies they might hold. Don't give them sympathy among the general electorate by being a complete ****tard.


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  • #22
    Davarus Walrus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭Davarus Walrus


    Dick phelan wrote: »
    Are you Joking Labor are Traitors to this country, they have lied and lied to to the people, Labor so against Water charges the scumbag now introduces them, so against property tax, guess what introduced it, Labor have done nothing but make life even tougher on already suffering people, while they still gladly ride the gravy train. Not saying what these people did necessarily was right but if any Labor candiate comes to my door they will get a swift **** off and the door slammed on them. They have betrayed the people and should be booted out of power ASAP

    Do you understand what a coalition government means? It means that the two parties came together and compromised on what decisions and policies they would implement. None of it was going to be good news. Considering the unprecedented situation we found ourselves in, I think they did a rather good job. Money doesn't grow on trees you know. If you want services then you need to pay for them.


  • #23
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    Dick phelan wrote: »
    Labor so against Water charges the scumbag now introduces them, so against property tax, guess what introduced it

    Not that I necessarily have much time for Labour, but do you really reckon they went along with introducing this stuff out of spite?

    Also, I don't remember them coming out against a property tax (open to correction) - FG did but not Labour IIRC.

    How do you propose we pay for water? Most countries pay for water... most countries also have a property tax.


  • #24
    Whosthis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Whosthis


    Foxhound38 wrote: »
    Presumably the way to "stand up to them", if that's what you want done, is to refuse to vote for them when the time comes - as opposed to harassing a young woman trying to make her point off the street?

    I'm not from the area and I don't know what she stands for aside from being a candidate for the Labour Party - but that sort of behaviour isn't on IMO. The funny thing is, if I was living in that area, I now wouldn't get a chance to hear what she stands for because two unhinged "campaigners" with a cameraphone bollocked her off my estate.

    What's democratic about that?

    That's not what I would choose to do. However I can completely understand the frustration of any member of the public that does behave in this manner. True, some people don't have the ability the verbalise their arguments in a sensible and coherent manner, instead they'll just scream and shout. It may not be pretty or particularly civilised but many people will see canvassing politicians as the only forum they are afforded to voice their opinions.


  • #25
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,523 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Foxhound38 wrote: »
    They come across as slightly unhinged IMO

    Like those loopers that go on rants when chuggers approach them while most people just smile and walk by


  • #26
    lertsnim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,978 ✭✭✭lertsnim


    Carole is a knacker who was full of chat till someone said something about her 21 year old daughter. Well able to give it but cannot take it. Typical of someone like her.


  • #27
    Rothko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,979 ✭✭✭✭Rothko


    The fact that they recorded it to post it online pretty much shows that they're doing it just for attention and to make themselves look like they're doing something important.


  • #28
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,563 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    lertsnim wrote: »
    Carole is a knacker who was full of chat till someone said something about her 21 year old daughter. Well able to give it but cannot take it. Typical of someone like her.

    Why, was she criticising other peoples daughters? If not, your post is beyond stupid.


  • #29
    Foxhound38
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,547 ✭✭✭Foxhound38


    Whosthis wrote: »
    However I can completely understand the frustration of any member of the public that does behave in this manner

    I don't - it's pig ignorance and entitlement at work.

    "I don't like X candidate/Party so now nobody gets to hear him/her - GET OFF MY ESTATE!! :mad: :mad: :mad: "

    They can feck right off with that attitude tbh...


  • #30
    lertsnim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,978 ✭✭✭lertsnim


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    Why, was she criticising other peoples daughters? If not, your post is beyond stupid.

    Wouldn't be the only stupid post on this thread in that case.


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  • #31
    Uriel.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,058 ✭✭✭Uriel.


    Dick phelan wrote: »
    Are you Joking Labor are Traitors to this country, they have lied and lied to to the people, Labor so against Water charges the scumbag now introduces them, so against property tax, guess what introduced it, Labor have done nothing but make life even tougher on already suffering people, while they still gladly ride the gravy train. Not saying what these people did necessarily was right but if any Labor candiate comes to my door they will get a swift **** off and the door slammed on them. They have betrayed the people and should be booted out of power ASAP

    I've never voted labour and doubt I ever would. I don't like what they stand for at all.

    But I find it interesting how they in particular are deviled. You do realise that they are a minority partner in a coalition government don't you?

    If anything they've continued the protection of headline social welfare rates etc. Which would be relatively sizable proportion their core vote.


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